The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
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The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Welcome to 'The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann' forum 🌹

Please log in, or register to view all the forums as some of them are 'members only', then settle in and help us get to the truth about what really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann.

When you register please do NOT use your email address for a username because everyone will be able to see it!

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Post by Liz Eagles 22.03.14 13:43

The paid spokesperson for the McCanns is a political candidate for the Conservative Party.

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Post by Guest 22.03.14 13:46

If Redwood really wanted the public to understand that the Met are now working on the possibilty that death may have occurred in the apartment and a corpse rather than a live child removed from there, why didn't he include this on CW? Why tuck the words away, heavily obfuscated, at a private conference? And at which only one journalist saw the words as having sufficient gravitas to merit quoting them.

The words are out there, but seemingly only by default. Although I really hope I'm wrong about this. Let's see if another 'slip' occurs, then we'll know for sure.
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Post by Cristobell 22.03.14 13:48

aquila wrote:The paid spokesperson for the McCanns is a political candidate for the Conservative Party.
Politicians are not known for their loyalty Aquila, many would sacrifice their own mothers to further their careers.
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Post by noddy100 22.03.14 13:59

Dee Coy wrote:If Redwood really wanted the public to understand that the Met are now working on the possibilty that death may have occurred in the apartment and a corpse rather than a live child removed from there, why didn't he include this on CW? Why tuck the words away, heavily obfuscated, at a private conference? And at which only one journalist saw the words as having sufficient gravitas to merit quoting them.

The words are out there, but seemingly only by default. Although I really hope I'm wrong about this. Let's see if another 'slip' occurs, then we'll know for sure.
Sometimes I think/hope that he just does the wishy washy stuff to keep the McC's happy and all teh real work is going on behind the scenes and out of their sights (as it should be)
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Post by Guest 22.03.14 14:54

We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO
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Post by TheTruthWillOut 22.03.14 17:05

Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Is it known what the breakdown of the 37 strong team is?
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Post by Judex Venturus 22.03.14 17:24

russiandoll wrote:Cristobell, am not being pedantic, but Redwood's words do not necessarily mean what you claim they do. If  Maddie was dead when she was removed from 5a, that does not mean that the apartment was where she died.

 Just thought his wording gave some food for thought
Good point, russiandoll.

No TM detail is "innocent" of some kind of back-cover.

Think about how M. supposedly entered the apartment for the last time.

Quote LM "madeleine" p. 67.

"She looked so pale and worn out [because???] . . . she was really tired and wanted me to pick her up, which I did. Ten minutes later [exactly? Why?] , the five of us [ NB not just 'we'] went back to our apartment. I was carrying Madeleine. Because she was so exhausted we skipped playtime that evening."

Was M. already dying/dead as a result of something that had happened when she was 'alone' earlier in the afternoon while all the others (Ella etc) were away at the beach? 
Just a thought...
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Post by Okeydokey 22.03.14 17:25

Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Very few people here believe the McCanns murdered their child and Amaral certainly doesn't (and I don't - just for clarification).  So I am not sure that is as positive as you think. It's probably still part of the abduction hypothesis.
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Post by russiandoll 22.03.14 17:36

I tried to elaborate on my post with an edit yesterday but could not, apologies.

  I can be a pain in the nether regions I am sure when I jump on language, because I am trained in analysis and am also a linguist. It is second nature to me.

 It is probable that Redwood meant death in the apartment, but there is a slight ambiguity which made me wonder.

 I believe that Madeleine died before 3rd May and by the time the staged abduction was acted out she was away from the premises. moved temporarily to some secure location. It might be that while the drama was acted out, someone assisting took advantage of the chaos that late evening to move the body again.

 I just wondered if there was a scenario where Maddie was found dead outside, close to 5a then taken indoors to be tended to.

Have always had a bee in my bonnet about that balcony  [ it was not a patio as the apartment was on a slope and there was some drop to ground level of the garden area ].  There is at least one photo showing a table and chairs close to a wall, where I believe it was possible for Maddie to climb and fall.

I do not know how likely this is, given what was alerted to by the [ very reliable imo ] blood and cadaver dogs and in the grand scheme of things she would have died close to 5a had this been the case, so on second thoughts I should say sorry because I was being pedantic!

  re this from the book..

Think about how M. supposedly entered the apartment for the last time.

Quote LM "madeleine" p. 67.

"She looked so pale and worn out [because???] . . . she was really tired and wanted me to pick her up, which I did. Ten minutes later [exactly? Why?] , the five of us [ NB not just 'we'] went back to our apartment. I was carrying Madeleine. Because she was so exhausted we skipped playtime that evening."

Was M. already dying/dead as a result of something that had happened when she was 'alone' earlier in the afternoon while all the others (Ella etc) were away at the beach? 
Just a thought...

 Good points  [and a thought from me]. There are nuggets of truth mixed in with the untruths in the book and I can well believe that a scenario such as described above  was part of the picture.

 Imo however nothing like this happened on 3rd May and it might not have involved fatigue due to crèche activities.

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Post by Guest 22.03.14 18:10

TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Is it known what the breakdown of the 37 strong team is?
***
First thing I could find for documentation is this:

Operation Grange
Major Investigation Team 5
Homicide and Serious Crime Command
Belgravia Police station
202-206 Buckingham Palace Rd
London SW1W 9SX

operation.grange@met.police.uk
--
I cannot atm refer to other sources ...
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Post by TheTruthWillOut 22.03.14 18:34

Châtelaine wrote:
TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Is it known what the breakdown of the 37 strong team is?
***
First thing I could find for documentation is this:

Operation Grange
Major Investigation Team 5
Homicide and Serious Crime Command
Belgravia Police station
202-206 Buckingham Palace Rd
London SW1W 9SX

operation.grange@met.police.uk
--
I cannot atm refer to other sources ...

Thanks. Looking at this link is interesting: http://content.met.police.uk/Site/homicideseriouscrime tells us what they do.

Murder Investigation Teams investigate:

  • All murder, manslaughter and infanticide offences;
  • Deaths within the workplace or mass disaster where culpability for the loss of life is likely to be an issue in criminal court
  • Attempted murder where the evidence of intent is unambiguous or where a risk assessment identifies substantive risk to life
  • High-risk missing persons where there is a substantive reason to suspect life has been taken or is under threat
  • Linked series of two or more stranger rapes which are beyond the capability of SCD2 Sapphire Command or other 'critical incidents'

Additionally, the teams provide advice for the MPS and other police forces on 'High Risk' situations.
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Post by Doug D 22.03.14 19:47

A5: A Major Investigation Team (MIT) is assigned to Operation Grange.
This is made up of:
1 - Detective Chief Inspector
3 - Detective Inspectors
5 - Detective Sergeants
19 - Detective Constables
6 - Police support staff.
This MIT is assisted by 3 Murder Review Group Officers.
Staff numbers are open to change depending on the needs of the review. The MIT also continues to work on its existing outstanding homicide cases.
 
And a partridge in a pear tree (sorry that would make 38)!
 
http://www.met.police.uk/foi/pdfs/disclosure_2012/april_2012/2011120000923.pdf
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Post by aiyoyo 22.03.14 20:51

TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:
TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Is it known what the breakdown of the 37 strong team is?
***
First thing I could find for documentation is this:

Operation Grange
Major Investigation Team 5
Homicide and Serious Crime Command
Belgravia Police station
202-206 Buckingham Palace Rd
London SW1W 9SX

operation.grange@met.police.uk
--
I cannot atm refer to other sources ...

Thanks. Looking at this link is interesting: http://content.met.police.uk/Site/homicideseriouscrime tells us what they do.

Murder Investigation Teams investigate:

  • All murder, manslaughter and infanticide offences;
  • Deaths within the workplace or mass disaster where culpability for the loss of life is likely to be an issue in criminal court
  • Attempted murder where the evidence of intent is unambiguous or where a risk assessment identifies substantive risk to life
  • High-risk missing persons where there is a substantive reason to suspect life has been taken or is under threat
  • Linked series of two or more stranger rapes which are beyond the capability of SCD2 Sapphire Command or other 'critical incidents'

Additionally, the teams provide advice for the MPS and other police forces on 'High Risk' situations.

I,too, was optimistic at first.
But on reflection having a murder squad on the team merely signifies they are open minded - just that - nothing is ruled in or ruled out.
It does not necessary mean they're looking at a murder, just that nothing is ruled out, not even that.
In short they will let the evidence lead them depending where the evidence falls.
So far there's no definitive indication from Redwood which way the wind blows .....
The expensive costs of CW and this later appeal for info on a sex fiend would suggest there are some loose ends that need to be TIED.

Earlier report that the Result of the Review will not be published floors me.
It makes absolutely no $$ sense or practical or legal sense to waste taxpayers money on a review that engages the public of several countries in the search for leads/information only to have the result privy to No. 10.  Say if the result is to be meant for Court purposes as the reason behind the proclamation it is jumping the gun to assume the review will definitely lead to Court.  Tried as I might I can't work out why the decision not to publish the result was taken and announced from the outset when the result is still an unknown factor.
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Post by Woofer 22.03.14 21:14

@ aiyoyo - "Earlier report that the Result of the Review will not be published floors me.
It makes absolutely no $$ sense or practical or legal sense to waste taxpayers money on a review that engages the public of several countries in the search for leads/information only to have the result privy to No. 10.  Say if the result is to be meant for Court purposes as the reason behind the proclamation it is jumping the gun to assume the review will definitely lead to Court.  Tried as I might I can't work out why the decision not to publish the result was taken and announced from the outset when the result is still an unknown factor.

Would CM, as a Conservative PPC for Brighton Pavillion, be privy to the result of the Review?
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Post by aiyoyo 22.03.14 22:11

Woofer wrote:@ aiyoyo - "Earlier report that the Result of the Review will not be published floors me.
It makes absolutely no $$ sense or practical or legal sense to waste taxpayers money on a review that engages the public of several countries in the search for leads/information only to have the result privy to No. 10.  Say if the result is to be meant for Court purposes as the reason behind the proclamation it is jumping the gun to assume the review will definitely lead to Court.  Tried as I might I can't work out why the decision not to publish the result was taken and announced from the outset when the result is still an unknown factor.

Would CM, as a Conservative PPC for Brighton Pavillion, be privy to the result of the Review?

Unlikely !
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Post by ProfessorPPlum 22.03.14 22:26

aiyoyo wrote:
TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:
TheTruthWillOut wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:We should remember, as is publicly known, there's a Murder Squad involved in the investigation ...
For me that spoke a 1,000 words at the time and now their direction is slowly surfacing IMO

Is it known what the breakdown of the 37 strong team is?
***
First thing I could find for documentation is this:

Operation Grange
Major Investigation Team 5
Homicide and Serious Crime Command
Belgravia Police station
202-206 Buckingham Palace Rd
London SW1W 9SX

operation.grange@met.police.uk
--
I cannot atm refer to other sources ...

Thanks. Looking at this link is interesting: http://content.met.police.uk/Site/homicideseriouscrime tells us what they do.

Murder Investigation Teams investigate:

  • All murder, manslaughter and infanticide offences;
  • Deaths within the workplace or mass disaster where culpability for the loss of life is likely to be an issue in criminal court
  • Attempted murder where the evidence of intent is unambiguous or where a risk assessment identifies substantive risk to life
  • High-risk missing persons where there is a substantive reason to suspect life has been taken or is under threat
  • Linked series of two or more stranger rapes which are beyond the capability of SCD2 Sapphire Command or other 'critical incidents'

Additionally, the teams provide advice for the MPS and other police forces on 'High Risk' situations.

I,too, was optimistic at first.
But on reflection having a murder squad on the team merely signifies they are open minded - just that - nothing is ruled in or ruled out.
It does not necessary mean they're looking at a murder, just that nothing is ruled out, not even that.
In short they will let the evidence lead them depending where the evidence falls.
So far there's no definitive indication from Redwood which way the wind blows .....
The expensive costs of CW and this later appeal for info on a sex fiend would suggest there are some loose ends that need to be TIED.

Earlier report that the Result of the Review will not be published floors me.
It makes absolutely no $$ sense or practical or legal sense to waste taxpayers money on a review that engages the public of several countries in the search for leads/information only to have the result privy to No. 10.  Say if the result is to be meant for Court purposes as the reason behind the proclamation it is jumping the gun to assume the review will definitely lead to Court.  Tried as I might I can't work out  why the decision not to publish the result was taken and announced from the outset when the result is still an unknown factor.


Given that the 'missing but life in grave danger' statistic likelihood is practically nil,  my money's on the word 'infanticide' in the first line of their remit.

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Post by TMH 22.03.14 22:49

SUNDAY EXPRESS FRONT PAGE: Police at war over Maddie. #skypapers pic.twitter.com/FSYRlawwqS


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Post by tasprin 22.03.14 23:08

Now it's two Eastern Europeans.


MIRROR

Madeleine McCann police hunt two Eastern European bogus charity workers who targeted Algarve holiday homes

Mar 22, 2014
By Matthew Drake

The “significant development” regarding men in their 50s with heavy builds came hours after a new appeal on Crimewatch last Wednesday

Police hunting for Madeleine McCann have been given vital new clues about two bogus charity workers operating in the resort when the tot went missing.

The “significant development” came hours after a new appeal on Crimewatch last Wednesday.

British officers were given fresh details about the conmen now believed to be Eastern European rather than Portuguese as originally thought.

They were told both were in their 50s with heavy builds. The men, claiming to be fundraisers for disabled children, were seen knocking on doors of ­apartments in Praia da Luz where the three-year-old went missing in 2007.

They had a yellow calling card showing a girl in a wheelchair pictured on the double-sided note. Both were also seen drinking coffees and shots of spirits in the morning outside a shopping centre yards from the apartment where the youngster vanished.

A source said: “The men were knocking on the doors of holidaymakers asking for cash for a charity for handicapped children. They disappeared from the area but it is not known how they­ ­travelled about.

“The charity card they used had six or seven sentences on each side. One was written in Portuguese and the other in English, but with very poor grammar.

“They said very little and appeared to rely on showing people their card. It is believed they were Eastern ­European.”

Scotland Yard officers on Operation Grange are keen to trace the two men. They believe they had previously targeted other areas in the Algarve and are focusing attention on the resort of Albufeira.

Police have previously issued e-fit photos of two bogus charity workers operating in the area – but believed them to be Portuguese at the time.

The fresh intelligence emerged after officers in the hunt launched an appeal on Wednesday night’s BBC1 Crimewatch programme – sparking more than 250 calls and emails.

Det Chief Insp Andy Redwood also revealed police are looking for an intruder who sexually abused five British children during break-ins in the area.

The tanned, dark-haired man is suspected of breaking in to 12 properties where families were staying in the Algarve between 2004 and 2010.

In four of the incidents, a total of five girls aged between seven and 10 were sexually assaulted.

These attacks all happened between 2004 and 2006, before Madeleine vanished the following year.

Mr Redwood said: “I’m sure the public will understand the significant features of this offending.

“A man attacking young, white, female children, in their beds while they are on holiday with their families has a very close resonance to some of the features of Madeleine’s disappearance.

“We need to identify the offender to bring to a close the trauma and the tragedy that these families have suffered.

“Then we need to establish whether this is connected to Madeleine’s disappearance.”

PA Gerry McCann and Kate McCann parents of missing child Madeleine McCann walk through Amsterdam of the final leg of there 2 day trip in Europe to spread the word about Madeline disappearance

A Yard spokesman said: “We have received over 250 calls and emails following the appeal. Officers are now reviewing the information and following up lines of inquiry."

Madeleine disappeared from her family’s holiday ­apartment in Praia da Luz on May 3 2007 as her parents Kate and Gerry dined at a nearby restaurant with friends, leaving their daughter sleeping with her younger twin siblings.

British detectives launched a fresh ­investigation into Madeleine’s disappearance in July last year – two years into a review of the case – and made renewed appeals on television in the UK, the Netherlands and Germany.

Portuguese authorities shelved their inquiry into Madeleine’s disappearance in 2008.

But they admitted last October that a review had uncovered enough new information to justify reopening it.

Last week Scotland Yard expressed frustration at the speed of the ­Portuguese legal system as they try to discover what has happened to the missing ­youngster.

David Cameron has said he would be willing to appeal directly to the P­ortuguese government if British police felt their investigation into Madeleine’s disappearance was being hampered by bureaucracy.

The Prime Minister’s official spokesman said Mr Cameron would be prepared to “make further representations” to the government in Portugal if it would help Scotland Yard’s inquiry.

Deputy Assistant Commissioner Martin Hewitt revealed Scotland Yard’s dissatisfaction with their slow progress. He said: “That’s causing us ­frustration because we know what we want to do and we are ready to go with that. But the process is the process.”

Scotland Yard has so far written three international letters of request to the Portuguese, covering 41 priority areas and including 287 separate requests.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccann-missing-police-hunt-3273735#ixzz2wjfn5TeF
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Post by notlongnow 22.03.14 23:15

A source said blah blah blah.....
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Post by j.rob 23.03.14 0:22

What a load of bullshit - still, what did anyone expect. The Express is one of the most hideous newspapers.
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Post by MRNOODLES 23.03.14 0:25

same old same old
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Post by ProfessorPPlum 23.03.14 0:32

The BBC R4 newsreader just said that SY believed 'the culprit' was a dead tractor driver who had sexually assaulted 5 English girls.

Utterly beyond belief. Are there NO boundaries any more? Can anyone just say anything the like about this case now?  wft 

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Post by j.rob 23.03.14 0:44

Yes - it is all bullshit and always has been.

Anyone on the relative spectrum of 'normal' - and that covers a multitude of sins - must come to the conclusion that this case - involving a sweet and lovely child 'disappearing'  - stinks. It always did.
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Post by jeanmonroe 23.03.14 1:12

So BBC saying SY/Met =dead tractor driver who assaulted FIVE kids,

Mirror saying SY/Met = 2 eastern europen charity 'collectors'

Anymore for any more?

WHO is 'authorising' this BS?

Redwood is only a four 'ranks' above a 'plod'

There are SEVEN 'ranks' above him.

Even on the original 'team he was only number 3.

(Campell and Foy, above him)

Redwood, imo, does not have the 'authority' to put out this BS.

So WHO is giving the 'go ahead' to totally try to trash the tourist industry in Portugal.

Redwood has now 'named' FOUR 'resorts' where you should NOT take your holiday, because the places are inhabited by 'nasty' men out to get your kids!

No wonder the Portuguese are 'at war' with SY/Met.
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Post by coati mundi 23.03.14 1:31

It was a circus that was in town. No-one has noticed them but they were all around the resort. They comprised a group of gypsies, a woman who looked like Posh Spice. A  man who looked like... sorry, but I'm too tired to type out all of the suspects and...

What nonsense! shark
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