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Missing Flight MH370

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Lance De Boils on 03.04.14 21:12

aiyoyo - I probably should have written: when there's no chance of locating the black box because it's 'pinger' is useless and the 'wreckage' found will potentially have drifted untold miles...

I don't think we'll ever get told the entire truth of what really happened to that plane, or why.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by TheTruthWillOut on 03.04.14 21:50

FWIW, the "pinger" has to last "at least" 30 days. They often last ~60 days apparently.

My view on what happened hasn't changed yet from my gut instinct from about day 2 that the pilot and/or co-pilot are responsible for deliberately turning off instruments and crashing the plane as far away from land as possible.

Things could change and I agree the Malaysian authorities are holding stuff back (e.g. warning signs something was brewing with the pilots).

I think it will be tough to find the plane though. Flight AF447's crash site was narrowed down to ~40 square miles and still took two years to find the black boxes...

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by aiyoyo on 04.04.14 7:29

The 'pinger' if working is helpful for the Sonar, otherwise other machinery/device can  be deployed to locate the boxes, provided the wreckage is found first giving a rough position of where the boxes could be.

The Malaysian Government may be economical with the truth, but if and when the wreckage and black boxes are found, the likely Authority conducting the investigation will be one that is independent of Malaysia.  The result of the findings will have to be made transparent and not up to Malaysian Authority to control.

The findings have to be reported to the Aviation Safety Board and given to an International Court for a final ruling that should determine who shall compensate the families - Malaysian Airline or Aircraft Manufacturer.  Often if found to be mechanical fault all the rest of the fleet of the same made will have to be rectified, as well as that additional/new safety measures introduced to the airlines to implement and observe.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Lance De Boils on 14.04.14 18:09

Now we are being told that the first officer made (or tried to make) a phone call from his mobile AFTER communication with the plane was lost. So surely that rules out a sudden catastrophic event.

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MH17

Post by Lance De Boils on 22.07.14 14:34

Given the recent horrific news about flight MH17, I thought I'd give this thread an airing.

I am totally bewildered by the current events - and appalled by the media coverage. Trying to sort through the propaganda is like wading through treacle.

As for the treatment of bodies - will, I am speechless with disgust.  

How 'odd' that of all the airlines in the world and all the various models of aircraft flying around, this tragedy should happen to a Malaysian Airlines plane of the same model as MH370, just over 4 months later.

This is all too much too comprehend.

What does everyone else think?

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by HelenMeg on 22.07.14 15:01

@Lance De Boils wrote:Given the recent horrific news about flight MH17, I thought I'd give this thread an airing.

I am totally bewildered by the current events - and appalled by the media coverage. Trying to sort through the propaganda is like wading through treacle.

As for the treatment of bodies - will, I am speechless with disgust.  

How 'odd' that of all the airlines in the world and all the various models of aircraft flying around, this tragedy should happen to a Malaysian Airlines plane of the same model as MH370, just over 4 months later.

This is all too much too comprehend.

What does everyone else think?
I suppose I think that it is a coincidence that both 'planes were from Malaysian Airlines. Although it seems that that a common denominator of sorts is Malaysian Airlines wish to cut costs. They continued to fly
over Ukraine as to divert would cost a substantial amount. Most airlines were already diverting away from Ukraine airspace.  Also, in the case of missing flight, didn't Malaysian Airlines cut costs through not subscribing to that 'keep in touch' satellite system (whose name I forget)?

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Woofer on 22.07.14 17:39

@Lance De Boils wrote:Given the recent horrific news about flight MH17, I thought I'd give this thread an airing.

I am totally bewildered by the current events - and appalled by the media coverage. Trying to sort through the propaganda is like wading through treacle.

As for the treatment of bodies - will, I am speechless with disgust.  

How 'odd' that of all the airlines in the world and all the various models of aircraft flying around, this tragedy should happen to a Malaysian Airlines plane of the same model as MH370, just over 4 months later.

This is all too much too comprehend.

What does everyone else think?

I`m getting more and more furious with the western politicians and media reporting on MH17.  Any tragedy in Ukraine, Obama and Cameron jump up and down with excitement as they use it to blame Russia, raise their fists and engage their armies - they want to have control over Ukraine.

As far as MH 17 is concerned, granted, its a coincidence that both planes were Malaysian Airlines considering other airlines fly that route.  Maybe the Malaysian Air Industry has corruptible individuals in it.  Was it the Malaysian air traffic control that instructed it to loose 2,000`?

IMO it is far more likely to be the puppet government recently installed in the Ukraine that is at the back of this tragedy.  They think nothing of wiping out hundreds of innocent people to achieve their aims.

The latest I`v heard is that there was another military aircraft in the area at the same time.

Its a good job we have other news channels to watch these days otherise we`d all be totally duped by our government and media.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Lance De Boils on 22.07.14 18:03

Woofer, I tend to agree. I'm not convinced that this can all be laid at Putin's door. And like you, I'm infuriated by the politics of this and the twisted press reporting. 

 shutup 

Oh, and have you heard the one about the Litvinenko inquiry?

The agenda is so blatently obvious.

I am angry, exasperated and frustrated with what's going on in the world at the moment. (I include the Israel/Gaza/Palestine issues in that.)

I almost feel like putting my head firmly in the sand and ignoring all news channels and print media.  notlistening

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Woofer on 22.07.14 18:52

@lance - "I am angry, exasperated and frustrated with what's going on in the world at the moment. (I include the Israel/Gaza/Palestine issues in that.) "

So do I.   I get the feeling the UK media are embarrassed to report what`s going on in Gaza, after all - our government have decreed they are all `friends of Israel`.  I get sick of our government pandering and following whatever the US dictates.  I am so ashamed of this country at the mo.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Masterblaster on 23.07.14 20:10

May Be a little off topic, but has anyone noticed the sincere grief of Queen Maxima today, never saw that from KM.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by aiyoyo on 23.07.14 21:07

@Lance De Boils wrote:

What does everyone else think?

I no longer know what to think.  I hope it was just an accident and not murder because it is senseless to murder a few hundred people just for political reasons.
But something is fishy about it.  How the plane can drift 300 miles off course into the war zone is mind boggling.

Today's Taiwan Airline crash claims 50 more life.  It's all so devastating news.  

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by tigger on 24.07.14 5:51

@aiyoyo wrote:
@Lance De Boils wrote:

What does everyone else think?

I no longer know what to think.  I hope it was just an accident and not murder because it is senseless to murder a few hundred people just for political reasons.
But something is fishy about it.  How the plane can drift 300 miles off course into the war zone is mind boggling.

Today's Taiwan Airline crash claims 50 more life.  It's all so devastating news.  

I understand that :
most other airlines didn't use that route anymore
the reason was the risk of overflying a war zone
that re-routing would have been very expensive in terms if extra fuel
that it was known that a number of Ukrainian military planes had been shot down in that area
that Malaysian airlines may have financial problems acercerbated by the loss of MH 370

Two similar 'accidents' are barely mentioned:

The passenger plane which was shot down by US Navy in the Persian Gulf some ten tears ago iirc

Kamchatka, in 1983. A passenger plane very much off the flight path, so much that it was unlikely to be accidental, flew over one of  Russia's. most sensitive military areas and was shot down.
I recall that the US did have a hand in the detour and in some circles it is accepted that it was a covert spying mission.m

Since this is not likely to be the case with MH 317 as satellites and drones can do the spying we now have the FACT that MH370 was shot down  in an area where shortly before and after this event two military planes were shot down.
I do not believe that this fact was not known to airline companies in general and those using that flightpath in particular.

As for the Russians arming the rebels, how is only that evil? I understand that the Ukrainian president wasn't  exactly democratically elected, his politics are suspect and in newly divided countries it's only to be expected  that there will be conflicts.
Just like the Balkan wars, it's almost as if  the good and the bad are  chosen by the media, Bosnians good, Serbs bad.
Btw Syria seems to  have taken a back seat in the news. Good rebels or bad rebels?  Make your choice.
Whereas the US fed and often instigated war in SA countries, supplying arms to any number of rebels. I
But that's 'good'  .

Meanwhile I'm wondering what 'bad news' is being buried whilst the press is busy with Bad Russia and good Gaza.
The reason so many civilians are killed is because Hamas puts them in harm's way.
Ten rocket launchers or similar equipment were found in a UN school last week, UN apologised to Israel. Headlines? No.
Each 'Palestinian' should by rights be a millionair as the billions given to the likes of Arafat were to improve their lives. But it's spent on  arms.
Yes, I do feel sorry for the population of Gaza, mainly because they are pawns of terrorist fanatics.
Has everyone forgotten that Saddam put women and children as near to the military installations as he could?

The reason not many Israeli's die from the constant bombardment that's been going on for years is that they've built shelters in their houses and they have about 15 seconds to get there when  the alarm goes off. No shelters built in Gaza, rocket launchers in schools and tunnels - just not for sheltering the population but to transport arms.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by tigger on 24.07.14 12:05

Correction: in the bolded sentence it should  read : Flight  MH 17


Btw: I'm impressed by the reports on  Radio 5 live on the above matters.  Interviewing families both in Gaza and Israel.



Eta:link to rocket launchers in Gaza school:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7d9_1405973367

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by sallypelt on 24.07.14 12:22

Algeria airliner missing on Sahara route from Burkina


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-28460625

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by aiyoyo on 24.07.14 13:04

@tigger wrote:

I understand that :
most other airlines didn't use that route anymore
the reason was the risk of overflying a war zone
that re-routing would have been very expensive in terms if extra fuel
that it was known that a number of Ukrainian military planes had been shot down in that area
that Malaysian airlines may have financial problems acercerbated by the loss of MH 370

Two similar 'accidents' are barely mentioned:

The passenger plane which was shot down by US Navy in the Persian Gulf some ten tears ago iirc

Kamchatka, in 1983. A passenger plane very much off the flight path, so much that it was unlikely to be accidental, flew over one of  Russia's. most sensitive military areas and was shot down.
I recall that the US did have a hand in the detour and in some circles it is accepted that it was a covert spying mission.m

Since this is not likely to be the case with MH 317 as satellites and drones can do the spying we now have the FACT that MH370 was shot down  in an area where shortly before and after this event two military planes were shot down.
I do not believe that this fact was not known to airline companies in general and those using that flightpath in particular.

As for the Russians arming the rebels, how is only that evil? I understand that the Ukrainian president wasn't  exactly democratically elected, his politics are suspect and in newly divided countries it's only to be expected  that there will be conflicts.
Just like the Balkan wars, it's almost as if  the good and the bad are  chosen by the media, Bosnians good, Serbs bad.
Btw Syria seems to  have taken a back seat in the news. Good rebels or bad rebels?  Make your choice.
Whereas the US fed and often instigated war in SA countries, supplying arms to any number of rebels. I
But that's 'good'  .

Meanwhile I'm wondering what 'bad news' is being buried whilst the press is busy with Bad Russia and good Gaza.
The reason so many civilians are killed is because Hamas puts them in harm's way.
Ten rocket launchers or similar equipment were found in a UN school last week, UN apologised to Israel. Headlines? No.
Each 'Palestinian' should by rights be a millionair as the billions given to the likes of Arafat were to improve their lives. But it's spent on  arms.
Yes, I do feel sorry for the population of Gaza, mainly because they are pawns of terrorist fanatics.
Has everyone forgotten that Saddam put women and children as near to the military installations as he could?

The reason not many Israeli's die from the constant bombardment that's been going on for years is that they've built shelters in their houses and they have about 15 seconds to get there when  the alarm goes off. No shelters built in Gaza, rocket launchers in schools and tunnels - just not for sheltering the population but to transport arms.

Far as I read, prior to this incident, the route was still used by a few other carriers.
Same route used by MH. The question is how, as in what caused the plane to stray off course.
It was flying at altitude of 33,000 ft (about 4 miles) at safe distance. 32,000 or below is the prohibition in the war zone.

My OH says something is fishy about it -
that the USA is probably behind this
that the separatists/pro russian rebels are infiltrated by CIA
that this was created by USA to give them an excuse to intervene in Putin war against Ukraine and force Putin's hands to the way they want things to be.
that Beacon was used to mislead/disturb electronic devices on the plane, fooling the pilots, causing them to fly off course into the war zone
that heat detection missile was fired in the general direction of the plane
that the missile was not aimed to hit the plane directly
that the missile was deliberately fired in close proximity of the plane knowing the impact would bring down the plane.

I argued against it saying it's hard for me to believe the Americans could be so cold and heartless as to murder a few hundred lives to meet their political agenda.
I also say if America was willing to murder innocents in order that they could poke their nose into foreign countries affairs, using cruelty to humans to achieve their objective, then one might as well believe conspiracists theory that 911 was not a religious attack but planned by the US government giving them perfect excuse to blame it on the terrorists and go after the terrorists, thereby rejuvenating their war industry.

My OH always say rich developed nation allocating colossal amount of taxpayers money to something they termed as "Defence" budget is indication men in politics are sick. That wars have to be created in order to keep the war industry going and up to date with technology.

All the rich and developed nations without exception allocate a hugh chunk of taxpayers money to Defence budget. The national expenditure for keeping the defence industry going often surpassing budgets given for fundamental public services such as education, health and transport.

Their stock pile of weapons of war, war vehicles, resources and manpower at the military and navy academies all had to be put to use from time to time, or they will become redundant, or become white elephants, which will make it hard for them to justify the expenditures.

So, in order to enable continuation of allocation of hugh budget to Defence every year, they must create wars or create conditions for other countries to go to war or go to war against another country so that they can continue to deploy, use, sell their weapons of war, turnover the war industry making it a lucrative and probably profitable business for them.

Only by exhausting old stocks then they can develop and built new ones of newer models incorporating latest technology and engineering building more sophisticated and state of the art ones over and above that of their competitors (other big nations with equal might and resources) and over imaginary enemies.

USA, Russia and China ought to re-term their "Defence" budget as "War" budget. Only Poor third world defenceless nations without the might or means to transgress against another country and in desperate need of these war equipment and weapons for defence have the right to term it "Defence" budget.

Historically the downing of commercial planes are done by political transgressor fighting a war with their neighbour. They are fearful of enemy using commercial plane to spy on them so usually carriers of their enemy flying near their territory risks being shot down. If the down plane belongs to Russia or even USA I can understand they can blame plane as being on covert spy operation. So I don't get it why MH was targeted, if it was targeted.

MH got back the black boxes so hopefully we should hear more.











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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Snifferdog on 24.07.14 14:26

As with the the medias incorrect reporting on the McCanns, I take everything the main stream media reports with a huge chunk of salt, and that's only if I suspect there is a grain of truth in the article. It just seems we are continuously fed s whole lot of bollocks. I am beginning to wonder again, as I did when I first joined this forum, is that the whole McCann saga is a false flag type set up. The only thing that would remain unanswered, if that were the case is, a big fat WHY?

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by PeterMac on 24.07.14 14:48

And now another one has disappeared between Burkina Faso and Algeria.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Guest on 24.07.14 15:50

[quote="aiyoyo"]
@tigger wrote:

My OH always say rich developed nation allocating colossal amount of taxpayers money to something they termed as "Defence" budget is indication men in politics are sick.  That wars have to be created in order to keep the war industry going and up to date with technology.

All the rich and developed nations without exception allocate a hugh chunk of taxpayers money to Defence budget.  The  national expenditure for keeping the defence industry going often surpassing budgets given for fundamental public services such as education, health and transport.

Their stock pile of weapons of war, war vehicles, resources and manpower at the military and navy academies all had to be put to use from time to time, or  they will  become redundant, or become white elephants, which will make it hard for them to justify the expenditures.

So, in order to enable continuation of allocation of hugh budget to Defence every year, they must create wars  or create conditions for other countries to go to war or go to war against another country so that they can continue to deploy, use, sell their weapons of war,  turnover the war industry making it a lucrative and probably profitable business for them.

Only by exhausting old stocks then they can develop and built new ones of newer models incorporating latest technology and engineering building more sophisticated and state of the art ones over and above that of their competitors (other big nations with equal might and resources) and over imaginary enemies.


What your OH is so accurately describing there is known as the military-industrial complex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military%E2%80%93industrial_complex

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by tigger on 24.07.14 16:50

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
@tigger wrote:

My OH always say rich developed nation allocating colossal amount of taxpayers money to something they termed as "Defence" budget is indication men in politics are sick.  That wars have to be created in order to keep the war industry going and up to date with technology.

All the rich and developed nations without exception allocate a hugh chunk of taxpayers money to Defence budget.  The  national expenditure for keeping the defence industry going often surpassing budgets given for fundamental public services such as education, health and transport.

Their stock pile of weapons of war, war vehicles, resources and manpower at the military and navy academies all had to be put to use from time to time, or  they will  become redundant, or become white elephants, which will make it hard for them to justify the expenditures.

So, in order to enable continuation of allocation of hugh budget to Defence every year, they must create wars  or create conditions for other countries to go to war or go to war against another country so that they can continue to deploy, use, sell their weapons of war,  turnover the war industry making it a lucrative and probably profitable business for them.

Only by exhausting old stocks then they can develop and built new ones of newer motdels incorporating latest technology and engineering building more sophisticated and state of the art ones over and above that of their competitors (other big nations with equal might and resources) and over imaginary enemies.


What your OH is so accurately describing there is known as the military-industrial complex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military%E2%80%93industrial_complex

-which is what did for JFK when he intended to pull out of Vietnam.

However, It's Aiyoyo you are quoting, flattered though I am  that you credit me with these political insights.
Strangely enough -now on hold - I'm listening to a History Extra podcast on the legacy of the First World War (12/6/14)  and the Zimmerman telegram - fascinating.

Only thing: I don't know who or what an OH is (it's an insulting term in Dutch)  laughat

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Guest on 24.07.14 16:52

Nothing insulting - it's one's other half: partner, spouse or whatever you call your nearest and dearest.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Guest on 24.07.14 16:53

@tigger wrote:
However, It's Aiyoyo you are quoting, flattered though I am  that you credit me with these political insights.
Only thing: I don't know who or what an OH is (it's an insulting term in Dutch)  laughat

Er.... I haven't got the tiniest clue how that happened.

OH = Other Half. You should spend more time on Mumsnet, then you'd know them all!

Do I dare ask what it means in Dutch?

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Another elephant in the room...?

Post by missbeetle on 25.07.14 3:37

@Snifferdog wrote:As with the the medias incorrect reporting on the McCanns, I take everything the main stream media reports with a huge chunk of salt, and that's only if I suspect there is a grain of truth in the article. It just seems we are continuously fed s whole lot of bollocks.  I am beginning to wonder again, as I did when I first joined this forum, is that the whole McCann saga is a false flag type set up.  The only thing that would remain unanswered, if that were the case is, a big fat WHY?

Hey Snifferdog -

I hadn't even heard of 'false flag' set ups until I started reading up on this case a couple of years ago.

I had thought to myself that the McCanns were weird, rather dull and oddly sporty - but that it was just me thinking that.

Further and wider reading about this case and others has really been an experience - I had NO idea.

It's quite something to discover that the truth has been manipulated, obscured and just plain invented...

...by people, governments, charities and the media. Some days I feel like cynicism itself.

However - there are good, kind and genuine people everywhere and I am grateful for the insights gained.

I'd taken no notice of conspiracy theories before and now I think there's something in a lot of them.

The 'Paul is dead' one is bang on, to my mind - the old Paul McCartney was cool. 'Faul' isn't.


A few years ago something was reported in the UK press to which I thought "No, that's not right" -

...elements of truth in there mixed up with (to me) strange anomalies...

I can't say why and how I know what was reported was 'off' - I was only ever on the edges of this episode -

- but I can now see how this situation may have been used to manipulate public opinion and lead towards new legislation.


My current thoughts are that the Mystery of Madeleine McCann is possibly an exercise in media manipulation and monitoring.

With reference to Operation Mincemeat, I'm not sure if the McCanns ever had a little girl called Madeleine.

That would to explain to me why they don't seem to look saddened by her death/disappearance - as hard as they try.


Mysteries, myths and legends... Have you heard of the legendary elephant's graveyard?

Thought to be somewhere in the Arabian desert...

"(snipped from elephantsforever.co.za, with thanks)

...and yet there seems to be some truth behind it, as elephants do care for their deceased ancestors' bones and tusks.


I don't know if the mysterious Madeleine McCann can ever be found -

- however the pilgrimage in search of the truth has been enlightening.


Media manipulation, monitoring, make-up and all.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Guest on 25.07.14 8:26

@missbeetle wrote:


I don't know if the mysterious Madeleine McCann can ever be found -

- however the pilgrimage in search of the truth has been enlightening.


Media manipulation, monitoring, make-up and all.

Yes, this is the position that I most frequently find myself coming back to.

I know you've been getting a bit of grief here and there missbeetle but I think that you know your stuff. If that damns me by association then so be it. It wouldn't be the first time I'd found myself in agreement with the "wrong" poster!


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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by PeterMac on 25.07.14 8:31

reports that wreckage has been spotted in the Sahara in Mali.
Not a good week for aviation.
Ukraine, Taiwan, Mali

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Re: Missing Flight MH370

Post by Guest on 25.07.14 8:34

@PeterMac wrote:reports that wreckage has been spotted in the Sahara in Mali.
Not a good week for aviation.
Ukraine, Taiwan, Mali

Maybe somebody found their way on board with an only partly charged Blackberry?

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