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Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by puzzled on 25.12.11 21:22

@Daisy wrote:
Sigmund Freud, the founder of psychoanalysis,
changed the perception of the human mind and its workings. His
influence on the twentieth century is generally considered profound. The
series describes the propaganda that Western governments and corporations have utilized stemming from Freud's theories.

It's a strange thing to consider, the theories of Fraud Freud haven't been taken seriously in academic psychology since the 1950s, but they still seem to be influential in therapy, and of course the myths he created like being 'anally retentive' and 'repression' and so on, are still widely believed in the culture.

Of course a brilliant account of the way psychological techniques are used in business and politics is The Hidden Persuaders by Vance Packard. That dates from 1957, so as you can imagine, the techniques are way more sophisticated now. (I'm not a believer in conspiracy theories by the way - this knowledge is all easily available).

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by Shibboleth on 26.12.11 6:57

Kate was happy with the child care because she (possibly) knew one of the nannies from years before. Charlotte Pennington. They worked in the same childrens hospital in NZ.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by tigger on 26.12.11 7:03

quote puzzled
It's a strange thing to consider, the theories of Fraud Freud haven't been taken seriously in academic psychology since the 1950s, but they still seem to be influential in therapy, and of course the myths he created like being 'anally retentive' and 'repression' and so on, are still widely believed in the culture.

Of course a brilliant account of the way psychological techniques are used in business and politics is The Hidden Persuaders by Vance Packard. That dates from 1957, so as you can imagine, the techniques are way more sophisticated now. (I'm not a believer in conspiracy theories by the way - this knowledge is all easily available).[/quote]

I agree that the knowledge is available, but few people are aware of how it is used. Since the Romans, if not before, rulers have realized that the vast mass of people had to be controlled in some way. 'Bread and Games' was what the Roman plebs had to have. Now we have Bread in the form of hand-outs and Games in the form of TV .Withdraw either of these and you have revolution.

I never used to believe conspiracy theories such as 9/11 until I saw a real-time clip of the buildings collapsing. You can't mess with the laws of nature.
Now I also believe that such conspiracies are not organized by politicians, too stupid imo. In the entire history of the world the power has always been with the powers behind the throne, industry and wealth and now the media.

To get back to Maddie: it is a good example of how the media and those in positions of power are intertwined. I do not see conspiracies as secret meetings or even Bilderberg (imo a sensible idea to get a lot of influential people together) often, imo it is made up as they go along, which is why we can see the mistakes. As in the post-Kennedy era and the post9/11 era, a lot of these mistakes have to be rectified, sometimes in the form of murder.



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The ubiquitous Charlotte Pennington

Post by Marian on 26.12.11 9:10

@Shibboleth wrote:Kate was happy with the child care because she (possibly) knew one of the nannies from years before. Charlotte Pennington. They worked in the same childrens hospital in NZ.

They could not have worked together in New Zealand as Charlotte would have been around 8 years old. There's an interesting topic just called Charlotte Pennington if anyone hasn't seen it.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by Shibboleth on 26.12.11 11:15

@Marian wrote:
@Shibboleth wrote:Kate was happy with the child care because she (possibly) knew one of the nannies from years before. Charlotte Pennington. They worked in the same childrens hospital in NZ.

They could not have worked together in New Zealand as Charlotte would have been around 8 years old. There's an interesting topic just called Charlotte Pennington if anyone hasn't seen it.

This depends on which version of the resumé of Charlotte, that you read. Perhaps Kate knew her as a child, a patient, or knew the family.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by tigger on 05.02.12 7:49

I don't like to start too many topics so seems the best one to post this one in.

http://www.news24.com/World/News/Greece-classes-paedophilia-as-disability-20120109
Greece classes paedophilia as disability
2012-01-09 23:02

Athens - Greek disability groups expressed anger on Monday at a government decision to expand a list of state-recognised disability categories to include paedophiles, exhibitionists and kleptomaniacs.

The National Confederation of Disabled People called the action "incomprehensible", and said paedophiles are now awarded a higher government disability pay than some people who have received organ transplants.

The labour ministry said categories added to the expanded list - that also includes pyromaniacs, compulsive gamblers, fetishists and sadomasochists - were included for purposes of medical assessment and used as a gauge for allocating financial assistance.

But NCDP leader Yiannis Vardakastanis, who is blind, warned the new list could create new difficulties for disabled Greeks who are already facing benefit cuts due to the country's financial crisis.

"What's happened is incomprehensible. I think there is some big mistake. The ministry should have a different policy on disability," Vardakastanis told the Associated Press.

"The list contains major changes to disability quotients, which could effectively remove many people from access to benefits."

The new list gives pyromaniacs and paedophiles disability pay up to 35%, compared to 80% for heart transplant recipients.

"It's really not serious to grant Peeping Toms a 20%-30% disability rate, and 10% to diabetics, who have insulin shots four or five times a day," said Vardakastanis.

Greece has been fighting to avoid bankruptcy since 2009. Public spending on health and welfare programmes has been sharply cut under austerity measures imposed as a condition for receiving emergency loans from the International Monetary Fund and other countries using the euro currency.

Independently run welfare programmes that survived on state grants have been the hardest hit, leaving some disabled groups, including the deaf, facing sudden drops in their standard of care.

The government is also battling widespread abuse in the welfare system, forcing tens of thousands of disabled people to be reassessed.



Only about 12 million Greeks - at this rate they'll all be on benefits and pensions.







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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by aquila on 05.02.12 8:23

@tigger wrote:I don't like to start too many topics so seems the best one to post this one in.

http://www.news24.com/World/News/Greece-classes-paedophilia-as-disability-20120109
Greece classes paedophilia as disability
2012-01-09 23:02

Athens - Greek disability groups expressed anger on Monday at a government decision to expand a list of state-recognised disability categories to include paedophiles, exhibitionists and kleptomaniacs.

The National Confederation of Disabled People called the action "incomprehensible", and said paedophiles are now awarded a higher government disability pay than some people who have received organ transplants.

The labour ministry said categories added to the expanded list - that also includes pyromaniacs, compulsive gamblers, fetishists and sadomasochists - were included for purposes of medical assessment and used as a gauge for allocating financial assistance.

But NCDP leader Yiannis Vardakastanis, who is blind, warned the new list could create new difficulties for disabled Greeks who are already facing benefit cuts due to the country's financial crisis.

"What's happened is incomprehensible. I think there is some big mistake. The ministry should have a different policy on disability," Vardakastanis told the Associated Press.

"The list contains major changes to disability quotients, which could effectively remove many people from access to benefits."

The new list gives pyromaniacs and paedophiles disability pay up to 35%, compared to 80% for heart transplant recipients.

"It's really not serious to grant Peeping Toms a 20%-30% disability rate, and 10% to diabetics, who have insulin shots four or five times a day," said Vardakastanis.

Greece has been fighting to avoid bankruptcy since 2009. Public spending on health and welfare programmes has been sharply cut under austerity measures imposed as a condition for receiving emergency loans from the International Monetary Fund and other countries using the euro currency.

Independently run welfare programmes that survived on state grants have been the hardest hit, leaving some disabled groups, including the deaf, facing sudden drops in their standard of care.

The government is also battling widespread abuse in the welfare system, forcing tens of thousands of disabled people to be reassessed.



Only about 12 million Greeks - at this rate they'll all be on benefits and pensions.







Tigger, to go into a state run Greek hospital it is widely accepted that you pay the surgeon with an envelope of cash 'fakelakia' the little envelope. IMO it is wrong to consider Greece on a par with UK healthcare and education. Greek education is bizarre to say the least. Greeks pay a lot of money outside their childrens' schooling, often to the same teacher that taught them in the day. From my experience there is very little state benefit in Greece. Paedophilia is definitely a disability, a disability to decent people. I'm surprised that given the austerity measures (and they are crippling) that this article was blessed with the light of day.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by tigger on 05.02.12 8:29

Aquila, I cannot possibly agree that paedophilia is a disability - it is a deviation at best. Certainly needs no hand-outs from the state, for what? Parking meters near playgrounds?
Taking responsibility for your actions and morals is part of being an adult.
Can we add serial killers and burglars and such to the list as well then?

To be an adult is to have reason and accountability, there is no soft option.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by aquila on 05.02.12 8:44

@tigger wrote:Aquila, I cannot possibly agree that paedophilia is a disability - it is a deviation at best. Certainly needs no hand-outs from the state, for what? Parking meters near playgrounds?
Taking responsibility for your actions and morals is part of being an adult.
Can we add serial killers and burglars and such to the list as well then?

To be an adult is to have reason and accountability, there is no soft option.

Tigger, sorry I didn't make myself clear. I meant that the disability of paedophilia is to children on the end of it (I'm a victim of it remember) and to have anyone give it credence in anyway as a medical/mental condition is too awful to consider. I don't know what's wrong in the world that paedophilia is given excuses. I can only imagine that it furthers the careers of well-meaning psychologists with careers to pursue and sadly, paedophiles in power. Kate mentioned something about Madeleine 'cowering' she was too bloody right, 'cowering' is what I did. I apologise if I went off on a rant but understand this is a subject close to my soul.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by tigger on 05.02.12 11:51

@aquila wrote:
@tigger wrote:Aquila, I cannot possibly agree that paedophilia is a disability - it is a deviation at best. Certainly needs no hand-outs from the state, for what? Parking meters near playgrounds?
Taking responsibility for your actions and morals is part of being an adult.
Can we add serial killers and burglars and such to the list as well then?

To be an adult is to have reason and accountability, there is no soft option.

Tigger, sorry I didn't make myself clear. I meant that the disability of paedophilia is to children on the end of it (I'm a victim of it remember) and to have anyone give it credence in anyway as a medical/mental condition is too awful to consider. I don't know what's wrong in the world that paedophilia is given excuses. I can only imagine that it furthers the careers of well-meaning psychologists with careers to pursue and sadly, paedophiles in power. Kate mentioned something about Madeleine 'cowering' she was too bloody right, 'cowering' is what I did. I apologise if I went off on a rant but understand this is a subject close to my soul.

We're OK then. I'm just going through Kate diary : Madeleine, her fear of pain. In the book Madeleine, her fear and pain.
One the editor didn't miss.
That's why I cannot find an atom of compassion for those two and their associates.

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by PeterMac on 05.02.12 12:26

It is dangerous, IMHO, to start classing what others see as perversions as illnesses or disabilities.
There is but a short step from there to the extreme political position that anyone who does not agree with the Leader must be mentally ill, and therefore to be locked up and denied freedom of speech. We have seen this in recent history in totalitarian regimes of the right and of the left.

Actually, now we come to think of it ........

"Carter-Ruck" [expletive included just so you find this post !]

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Re: Paedophilia in church and creche in the Netherlands.

Post by aquila on 09.02.12 6:48

@PeterMac wrote:It is dangerous, IMHO, to start classing what others see as perversions as illnesses or disabilities.
There is but a short step from there to the extreme political position that anyone who does not agree with the Leader must be mentally ill, and therefore to be locked up and denied freedom of speech. We have seen this in recent history in totalitarian regimes of the right and of the left.

Actually, now we come to think of it ........

"Carter-Ruck" [expletive included just so you find this post !]

Whatever changes in this world of ours I cannot find a single excuse for paedophilia to be seen as an illness or a disability unless that thought is introduced into our daily lives by egotistical people who just like to argue the opposite, people who are guilty of it themselves or people who make careers (and shitloads of money) publishing books and papers.

It's just plainly wrong to rape or sexually abuse a child in anyway.

What is wrong with this world in our 'enlightened' times that we fight over religion, oil, forcing our cultures onto other people etc that we can't just have a big world statement that paedophilia is WRONG.

No doubt someone is going to question the definition of a child...watch this space

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