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We were taken on a ride

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 14.08.12 20:19

Hello Cath2756 and mira2.

I find this a really interesting subject, but I haven't contributed to the above post although my name is above it. I'm sure you didn't mean this, but please!
when you answer a post, please, please press the 'quote' button first. The whole of the quoted post will then appear in the box.
Scroll down to the last [quote] and then type in your own post. That is the only way to keep things clear.

The other method which some people use on longer posts is to post their replies underneath separate paragraphs in a different colour - again so that it is clear who is 'speaking'.

It just so happens it is my pet hate to be credited with something I haven't said or written...... roses roses roses

What I think about Gordon Brown isn't fit to be printed....

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 14.08.12 20:27

It is a fact that historically speaking, the Scots have had closer bonds with the catholic countries of Europe than with England.

In view of the above posts, I'm just wondering if there are certain people who can see themselves as 'President of Scotland' and are actively working for separation.
As far as Blair is concerned, he didn't get the Presidency of Europe (there is a God!) - wouldn't it be amusing to see Brown and Blair once again competing for the same job?
Economically speaking, how on earth would Scotland fare on its' own? History isn't encouraging in this respect.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by mira2 on 07.09.12 22:24

@tigger wrote:It is a fact that historically speaking, the Scots have had closer bonds with the catholic countries of Europe than with England.

In view of the above posts, I'm just wondering if there are certain people who can see themselves as 'President of Scotland' and are actively working for separation.
As far as Blair is concerned, he didn't get the Presidency of Europe (there is a God!) - wouldn't it be amusing to see Brown and Blair once again competing for the same job?
Economically speaking, how on earth would Scotland fare on its' own? History isn't encouraging in this respect.

________

evening tigger, ty for pointing out in no nonsense terms the 'quote' button, much appreciated.

[quote="tigger"]It is a fact that historically speaking, the Scots have had closer bonds with the catholic countries of Europe than with England.


I have no idea what you mean by that comment. I have read it over and over again it just isn't working for me --- tigger please enlighten me.

This whole thing with Blair, Brown, Mandelson and Murdoch and a few well placed individuals controlling the banks -- the question begs: how undemocratic was, and is, the system here in the UK that this bunch of imposters ran off with the Crown Jewels and continue to milk the nation.

Of the lot of them, the only one that I give any credibility to is Brown, in that thoughout his political life he had to play piggle in the middle to Brown and Mandelson, of the trio Brown is the only one who with a conscience.

It bothers me that the British people are so passive and so unconcerned with anything other than themselves, and higher up you go the more insular they get.

They don't have the capacity to look beyond themselves and their little family, it is all about ensuring that their offspring have a legacy (financial that is), not about what really matters to their offspring, like, i,e, a planet that still has natural resources to sustain it, a world where Western Governments are forced by the power of the people to act honourably and are accountable for their actions. No more fuelling massacres in Africa by selling arms in return for food aid. No more fuelling the drug menace that is killing our kids, no more nuclear weapons of mass destruction. No more of the scandal of the parasitic banks who have been given carte blanche to speculate on food prices with the effect that the poorest of the poorest on our planet die, and will continue to die, in order for the one percent of well connected on this planet to get a kick. Blair is in the frame here, this guy is a cancer .........just take a look at how he makes his millions, and wonder.

P.S. tigger just letting off steam, the above is not directed at you, it is just that you raise the questions that give me motivation (that is a compliment by the way).

For anyone picking up on this discussion there is something that has never sat right with me regarding T Blair.

I will tell you what puzzles me, and would be interested in your take.

It is my understanding that in order to be elected as UK leader you have to be Church of England, it is not possible to become the PM if you are of a different persuassion. Allthough Blairs wife was Catholic and the children brought up in that persuassion(could be wrong) Blair himself was Church of england (or such) allowing him to become PM.

Soon after he stepped down as PM he was off to Rome to be baptised as a Catholic. That much is a fact.

(By the way this bafoon claims that it was his religious beliefs that led him to kick down the door to Iraq, more than 100,000 innocent civilians dead as a result.)

?

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 07.09.12 22:35

Just a quick point Mira2, there is no bar to a Catholic (or any other denomination or religion) becoming prime minister. You're thinking of royalty - mind you, Tony Blair did seem to believe that he was!
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 7:05

Jean wrote:Just a quick point Mira2, there is no bar to a Catholic (or any other denomination or religion) becoming prime minister. You're thinking of royalty - mind you, Tony Blair did seem to believe that he was!

That's right. Disraeli was Jewish although may have adopted C of E, I don't know. He was - I can't resist this - Queen Victoria's favourite PM. She said: 'When Mr. Gladstone was in the room, one would feel he was the cleverest person in the world - but when Mr. Disraeli was in the room, one would feel one was the cleverest person in the world.'

Blair and Booth tried to turn the whole thing into an American style presidency. Ms. Booth took it upon herself to launch a ship early in her career as 'First Lady', the papers ignored it mostly/ Then she managed - with the help of acolytes such as the Chief Justices to turn the human rights laws into a free for all except 'normal' people.
Blair was a closet catholic - sent his children to a very expensive private catholic school - a hypocrite from start to finish.

Last year he was present at a modest baptising ceremony by the river Jordan in his capacity as godfather to Murdoch's youngest daughter.
Is Murdoch catholic? That would have helped.

I'm not great on church history, but the catholic church cannot have been pleased to lose their hold over GB. The threat of excommunication was a potent one at the time. GB has alway been a problem for the RC as Celtic Christianity was a far more tolerant religion and far more practical. The UK wasn't converted by St. Augustine - who had to write back to Rome that there really wasn't much to do as there were plenty of Christians already in Britain.
He was there to suppress the Celtic church and install the RC one.

After the dissolution Scotland remained mostly catholic - it's really dire if you think about it - a choice between RC or the gloomy Calvinistic Kirk.
The Scots and the Irish emigrated in large numbers to the States and Canada. Being of Scottish or Irish extraction there is almost like being royalty.

The myths of the brave Scots came with them. Wallace was betrayed by his own side.
At the battle of Culloden more Scottish clans fought on the English side than on the Scottish side. Mary, queen of Scots, did plot to destroy England with the help of Spain, Bonny Prince Charlie wasn't too keen to live in Scotland after Paris and so on.
It's feeding the misplaced nationalism, because not only do the Scots not like the English, they don't like each other either.
With products like Blair and Brown, who can wonder?


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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by PeterMac on 08.09.12 8:32

At Culloden three of the Chisholm's sons fought for the English, the other two for the Scots ! They retained their ancestral lands, no matter what.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by statsman on 08.09.12 8:54

On the topic of the religious beliefs of UK prime ministers, Gordon Brown is Church of Scotland, Harold Wilson was Congregationalist, Clement Attlee was agnostic and the present Leader of the Opposition is an atheistic Jew.

On nationalities, Tony Blair, though born in Scotland had English parents and spent most of his childhood in England and, since the war, Scotland has produced Harold MacMillan and Sir Alec Douglas Home as UK prime ministers.

As far as I'm aware Scotland rapidly became Protestant after the reformation and the emigrations over the Atlantic were in the most part because the Scots were cleared off their land by the aristocracy.

Regarding Culloden, it wasn't a Scottish civil war, it was a British civil war. The Scots that fought against Prince Charlie were in the British Army and had little choice or, as PertMac has said, they were from clans whose chiefs wanted to bet on both sides.

It's also true that Scots are fond of myths but Brave Scots is not a myth. Scottish fighters were not called "ladies from hell" by the Germans for nothing!
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 08.09.12 8:58

Thanks for your reply Tigger.

The school attended by Tony Blair's three sons is not a private one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Oratory_School

At the time the two older ones joined, it selected pupils in order of merit - nothing of course to do with how much money their parents had!

That's what attracted controversy as Labour Party policy was opposed to selective education. I can't recall which school Kathryn Blair attended but again it wasn't a private one.

Compared to everything else Tony went on to do, the schools incident is very trivial to my mind!
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by PeterMac on 08.09.12 9:15

Blair was at the Chorister School in Durham and was then a boarder at Fettes. (in Edinburgh, for readers not from the UK)
"His teachers were unimpressed with him, his biographer John Rentoul, reported that "All the teachers I spoke to when researching the book said he was a complete pain in the backside and they were very glad to see the back of him.""
Priceless !

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 08.09.12 9:53

I hope that John Rentoul is back from exile to Siberia by now!

As far as I'm aware, there has been very little gossip and tittle-tattle in the media about Tony's younger days. Even John Major (the grey man loved by Spittin' Image) was found to have had a relationship in his young days with an older woman who was still married to someone else (let's not think about him and Edwina please!) but there was and is nothing like that with Tony.

It does remind me of a certain couple who, despite being one of the most famous in the world for all the wrong reasons, seem to exist in a vacuum with only their immediate families to vouch that they are the most wonderful human beings ever to walk the earth.

Their paths must have crossed with many people over the years but nobody is saying a word.
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by PeterMac on 08.09.12 9:55

Jean wrote:
Their paths must have crossed with many people over the years but nobody is saying a word.
Would you admit to it ?

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 10:00

@PeterMac wrote:
Jean wrote:
Their paths must have crossed with many people over the years but nobody is saying a word.
Would you admit to it ?

@ Jean - I'm worried about your latest hairdo/incarnation Jean. I've head that a bleach job can turn green if you jump into a chloride laden swimming pool, but blue!
Thanks for the info on oratory school.
Yes, there's teflon Tony and teflon McCanns. Innocent explanations for anything found or not yet found....

Tony and Mandelson were close once, I heard, and he was called Miranda... urrghh!

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 08.09.12 10:22

Hi there Tigger, I decided to go for a more realistic image of myself. The one I had before (young and pleasant looking) was about as true to life as Kate's book!!

Miranda and Mandy - what an image that conjures up.

PeterMac: the exact nature of any dealings I'd had with the saintly pair would determine whether I'd speak out!
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by PeterMac on 08.09.12 11:46


There is in the public domain a fascinating article about a certain person who appeared in court many many years ago for the offence of importuning, and apparently was allowed to use a false name.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 08.09.12 11:55

If that story is true, I'm surprised that the person involved was ever taken to court in the first place!
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 12:15

Jean wrote:If that story is true, I'm surprised that the person involved was ever taken to court in the first place!

I've PM'd you with a link that will turn your blue coat red! winkwink

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by bobbin on 08.09.12 12:19

Jean wrote:If that story is true, I'm surprised that the person involved was ever taken to court in the first place!

you mean the £50 fine paid to Bow Street Court in 1983 was it, for cottaging, using his middle names instead of the two outer names that we know him by?
Well, at that time he wasn't in the position of power which he later attained, to ensure all reference would be erased from the records, if that is what happened of course, who knows.

P.S. do I get a P.M. as well to turn my blue coat red, I can't afford the dyes these days.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 12:22

@bobbin wrote:
Jean wrote:If that story is true, I'm surprised that the person involved was ever taken to court in the first place!

you mean the £50 fine paid to Bow Street Court in 1983 was it, for cottaging, using his middle names instead of the two outer names that we know him by?
Well, at that time he wasn't in the position of power which he later attained, to ensure all reference would be erased from the records, if that is what happened of course, who knows.

To think that I merrily went to the opera in '83 (upper slips I hasten to add, in case anyone thinks me posh) and just opposite a greater drama was being played out!

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Invinoveritas on 08.09.12 12:50

@PeterMac wrote:
There is in the public domain a fascinating article about a certain person who appeared in court many many years ago for the offence of importuning, and apparently was allowed to use a false name.
I was under the impression that he used his third forename as his surname, it was in a London court after he was caught in a mens´toilet
sorry tigger, I posted after you without reading your post

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by PeterMac on 08.09.12 13:21

@Invinoveritas wrote:
I was under the impression that he used his third forename as his surname,SNIP
Yes, middle two names.
But one should not be too judgmental. Edward Heath was 'rescued' by MI6 several times.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Guest on 08.09.12 17:52

Tigger: you can see from my new look what all this has done to me - I'm no longer a lovable furry creature!

As I've mentioned before, it's a definite cause for concern when people seem to have no "history" prior to their appearance on the public stage.

Almost certainly there is something very very dodgy that they don't want anyone to know about.
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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Invinoveritas on 08.09.12 18:07

Jean wrote:Tigger: you can see from my new look what all this has done to me - I'm no longer a lovable furry creature!

As I've mentioned before, it's a definite cause for concern when people seem to have no "history" prior to their appearance on the public stage.

Almost certainly there is something very very dodgy that they don't want anyone to know about.
you look bloody awesome Jean, not the Jean that I have learnt to respect and cherish

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 19:21

It is also the fault of the media - the erased past of people in high places.

There was a news black-out on Diana Spencer from the time she was only 14! She could not have any real boyfriends because the newspapers would have had the exes tell all - either before or after the wedding. It's the only one I know about, I'm sure there are many more such black-outs. My source was from the BBC.

@Jean: there' aint gonna be no messin' with you little lady! thump

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by Ross on 08.09.12 20:20

I have read through this thread and am concerned that some posters appear to be in danger of wandering off the reservation. Stop this immediately! Believe what you are told! We live in a democracy and Parliament exists to express the will of the people. The courts are there to pursue justice without fear nor favour. Nothing is hidden, we live in a free, open and fair society. The news is true, history is true and everything you were taught in school is true. There is no plot. There is no conspiracy. All is well with the world.

Carry on.

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Re: We were taken on a ride

Post by tigger on 08.09.12 20:47

In BNW, happiness derives from consuming mass-produced goods, sports such as Obstacle Golf and Centrifugal Bumble-puppy, promiscuous sex, "the feelies", and most famously of all, a supposedly perfect pleasure-drug, soma.

Not only do I not participate in any of the above - I'm never asked to that sort of party - I'm right out of soma! mad

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