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McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by russiandoll on 01.05.14 15:12

Seek truth wrote:Spoilt brats.

What's Portugal done now? SY have been since 2011 on it but they haven't complained about them!

 Note also  SY are on board.... with them central,  as if they are at the helm with the police as their boat-crew. Arrogant as ever.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by diatribe on 01.05.14 15:13

Seek truth wrote:Spoilt brats.

What's Portugal done now? SY have been since 2011 on it but they haven't complained about them!

That's because they're onside, Seek truth. Whilst Scotland Yard are clearly conducting what amounts to a wild goose chase, there is a possibility if they haven't been nobbled by the UK gov. that the Portuguese police are conducting an authentic investigation.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Guest on 01.05.14 15:35

russiandoll wrote:
 Note also  SY are on board.... with them central,  as if they are at the helm with the police as their boat-crew. Arrogant as ever.
***
Yes, RD, that hit me too: as if they own them ...
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by jeanmonroe on 01.05.14 15:37

Those 'pesky' Portuguese PJ fellows have a 'nasty' habit of re-leasing 'case files' into the public domain.

The extremely embarrassed Superintendent of Leicestershire Police, Stuart 'protect McCanns at all costs' Prior will testify to that!

He never, ever, in his wildest dreams, ever thought that his 'helpful' e-mails to the T7 and all round good 'buddy' to the McCanns would ever see 'the light of day'

Bet DCI Andy Redwood and the brilliant Met, can't wait to see all their 'actions' investigating ONLY an 'abduction' displayed in the public domain.

(neither can i!)  laughat laughat 

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by diatribe on 01.05.14 15:42

jeanmonroe wrote:

Bet DCI Andy Redwood and the brilliant Met, can't wait to see all their 'actions' investigating ONLY an 'abduction' displayed in the public domain.

(neither can i!)  laughat laughat 

I stand to be corrected, but I think such an action by any British police force would be unprecedented, certainly in an ongoing enquiry.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by jeanmonroe on 01.05.14 15:54

diatribe wrote:
jeanmonroe wrote:

Bet DCI Andy Redwood and the brilliant Met, can't wait to see all their 'actions' investigating ONLY an 'abduction' displayed in the public domain.

(neither can i!)  laughat laughat 

I stand to be corrected, but I think such an action by any British police force would be unprecedented, certainly in an ongoing enquiry.

Not if the Portuguese 're-shelve' their current investigation.

I can see why the Met wouldn't be 'pleased'

Who knows what would become publicly 'avaiiable'?

6,000 'suspects' 20 million phone 'calls' to trace, ONLY 'abduction' hypothesis 'considered' etc.

In Portuguese law, i believe the PJ have to release their 'files' if a case is 'shelved'

I think!

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by lj on 01.05.14 16:17

Tony Bennett wrote:This bit nails pretty precisely the level of non-co-operation between the two forces, and this despite 26 visits to Portugal, £8 million (and rising by over £6,000 a day), and a slew of leaks either by Operation Grange or 'a source close to the McCanns' claiming there was excellent co-operation - and utter nonsense like 'the tempo is moving forwards':

"Mrs McCann said she was particularly frustrated that police in Portugal had so far ruled out a joint inquiry with their British counterparts.

"As a parent, I find the slowness of action in Portugal really hard to take. I find it quite distressing," she said.

"Even though we're seven years down the line, waiting weeks or months, particularly for letters of request to be processed basically... it is frustrating.

"I suppose I do struggle with the fact. Please work together."



+++++++++++++++++++++

It is surely now as plain as a pikestaff.

The two forces have NOT been working together.

For three years the Portugues have NOT agreed to a joint review/investigation.

The Portuguese authorities have NOT answered the rogatory letter enquiries from the British.

The McCanns and their expensive team of advisers have NOT been able to get their hands on the 'missing files' they want to get hold of and examine.

This entire flawed investigation by Scotland Yard is never going to get anywhere meaningful, and those directly or indirectly responsible for the complete disappearance of Madeleine McCann are unlikely to be caught and prosecuted.




I do think we should be glad for that. Maybe something useful will come out of the PJ investigation. That would never have happened if Andy and/or TM would have gotten their fingers on some files.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by jeanmonroe on 01.05.14 16:25

Is this true?

Gerry and Kate McCann went to London today and left dangling signs on their Rothley house doors saying "Gone Phishing"


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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by TheTruthWillOut on 01.05.14 16:45

jeanmonroe wrote:Is this true?

Gerry and Kate McCann went to London today and left dangling signs on their Rothley house doors saying "Gone Phishing"


Would you like me to check!? lol4
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by tigger on 01.05.14 17:19

Tony Bennett wrote:This bit nails pretty precisely the level of non-co-operation between the two forces, and this despite 26 visits to Portugal, £8 million (and rising by over £6,000 a day), and a slew of leaks either by Operation Grange or 'a source close to the McCanns' claiming there was excellent co-operation - and utter nonsense like 'the tempo is moving forwards':

"Mrs McCann said she was particularly frustrated that police in Portugal had so far ruled out a joint inquiry with their British counterparts.

"As a parent, I find the slowness of action in Portugal really hard to take. I find it quite distressing," she said.

"Even though we're seven years down the line, waiting weeks or months, particularly for letters of request to be processed basically... it is frustrating.

"I suppose I do struggle with the fact. Please work together."



+++++++++++++++++++++

It is surely now as plain as a pikestaff.

The two forces have NOT been working together.

For three years the Portugues have NOT agreed to a joint review/investigation.

The Portuguese authorities have NOT answered the rogatory letter enquiries from the British.

The McCanns and their expensive team of advisers have NOT been able to get their hands on the 'missing files' they want to get hold of and examine.

This entire flawed investigation by Scotland Yard is never going to get anywhere meaningful, and those directly or indirectly responsible for the complete disappearance of Madeleine McCann are unlikely to be caught and prosecuted.



SY have sent 31 ILORs - ONE of which was to Portugal. Doesn't look like a close working relationship to me. The horrifying possibility that up to 30 different countries may have been sent an ILOR cannot be dismissed. let's see, Brazil?  Morocco, Germany, Russia (although that wasn't much of a draw publicity wise) , Austria, Croatia....

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Gillyspot on 01.05.14 17:35

Looks like Portugal is getting their own back on UK police/Home Office for their delays/refusals to help when they asked for information during the initial investigation.  Who can blame them? Not me.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by aquila on 01.05.14 17:47

Gillyspot wrote:Looks like Portugal is getting their own back on UK police/Home Office for their delays/refusals to help when they asked for information during the initial investigation.  Who can blame them? Not me.
It might have all been a bit easier if the McCanns hadn't brought a libel trial to Portugal involving a senior police officer and brought the f***ing media trash that goes with all things McCann.

It's my understanding the McCanns were offered the option to hold the libel trial in camera and they refused.

All part of the 'wider campaign'?

Apologies for the bad language.
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by MRNOODLES on 01.05.14 18:59

Tony Bennett wrote:
MRNOODLES wrote:"Madeleine McCann wearing an Everton football shirt Madeleine went missing seven years ago this month"

Pardon have I missed something here?
Yes you have.

It should have been edited to read like this

[PICTURE (not available): Madeleine McCann wearing an Everton football shirt]

"Madeleine went missing seven years ago this month".

++++++++++++++++++

In copying-and-pasting, very often the photograph gets lost, but the caption remains.

Tasprin was no doubt doing her best, however, the caption (first part) and the text (second part) got put together in one line as part of the copying-and-pasting exercise.

Hopes that's clear

Oh right.

Sorry I wasn't being funny to the OP. I thought the BBC was re-writing history. big grin 
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by TheTruthWillOut on 01.05.14 19:05

I'm confused. The McCann's are now on record complaining the PJ aren't playing ball with SY. Yet when Paul Luckman from Portugal News spoke to 5live he said:

Rachel – What about this assault on a 10 year old girl back in 2005 in Praia Da Luz. Now that's only recent that information & we don't know why it's only come to light recently. There are all sorts of … potential explanations. It could be that the child herself didn't report it at the time, They have to look closely at something like that don't they.




PL – Well the police will look closely and I think that the attitude, certainly the comments that I heard yesterday I believe eh will do little to create good relations between the English police and the Portuguese Police who are trying very hard to get this resolved. They have reopened the case




Rachel (interrupts) – are they cooperating with the Met?




PL – Yes, totally em this, this suggestion that they're not. I read headlines in the UK this morning arrests imminent … complete nonsense


Who to believe?


I think the Mc's/UK tabloids are going out their way to disrupt the SY/PJ by having "stories" printed that undermines them/the investigation....IMO.
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McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by XTC on 01.05.14 23:33

aquila wrote:
Gillyspot wrote:Looks like Portugal is getting their own back on UK police/Home Office for their delays/refusals to help when they asked for information during the initial investigation.  Who can blame them? Not me.
It might have all been a bit easier if the McCanns hadn't brought a libel trial to Portugal involving a senior police officer and brought the f***ing media trash that goes with all things McCann.

It's my understanding the McCanns were offered the option to hold the libel trial in camera and they refused.

All part of the 'wider campaign'?

Apologies for the bad language.
Gillyspot

No I wouldn't blame them for that. I do suspect that unlike SY the latest PJ team will have read the previous archiving Summary and may not be best pleased with the obstruction from the UK Authorites that really happened. What once was rumour is now written fact so to speak.

I must say that it takes a great deal of front for a couple to mislay a child ( one way or the other ) and then try to derail the initial process
knowing that you are going to be the first people the police question when your child is missing. It goes with the legal territory as they say.

The problem was that as soon as the investigative compass pointed North some participants wanted it to point South and here we all are in the Antarctic of the Interrupted Investigation. Blacksmith's latest is a fair assessment I think. Namely that if SY are busying themselves with a re-archiving ( nothing to see here ) and don't follow the logical process of the initial investigation then as far as the British are concerned it is back to the drawing board and at least we tried and failed to find Madeleiene. The problem is that for all concerned is that this particular current Judicial Secerecy is now seceret. No-one knows what the current PJ people are doing. It's not so much of a case of getting information into the process as much as not knowing what the process is and what the PJ are doing with it? Neither SY or anyone else knows what the PJ are up to. I kind of like that.

As a  of side issue re: The Libel Case: Mr Amaral and his legal team have apparently been asked to pay for and get an update of Madeleine's  status from the UK. This is interesting because as a WOC the the Family Court must think that they are dealing with a findable alive  person. You can't represent a non alive person it is impossible I think. The  thing is that both the PJ and SY are contemplating that the stranger who may have abducted her may have removed Madeleine from 5a not alive. What a dilemma for the Libel Judge. Yet again a Judge in a case will by definition of his/her findings have to state for the record that Madeleine is dead or alive. The AG doesn't know, the initial investigative team thought they did and SY are in a similar position to the parents.

Who'd be a Judge?






the current

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Doug D on 02.05.14 0:29

Jeanmonroe:
 
‘Not if the Portuguese 're-shelve' their current investigation.
I can see why the Met wouldn't be 'pleased'
Who knows what would become publicly 'available'?
6,000 'suspects' 20 million phone 'calls' to trace, ONLY 'abduction' hypothesis 'considered' etc.
In Portuguese law, i believe the PJ have to release their 'files' if a case is 'shelved'
I think!’
 
Aside from the PJ probably not trusting SY, due to the lack of co-operation first time round, failure to come up with medical records, the dodgy-dosier (re-written FSS reports) destruction of evidence, etc etc, from todays interviews and previous reports it does seem to be clear that TM are desperate to get inside the PJ’s current investigation.
 
PJ are obviously not going to play one-way ball, and Redwood is certainly not going to give his new files to the PJ as he would be scared stiff that if they did become part of a joint investigation they might get released into the public domain at some time in the future.
 
Other than what gets released in Met. statements & press ‘leaks’, Redwood’s files ever getting to be seen in public is just wishful thinking I believe.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by jeanmonroe on 02.05.14 2:08

Doug D

Other than what gets released in Met. statements & press ‘leaks’, Redwood’s files ever getting to be seen in public is just wishful thinking I believe.
----------------------------------------------------------
THAT'S WHAT LEICESTERSHIRE POLICE AND SUPERINTENDENT STUART PRIOR 'THOUGHT'

OOPPPS!

We know the PJ/Met have had at 'least' 26 'meetings/visits'

The first 10, say, may have been very 'amicable' but the next,say, 16, with the Met 'insisting' ONLY on 'abduction' (their remit) by a stranger and NOTHING else.?

ALL those meetings/visits would have been minuted, given the PJ's previous er, 'dealings' with UK Police in their first 'investigation'

So if the PJ do 'reshelve', not CLOSE, their second 'investigation', as the McCanns tried to 'convince' the world, the first investigation had been, then the details of those 26 'meetings/visits' WILL be publicly released.

I'm sure the Met haven't 'obstructed' any PJ 'work' but, if they have, everybody will know, they did, eventually.

imo.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Watching on 02.05.14 6:19

jeanmonroe wrote:Unless someone knows different:

The McCanns can be re-arguidoed the moment one or both, or any of their 'friends', set foot on Portuguese soil.

As the PJ's investigation is 'live' that is what can happen.

And it dosen't matter how many of the 38, solely dedicated, full time, 'Maddie Cops' they 'surround' themselves with.

See ya in Lisbon, PDL, Gerry and Kate.


What was it Mourinho said of his team, Chelsea, they might not be going to Lisbon, but he will be going in the summer - he always does - said he!  Funny guy!

Maybe Mr & Mrs will be making that trip too, without their team (of fancy lawyers)

38 Met detectives?  That's one question each from Mrs' long list of 'unanswered' they can put to her.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by aiyoyo on 02.05.14 9:18

Mr & Mrs must be confident MET investigation isn't going to end up at their door.

Else you'd have to ponder at their point in being scathing the Portuguese and their point on commenting about the Review.
Contrary to earlier statement on their FM website wherein it was stated they weren't going to comment on ongoing investigation, at the same time people were warned against speculating, they are breaching their own rule.

Their PR spin won't go unnoticed by MET surely? Even if their objective was to highlight the old leads (from the horse's mouth) and drew public attention to that and away from them (look there, not here) what tangible result would they achieve from this PR exercise? ZILCH, nothing, nada, except hoping the public will continue to be fooled by their lies. But they are so transparent, I doubt the public are taken in.
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Doug D on 02.05.14 9:54

Jeanmonroe

Yes I agree the meeting minutes, correspondence etc will get into the PJ files and potentially get released, but Andy's files, I suspect, are not an 'open-book' at the meetings, which probably accounts for much of the alleged friction between the two parties.

He wants everything the PJ have, but is not prepared to reciprocate.

This is not evidence based, but I know that if I were in Andy's shoes, being pushed along the course he appears to be forced along, I would certainly not want to risk giving up all of my files for possible publication and presumably ridicule further down the line, although the minutes etc may be damning enough.

Stuart Prior & co. never realised the openness of the Portugese system in their previous dealings with the PJ.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Monty Heck on 02.05.14 10:29

PeterMac wrote:This jumped out at me.
She said: “It’s where I last saw her, where I last held her.

Even in the book there is precious little 'holding'. (barring the first years where she was screaming with colic or some other undisclosed condition)
Even when they are having their last story Kate is on the with the twins and Madeleine is "snuggled down" in bed.
NOT being cuddled, or held.

And then we add "where I last held her" to the cadaverine traces on Kate's clothing, cuddle cat . . .
And she may be telling the truth, and giving too much information,as they usually do.

Gerry's job was, or 'could have been'  the more clinical one of disposal, blue tennis bag, take the afternoon off because of the ruptured Achilles tendon, (which was miraculously healed by Pope John Paul II - recently canonised ? ? )
borrow a car, or take a taxi a short distance . . .
of course that is pure fantasy.
A taxi driver may have remembered GMcC so maybe not such a great method?  Taking a bus would have been fairly anonymous though.  There's a good service from PDL that goes either west along the coast or east into Lagos where buses go further afield from the bus station there.  The PDL bus stop is near the church so very handy for OC club guests.  If someone with something to hide took the bus going west, that would open up a pretty big expanse of fairly empty countryside and coastline within a very short time frame.  Certainly such a person could be at their chosen location and back between, say morning tennis and the evening games.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Guest on 02.05.14 10:39

Monty Heck wrote:
PeterMac wrote:This jumped out at me.
She said: “It’s where I last saw her, where I last held her.

Even in the book there is precious little 'holding'. (barring the first years where she was screaming with colic or some other undisclosed condition)
Even when they are having their last story Kate is on the with the twins and Madeleine is "snuggled down" in bed.
NOT being cuddled, or held.

And then we add "where I last held her" to the cadaverine traces on Kate's clothing, cuddle cat . . .
And she may be telling the truth, and giving too much information,as they usually do.

Gerry's job was, or 'could have been'  the more clinical one of disposal, blue tennis bag, take the afternoon off because of the ruptured Achilles tendon, (which was miraculously healed by Pope John Paul II - recently canonised ? ? )
borrow a car, or take a taxi a short distance . . .
of course that is pure fantasy.
A taxi driver may have remembered GMcC so maybe not such a great method?  Taking a bus would have been fairly anonymous though.  There's a good service from PDL that goes either west along the coast or east into Lagos where buses go further afield from the bus station there.  The PDL bus stop is near the church so very handy for OC club guests.  If someone with something to hide took the bus going west, that would open up a pretty big expanse of fairly empty countryside and coastline within a very short time frame.  Certainly such a person could be at their chosen location and back between, say morning tennis and the evening games.
Can't see Gerry hopping on a bus carrying a big 'heavy' sports bag. If it had a few passengers on then wouldn't be anonymous at all. Bus driver more likely to recognise him than a taxi driver IMO as would have a good look when got on and paid fare. In a taxi, you can just jump in the back and sit directly behind the driver. Hand over the fare and get out..
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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by jeanmonroe on 02.05.14 12:48

Doug D

"...but I know that if I were in Andy's shoes, I would certainly not want to risk giving up all of my files for possible publication and presumably ridicule further down the line"
-------------------------------

Ridicule FURTHER down the line?  laughat 

Andy Redwood leapt/jumped/bounded over/was pushed "over the line" the moment he first,  publicly, stated his elite team of Maddie Cops were 'investigating' ONLY 'abduction, by a stranger'

NOT 'considering/ignoring', completely, ANY 'OTHER' EXPLANATION as to why Madeleine 'is not here'.

No, i'm afraid, the best, 30 year 'career' Detective Chief Inspector Mr Redwood, can hope for, is that the current, some say brought on himself, by himself, and reflected on his 37 'ELITE Maddie Cops' colleagues, 'ridicule' will lessen.

He, and his 'team' have seemingly, IGNORED, completely, any 'discrepancies and contradictions', about the McCanns 'version of events' supplied to Operation Grange, by intelligent, thoughtful people, who, by the way, he 'asked' to provide any 'information they might consider relevent and pertinent' that might lead to 'solving' the 'disappearance' of a 3 years old child.

If 'the line' was in a long jump pit, set at a distance of 15 METRES, DCI Redwood would have broken that 'world record' many times over!

all imho, obviously.  winkwink winkwink

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by Cristobell on 02.05.14 14:56

aiyoyo wrote:Mr & Mrs must be confident MET investigation isn't going to end up at their door.

Else you'd have to ponder at their point in being scathing the Portuguese and their point on commenting about the Review.
Contrary to earlier statement on their FM website wherein it was stated they weren't going to comment on ongoing investigation, at the same time people were warned against speculating, they are breaching their own rule.

Their PR spin won't go unnoticed by MET surely? Even if their objective was to highlight the old leads (from the horse's mouth) and drew public attention to that and away from them (look there, not here)  what tangible result would they achieve from this PR exercise? ZILCH, nothing, nada, except hoping the public will continue to be fooled by their lies. But they are so transparent, I doubt the public are taken in.
I don't think public are taken in anymore either Aiyoyo, even Lorraine was not as fawning as she normally is.  The public have had 7 years of swarthy, smelly suspects and the case still carries on going round in circles, and probably will until perpetuity.  Its groundhog day, because whatever way they look at it, and they are back to square one again by the sound of it, they will not find an abductor, because there wasn't one.

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Re: McCanns "frustrated" by lack of joint inquiry

Post by noddy100 on 02.05.14 15:01

Cristobell wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:Mr & Mrs must be confident MET investigation isn't going to end up at their door.

Else you'd have to ponder at their point in being scathing the Portuguese and their point on commenting about the Review.
Contrary to earlier statement on their FM website wherein it was stated they weren't going to comment on ongoing investigation, at the same time people were warned against speculating, they are breaching their own rule.

Their PR spin won't go unnoticed by MET surely? Even if their objective was to highlight the old leads (from the horse's mouth) and drew public attention to that and away from them (look there, not here)  what tangible result would they achieve from this PR exercise? ZILCH, nothing, nada, except hoping the public will continue to be fooled by their lies. But they are so transparent, I doubt the public are taken in.
I don't think public are taken in anymore either Aiyoyo, even Lorraine was not as fawning as she normally is.  The public have had 7 years of swarthy, smelly suspects and the case still carries on going round in circles, and probably will until perpetuity.  Its groundhog day, because whatever way they look at it, and they are back to square one again by the sound of it, they will not find an abductor, because there wasn't one.
I also thought Lorraine wasn't as OTT fawning with them

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