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Having met Dan in the car

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 24.02.13 22:47

Someone else saw ROB that night--alone--in a dark place---DAN. (I think Dan was just on the search and saw him.)

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 1:54

I just looked at ROBS statment.

_____early in the week----"but I did'nt need Kate and Gerry's key because I went through the patio door"

and "I entered Gerry's flat through the patio door"

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by Guest on 25.02.13 12:56

plebgate wrote:Snipped from Joyce's post:

I just wonder how exact we can take the diaryetc. we have spent so many
hours on it and i begin to wonder if its mostly false times guessed at
to keep us all busy ? how long has this been going on


I agree with that Joyce. There is confusion everywhere isn't there. Statements, diary.

For me it all comes down to Maddie's little sticker book they wrote their timeline down on. I still wonder why, if they had had days in which to do so, so many "educated" people would not be able to see how implausible the toing and froing seems. As a poster said earlier in the week it seems like a benny hill sketch.

They were still writing the two time schedules when the first police (GNR) walked on scene. The GNR impounded them immediately, not even waiting for an official seizing authorisation. So maybe, just maybe, the 2 schedules or one of them was a fake too, meant to be discovered and to give the impression that everything happened on the 3rd. Could we examine them again with this in mind: that they were drawn up only to muddy the waters even at that early stage? Why else would they want to have been seen drawing them up by the GNR, when they had so much time to have drwan them before their arrival?

I think they just had to re-write a previous scenario, because someone screwed up (excuse me) So two versions of the schedule. One agreed previously, one concocted there and then wating for the police to be found.

Candidates for the cock-up enough:

JT by taking the wrong turn and missing JW & GM;
Kate by starting to holler at a wrong moment (either too early or too late)
JW by disturbing the little body being transported from A to B and thereby causing it to be hastily hidden in the garden beneath the brushes.
GM for walking into the Smiths who were english speaking and in a great number.

Yes, bushes were in need of pruning. But when and by whom?
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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 14:16

Just some thoughts.

The early shouting around pool on "abduction" night.------to muddy up the time Gerry returned to table.

Rob being missing on the night of the Tapas meal on night of "abduction"-----knew he had to move body later and was bricking himself---could'nt act naturally.

Tearing the book---just moved the body-------totally shitting himself.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by plebgate on 25.02.13 14:18

Portia thanks for post.
After I posted that last night I was thinking more or less along those lines to muddy the waters, yes imo that is very feasible.
Havent looked at the timelines on the book in a good while. Can anybody guide me to them please.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 14:20

reason for ROBS involvment?-----was he with M. on Monday night? When he let himself in through the patio doors.(in his statment)

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 14:33

IMO - Kate and David Payne in with M. Tuesday night.

Is that why she is calling DAD ----because Mum had been and gone.

After one and a quarter HOURS ---she goes looking. Patio doors open.

Abused + injured. They HAD to keep it all "in house"

The next morning (Wed.) Kate is "up with the lark" calling her friend Amanda. I bet Amanda was told what a lovely time M. was having.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by Mrs Beeton on 25.02.13 15:55

rolodog wrote:I think she was placed there briefly while he saw Jez. PLUS Carole Tramnere said she saw someone leaving by the small gate (side gate?) from above on her balcony when she was visiting her mother Mrs Fenn. She saw a tall blonde man leaving---shutting the gate really quietly. He had a long face.....a long,long face.

And did'nt Jez see Jane Tanner in the side street, in a purple top, around quater to nine. I am going by memory and things that have jumped out at me.

Look for Carol Tranmere's statment and she describes a shady charactor --tall--long face --short blonde hair. ---The only thing is --Does ROB look blonde?

I can't decide--but he certainly has a long face.

In Matthew Oldfield's rogatory he describes the tennis coach as blond. I can't find any info about the tennis coach's face or height though.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 16:45

Back in the thread Sami mentioned Leverton Williams coaching team web-site.

Some small pictures of Dan.

He is blonde but he looks like he has long hair.-----going to check if he has long face.

Also could Rob be considered to have blonde hair? --I think if it was sunny---then maybe

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 16:51

Pic of Dan in 'the coaching team section'

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by Guest on 25.02.13 17:02

rolodog wrote:Pic of Dan in 'the coaching team section'


Just google Dan Stuk. Get present employer. Tick Dan Stuk again. See curriculum, with MW in Greece mentioned.

So yes, someone having sojourned at MW Greece before would be familiar with him.

Blonde or not hard to see on this pic. But if only a 'summer blonde', not likely to be so in April/May already.
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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 18:33

He might be a vital witness who disturbed Rob----later that night.

ROB panicked? reason for rushed timeline on Maddies book.

I worked out from statements that 10 past 7 on the evening of May 3 is important.

I.M.O. David Payne left Kates flat 7.10

Fiona Payne arrives Kates flat 7.10

All men with Dan on tennis court 7.30

You have to wade through statments to get that timeline because they try to muddy it so much.

Going to check if I am correct.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by guest. on 25.02.13 18:39

What I don't get is there is different activities on different days and pre booked private tennis lessons etc surely to keep up with this and not miss anything you would have wrote it down either in your diary or on the MW sheet of activities you are given and yet none of them seem to have a clue what they were doing when

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 18:43

They carried on as normal.

I think they were expecting Maddie to get better.

They cleaned up an accident.

Maybe Maddie recovered but Payne went too far when he was in Kates flat on May 3.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 18:49

Or maybe she caught that toxic flu/shock/sickness they had.

And it was too much.

Which meant they had a sudden death to deal with. Hence the BIG RISKS they had to take that night.

But they could have acted quite normally till Thursday because M. was going to get better(they thought)

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 18:56

Sally --I get what you mean.

How did they pass off M. at her activities on Wed. and Thur.

All I can think is they conned the nannies.

They did'nt think M. was going to die.

+ maybe she was well on Thursday.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 19:04

The first sniffer dogs tracked to the supermarket carpark.

I think that is where ROB +Payne met up .Was Gerry there.

Rember Payne was ashen. This is bad-----very bad.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by Guest on 25.02.13 19:22

rolodog wrote:Sally --I get what you mean.

How did they pass off M. at her activities on Wed. and Thur.

All I can think is they conned the nannies.

They did'nt think M. was going to die.

+ maybe she was well on Thursday.

Maybe she just seemed to be better on Thursday.

T7 and offspring went to the beach thursday afternoon and did not invite the McCs and/or Maddie to come with them.
Strange. Why would they have left their close friends out of the fun?

Perhaps it was obvious that Maddie was ill?

KM stresses Maddies feeling tired and having to be carried to the appartment.
Another red herring: anyone could spot KM carrying the child, so this fact had to be explained away.

Here in Belgium Prince Laurent, one of the Royal family, had a skying accident last week. Seems he tripped over his own skies, something silly and innocuous as that. Got up, dusted himself off and carried on.
Bellyache the next day. Got worse. Had it checked by a local GP. Sent of to hospital by chopper immediately. As it turned out, he had an internal bleeding of the liver. Two days after the fall.

So what if a small child fell off the balcony, onto the prickly brushes underneath, was bruised and scratched as a result; had a concussion too which developed into internal bleeding someplace in her head (maybe even the brain) and died after a couple of days?

I consider the McCs tough medics, but not as monsters that would consciously ignore a possible lethal accident of one of their children.

My theory? Either the child fell to her death soon after arrival and they only discovered this after the fall, or they overlooked the possibiliy of very serious internal injuries and just carried on having adult fun till midnight.

Both of these would have ruined their careers, their social standing and family lives.
Especially if it should have emerged that they were in fact out boozing every night, when it happened.

Or, is the boozing another red herring? It is well nigh impossible to keep on jogging & playing tennis at their astonishing pace, having downed that much wine night after night, coming in around midnight, getting up around 08.00 with the kids. The system simple kicks in. It seems to me that, in order to be able to implement a complicated scam like the abduction story, you cannot afford to be addled.
You have to keep your wits together, very together.

One or more of them did just that.
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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by plebgate on 25.02.13 19:48

Portia wrote:
plebgate wrote:Snipped from Joyce's post:

I just wonder how exact we can take the diaryetc. we have spent so many
hours on it and i begin to wonder if its mostly false times guessed at
to keep us all busy ? how long has this been going on


I agree with that Joyce. There is confusion everywhere isn't there. Statements, diary.

For me it all comes down to Maddie's little sticker book they wrote their timeline down on. I still wonder why, if they had had days in which to do so, so many "educated" people would not be able to see how implausible the toing and froing seems. As a poster said earlier in the week it seems like a benny hill sketch.

They were still writing the two time schedules when the first police (GNR) walked on scene. The GNR impounded them immediately, not even waiting for an official seizing authorisation. So maybe, just maybe, the 2 schedules or one of them was a fake too, meant to be discovered and to give the impression that everything happened on the 3rd. Could we examine them again with this in mind: that they were drawn up only to muddy the waters even at that early stage? Why else would they want to have been seen drawing them up by the GNR, when they had so much time to have drwan them before their arrival?

I think they just had to re-write a previous scenario, because someone screwed up (excuse me) So two versions of the schedule. One agreed previously, one concocted there and then wating for the police to be found.

Candidates for the cock-up enough:

JT by taking the wrong turn and missing JW & GM;
Kate by starting to holler at a wrong moment (either too early or too late)
JW by disturbing the little body being transported from A to B and thereby causing it to be hastily hidden in the garden beneath the brushes.
GM for walking into the Smiths who were english speaking and in a great number.

Yes, bushes were in need of pruning. But when and by whom?

____________________
Judge Judy to shifty  witnesses   -    LOOK AT ME  -   Um is not an answer.

If I forget to add it to a post everything is In My Opinion and I don't know anything for sure.
Rolling Eyes

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by plebgate on 25.02.13 19:51

Sorry portia that is so annoying, I just spent about 10 minutes replying to your post and now lost it.

If I have the energy I will try and get my thoughts together again tomorrow and reply. Too tired and fed up now.

Edited to add that I highlighted the text in red in portia's post. At least that might remind me tomorrow of what I was saying.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 20:01

Yes ---I had not thought of that. Was it one to give the police (that they all had to memorize) and the REAL one ---but the police arrived.

I remember reading ROB was suprised when the police walked in and he had to hand them over.

Going to look for the one with Gerry written down the page. If it was a clock it would be around 4 in the morning.LOL

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by sami on 25.02.13 20:17

Portia wrote:
rolodog wrote:Pic of Dan in 'the coaching team section'


Just google Dan Stuk. Get present employer. Tick Dan Stuk again. See curriculum, with MW in Greece mentioned.

So yes, someone having sojourned at MW Greece before would be familiar with him.

Blonde or not hard to see on this pic. But if only a 'summer blonde', not likely to be so in April/May already.



Amaral talked about Greece in his book, in relation to the Gasper statements. Whilst talking about how the Gasper statements were with held from the PJ, he said they had received reports of a similar incident in Greece and they passed the information to the UK police. The point he was making was that even when the PJ gave the info to the UK, they still held back the Gaspers statements from them.

Another co-incidence no doubt.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 20:26

I think they are definately boozers. (that and the darker thing) That was the cause.

But they sobered up on Wed. morn. and IMO set the plan in motion. She phoned her friend very early. For advice? To make out to a friend that M. was alive and thriving? a chat?

Maybe they did'nt booze as much Wed.

One puzzle. Yesterday I saw a photo of Kate taking Amelie to nursery on Wed. morning and she looks quite jaunty.

When I tried to find out what kind of information there was about what Kate was like when she was younger----it's all about being a party animal.

And I could'nt believe that bit in the diary about "we've all been there" about a paralytic tramp.

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 20:41

I think ---because she had been drinking on Tuesday night (from 7 0'clock) ---she went back with Payne at 9.30 ---left at 10---and because she is

not maternal---did'nt do what any NORMAL mother would do at least ---which was put the white plastic chairs back in the flat.

AND did not shut the patio door properly OR left it open for someone else to go in.

I think Tuesday was an 'anything goes' kind of night. Why was Gerry blatently chatting up that busty woman?

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Re: Having met Dan in the car

Post by rolodog on 25.02.13 20:50

Sami,

I did not know that about Greece. Wonder if Payne was there.

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