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Those unreliable dogs...

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by j.rob on 06.06.15 19:20

Snipped from link below. There are many other sights on the internet with similar observations however. 


------


Before we join the jury for  a visit to USAF Lakenheath at the beginning of week two,  let us close the book forever on the Soham crime scene, by borrowing witness WPC Anna Burton, who actually appeared in court much later on 14 November. WPC Burton is a police dog handler who attended Soham Village during Sunday evening to assist in searching for the missing girls. Her trained tracker dog had Holly Wells' scent, and for a while the pair searched around the village without any success. Then just after midnight, WPC Burton bumped into Ian Huntley near Soham College.

            “It was wonderful to run into the caretaker because he would know the layout of the place and he had offered to help look around”… "I just thanked him and said I was very grateful for his help, particularly because of the fact it was so late” WPC Burton told how she able to ask Huntley about buildings having alarms, and they spent an hour going round the site together, only going inside buildings if they were unlocked, meaning Holly and Jessica could have got inside.
WPC Burton asked him what the hangar building was, where the court has heard the charred remnants of the girls’ clothes were later found hidden in a bin, and was told it was a Groundsman’s building. She asked if he had the keys and was told he did not. WPC Burton  let her dog sniff round the outside of the building, but said it drew no reaction.


            The seminal clue here is not that WPC Burton’s trained police dog failed to react to the hangar building where the substitute red shirts would later be planted, but because the dog completely failed to react to Ian Huntley himself. Remember that the dog was following Holly Wells’ scent, and then came into very close proximity to the man who stands accused of attacking and murdering Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman just a few hours earlier, and is then alleged to have traveled  in a car with their corpses all the way to Lakenheath. Believe me, if Huntley had been anywhere near Holly Wells at any time during the evening, WPC Burton’s trained dog would have picked it up in seconds. So let me repeat that one more time, the highly-trained police tracker dog failed to react in close proximity to Ian Huntley.



In summary then, before we set off for Lakenheath with the jury, the Soham crime scene has proved absolutely no connection between Ian Huntley, and either Holly Wells or Jessica Chapman. The prosecution claims both girls were inside Huntley’s house, but the total lack of DNA proves they were not. The prosecution claims both girls were inside Huntley’s car, but the total lack of DNA proves they were not. A highly trained police tracker dog following Holly Wells’ scent on the night of the incident, does not react at all when placed in close proximity to the alleged murderer.



huh



http://www.whale.to/b/trial_of_ian_huntley.html

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by tigger on 06.06.15 21:09

Possibly a cadaver dog would have reacted to Huntley but not a tracker dog. Total lack of DNA - surely Huntley was cleaning the car the next day and had weeks I believe to do some more cleaning. 

By the time Huntley showed the WPC round he had not yet put the clothes in the incinerator. His house was not searched till much later. Can't blame the dog imo.

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by Doug D on 30.06.15 13:54

Those bloody dogs again:
 
From the Met Police News pages,
 
Met dogs star in film with tennis ace Andy Murray


 Jun 29, 2015 00:01 BST
 
With The Championships, Wimbledon taking place a week later than on past occasions, the Met has used this opportunity to undertake additional training and searches within the grounds. Search dogs and their handlers are a regular sight in the lead up to the tournament beginning and this caught the attention of the All England Lawn Tennis Club (AELTC) and WWF.




Snips:

Five year-old English Springer Spaniel Ike who is one of the Met’s most experienced search dogs and five eight-week-old puppies have starred alongside Wimbledon Champion and WWF global ambassador Andy Murray in a social media campaign highlighting the fight against poaching and the illegal wildlife trade.

The campaign will launch on Monday, 29 June, with a video starring Ike and Andy. This will be followed later on in The Championships with a second video with Andy and the five Cocker Spaniel puppies, Marigold, Marvin, Matilda, Misha and Maramaduke.
 
Filming took place last week within the famous grounds and Ike’s searching skills were called upon to find a tennis ball belonging to Andy.

Ike was bred by another police force and his official kennel name is ‘Icon’-hence the name Ike - and he has been with his handler since he was one-year-old. Now considered a pro, Ike thoroughly enjoys work and his search skills were put to the test during the Commonwealth Games and Olympics. He has searched almost all of London’s iconic sites including the Palace of Westminster, Downing Street and Buckingham Palace.
 
To find out more about the Met’s dog support unit visit:

http://content.met.police.uk/Site/dogsupportunit
 
http://www.mynewsdesk.com/uk/metpoliceuk/news/met-dogs-star-in-film-with-andy-murray-121828

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by Syn on 04.07.15 9:28

Two more cases where Eddie alerted and was proven to be correct years later:

The Sam Parker case (Sept 2007, not long after Martin and the dogs were in PDL)



Adrian Prout case.  Prout was a NOT suspect x 3 & WAS a suspect x 3 so pros chuntering on about McCanns being 'not suspects' means zilch.






The only reason police officers and Eddie did not find her body initially after he alerted in the lounge was because Prout had used digging equipment to bury his wife's body under a pheasant pen wrapped in an impermeable membrane. 




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And another one

Post by PeterMac on 04.07.15 10:50

http://news.sky.com/story/1512836/human-remains-found-inside-apartment-wall

Human Remains Found Inside Apartment Wall
Family members say they fear the body is that of Raven Joy Campbell, 31, who disappeared in Lomita, California, in 2009.
Friday 03 July 2015

Raven Joy Campbell went missing in 2009

Human remains have been found inside the walls of an apartment building in California after a tip off to police.
Coroner's office officials went to the property in Lomita and cadaver dogs gave a "positive alert" for a body.
The family of Raven Joy Campbell, 31, who disappeared in 2009 after she was last seen leaving the apartment at the Harbor Hills Housing Project, has said they believe the body to be hers.
The body was discovered after a tip off to police last week
Malaikah Manasseh, Ms Campbell's sister, told CBS News: "The body has to be hers, there's no question."
She added: "We held out hope because [authorities] said she wasn't here."
Cousin Linda Campbell Humphrey told the Los Angeles Times: "I have a gut feeling it's her. I have such a feeling in my stomach."
Sniffer dogs found the remains in the wall of an apartment in Lomita
Lieutenant Steve Jauch, of Los Angeles Sheriff's Department, did not comment on the identity of the body.
He said: "It's not fair for me to get their hopes up or dash their hopes. I'll have to wait for the process.
"I don't know how long the victim has been here, I just don't know."
The sheriff's department said it had received a call that there might be a body in the wall cavity behind stairs in the building last Wednesday.
Neighbours claimed that people living in the apartment complex have complained of a terrible smell near where the body was found.
Residents have been evacuated from the properties and yellow police tape has blocked off a section of the complex.

Worth stressing yet again, for the anti-dog people - who won't accept or understand this point anyway -
The dog alerted.
Then the officers found the body.
So the dog's alert will not have any place in the court case.
The officer will state "At Time, Day, Date I recovered the remains . . . "
Th face that a 100% reliable dog told him where to look is legally irrelevant.
But does not alter the fact of the 100% reliability

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by skyrocket on 06.07.15 8:49

Syn (or anyone who knows!)

Do you know whether Eddie and Keela (and Martin) went into apartment 5J? Can't find refernce to this in the PJ files but may have missed it. I know the Spanish tracker dogs reacted strangely there and about the business with the fridge and rotting food.

thanks
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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by Syn on 06.07.15 12:53

@skyrocket wrote:Syn (or anyone who knows!)

Do you know whether Eddie and Keela (and Martin) went into apartment 5J? Can't find refernce to this in the PJ files but may have missed it. I know the Spanish tracker dogs reacted strangely there and about the business with the fridge and rotting food.

thanks

He was definitely not asked to take the dogs to 5J Skyrocket, so you haven't missed any reference to MG and the dogs in the PJ Files.  The GNR dogs reaction was only based on the rotting fridge contents and any dog would have reacted the same. Numi and Kit's only 'reliable' scenting to the Turkish towel scent allegedly used by Madeleine was out on the street near the leisure/carpark area  but as she will have walked passed there with the McCanns on many other occasions to the supermarket and to the creche, the alerts held little value.

'After entering the apartment, it was observed that the odour came from close to the fridge, which was open and contained some rotting meat and vegetables.

During the searches carried out in the apartments no sign of the girl was found by the dogs.'


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GNR_SNIFFER.htm




GNR Officer Pedro Miguel Esteves Fernandes said:

'None of the dogs used in this search action, after having smelled the towel, went into block 5 but headed to the zone which gives access to the road between the apartment and the leisure area.'

and  'the missing minor passed that location, on the day of the events or before that date'

Re 5J he said that on 08/05/07, the search action was repeated but was centred on the dogs inside blocks 5 and 4 of the resort.

'Initiating the diligence, the first sniffer dog, after having smelled the towel used in the previous operation, began searching, it being certain that next to the doors of some apartment he demonstrated major interest whilst he did not even approach others. In none of these actions did the dog give him a signal that he had caught the scent of the missing child. It is certain however, that near apartment 5J, 5H and 4G, that the dog showed major interest in smelling the doors and the immediate areas. He states that next to 5H, there were two bags of rubbish which may condition the dog. Just outside apartment 4G was a tray with plates, cutlery and cloth napkins, apparently used. It is certain that this apartment is the one where the missing child's parents were lodged (at the time). In relation to the dog's interest at doorway 5J, the same may have been conditioned by the presence of people inside the apartment.
- After completing the search in the interior of block 5, verandas and apartment access, and whilst in the exterior, the sniffer dog took the same route he had taken on 04/05/07, being the road between that apartment and the leisure area-pool sand restaurant, and headed toward the same parking area. There he lost the scent of the search. This situation may be explained by the fact that the biggest concentration of odours in that location have been preserved and protected from the winds due to the adjoining walls. When this dog got to the main road, he turned right where a large dispersion of odours existed. Here the dog lost the scent.'

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PEDRO_ESTEVES.htm

Antonio Freitas Silva handler of one of the GNR dogs re the reaction to the scenting in the street said:

'Taking into account the aforementioned results, he states that it can be confirmed with a certain degree of certainty that the missing child passed by that location, on that day or on a previous day. This situation can be explained by the nature of the terrain, that is, it is a small space enclosed by walls and as such lingering scents would take longer to dissipate.'

Re the dogs reaction to 5J he said:

'The dog did not demonstrate to its owner that it had found the scent it was searching for.'

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ANTONIO_SILVA.htm


All the GNR officers could conclude was that 'Someone' from 5a who used the Turkish towel provided for the GNR dog scent search walked down the street between the apartment and the leisure area on the 03/05/2007 or before that date.

Re 5J both officers gave good reasoning for their dogs interest in 5J and other apartments, and neither concluded that their dogs demonstrated that it had found the scent it was searching for.

Mark Harrison will have used the above intelligence provided by the GNR officers and deemed that it would be of no value to deploy Martin and the dogs to 5J.

Hope this helps :)

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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by skyrocket on 06.07.15 15:59

Syn - friends as usual your reply went above and beyond! Much appreciated and yes it did clear up the matter of 5J for me.
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Re: Those unreliable dogs...

Post by Syn on 07.07.15 21:51

@skyrocket wrote:Syn - friends as usual your reply went above and beyond! Much appreciated and yes it did clear up the matter of 5J for me.
Thank you and you are very welcome skyrocket  smilie

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Fascinating programme on identical twins last night... and dogs.

Post by comperedna on 16.07.15 11:54

Towards the end of the programme, having spent most of it explaining how very similar identical twins were in so many ways besides looks and likes, even when brought up apart, the programme considered their differences. Though DNA was the same and 80%+ of IQ, fingerprints were as different as any other two people's. Moreover specially trained SNIFFER DOGS, when given the scent of one identical twin, could easily distinguish between them. THOSE AMAZING DOGS YET AGAIN.

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Wood flour mill

Post by PeterMac on 18.07.15 22:52

And in the aftermath of the devastating exposion in Cheshire, England of the wood flour mill, there are four people missing.  As we say in England "presumed dead"  which is code for . . .

Are they asking Gerry and Kate to help ? ? ? /
NO
They are using DOGS. Drawn from three adjacent Police Forces.
And by tomorrow all four victims will have been identified and recovered with proper dignity.

McCanns and your supporters -  be ASHAMED.

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Medical Snifferdog Lacey

Post by aquila on 22.07.15 8:24

I watched a lovely programme on catch up tv last night 'The Secret Life of Twins' all about identical twins. It was interesting, factual and truly heartwarming.

A segment of the programme showed a medical snifferdog called Lacey being set a task to identify the dna of a particular twin. DNA samples of both twins were offered up along with another 5 random DNA samples. The dog was tasked to find only the DNA of 1 twin. Lacey achieved it in seconds.

Here is the itvplayer link. It's at around 29mins.

https://www.itv.com/itvplayer/the-secret-life-of-twins
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