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Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

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Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Doug D on 04.04.14 0:12

When you look at this case, Grange is fair galloping along!

Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-26865695

The Commons Committee on Standards ordered her to repay £5,800 to cover over-claiming of mortgage expenses after she failed to cut her claims as interest rates fell.
It cleared her of making false expenses claims, but said her submission of "incomplete" evidence to the inquiry had breached the MPs' code of conduct.
 
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201314/cmselect/cmstandards/1179/1179.pdf

‘The time taken to deal with this case

 As is well known, the complaint against Mrs Miller was made on 11 December 2012. The Commissioner was able to gather information about Mrs Miller’s parents’ situation, but there was subsequently protracted correspondence about other matters. The Commissioner submitted a memorandum to us on 23 January 2014.’
 
Current membership
Rt Hon Kevin Barron MP (Labour, Rother Valley)    (Chair) Sir Paul Beresford MP (Conservative, Mole Valley) Mr Robert Buckland MP (Conservative, South Swindon) Mr Christopher Chope MP (Conservative, Christchurch)
Rt Hon Mr Tom Clarke MP (Labour, Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) Sharon Darcy (Lay Member) Mr Geoffrey Cox MP (Conservative, Torridge and West Devon) Sir Nick Harvey MP (Liberal Democrat, North Devon)
Fiona O’Donnell MP (Labour, East Lothian) Mr Peter Jinman (Lay Member) Mr Walter Rader (Lay Member) Heather Wheeler MP (Conservative, South Derbyshire) Dr Alan Whitehead MP (Labour, Southampton Test)
The following were also Members of the Committee during the Parliament:
Annette Brooke MP (Liberal Democrat, Mid Dorset and North Poole)
 
 
Over 12 months work by 'the commissioner' (and his staff presumably), then 14 Members (all but 3 are MP's) on the committee, to produce a 113 page report to decide that she must repay £5800. God knows how many hours and how much money this has taken.
 
Although published today, the report was ordered by the House of Commons to be printed 1 April 2014, which seems pretty apt.
 
 
 

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Mirage on 04.04.14 0:21

Twitter is buzzing with this. People are very angry. As were the Bristol audience on tonight's Question Time.

She has obviously been very obstructive with the investigating committee and this will prove extremely damaging for Cameron.

I don't think this is going away somehow. I predict she will be forced out over this. Another narcissist who thinks she's above being questioned.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Gillyspot on 04.04.14 8:16

If she goes (resigns) then it will be at a general election. They get to keep their full pensions then but if the go mid term they do not.  Have a look at how many "expenses" MP's resigned mid term.

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Politicians' expenses in Ireland

Post by Enid O'Dowd on 04.04.14 9:13

I saw Maria Miller make her 'apology' / statement on Sky News.  She had, it seems, 'inadvertently' overclaimed the interest on the mortgage on her second home used when she is in London attending Parliament.

In Ireland we have a unique system of expenses (politicians make the expenses rules and set the rates...). Take their 'travel' expenses, known as 'turning up' money to cynical people like me!  A round figure sum is paid tax free every month with salary depending on how far from the Dail (Parliament) the politician lives.  They don't have to submit claims detailing dates, distance travelled, receipts for accommodation where they live outside Dublin. At the end of the year they self certify that the spent all their travel money on travel - and surprise surprise with very rare exceptions they all certify that they spent exactly the round figure allowance on travel and this is never questioned; their certificates are merely filed. One TD (MP) who lives 1 km from the Dail and does not even run a car, certified that he spent ALL his €9000 pa allowance on travel. Those who live within 25-59 km from the Dail (= a normal commute) get €25,295 pa for travel (more than many of their constituents earn) but they managed to spend it all on 'travel.'

The 'travel' allowance is really salary. Our legislation permits the payment of travel allowances to politicians tax free which is why I suspect they need such generous travel allowances!

Ordinary workers pay their own travel expenses to work. Our 226 politicians are special people and don't have to. Interesting that ALL the various leftie TDs take their travel money in full and don't decline it in solidarity with other workers!

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Guest on 05.04.14 7:45

I also watched her "apology" all 32 seconds of it. Is this her culture? Miller doesn't need the money just wants more of it, She overclaimed by £45,00 and only has to pay back £5,800 Why is she still in her job? IMO she should resign or be sacked,  That woman probably thought her false sorry would be the end of it, but it's not going to go away.

.Maria Miller expenses report: how Culture Secretary tried to bully MP watchdog
Pressure grows on Maria Miller as it emerges that she warned Commons standards Commissioner and that her adviser 'flagged up' Culture Secretary's role in press regulation to Telegraph as it investigated her expenses claims


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/conservative-mps-expenses/10746003/Maria-Miller-expenses-report-how-Culture-Secretary-tried-to-bully-MP-watchdog.html
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by PeterMac on 05.04.14 9:03

So she tried to intimidate the Telegraph by threatening them with "Leveson"
In exactly the same way as Archer et al. threatened people with Libel lawyers
and exactly the same way another couple have threatened - and followed through with their threats - of Carter-Ruck.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by plebgate on 05.04.14 9:51

Cherry Blossom wrote:I also watched her "apology" all 32 seconds of it. Is this her culture? Miller doesn't need the money just wants more of it, She overclaimed by £45,00 and only has to pay back £5,800 Why is she still in her job? IMO she should resign or be sacked,  That woman probably thought her false sorry would be the end of it, but it's not going to go away.

.Maria Miller expenses report: how Culture Secretary tried to bully MP watchdog
Pressure grows on Maria Miller as it emerges that she warned Commons standards Commissioner and that her adviser 'flagged up' Culture Secretary's role in press regulation to Telegraph as it investigated her expenses claims


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/conservative-mps-expenses/10746003/Maria-Miller-expenses-report-how-Culture-Secretary-tried-to-bully-MP-watchdog.html
She should be sacked imo.  No two ways about it.   Does Cameron really believe he can achieve a majority at the next election?  

On question time, one of the audience had a go at Hain and said several times she should be sacked as anyone working in the private sector would be.   None of the panel wanted to take this point on and were relieved to move on.    WHAT A BUNCH we have GOVERNING US.    Makes me feel ill, it really does. 

MILLER FOR THE SACK   NOW.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Guest on 05.04.14 12:42

@plebgate wrote:
Cherry Blossom wrote:I also watched her "apology" all 32 seconds of it. Is this her culture? Miller doesn't need the money just wants more of it, She overclaimed by £45,00 and only has to pay back £5,800 Why is she still in her job? IMO she should resign or be sacked,  That woman probably thought her false sorry would be the end of it, but it's not going to go away.

.Maria Miller expenses report: how Culture Secretary tried to bully MP watchdog
Pressure grows on Maria Miller as it emerges that she warned Commons standards Commissioner and that her adviser 'flagged up' Culture Secretary's role in press regulation to Telegraph as it investigated her expenses claims


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/conservative-mps-expenses/10746003/Maria-Miller-expenses-report-how-Culture-Secretary-tried-to-bully-MP-watchdog.html
She should be sacked imo.  No two ways about it.   Does Cameron really believe he can achieve a majority at the next election?  

On question time, one of the audience had a go at Hain and said several times she should be sacked as anyone working in the private sector would be.   None of the panel wanted to take this point on and were relieved to move on.    WHAT A BUNCH we have GOVERNING US.    Makes me feel ill, it really does. 

MILLER FOR THE SACK   NOW.

Completly agree plebgate, It does make you wonder how many more newspapers have been threatened by using the name with "Levison"

Labour have written to the coppers:

Assistant Commissioner Mark Rowley
Metropolitan Police Special Crime Directorate
New Scotland Yard
8-10 Broadway
Westminster
London SW1H 0BG

Dear Commissioner Rowley,

Re House of Commons Committee on Standards Report into Maria Miller

The Standards Committee Report published today, 3 April 2014, finds that Maria Miller overclaimed £5800 of mortgage payments and required her to make a personal statement on the floor of the House of Commons.

The key conclusions are as follows:

The House of Commons Code of Conduct from 2002 stipulated that: “No improper use shall be made of any payment or allowance made to Members for public purposes”. We have seen no evidence to suggest that Mrs Miller failed to abide by this part of the Code.

The 2002 rule had a second part stipulating that “the administrative rules which apply to such payments and allowances must be strictly observed”. Mrs Miller failed to observe this.

We have already recommended that Mrs Miller repay the £5,800 which she has identified as an over-claim. She should also apologise by personal statement on the floor of the House for her attitude to the Commissioner’s inquiries.

I believe the widely differing conclusions of the Commissioner and the Committee detailed in the Report are important to note and, in my view, warrant further investigation.

On the issue Mrs Miller’s decision to designate her constituency home in Basingstoke as her main home, the Commissioner states:

In my view Mrs Miller’s London home would have been maintained in any case, even had she not been an MP.The statement provided by Mrs Miller’s legal advisersaid that she had to have a second home”exclusively and necessarily for her parliamentary duties”. It cannot be said that her London home was established or maintained”exclusively and necessarily for her parliamentary duties”

I consider it more likely than not that Mrs Miller’s London home was her main home, as a matter of fact, and that the expenses which she incurred on staying away from her main home in order to perform her parliamentary duties were those associated with the Basingstoke properties.

The Commissioner also states that the Committee might take a different view and, indeed, it does. This Committee states:

We agree with the Commissioner that Mrs Miller should properly have designated London as her main home rather than Basingstoke.

Nonetheless, we consider that Mrs Miller’s designation was reasonable in the light of the guidance available at the time, given that the matter was finely balanced. Accordingly we make no criticism of Mrs Miller for her error.

On the issue of by how much Mrs Miller overclaimed there is also some disagreement between the Commissioner and the Committee.

The commissioner states that Miller over-claimed by more than £40,000.

In particular I find it difficult to believe that Mrs Miller genuinely thought she was entitled to make the additional claim for her extended mortgage in 2007 without any consultation with the House authorities or agreement from them.

If the Committee agrees with my interpretation of the rules, the total amount by which Mrs Miller has over-claimed in relation to her mortgage interest would be around £44,000, to which should be added a further £1,000 to take account of the reduction which she should have made to her claims for council tax to take account of her parents’ presence in the home.

Her apparent misuse of the allowances system continued for four years from May 2005 to the end of April 2009 and seems to have been brought to an end only by the expenses scandal of 2009-10 when she abruptly ceased to claim.

However the Committee does not accept this figure, for technical reasons, that it explains as follows:

As Mrs Miller pointed out, no attempt was made to ensure that newly elected Members only made claims against the original purchase price of the property. In these circumstances, imposing a strict interpretation of the rule would not be appropriate.

Whatever the strict construction of the rule, it was reasonable for Mrs Miller to claim the interest on her mortgage as it was when she entered the House, rather than as it was when she first purchased the property

Mrs Miller considers that she overclaimed on her mortgage by £5,800 in 2008-09. We have examined the figures carefully and accept that that is a reasonable assessment of the amount that she overclaimed. We recommend this sum should be repaid.

I note that the Committee’s report also states that Mrs Miller did not co-operate with the investigation:

Mrs Miller has also breached the current Code of Conduct by her attitude to this inquiry.

Given the widely differing conclusions of the Commission and the Committee regarding the serious allegations made about Mrs Miller and the fact that both the Commission and Committee feel that Mrs Miller did not cooperate with the inquiry, I believe this matter warrants further investigation and I believe the Metropolitan Police are the appropriate body to carry out such an investigation.

I have enclosed a copy of the report and await your response

Yours sincerely,

Thomas Docherty

Member of Parliament for Dunfermline and West Fife

http://order-order.com/

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by plebgate on 06.04.14 10:33

Agree CB - this is not going away and it definitely should not.   Well done the labour MP who has referred it to police.   Tories would have done so if boot on other foot.

This nonsense has got to stop.   Start now Cameron.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by IAmNotMerylStreep on 06.04.14 19:06

I notice Ian Duncan Smith was on the news just now sticking up for Maria Miller because of people calling for her resignation after her fraudulent expenses claims, saying this was turning into a witch hunt, yet he has been on a witch hunt of the sick and disabled since the tories came into power.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by aquila on 06.04.14 19:15

@IAmNotMerylStreep wrote:I notice Ian Duncan Smith was on the news just now sticking up for Maria Miller because of people calling for her resignation after her fraudulent expenses claims, saying this was turning into a witch hunt, yet he has been on a witch hunt of the sick and disabled since the tories came into power.

Awww...listen to Clarence Mitchell's devotion to IDS on twitter.

5th April 2014

Clarence Mitchell@mitch_1uk Apr 5
IDS Q&A: also makes key point, overlooked by media, that pensioners are exempt from spare room sub policy. pic.twitter.com/WDS96r8LBm





How can anyone ignore something in the media when Clarence is at the helm?

A senior politician can fiddle their expenses and it's called a witch hunt.

A senior citizen ought to be very grateful that they don't pay bedroom tax.

This is one f***ed up country.
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by aquila on 06.04.14 19:47

Remember that this expenses fiddle is all about property. A substantial profit was made on a second home which wasn't a second home and as I understand it government guidelines prohibited parents from living in the property.

How much did it cost to investigate this and to have it called a witch hunt.

Would the government like all senior citizens living in council housing to go to the crappy privatized care homes they also as individuals rake in profit from? (well that's if you can get into one of these cess pits for humans).

I am angry.
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by russiandoll on 06.04.14 22:04

More breaking in the Telegraph tomorrow re her owing capital gains tax of nearly £ 300,000.

She " flipped " her home to avoid tax allegedly.

 More in the Guardian tomorrow

 And this from twitter 

 Media still gunning for the shameless woman. Good.


Maria Miller called to resign as it's revealed she has bought Tudor barn worth £1.2m http://dailym.ai/PAKhXh  pic.twitter.com/OIsTTmcHds

 that amount being the same as the profit she made.

 The British taxpayer has paid for this.

 And Cameron stands by her?  He needs his head examining.


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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by TheTruthWillOut on 06.04.14 22:37

@Enid O'Dowd wrote:I saw Maria Miller make her 'apology' / statement on Sky News.  She had, it seems, 'inadvertently' overclaimed the interest on the mortgage on her second home used when she is in London attending Parliament.

In Ireland we have a unique system of expenses (politicians make the expenses rules and set the rates...). Take their 'travel' expenses, known as 'turning up' money to cynical people like me!  A round figure sum is paid tax free every month with salary depending on how far from the Dail (Parliament) the politician lives.  They don't have to submit claims detailing dates, distance travelled, receipts for accommodation where they live outside Dublin. At the end of the year they self certify that the spent all their travel money on travel - and surprise surprise with very rare exceptions they all certify that they spent exactly the round figure allowance on travel and this is never questioned; their certificates are merely filed. One TD (MP) who lives 1 km from the Dail and does not even run a car, certified that he spent ALL his €9000 pa allowance on travel. Those who live within 25-59 km from the Dail (= a normal commute) get €25,295 pa for travel (more than many of their constituents earn) but they managed to spend it all on 'travel.'

The 'travel' allowance is really salary. Our legislation permits the payment of travel allowances to politicians tax free which is why I suspect they need such generous travel allowances!

Ordinary workers pay their own travel expenses to work. Our 226 politicians are special people and don't have to. Interesting that ALL the various leftie TDs take their travel money in full and don't decline it in solidarity with other workers!

This so boils my pee. The real reason these people become MP's is to rob the tax payers and make a killing on property.

And the reason for Cameron defending Miller in this case is because he knows full well virtually every MP is guilty of similar to one degree or other at some point in the past.
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Tony Bennett on 06.04.14 22:39


"The official was among a group of Tory aides who stayed there during the conference in 2011 with the bill being footed by a taxpayer-funded organisation".

That'll be Stonewall, I guess

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by russiandoll on 06.04.14 22:41

All on Sky now, the Telegraph claiming that Miller redesignated her 2nd home as her main home after she discovered that rule changes meant tax would need paying once it was sold.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by TheTruthWillOut on 06.04.14 22:48

@russiandoll wrote:All on Sky now, the Telegraph claiming that Miller redesignated her 2nd home as her main home after she discovered that rule changes meant tax would need paying once it was sold.

So deliberate action to ensure maximum profit? No doubt 'within the rules', but also I'd wager her number 1 priority of being an MP. angry
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by russiandoll on 07.04.14 9:26

Her office is saying that the newspaper reports are  "factually and chronologically untrue ".

   The audit trail of money and official paperwork will show when this woman stopped claiming expenses for one home and why.

   She is a one hard-faced, cheeky, arrogant [ insert expletive of your choosing]

   Not much time for the Tories, but Norman T has gone up in my estimation after his words about her and it was amusing hearing David Mellor on Sky yesterday saying that if she stays she won't be noticed and if she goes, she won't be missed . He clearly does not find her especially talented.



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#MariaMiller Minister Disabled People 2010 to 2012 while fiddling her own expenses ,she was robbing you of legal aid and welfare.



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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Guest on 09.04.14 7:28

The Culture Secretary, Maria Miller, has resigned after a week of mounting pressure over her expenses investigation.

More follows...

http://news.sky.com/story/1239393/culture-secretary-maria-miller-resigns
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by Guest on 09.04.14 8:25

Cherry Blossom wrote:The Culture Secretary, Maria Miller, has resigned after a week of mounting pressure over her expenses investigation.

More follows...

http://news.sky.com/story/1239393/culture-secretary-maria-miller-resigns

Maria Miller's Letter Of Resignation
Updated: 7:28am UK, Wednesday 09 April 2014

The exchange of letters between the Prime Minister and Maria Miller is below:

LETTER TO THE PRIME MINISTER

9 April 2014

Dear Prime Minister,

It is with great regret that I have decided that I should tender my resignation as a member of the Cabinet.

I am very grateful to you for your personal support but it has become clear to me that the present situation has become a distraction from the vital work this Government is doing to turn our country around.

I have been a member of the Conservative Party for more than 30 years. As a working mother, educated at a South Wales Comprehensive School, I know that it is our Party that understands the importance of giving everyone the opportunity to succeed regardless of where they come from.

I am immensely proud of what my team have been able to achieve during my time in Government: ensuring that our arts and cultural institutions receive the rightful recognition that they deserve in making Britain Great; putting women front and centre of every aspect of DCMS's work; putting in place the legislation to enable all couples to have the opportunity to marry regardless of their sexuality.

Of course, implementing the recommendations made by Lord Justice Leveson on the future of media regulation, following the phone hacking scandals, would always be controversial for the press. Working together with you, I believe we struck the right balance between protecting the freedom of the press and ensuring fairness, particularly for victims of press intrusion to have a clear right of redress.

I will continue to support you and the work of the Government as you move forward. Ensuring the best future for the people of Basingstoke has been my priority throughout the last 9 years. Whether on the front or back benches of the House of Commons I will continue this work.

The only reason I was able to become an MP and indeed a Government Minister and Cabinet Minister is because of the unstinting support of my husband, my mother, my father and my three children. I owe them all a great deal.

Maria Miller

REPLY FROM THE PRIME MINISTER

9 April 2014

Dear Maria,

Thank you for your letter. I was very sorry to receive it.

I think it is important to be clear that the Committee on Standards cleared you of the unfounded allegations made against you, a point which has been lost in much of the comment in recent days.

You can be extremely proud of your work in Government - as Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport, as Minister for Women and as Minister for Disabled People.

You have been responsible for successfully handling two of the most controversial issues with which this Government has dealt. As Culture Secretary, you have played a critical role in advancing Britain's proud record of respect and equality in piloting the Equal Marriage Act through Parliament and onto the Statute Book. There are many people in our country today, and there will be many in the future, who will always be grateful for this very important change, which you did so much to bring about. You have also handled the sensitive subject of press regulation with skill and dedication.

You can be very proud as well that you have led one of the most important infrastructure projects: many more premises are now able to access super-fast broadband . You have also ensured a lasting legacy for the Olympic Games.

As you leave the Government, you should be proud of your service on the Frontbench and in Opposition.

I am personally very grateful for the support you have always given me, and which I am sure that you will continue to give.  I hope that you will be able to return to serving the Government on the Frontbench in due course, and am only sad that you are leaving the Government in these circumstances.

David Cameron

http://news.sky.com/story/1239393/maria-miller-resigns-as-culture-secretary

It's taken her long enough, should have done the honerable thing days ago. Seems Cameron has left the door open for her

PMQ's could be interesting!
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by plebgate on 09.04.14 9:09

What a pair of grovellers those 2 letters make them look (imo).    These are our leaders sadly.    She should be sacked and the new house sold and put back into the taxpayers' pocket.   This stinks.   To leave the door open for her return, what is the man thinking.  Let's hope her consistuents show some sense and BOOT THE GREEDY WOMAN OUT at the next election.    Same for all the others who have tried to get away with raiding the public purse for their own ends, GET EM OUT.

I would wager a tenner that Cameron was not looking forward to PMQs if she had not tendered this resignation.   He still wont be, but I cannot understand why, if he thinks so highly of her he has accepted her resignation.   If she has done nothing wrong surely he would have been able to stand up in The Commons and said so.  

I notice she got in Leveson in her resignation letter.  As though this is the reason for the so-called witch hunt against her by the Press.    Wake up and get in the real World and own what she has done.    If they did this, they might stand a chance of a majority at the next election, but yet again, IMO they have shown what a lilly livered bunch of chancers they are.  

PAH.

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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by tiny on 09.04.14 9:22

Is there not one mp who is not a thief.I just hope this gov don't get in at the next election,cameron has just proved what he is by keeping the door open for this person.what he has done is say sod the lower paid workers of this country.
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Re: Culture Secretary Maria Miller has apologised to MPs for her attitude towards an inquiry into her expenses.

Post by PeterMac on 09.04.14 9:41

@plebgate wrote:
I notice she got in Leveson in her resignation letter.  As though this is the reason for the so-called witch hunt against her by the Press. .

I think that might have a lot to do with it. Her aide tried to threaten the Telegraph in those terms, and no one likes a bully
Do they Gerry and Kate, and Adam T and Mrs M !!!
The ones who ripped off an old man of a third of his pension for the rest of his life, for their own disgusting morally bankrupt crusade.
Even the judge felt he had been trapped and said, in open court, and on the record, words to the effect "I wonder what would be the position if Madeleine had NOT been abducted ?"
He knew.
He knew, Kate

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