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I want to believe - I really do ! !

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I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by PeterMac on 20.02.14 17:00

What happens if I want to believe the McCanns, and I decide to believe, in my heart of hearts [whatever that means, but it sounds ‘good’] that Madeleine WAS abducted.
I then surely have a number of choices to make

I have to decide whether Gerry stayed in the apartment watching TV for some minutes, or if he simply visited the bathroom and then left.
I have to decide whether I believe that he met Jez W on the West, or the East side of the road
I have to decide whether I think that Jane Tanner saw a man carrying Madeleine, or whether this man was a father with his child,

I have to decide whether to believe . . .

• the father with his child has been ruled out of the enquiry, or is still a person to be traced
• the curtains were wide open, or that they were tight closed
• the door slammed and then the curtains “whooshed”, or that the Met Office records are correct
• the abductor climbed out of the open window, or that this was a ‘red herring’
• the twins were not sedated, or they “must have been” sedated
• the McCanns made half hourly checks through the week, or whether Mrs Fenn was telling the truth
• the Last Photo was taken at lunchtime on a cold, windy and cloudy Thursday, or on a bright sunny calm Sunday
and so on
So far this gives ten separate decisions, (and there are many more, as we know.)

Two to the power 10 is 1024.
So 1024 people can believe, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Madeleine was abducted and still fight to the death over the details of how it might have happened.

May we know what the latest “official story” is ?

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by sharonl on 20.02.14 21:50

So Mr Mac, you want to believe?

You will also have to choose between 3 possible timelines, 2 that the Tapas friends made up on the covers of Madeleines sticker book and the new timeline created by NSY for Crimewatch.

You will also have to choose from 18 abductors, 1 Victoria Beckham lookalike, I disgruntled Maid, 6 cleaners, 3 burglars, 1 dead paedophile, a gang of romany gypsies and Rob Murat.

If you genuinely want to believe that Madeleine was abducted, the best advice than anyone can offer you is stay well away from the British media reports on the case, these are so ridiculous and lacking in credibility that anyone who reads them will smell a pink rat.

Get a few vodkas down you and watch the Kate and Gerry videos on repeat, we are supposed to start believing in things if we hear them often enough.

Good luck!!

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Guest on 20.02.14 22:10

[quote="sharonl"]So Mr Mac, you want to believe?


You will also have to choose from 18 abductors, 1 Victoria Beckham lookalike, I disgruntled Maid, 6 cleaners, 3 burglars, 1 dead paedophile, a gang of romany gypsies and Rob Murat.

/quote]

Best sung along to the tune of 12 Days of Christmas.....don't forget to include the dead tractor man.

 Mrs
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by sharonl on 20.02.14 22:39

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:
@sharonl wrote:So Mr Mac, you want to believe?


You will also have to choose from 18 abductors, 1 Victoria Beckham lookalike, I disgruntled Maid, 6 cleaners, 3 burglars, 1 dead paedophile, a gang of romany gypsies and Rob Murat.

/quote]

Best sung along to the tune of 12 Days of Christmas.....don't forget to include the dead tractor man.

 Mrs

 lol! |Perhaps we can get Tony to fine tune the lyrics he is really good at song writing.  Then we can form a large choir and if Madeleine is not home by xmas we could perform at Trafalgar Square or near SY, no mention of the real suspects in that list so we should be safe.  That should raise a few eye brows  big grin 


On the 12th day of the review Scotland Yard brought to me ********
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by notlongnow on 20.02.14 22:51

....................6 cleaners cleaning.............5 TO 10.....4 broken shutters.......3 burglars burgling......2 child abductors......and a cuddlecat on the top shelf.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by sharonl on 20.02.14 22:57

@notlongnow wrote:....................6 cleaners cleaning.............5 TO 10.....4 broken shutters.......3 burglars burgling......2 child abductors......and a cuddlecat on the top shelf.


Excellent

And 

5 Mobile Pings 

Obviously  big grin

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by worriedmum on 20.02.14 23:20

PeterMac you also have to believe that the British-trained dogs, Eddie and Keela, both alerted , independently of one another and in some of the same locations, to objects and locii associated  with the parents of Madeleine, BY MISTAKE.
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by sharonl on 21.02.14 0:11

@worriedmum wrote:PeterMac you also have to believe that the British-trained dogs, Eddie and Keela, both alerted , independently of one another and in some of the same locations, to objects and locii associated  with the parents of Madeleine, BY MISTAKE.


You will also need to convince yourself that:

1.  The blood that had seeped into the tiles behind the sofa was from a graze on Madeleines knee, that had happened 4 days earlier
2.  The cadaver odour on Kate and Cuddlecat was due to them attending to 6 corpses in the week before the holiday
3.  The Cadaver odour in the boot was really sea bass for the two year old son
4.  The sea bass for the two year old was in the boot with the rotting meat & the soiled nappies that caused the presence of blood and bodily fluid
5.  The mass of hair found in the tyre well came from a childs hairbrush
6.  Within a time slot of a few minutes, the abductor, despite all the people who were allegedly around the apartment, snook into 5a without being seen or heard, found Madeleine in the dark, drugged the children, opened the window for no reason, lifted Madeleine out of bed and got out again carrying a four year old, having left no trace whatsoever and was seen by no-one apart from Jane Tanner.
7.  Portuguese Police tried to frame Kate McCann
8.  Portuguese Police planted DNA and cadaver odour in the apartment


Then you have to decide who on team McCann do you believe.  Did David Payne stay 30 minutes or a few minutes?  Jane passed Gerry & Jez but neither saw her or the abductor.  These are just two of many contradictions. And what about Jane Tanners ever-changing stories, which one will you accept?

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by kimHager on 21.02.14 1:27

Wait... You would also have to believe K&g are parents of the year. The book was written so the truth would always be available.. Also would have to believe all the Madeleine's were one.. That Kate washes curtains but not her clothes.. Can't have the curtains cadavered but the clothing is perfectly acceptable... Sharing a toothbrush is hygenic as is sharing hair brushes and no DNA from children is NORMAL in an apartment where they've been for a week... Also the biggest thing you would have to believe is that child meant so much that in a 5/10 minute time frame the abductor would have been moving so fast that the parents couldn't possibly have found her so why bother? I know it's alot to swallow but it's believable right?

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Bishop Brennan on 21.02.14 1:33

And once you have done all that, PeterMac, you will be fully qualified for a position on SY's top investigative team!  dance 

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by deafoldbat on 21.02.14 9:27

bravo 

Nothing like a bit of confusion to keep us all guessing!

How will it all end?!!!! Will we wake up one day and find it was all a dream?  Rolling Eyes
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by jeanmonroe on 21.02.14 11:47

@deafoldbat wrote:bravo 

Nothing like a bit of confusion to keep us all guessing!

How will it all end?!!!! Will we wake up one day and find it was all a dream?  Rolling Eyes

".....including the accident, were nothing more than a lengthy dream of Pam's."

It wuz Bobby Ewing that dun it, innit?

He wuz 'hiding in the shower' in 5A when Gerry 'checked' at 9:05pm, geddit?

How we have all missed this 'revelation' these past almost 7 years, is quite beyond me.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Mirage on 21.02.14 12:06

He wuz 'hiding in the shower' in 5A when Gerry 'checked' at 9:05pm, geddit?........
-------------------------------------
.................thus bringing the curtain down.

Then we all woke up.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by j.rob on 21.02.14 15:42

You also have to wrap your brain around how quickly the McCanns and their friends can do a 360 degree turn in terms of the apparent safety of leaving the children without a babysitter and instead doing their own baby-listening.

"As the restaurant was so near, we collectively decided to do our own child-checking service. .....Speaking for myself, I can say, hand on heart,  that it never once crossed my mind that this might not be a safe option. If I'd had any doubts whatsoever, I would simply never have entertained it. ......I would never knowingly place them at risk, no matter how small a risk it might seem to be." ((p53-54).

This was the apparent mind-set of the Mccanns when they supposedly tucked up their children in bed on the evening of Thursday 3 May 2007. That was exactly how happy and safe Kate felt with their own baby-listening arrangements. They would have felt like this at 8.30pm when the left the children sleeping alone. Gerry would have felt like this at 9.05pm when he, allegedly, saw all three children sleeping peacefully.

They would both have felt like this when they were quite happy for someone else who they did not know very well - Matt - to allegedly check that that there was no crying coming from the McCann children's bed room. They wouldn't have been worried whether he looked in the room or not, because they were so confident that their child-listening system was without risk - however small. And as long as there was no crying coming from the room or signs of noise, it was okay. We know that they were quite happy with Matt's alleged check at 9.30pm because. when he returned, neither of the McCann parents asked if Matt had actually gone into the room or actually seen Madeleine in there. If they had been worried, they would have asked. But they didn't, despite the fact that the Russell child had, allegedly,  been violently sick while unattended that very evening - necessitating, Russell staying behind in the apartment to clean up. The child also, apparently, had a badly upset stomach during the holiday, according to the parents. 

But the McCanns were clearly not concerned on about their children on that score. The McCanns were happy that their children were safe. 

However illogical this belief system is, given that accidents in the home are not in the least unusual - especially for the under 5 year group and that the risk of an accident is going to be far higher if children are left unattended, I am simply highlighting it to indicate the belief system of the parents. It is clearly illogical as the risk of an adult not being there immediately in the event of accident or illness - to administer first aid and/or call an ambulance or take your child to A+E can, literally, be life-threatening,, not to mention hugely distressing and upsetting for the child. But, despite its illogicality (and, frankly, it's downright negligence)  it is, nevertheless what the McCanns are adamant that they believed at the time.

(I do agree with the McCanns however on one point, and one point only, that the risk of a complete stranger stealing or molesting or harming or even killing you child is, indeed, extremely low. Usually these horrible things happen at the hands of the parents or a family member of someone the child knows. And in such cases the adult responsible will quite often claim that the child has disappeared, or had an unexplained accident or was kidnapped, as a way of covering up the crime.  Helpfully, as always, Kate provides statistics in her book that support this, for instance one of the quoted statistics is: 'The majority of completed child abductions are parental/family abductions, with 16% involving abduction by a stranger.') Indeed, Kate.

Anyway, I have digressed, but I think it is important to be very clear about how Kate felt and what Kate did and said on that fateful evening. And Gerry too.

At 10pm, when Kate goes to check on the children, as she walks up to the apartment, she is still a happy and contented little bunny, knowing that their children are at no risk of harm.

She looks inside and, so confident is she that the children are happy and safe and absolutely fine that she almost doesn't bother to look into the children's bedroom (which you must admit is a bit negligent, given that Russell had told Matt that his own child had been violently sick and to tell everyone at the table that was the reason he was staying in the apartment. Don't you think it's a bit odd that Kate wouldn't have been worried about her own three children as being violently sick as if another child in the group had a tummy bug these can sweep around holiday resorts like the plague....anyway....clearly both Kate and Gerry had much more pressing issues to deal with)

However, noticing that the bedroom door is open quite wide, not how they had apparently left it: "At first I assumed that Matt must have moved it. I walked over and gently began to pull it to." (ie: not go inside)

The only reason she became suspicious that something wasn't right was when: "Suddenly it slammed shut, as if caught by a draught."

This surprises her a little so she checks that she closed the patio doors behind her, which apparently she did. So she then goes back to the children's bedroom (remember, she is still happy that the children were not put at risk at any time) and 'glanced' at Madeleine's bed. Seeing her not in it, she checks that she hasn't gone into the parent's bed. 

Okay, so far, so logical - or at least as logical as the McCann's health and safety beliefs are (and social workers could have a field day with them!)  Their children are not at any risk from being stolen from their beds by a stranger.

From this point onwards, however, the McCann logic, such as it was, flies right out of the open window, presumably closely behind the mystery abductor. Kate's belief system dramatically rotates around 360 degrees and, on discovering that Madeleine has not got into their own bed:

"The first wave of panic hit me. As I ran back into the children's room the closed curtains flew up in a gust of wind. My heart lurched as I saw now that, behind them, the window was wide open and the shutters on the outside raised all the way up. Nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear. Dear God, no! Please no!


You wouldn't want Kate to be the first medic at the scene of a car crash, would you? 

Within the space of less than a minute - in fact I think that Kate said in an interview that she KNEW within 30 seconds ('there was no doubt in my mind') that Madeleine 'had been taken'.

That must be the fastest piece of detective work in history. It should go into the Guinness Book of Records. Kate doesn't hang around with making a diagnosis! Aren't doctors supposed to rule out the statistically most likely scenarios before considering the least likely scenarios?  How does this diagnosis fit in with the McCann's carefully considered risk assessment method? 

You know, the one that acknowledges that stranger abductions are so rare that it had never occurred to either Kate or Gerry that it could possibly happen in this safe, family-friendly resort? (There are many interviews in which these are pretty much their exact words. )

Thirty seconds earlier, Kate had considered the risk of a stranger abducting the children as zero risk, And half a minute later Kate is  100% certain that this is precisely what has happened. There are no other options, according to Kate. "Refusing to acknowledge what I already knew.......I knew, deep down.......I knew that Madeleine had been abducted."

So much so that Kate writes that she is frustrated when David Payne says, 'Let's just check the apartment.' (I wonder why she added that sentence which David Payne apparently thinks it is worth searching the apartment while Kate knows there is no point - is it planted there to suggest that DP doesn't know what Kate knows? Or for some other reason?)

"I'd done that, and I knew, I knew, that Madeleine had been abducted."

But when had Kate searched the apartment? She gives no description of doing this in her book. None whatsoever.  The only search that she did for Madeleine, according to her book, is looking inside their bedroom and discovering that Madeleine had not got into their bed. She did not look in the kitchen. She did not search the lounge or the dining area. She did not look in the wardrobes either in the children's bedroom or in their room. She does not describe looking into the bathroom, which would be one of the most logical places that Madeleine would be if not in her bed. She does not open the front door and look outside - Madeleine could have let herself out of the front door to go and try to find her parents. She could have been standing on the door step. Or anywhere near the apartment if she had let herself out.

But, no. She does none of those things. Instead, she is, apparently 'hit by panic' and when she sees the window open and the shutters up she is hit by 'nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear.'

The stupid woman hasn't even searched the apartment?! How does Kate know that Madeleine isn't hiding under a bed? Or in a cupboard? Or someone opened the window and shutters for an innocent reason? Or that Madeleine hadn't opened them? (If I remember rightly, in one interview Kate very indignantly scotches the idea that Madeleine could have got out this way saying: how could Madeleine open them all - and close them all behind her - ooops - get the story right Kate! You discovered the window and shutters open, remember, so Madeleine wouldn't have had to close them behind her?!)

Stark raving bonkers, the whole thing. You couldn't make it up. The biggest load of bilge and codswallop I have ever heard in my entire life. 

Both the McCann are seriously personality disordered, imo. Narcissistic, psychopathic, anti-social, entirely delusional. You could laugh at them except for the fact that they have got away with........at the expense of so many people.

Not least Madeleine.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Guest on 21.02.14 18:19

I don't this often, but today's it warranted:  bravo
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Watching on 21.02.14 18:40

Peter Mac - "I want to believe, I really do"




And Mr & Mrs want you to believe, they really, really do!   :-)

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by lj on 21.02.14 22:27

@j.rob wrote:You also have to wrap your brain around how quickly the McCanns and their friends can do a 360 degree turn in terms of the apparent safety of leaving the children without a babysitter and instead doing their own baby-listening.

"As the restaurant was so near, we collectively decided to do our own child-checking service. .....Speaking for myself, I can say, hand on heart,  that it never once crossed my mind that this might not be a safe option. If I'd had any doubts whatsoever, I would simply never have entertained it. ......I would never knowingly place them at risk, no matter how small a risk it might seem to be." ((p53-54).

This was the apparent mind-set of the Mccanns when they supposedly tucked up their children in bed on the evening of Thursday 3 May 2007. That was exactly how happy and safe Kate felt with their own baby-listening arrangements. They would have felt like this at 8.30pm when the left the children sleeping alone. Gerry would have felt like this at 9.05pm when he, allegedly, saw all three children sleeping peacefully.

They would both have felt like this when they were quite happy for someone else who they did not know very well - Matt - to allegedly check that that there was no crying coming from the McCann children's bed room. They wouldn't have been worried whether he looked in the room or not, because they were so confident that their child-listening system was without risk - however small. And as long as there was no crying coming from the room or signs of noise, it was okay. We know that they were quite happy with Matt's alleged check at 9.30pm because. when he returned, neither of the McCann parents asked if Matt had actually gone into the room or actually seen Madeleine in there. If they had been worried, they would have asked. But they didn't, despite the fact that the Russell child had, allegedly,  been violently sick while unattended that very evening - necessitating, Russell staying behind in the apartment to clean up. The child also, apparently, had a badly upset stomach during the holiday, according to the parents. 

But the McCanns were clearly not concerned on about their children on that score. The McCanns were happy that their children were safe. 

However illogical this belief system is, given that accidents in the home are not in the least unusual - especially for the under 5 year group and that the risk of an accident is going to be far higher if children are left unattended, I am simply highlighting it to indicate the belief system of the parents. It is clearly illogical as the risk of an adult not being there immediately in the event of accident or illness - to administer first aid and/or call an ambulance or take your child to A+E can, literally, be life-threatening,, not to mention hugely distressing and upsetting for the child. But, despite its illogicality (and, frankly, it's downright negligence)  it is, nevertheless what the McCanns are adamant that they believed at the time.

(I do agree with the McCanns however on one point, and one point only, that the risk of a complete stranger stealing or molesting or harming or even killing you child is, indeed, extremely low. Usually these horrible things happen at the hands of the parents or a family member of someone the child knows. And in such cases the adult responsible will quite often claim that the child has disappeared, or had an unexplained accident or was kidnapped, as a way of covering up the crime.  Helpfully, as always, Kate provides statistics in her book that support this, for instance one of the quoted statistics is: 'The majority of completed child abductions are parental/family abductions, with 16% involving abduction by a stranger.') Indeed, Kate.

Anyway, I have digressed, but I think it is important to be very clear about how Kate felt and what Kate did and said on that fateful evening. And Gerry too.

At 10pm, when Kate goes to check on the children, as she walks up to the apartment, she is still a happy and contented little bunny, knowing that their children are at no risk of harm.

She looks inside and, so confident is she that the children are happy and safe and absolutely fine that she almost doesn't bother to look into the children's bedroom (which you must admit is a bit negligent, given that Russell had told Matt that his own child had been violently sick and to tell everyone at the table that was the reason he was staying in the apartment. Don't you think it's a bit odd that Kate wouldn't have been worried about her own three children as being violently sick as if another child in the group had a tummy bug these can sweep around holiday resorts like the plague....anyway....clearly both Kate and Gerry had much more pressing issues to deal with)

However, noticing that the bedroom door is open quite wide, not how they had apparently left it: "At first I assumed that Matt must have moved it. I walked over and gently began to pull it to." (ie: not go inside)

The only reason she became suspicious that something wasn't right was when: "Suddenly it slammed shut, as if caught by a draught."

This surprises her a little so she checks that she closed the patio doors behind her, which apparently she did. So she then goes back to the children's bedroom (remember, she is still happy that the children were not put at risk at any time) and 'glanced' at Madeleine's bed. Seeing her not in it, she checks that she hasn't gone into the parent's bed. 

Okay, so far, so logical - or at least as logical as the McCann's health and safety beliefs are (and social workers could have a field day with them!)  Their children are not at any risk from being stolen from their beds by a stranger.

From this point onwards, however, the McCann logic, such as it was, flies right out of the open window, presumably closely behind the mystery abductor. Kate's belief system dramatically rotates around 360 degrees and, on discovering that Madeleine has not got into their own bed:

"The first wave of panic hit me. As I ran back into the children's room the closed curtains flew up in a gust of wind. My heart lurched as I saw now that, behind them, the window was wide open and the shutters on the outside raised all the way up. Nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear. Dear God, no! Please no!


You wouldn't want Kate to be the first medic at the scene of a car crash, would you? 

Within the space of less than a minute - in fact I think that Kate said in an interview that she KNEW within 30 seconds ('there was no doubt in my mind') that Madeleine 'had been taken'.

That must be the fastest piece of detective work in history. It should go into the Guinness Book of Records. Kate doesn't hang around with making a diagnosis! Aren't doctors supposed to rule out the statistically most likely scenarios before considering the least likely scenarios?  How does this diagnosis fit in with the McCann's carefully considered risk assessment method? 

You know, the one that acknowledges that stranger abductions are so rare that it had never occurred to either Kate or Gerry that it could possibly happen in this safe, family-friendly resort? (There are many interviews in which these are pretty much their exact words. )

Thirty seconds earlier, Kate had considered the risk of a stranger abducting the children as zero risk, And half a minute later Kate is  100% certain that this is precisely what has happened. There are no other options, according to Kate. "Refusing to acknowledge what I already knew.......I knew, deep down.......I knew that Madeleine had been abducted."

So much so that Kate writes that she is frustrated when David Payne says, 'Let's just check the apartment.' (I wonder why she added that sentence which David Payne apparently thinks it is worth searching the apartment while Kate knows there is no point - is it planted there to suggest that DP doesn't know what Kate knows? Or for some other reason?)

"I'd done that, and I knew, I knew, that Madeleine had been abducted."

But when had Kate searched the apartment? She gives no description of doing this in her book. None whatsoever.  The only search that she did for Madeleine, according to her book, is looking inside their bedroom and discovering that Madeleine had not got into their bed. She did not look in the kitchen. She did not search the lounge or the dining area. She did not look in the wardrobes either in the children's bedroom or in their room. She does not describe looking into the bathroom, which would be one of the most logical places that Madeleine would be if not in her bed. She does not open the front door and look outside - Madeleine could have let herself out of the front door to go and try to find her parents. She could have been standing on the door step. Or anywhere near the apartment if she had let herself out.

But, no. She does none of those things. Instead, she is, apparently 'hit by panic' and when she sees the window open and the shutters up she is hit by 'nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear.'

The stupid woman hasn't even searched the apartment?! How does Kate know that Madeleine isn't hiding under a bed? Or in a cupboard? Or someone opened the window and shutters for an innocent reason? Or that Madeleine hadn't opened them? (If I remember rightly, in one interview Kate very indignantly scotches the idea that Madeleine could have got out this way saying: how could Madeleine open them all - and close them all behind her - ooops - get the story right Kate! You discovered the window and shutters open, remember, so Madeleine wouldn't have had to close them behind her?!)

Stark raving bonkers, the whole thing. You couldn't make it up. The biggest load of bilge and codswallop I have ever heard in my entire life. 

Both the McCann are seriously personality disordered, imo. Narcissistic, psychopathic, anti-social, entirely delusional. You could laugh at them except for the fact that they have got away with........at the expense of so many people.

Not least Madeleine.


 goodpost 

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by worriedmum on 22.02.14 1:39

quote ''
"As the restaurant was so near, we collectively decided to do our own child-checking service. .....Speaking for myself, I can say, hand on heart,  that it never once crossed my mind that this might not be a safe option. If I'd had any doubts whatsoever, I would simply never have entertained it. ......I would never knowingly place them at risk, no matter how small a risk it might seem to be." ((p53-54).unquote


[color:cf18=000000]Excerpt from Fiona Payne's Rogatory interview with Leicestershire police on 10 April 2008


Fiona Payne: "She did... she brought it up and that she - I mean, this is awful in retrospect, as well - she asked what my opinion was on, errm... tut, on whether they were okay leaving the... the doors unlocked, because she was saying: 'Is it better that, if Madeleine wakes up, she can get out and find us or...,' errm... 'or locking it and, you know, finding that we're not there and the door's locked, if she woke up,' because Madeleine had woken up, what I thought was the night before. Errm... tut, and it was in that context, really, just asking, you know, what I thought. So it was obviously something that was on her mind a bit, huh."
 
Q: "So she asked you what your thoughts were regarding locking?"
 
Fiona Payne: "Yeah."
 
Q: "Did she say whether she had locked or..?"
 
Fiona Payne: "No, that was the point, I think they said they'd left it, well she'd said she'd left it unlocked."
 
Q: "Left the patio?"
 
Fiona Payne: "And she felt a bit nervous about it but Gerry... Gerry had sort of said: 'Oh, it will be fine,' you know. But she was obviously... because it wasn't something she was quite easy with, that's the way it came across, you know, but... but Gerry said, you know: 'It'll be fine. It'll be fine'.
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by russiandoll on 22.02.14 16:20

An excellent post, always worth pointing out that Kate boasted in her book that the checks involved looking as well as listening, in contrast to the MW checks at other resorts, listening only from outside.

 Gerry also said in their documentary that the Thursday evening was the only one when he put his head around the door[ to look]. So listening only it appears, not looking as his wife claimed...neither of them looked until the very night they discovered Maddie gone. Strange, that.

  One correction, though, to your otherwise spot- on post :  Kate did write in her book about searching the apartment

   
 Refusing to acknowledge what I already knew, and perhaps automatically going into a well-practised medical emergency mode, I quickly scoured the apartment to exclude all other possibilities, mentally ticking boxes I knew, deep down, were already ticked.
I checked the wardrobe in the children’s room. I ran into the kitchen, throwing open all the cupboard doors, into our bedroom, searching the wardrobes, in and out of the bathroom, all in about 15 seconds, before hurtling out through the patio doors and down towards Gerry and our friends.
As soon as our table was in sight I started screaming. “Madeleine’s gone! Someone’s taken her!”

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Newintown on 22.02.14 16:39

@russiandoll wrote:An excellent post, always worth pointing out that Kate boasted in her book that the checks involved looking as well as listening, in contrast to the MW checks at other resorts, listening only from outside.

 Gerry also said in their documentary that the Thursday evening was the only one when he put his head around the door[ to look]. So listening only it appears, not looking as his wife claimed...neither of them looked until the very night they discovered Maddie gone. Strange, that.

  One correction, though, to your otherwise spot- on post :  Kate did write in her book about searching the apartment

   
 Refusing to acknowledge what I already knew, and perhaps automatically going into a well-practised medical emergency mode, I quickly scoured the apartment to exclude all other possibilities, mentally ticking boxes I knew, deep down, were already ticked.
I checked the wardrobe in the children’s room. I ran into the kitchen, throwing open all the cupboard doors, into our bedroom, searching the wardrobes, in and out of the bathroom, all in about 15 seconds, before hurtling out through the patio doors and down towards Gerry and our friends.
As soon as our table was in sight I started screaming. “Madeleine’s gone! Someone’s taken her!”

So if Kate thought her 3 children were safe being left on their own, yet she scours the apartment looking for Madeleine, she is obviously now saying that the children could have woken up and wandered around the apartment whilst left on their own, with access to the kitchen (knives in drawers), access to oven/hobs in kitchen, medications left in bedroom side tables, filling the bath with water to play boats, pretend swimming, M bathing the twins; the possibilities of danger are endless, yet K & G were adamant at the beginning of the evening that the children were safe to be left in the apartment.

Oh dear, it all doesn't really add up does it K & G?

One of the waiters, I believe at the Tapas bar, stated that the McCanns/Tapas group were at the bar until 11.30 one night as he was waiting to close up and go home. I think it was the Monday or Tuesday night, so how long were the children actually being left on their own if the parents were still at the bar at 11.30, would the regular checking had gone out of the window if the parents were tanked up to the eyeballs on wine, liqueurs or whatever they were drinking until 11.30 p.m.?


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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by russiandoll on 22.02.14 17:05

She certainly is admitting to the dangers.  Kitchen first, event though the next- door bathroom would have been the nearest and most likely place to find Maddie.  By the way, could you have done all that in 15 seconds, seriously looking for a child? Bathroom. couple of seconds.
 Her own room, longer. Kitchen area, opening the base unit doors... how long? Plus she opened wardrobe doors......why bother with the obvious untruth of 15 seconds? So much needless and untrue detail.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Hobs on 22.02.14 22:37

"The first wave of panic hit me. As I ran back into the children's room the closed curtains flew up in a gust of wind. My heart lurched as I saw now that, behind them, the window was wide open and the shutters on the outside raised all the way up. Nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear. Dear God, no! Please no!



The perfect emotions in the perfect spot is a huge red flag plus note all the fropped promouns in relation to the emotions, if she can't take ownership of the emotions, i can't do it for her.

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by ultimaThule on 22.02.14 23:46

Any other parent would have flown across that room to the open window fearing their almost 4 year old child had managed to climb out and was lying on the paving below with a fractured skull or worse. 

But not our Kate... oh no. Instead of doing the obvious, or running out of the door to the apartment which was was separated from the window by only the dividing wall between the bedroom and the entrance hall, screaming her daughter's name as she did so, our antiheroine left her sleeping infant twins undisturbed and, via the unlocked rear patio windows, returned to the Tapas Bar to raise the alarm despite the fact that she could have alerted Gerry and her pals by means of a couple of shouts from the balcony. 

In addition to your 'perfect' and 'pronoun', Hobs,  another 3 'P's come to mind, namely parody, pastiche, plagiarism, because it seems to me Kate has scraped the barrel of crime tales which relate the discovery that a child is missing to cobble together a scenario which didn't happen and peppered it (another P!) with emotions she's incapable of feeling. 

"As soon as our table was in sight I started screaming. “Madeleine’s gone! Someone’s taken her!” If my child was missing the whole resort would have heard about it without my leaving the apartment and if, for some inexplicable reason, I found it necessary to return to a bar to alert others they would have heard me coming long before I got there.  

And she was paid £500,00 for this tripe plus more from the serialisation of what has to be the biggest load of codswallop ever told.
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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Mirage on 23.02.14 0:35

@Hobs wrote:"The first wave of panic hit me. As I ran back into the children's room the closed curtains flew up in a gust of wind. My heart lurched as I saw now that, behind them, the window was wide open and the shutters on the outside raised all the way up. Nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear. Dear God, no! Please no!



The perfect emotions in the perfect spot is a huge red flag plus note all the fropped promouns in relation to the emotions, if she can't take ownership of the emotions, i can't do it for her.

Such an overblown writing style, Hobs. It puts me in mind of Bridget O'Donnell's weird article in the Guardian, entitled bizarrely "My Months with Madeleine". I have often wondered about that title when she wasn't sure she had even seen MM at the resort "Madeleine must have been there, but I couldn't distinguish her from the others. They all looked the same - all blonde, all pink and pretty."

. I have found myself wondering if Ms McDonnell did spend months with "madeleine" - the book.

Here is an excerpt from that article. One could almost imagine the entire book "madeleine" had been ghost-written by this woman, so similar is the writing style:

We had not seen the McCanns since Thursday, when suddenly they appeared by the pool. The surreal limbo of the past two days suddenly snapped back into painful, awful realtime. It was a shock: the physical transformation of these two human beings was sickening - I felt it as a physical blow. Kate's back and shoulders, her hands, her mouth had reshaped themselves in to the angular manifestation of a silent scream. I thought I might cry and turned so that she wouldn't see. Gerry was upright, his lips now drawn into a thin, impenetrable line. Some people, including Jes, tried to offer comfort. Some gave them hugs. Some stared at their feet, words eluding them. We all wondered what to do. That was the last time we saw Gerry and Kate.

All in all, quite a state according to this description. Who'd have thought this was Saturday morning - some 36 hours after MM had gone missing and they've come down to be poolside in full view of other holidaymakers who are going to be staring at them. Change-over day too so new ones arriving knowing the news. Utterly staggering.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann

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Re: I want to believe - I really do ! !

Post by Okeydokey on 23.02.14 2:19

@Mirage wrote:
@Hobs wrote:"The first wave of panic hit me. As I ran back into the children's room the closed curtains flew up in a gust of wind. My heart lurched as I saw now that, behind them, the window was wide open and the shutters on the outside raised all the way up. Nausea, terror, disbelief, fear. Icy fear. Dear God, no! Please no!



The perfect emotions in the perfect spot is a huge red flag plus note all the fropped promouns in relation to the emotions, if she can't take ownership of the emotions, i can't do it for her.

Such an overblown writing style, Hobs. It puts me in mind of Bridget O'Donnell's weird article in the Guardian, entitled bizarrely "My Months with Madeleine". I have often wondered about that title when she wasn't sure she had even seen MM at the resort "Madeleine must have been there, but I couldn't distinguish her from the others. They all looked the same - all blonde, all pink and pretty."

. I have found myself wondering if Ms McDonnell did spend months with "madeleine" - the book.

Here is an excerpt from that article. One could almost imagine the entire book "madeleine" had been ghost-written by this woman, so similar is the writing style:

We had not seen the McCanns since Thursday, when suddenly they appeared by the pool. The surreal limbo of the past two days suddenly snapped back into painful, awful realtime. It was a shock: the physical transformation of these two human beings was sickening - I felt it as a physical blow. Kate's back and shoulders, her hands, her mouth had reshaped themselves in to the angular manifestation of a silent scream. I thought I might cry and turned so that she wouldn't see. Gerry was upright, his lips now drawn into a thin, impenetrable line. Some people, including Jes, tried to offer comfort. Some gave them hugs. Some stared at their feet, words eluding them. We all wondered what to do. That was the last time we saw Gerry and Kate.

All in all, quite a state according to this description. Who'd have thought this was Saturday morning - some 36 hours after MM had gone missing and they've come down to be poolside in full view of other holidaymakers who are going to be staring at them. Change-over day too so new ones arriving knowing the news. Utterly staggering.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann

One thing is sure: Kate or her ghost writer ain't no physicist with an understanding of gas pressure.

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