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Breakfast Arrangements

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Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Hummingbird on 23.05.12 17:09

Didn't know where else to put this so please feel free to move to another thread and I apologise if there is a relevant one I have looked but can't find one!

I had always believed that KM & GM breakfasted in their apartment every morning, not only because they have said that they did but because of the 3rd of May scenario where Madeleine questions where they were and they say they were still in pyjamas.

I also thought that they clearly say they never went back to the Millenium restaurant again after the first night because it was too far for the children to walk and they had no pushchair.

DP in his interview to the British Police quite clearly states that allt he couples had breakfast in the Millenium restaurant but G< & KM breakfasted at home.

So why then does DW say this in her statement.

Wednesday morning the ladies tennis was postponed due to the rain .

'I was with DP and FP for breakfast I seem to recollect seeing K & G then who were sitting with us and I think they'd just finished their breakfast'

If they were sitting with you then you say them , not a recollection of perhaps seeing them.

So where exactly did the Mccanns take breakfast?

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by jmac on 23.05.12 18:32

I am sorry I do not know where to locate the information, possibly in The Truth of the Lie by Amaral. It seems that the apartment on May 4th had little evidence that three children had been staying there. The cupboards were sparse and there were few provisions. It this is correct then they were ill prepared for breakfast, but they should have been, because Madelaine was not discovered missing until 10.00 pm on May 3rd and the shopping at the Baptista should have been done for the following morning, May 4th, I would have thought.

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by aquila on 23.05.12 19:00

@jmac wrote:I am sorry I do not know where to locate the information, possibly in The Truth of the Lie by Amaral. It seems that the apartment on May 4th had little evidence that three children had been staying there. The cupboards were sparse and there were few provisions. It this is correct then they were ill prepared for breakfast, but they should have been, because Madelaine was not discovered missing until 10.00 pm on May 3rd and the shopping at the Baptista should have been done for the following morning, May 4th, I would have thought.

You are so right.

Just off the top of my head a shopping list of basic things that would be in a holiday apartment for a family of two adults and three children holidaying in the Med.

Bread, cheese, butter, lovely orange yolked eggs, mediterranean tomatoes, milk and biscuits (the children apparently had them before bedtime) tea bags (usually Liptons when a Brit is on holiday) cool drinks, juice, water, fruit, perhaps some wine and beer, a few nibbles and maybe some olives.

What we have is very little in the fridge and cupboards according to Amaral's detectives.

What a good post - the breakfast stuff should have been in the fridge and the cupboards!
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Hummingbird on 23.05.12 19:02

@jmac wrote:I am sorry I do not know where to locate the information, possibly in The Truth of the Lie by Amaral. It seems that the apartment on May 4th had little evidence that three children had been staying there. The cupboards were sparse and there were few provisions. It this is correct then they were ill prepared for breakfast, but they should have been, because Madelaine was not discovered missing until 10.00 pm on May 3rd and the shopping at the Baptista should have been done for the following morning, May 4th, I would have thought.

Yes I have read that somewhere too, so if they had breakfast at home as they tell us every day why were the cupboards and fridge not containing any food?

Why stay in an apartment of you do not intend to do at least some self catering? We always have apartment holidays and whilst we may eat out most nights we always have breakfast in and we always have juice, pop, snacks, loads of cereals, milk and sandwich stuff, oh and don't forget the alcohol!!! I may throw some of it away at the end but it is always there in case anyone wants some extra food!!! So where was all the snacks she was giving the children every night, the milk and the wine and beer they had before they went out?

aquila, yes of course the eggs and ham etc etc and water. (Yes I always take my T bags LOL) !!

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by tigger on 23.05.12 19:03

http://textusa.blogspot.com/search/label/Millenium

You will love this one! Hummingbird. I didn't want to copy and paste, because the all important maps would then not copy - can someone do that?


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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Hummingbird on 23.05.12 19:29

@tigger wrote:http://textusa.blogspot.com/search/label/Millenium

You will love this one! Hummingbird. I didn't want to copy and paste, because the all important maps would then not copy - can someone do that?


Absolutely brilliant one of the best things I have ever seen written about the holiday I will have to read this again when the family aren't around, just pure brilliance!! Thanks tigger!!

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by PeterMac on 24.05.12 8:56

Copied and pasted from Textusa. With many thanks.

EastEnders, WestEnders & NoEnders

Ocean Club, Tapas, Millenium Restaurant, Kid’s Club, Baptista Supermarket and Paraíso Bar, are names that have become too familiar due to Maddie’s tragedy.

As was the name of a little Portuguese fishing village, Praia da Luz, that has even achieved the rare notorious status of an acronym: PdL or PDL.

The only other two that come to mind are NY, and LA.

Today, as in 2007, fishing is no longer the village’s main activity. Its tourism and ONE main attraction: the beach.

It’s privileged to be located near Lagos, a city where all can be found, but sufficiently detached so that it’s not minimally affected by it.

Ocean Club, Tapas, Millenium Restaurant, Kid’s Club, Baptista Supermarket and Paraíso Bar, seem to be the ONLY locations, in PdL, known to the Tapas Party during their whole vacation.

At least they are the only one’s mentioned by the group when referring to anything before “Maddie”.

After that, the only other location they seemed to have learned is the PdL Church.

It even seems that the whole Tapas Party was confined to the grounds of the Ocean Club, quarantined due to some sick and strange disease.

Allowed only to an occasional escape to beach…

To which, unlike the other children, Maddie was taken by her father only once, and had the bad luck of having that sole fatherly visit spoiled by clouds.

Of all the names mentioned, only Paraíso Bar and the Baptista Supermarket are outside the facilities.

And the latter was to buy food to eat inside the apartment.

Other places mentioned, are included in “Ocean Club”: the tennis Courts and the famous Apartment 5A.

It seems that only AFTER Maddie was “abducted” that the McCanns & friends found the courage to venture “outside”.

But not even on the night the abductor took her.

That night they stayed indoors. Just to be safe.

The McCanns say they arrived on Saturday, 28th, at 14.30; the others, before them.

Plenty of daylight left. So what did they do? Go to the beach? Walk around and check out the surroundings, see a little of the little town they were going to spend their holiday?

At least, that is what I would do. I would check-in, just place the luggage in the apartment without unpacking, and take hubby and the kids to see the Ocean Club, the village and the beach.

And if all hurried, put on the bathing suits and head for the beach.

After all, holidays are al about novelty, aren’t they? But, that’s me. Yes, I know I’m weird.

So, for me, if you’ve arrived at 14:30 on a sunny day at PdL, by 15:00 you’re on the beach. Maybe not in a bathing suit, but certainly you’ve walked and checked where it was in relation to the hotel, what is the best path to get there, etc...

Naturally, if you’re new in town, you want to know the town. But the McCanns, on that first day, checked-in, unpacked THOUROUGHLY, and then went to the Tapas Bar (how they would just loooooove that place…) to hear a lecture about all the activities; and would you believe it, when it was over, it was dinner time.

Time flies when you’re listening to a lecture, everyone knows that.

For hours on ALL the activities for the forthcoming days. For hours.

All they wanted to hear about was tennis and… well, tennis.

Was there any other activity? You know, tennis is that unknown and complex sport that has so many interesting details that require hours to explain, and then hours to listen to.

Very, very interesting stuff. You have the service, the backhand, the grass, which makes tennis faster, then you have…

No, too, too complex, it would take me hours to explain.

Seriously. Ask the McCanns.

So, naturally, they were surprised that it’s was already dinner time.

So you’re on holiday and it’s your first meal out, what do you do?

If you take a poll at hotel receptions to what is the most often asked question after a check-in, you’ll get 50% stating that it’s “do you know any good restaurants around?” and the other 50% that it’s “which restaurants nearby do you recommend?”

I’m obviously exaggerating. They’re also asked, although not as frequently, “what is interesting around here to visit/go?” and “where is the most lively area around?”.

If you take another poll, this time to hotel customers about what is the expected reaction to the most frequent asked question, you’ll get a 100% answer which is what anyone who has walked into a hotel has already experienced: the receptionist whisks up a photocopy of the town/city map, proceeds to scribble, mechanically, and circles around various spots.

Usually in ink, so it ruins the paper, and none of the circles fall at the hotel they’re working at.

Oh, and I’m forgetting, they were in a restaurant!

The Tapas. One they were to use so, so often.

But, unfortunately, it was closed for dinner. Closed on a Saturday.

On a Saturday, I repeat, in an activity and location that lives off tourism.

But closed is closed, you can’t do anything about it.

That can only mean one thing, and one thing only: lack of clients. And that, in turn, means that they go somewhere else...

Apparently nobody at the Ocean Club would recommend a restaurant other than the Millenium.

About a 500 metres walk, so we can only assume that there was no other near, or most likely, the only one open that night.

Well PdL is not Manhattan, we know that. But it’s not Radiator Springs, a single Avenue town.

Let’s first understand the distances we’re talking about, with this picture with concentric 100 metre circles around Apartment 5A:

Easily, you can see that ANYTHING is available to Apartment 5A, in 500 metres or less. Most, under 400 meters. Four football pitches. Less than from Piccadilly Circle to Trafalgar Square:


The whole area is around 1,000 square metres, even less. Why go to the Millenium?

Because, say you, The Tapas was closed.

Then, say I, was there any particular reason to choose the Millenium specifically?

Say thee, it was the nearest and the only restaurant open that Saturday. And I say:


Wow, that's a lot of restaurants for such a small place!

Pubs, Bars, Cafes, Takeaways, it's all there.

And the Millenium Restaurant doesn’t even appear on the map!.

It’s near, or as per Jane Tanner’s statement, where Mirage Restaurant (d) is, right there, all alone, on the top-right hand corner of the map.

Does it make sense any at all, in a beach town, to head Northeast, to the farthest restaurant of all, when most of the restaurants are in the exact opposite side?

I had a hard time finding the thing. You try and google it. Even asked for help from the readers. This is the only thing I found with the location of the Millenium Restaurant:


It’s like booking a hotel in Las Vegas and heading, on foot, for the desert for dinner, without as so much getting a single glance at any of the neon…

Ok, so after one fascinating lecture, you were directed to eat at the Millenium.

Let’s be naïve and believe that you’re convinced to go there and new no better. But did you have to have whined all the way there? If it was THAT far, which we know it isn’t, wouldn’t have been wise to go to the room and get a stroller?

No, you had to submit yourself to a torturous five football pitches of carrying your own child. After all, unlike you've led us to believe, it's about the same distance as the Paraíso Bar, and your friends, at least on May 3rd, made the distance, on foot, and no complaints.

But it must have been a terrible, terrible pain that must have had to endure. Before then, I’m sure the furthest you had carried your children was from your doorstep to your car.

And didn’t any of your friends help? There were another seven grown-ups, and none, witnessing your heart-wrenching pain offered to carry one of the kids a couple of yards?

Not even David Payne, that a few days later would be so concerned, for no reason whatsoever, with Kate’s well being?

I honestly don’t know, after that ordeal, how you found strength to play tennis. And play it over, and over again for the next days…

And your jogging after your daughter was supposedly kidnapped?

I’m being unfair… you just ran all the way to the Baptista Supermarket and back, and that must have been an effort, especially the uphill bit…

Or were just trying to pass to the public, forcibly, the message that the McCann family was during their whole holiday basically quarantined “Ocean Club in-walls” just because they had ONE more child than the others?

Why on Earth would you that for? But that was one night. Five other to explain.

I know you said that you had ALL the other dinners at the Tapas Bar. Unfortunately for you, Ironside has already proved that to be false.

What really is going on here is that the McCann wanted, with these "subliminar" messages, to convey the idea that most of PdL was unknown to them, that they knew only the immediate surroundings of the Ocean Club and a direct path to and from the beach.

The Southwest part of PdL, for some reason, was completely off-limits to these people.

Completely out-of-bounds.

For the McCanns & friends, it was the infamous “PdL Red Zone”, to be avoided at all costs, as if it was plague, prostitution and drug-trafficking territory.


Let’s then see what lays in this so ill-reputed area of PdL:


Fascinating. all the Pubs and Bars are located in that area.

ALL of them.

It's where PdL's night life is located.

Now, why would an English group not want to be linked to Pubs and Bars?

We know the McCann like to drink, at least New Zealand wine, which is perfectly natural and healthy if done in moderation, and you both are Doctors. So it’s not got to do with booze problem.

And these establishments do sell sodas and other non-alcoholic drinks.

Let's leave that unanswered for, and move on. There are two commercial establishments I would like to call your attention to: Kelly’s Bar and Chaplin’s Restaurant.

I call to your attention Kelly's Bar not because of Mr. Smith, but because of both Drs. McCann: “Kelly's Irish Bar, three minutes' walk from the Mark Warner Complex where the McCanns stayed, is -- allegedly -- one of the places visited by Gerry and Kate McCann during their brief stay on the peninsula.”

Kelly’s is managed by a Mary from Donegal, and the father of her son worked at Chaplins. Once again, pure coincidence. But looking at these two establishments one discovers what seems to be, after tennis, the second most popular activity in PdL: Quiz Night!!!

On Kelly’s: “Despite the Irish sounding name, Kellys is actually a Welsh owned bar. Nice friendly staff. A good sized bar with plenty of outside seating ( a good afternoon sun trap ). Crisps and nuts only. - ‘ Two Sky T.V.'s for football. - Lively Quiz nights Mondays and Fridays. A popular haunt of the English residents especially on the quiz nights.”

On Chaplins: “An English Restaurant great for traditional British dishes when you want to go for 'home cooking'. Good value for money. Fish & Chips, Bangers and Mash etc.. Large portions, well prepared and nice service. They do a Cataplana for one which is unusual ( normally only for two persons ). The rack of lamb is probably the best we've ever eaten. The steaks are more than substantial. 3 course Sunday Roasts from €12 - ( 12.30 to 21.00 ). Take away service for fish & chips, curries, bangers and mash. - Quiz night every Tuesday at 22.00 (seasonal). Be sure to say hello to Analise when you visit"

It seems that Quiz nights are also held on The Duke (s) (twice weekly Quiz nights (Saturday)) and the Luz Tavern (I) (A full program of entertainment during the 'season'. Cabaret, Live Music, Quiz night, Karaoke).

How stupid of The Duke to be open on Saturdays… Oh, they had, what are they called, again? Clients, they had clients, on Saturday nights, unlike Tapas... (but you should see Tapas on Sundays, and Tuesdays, it's packed... Quiz Night, remember?)

And about Quiz Night, of course… we couldn't forget the Tapas Bar where Najoua worked Sundays and Tuesdays.

So, on Tuesday, by coincidence, we have two Quiz Nights going on at PdL, one in Tapas and the other at Chaplins.

Separate entertainers one hopes, as ubiquity is not a gift for many.

You could argue that she would be finished at Tapas, and then rush to Chaplins. But, then, would she stayed and chatted with the Tapas at Tapas?!?

Wouldn't be more natural to chat with clients at Chaplins, where she finished, and in my opinion started, the night?

We hope, honestly, that whoever was the Quiz Mistress that May 1st Tuesday night at Chaplins made a more memorable appearance than Najoua did at Tapas that night.

We all remember how she was NOT remembered...

Or, is it possible, that on THAT Tuesday, the the McCanns were at Chaplins and not at Tapas?

And if that be the case, how many nights did the McCanns really dine at Tapas?

And, oh, how about throwing in a Happy Hour at Chaplins?

That, for the English is not exactly “bait”, it’s more like an irresistible magnet…

On this site, if you click on the Chaplins link: “Later on in the evening, once the food has finished, Chaplins swings into Bar mode and is soon full of people enjoying the music, the great company and perhaps most of all the Happy Hour (11.30pm - 12.30pm) when all drinks are half price.”

There is one easy way to find out: credit card statements.

Oh, I forgot they don’t exist… or, apparently, they hold big no-no state secrets or whatever.

In PdL there aren’t many things in which you can use a credit card. Basically in two things: restaurants, as in meals and bar tabs; and lodging, when checking-in or on your way out.

What else can you buy with a credit card in PdL? A beach towel?

The credit card statement tell exactly where and when it was used.

No abductors, no pimpleman, no New Zealand sightings.

And I'm sure that if ever we're able to look at those statements we will be able to take out the "-- allegedly --" from the places visited by Gerry and Kate McCann.

No state secrets, just that, and for that to be a secret in itself tells us a lot.

Yes, there is the possibility of stolen identity, as we unfortunately took awareness of that major problem with Operation Ore.

But, what a huge coincidence it would have been to have your identity stolen by someone in PdL and you NOT having reported any stealing of any card.

But coincidences are your speciality aren't they? So, its CLEAR that the McCanns have PURPOSEFULLY hid the fact that they were familiar with the Southwest part of PdL.

By lying about having ALL dinners at Tapas, by hiding their credit card statements. But why? After all, it’s a perfectly innocent piece of information…

Because somebody knew, before anybody else did, that someone was seen THERE holding a child, and that that somebody also knew that that someone had gone THERE in that specific direction because that someone knew VERY WELL that it was there he was most likely to be seen:


Now, you may tell me that even though nobody confirmed in any way that they didn’t know the area, NOBODY from the McCanns or the Tapas has ever, ever denied knowing it, so all I’ve stated above is all BASELESS.

Beg to differ. Gerry, asks, on the night of 3rd, the GNR Officer Rui Sergio Lópes Silva , if he knew a church nearby (“He only had direct contact with the couple and their friends at about 04.00 when Gerry McCann approached the GNR group of which he was a member to ask whether there was a church close by. He replied to him in English, giving the directions to a nearby church.”)

By doing so, Gerry McCann is EXPLICITLY and INTENTIONALLY denying ever being near to the PdL Church, situated in the heart of the “PdL Red Zone".

Why? Because Gerry McCann knew, before anybody else did, that he, Gerry McCann was seen THERE holding a child, and that that he, Gerry McCann, also knew that that he, Gerry McCann, had gone THERE in that specific direction because he, Gerry McCann, knew VERY WELL that it was THERE he was most likely to be seen.
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by uppatoffee on 24.05.12 10:32

Surely the reason for going to the Millenium and the Tapas restaurants were that they were the ones included in the Mark Warner package? Why would you pay half board for breakfast and dinner then go and pay to eat somewhere different? With three kids that would get expensive.
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Mariita on 24.05.12 11:48

I was also thinking of an "All inclusive" concept where certain restaurants were included. Still it´s no excuse for not going to the beach more than once during a week´s stay. And exploring the surroundings is also nothing uncommon to do on holidays. People who spend a majority of their vacationtime in bars close to the hotel, are IMO generally people with more or less severe alcoholproblems. Children are treated as outsiders, not being a part of the "real" family which instead is the group you´re drinking with. Luckily, most people I´ve seen with this behaviour on holidays, are persons WITHOUT children. The McCanns would probably never have gone to that place if there hadn´t been a creche/kindergardenfacility.
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Hummingbird on 24.05.12 12:12

@uppatoffee wrote:Surely the reason for going to the Millenium and the Tapas restaurants were that they were the ones included in the Mark Warner package? Why would you pay half board for breakfast and dinner then go and pay to eat somewhere different? With three kids that would get expensive.

Absolutely right the Millenium offered a free buffet breakfast service and I believe the meals in the evening but as it was such a long walk with the children they decided not to use it again.

Of course apart from breakfast time. So it was too hard to walk there at night but not in the morning!!

FP's rogatory interview.

'K & G would go to the Millenium for breakfast, a buffet breakfast, we'd all be slightly different times but generally you'd see someone else there.'

Much later on in this interview she then changes her mind again and says that they only went there on the Sunday morning for breakfast (K & G) because the twins played up so much on the way back!! But of course DW says she saw them their on the Weds morning!!

Also she tells us that every lunch time everyone would go to their (the Payne's) apartment because they had the biggest apartment and DW used to do piles of baquettes etc for lunch for everyone would come over and pile in! Except for of course K & G who had lunch in their apartment because 'they found it easier!'

So it would appear that K & G's apartment should have been practically overflowing with provisions as they didn't take the free breakfast because the twins played up, and didn't partake in the lunch time get togethers with all their friends because it was easier to be alone!

I also don't remember anywhere in K & Gs statements telling us about their frequent visits on this holiday to buy all this food for breakfast and lunch - so where exactly did they spend their time?


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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by tigger on 24.05.12 12:15

I think:
they went to Chaplins a few times at least after having dinner at the Tapas - the Tapas staff would think they'd gone home to their children
that they had been in PdL before in 2006 when the pool photo was taken
that this whole insistence on 'not knowing PdL at all' was essential for the sighting by the Smiths to attributed to an unknown male
that not knowing PdL at all would mean they had never met Murat before
that therefore they could not know where Murat lived
that they could not have known the lay-out of the site before 29/4/07
that not knowing PdL at all would prove they didn't know anyone at all in the town (Geraghty springs to mind for a start)
that they were very unlucky that have been assigned the most vulnerable appartment - not knowing the site
that Gerry wasn't so keen on golf as to try and have a game there (several courses there) despite having made special trips to Portugal to play golf
In fact: golf was conspicuous by its absence in the narrative. Golf and golf courses are never mentioned by this ardent player.


Re the prices: yes, it would be more expensive with a number of children to eat elsewhere, but children's portions are very low priced usually and most restaurants will even share portions between two small children. The food at the Millenium wasn't up to much and they were used to eating out in expensive places in the UK - having breakfast in 5a would be a minimal cost and lunch I understand was sandwiches - they were all high earners - so what's the problem?
Besides, the children just had a light supper at home before bed. So a bit of cereal, bread and milk from the supermarket, sandwich lunch. No big deal.

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by uppatoffee on 24.05.12 12:28

Come on Tigger! These are people that didn't want to pay for a babysitter, why waste good money on a second breakfast?!!! Mrs
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Hummingbird on 24.05.12 12:43

I think the point I am really trying to make is that the McCanns say they had breakfast at home every day but two other people say they breakfasted at the Millenium at least on two occasions. The McCanns have always made a big thing about their getting up times and breakfast and the fact that they didn't want to go the Millenium because it was too far. So you either do go or you don't go and you either breakfast at home ALL week or you don't!
So many inconsistencies it is unbelievable!!!

How much they buy or eat is irrelevant really tbh, it is just the glaring differences in what they are supposed to have done that baffles me!

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Gillyspot on 24.05.12 18:52

From the Files


Alice Maria Velhuco Ciriaco Guerreiro Silvestre

Place of Work: Millenium Restaurant

"She comes to the process as a witness. She says that she has worked as a waitress in the Millenium Restaurant since the 12th April 2007.

The restaurant is used by guests staying at the resort, mainly for breakfast and dinner.

When asked, she says she remembers the McCann family as they often used the restaurant where she worked although she adds that she never had a conversation with them."

Ana Marilia do Carmo Silva

Place of Work: Millenium Restaurant, OC.

She says that the child and her parents frequented the restaurant where they would have breakfast.
When asked, she says that she can not remember the date when they first began to frequent the restaurant.
However she is certain that they frequented the restaurant from the beginning of the week."

Cecilia Paula Dias Firmino do Carmo

When asked, she says that she knows the parents, the siblings and Madeleine. She received them for breakfast on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday, she does not know whether they went for breakfast on Sunday or Monday, as these were her days off.

She says that breakfast was served between 08.00 and 10.00 and that the McCanns would arrive between 08.00 and 09.00.

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Guest on 24.05.12 19:04

Very interesting Gillyspot here from KM and GM witness statements 4th May..............

GM

Concerning routines, he mentions that on Sunday, they had breakfast, between 7.30 and 8.30am at the Ocean Club, namely in the resort’s bar a few metres away from the apartment. On the following days, because the war was rather distant, they started buying food at the supermarket, located on the same road as the apartment, whose name he cannot recall. After breakfast, the children were left at one of the Club's crèches, called the "Kid Club


KM
As far as the routines are concerned, the witness refers that on Sunday they went for breakfast at around 7.30/8.30 at the Ocean Club, namely at the resort’s bar which is located at some metres’ distance from the apartment. On the following days, and because the bar was quite far away, they started buying food at the “BATISTA” supermarket, which is located on the same road as the apartment, and they had their first meal of the day at the apartment.

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic31.html
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by tigger on 24.05.12 19:12

But Brigit Wilkins said there were about 10 similar little blond girls at the OC, the staff at the Millennium could easily have been mistaken. The staff at the Paraiso Bar were sure they'd seen Gerry dance with Madeleine and the CCTV showed this was I think a French family at OC.

If Maddie was absent from early on the the week, I expect it was better to have breakfast in 5a, as her absence would not be noticed.

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by jmac on 25.05.12 0:33

Yes perhaps all of the staff at the Millenium were mistaken, or maybe one or two were mistaken. We do not know. But what is certain is that DW would not make such a mistake, and she is the only one of the Tapas group who never contradicted any of her statements.

Admittedly her recollection is a bit vague. The point is it did not surprise her to see the McCanns at the Millenium for breakfast. As a member of the Tapas group surely she would have known that the McCanns had decided not to bother going to the Millenium if that is what they really did?

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by tigger on 25.05.12 5:59

@jmac wrote:Yes perhaps all of the staff at the Millenium were mistaken, or maybe one or two were mistaken. We do not know. But what is certain is that DW would not make such a mistake, and she is the only one of the Tapas group who never contradicted any of her statements.

Admittedly her recollection is a bit vague. The point is it did not surprise her to see the McCanns at the Millenium for breakfast. As a member of the Tapas group surely she would have known that the McCanns had decided not to bother going to the Millenium if that is what they really did?

DW is an underrated member of the group imo. She would side with whatever Fiona told her had happened I think. Because she stuck with the general story from 10.00 pm on - although in TB's topic on the 3rd/4th it's clear other things were happening.
For her too, to say she though it was one of their games - make you wonder what these games were for people who were so 'into' each other. It all sounds rather puerile. I mean, did they leap from the table from time to time to chase each other? What sort of game for goodness sakes.

She is also very vague on the last time she saw Maddie - in her RI it sounds as if she is saying what she is told to say.
(Dr. Roberts '30 days) So perhaps she was also told to say they went to the Millennium.

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Spaniel on 25.05.12 8:31

@tigger wrote:
@jmac wrote:Yes perhaps all of the staff at the Millenium were mistaken, or maybe one or two were mistaken. We do not know. But what is certain is that DW would not make such a mistake, and she is the only one of the Tapas group who never contradicted any of her statements.

Admittedly her recollection is a bit vague. The point is it did not surprise her to see the McCanns at the Millenium for breakfast. As a member of the Tapas group surely she would have known that the McCanns had decided not to bother going to the Millenium if that is what they really did?

DW is an underrated member of the group imo. She would side with whatever Fiona told her had happened I think. Because she stuck with the general story from 10.00 pm on - although in TB's topic on the 3rd/4th it's clear other things were happening.
For her too, to say she though it was one of their games - make you wonder what these games were for people who were so 'into' each other. It all sounds rather puerile. I mean, did they leap from the table from time to time to chase each other? What sort of game for goodness sakes.

She is also very vague on the last time she saw Maddie - in her RI it sounds as if she is saying what she is told to say.
(Dr. Roberts '30 days) So perhaps she was also told to say they went to the Millennium.
I believe I've said before that DW would be my first of the group to question. As for the "games", could there have been a rehearsal for the 3rd May?
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by FH on 25.05.12 19:55

Would they not have had to give their appartment/room number to whoever serverd them in the Millenium? So would the millenium not have had some kind of records that they ate there?

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by bobbin on 25.05.12 21:00

@FH wrote:Would they not have had to give their appartment/room number to whoever serverd them in the Millenium? So would the millenium not have had some kind of records that they ate there?

That's a very good point. I wonder if the Portuguese police got hold of any records. Anyone come across any reference to this ?

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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by tuom on 25.05.12 21:19

@bobbin wrote:
@FH wrote:Would they not have had to give their appartment/room number to whoever serverd them in the Millenium? So would the millenium not have had some kind of records that they ate there?

That's a very good point. I wonder if the Portuguese police got hold of any records. Anyone come across any reference to this ?

You just beat me to it Bobbin , yes I would imagine there would be records of some kind , we have gone HB a few times and they always list your room/apt number
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by jd on 25.05.12 22:27

Luis Miguel de Sousa Barros - Barman Millenium Restaurant

" His work requires responsibility and he is usually one of the last persons to leave, there being some margin for starting later the following day. Recently, given the scarcity of personnel, he has only had one day off a week. This is always a Thursday, coinciding with the day Madeleine disappeared.......He remembered being in the presence of the group Madeleine belonged to, composed of nine adults and eight children on the 28th April, the day they arrived at the resort. Apart from breakfast, which they would eat every day in the Millenium restaurant, dinner on Saturday night was the only meal they had there because the Tapas bar did not serve dinner on Saturdays. "

"When asked he says that on a date he cannot remember, the group, just the adults because the children were dining with the nannies, had been too late in making their dinner reservation at the Tapas, and an exception was made, authorised by his boss Steve, as the Tapas only provides for 20 dinners for half board clients as was the case.

He think that this request was made in order to be close to the children who had their meals with the nannies, and to be close to the apartments."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LUIS_BARROS.htm

I didn't know of another day the adults eat on their own at the Millennium Restaurant. Maybe this was the Sunday?




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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by jd on 26.05.12 1:00

I am confused. DP in his interview to the British Police quite clearly states that all the couples had breakfast in the Millenium restaurant but GM & KM breakfasted at home

Dianne Webster says:

Reply ” Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday I remember it rained....Err but on the Wednesday morning it was err delayed if you like, it wasn’t cancelled, we did have it later.
4078 ”Right.”

Reply ”Err and that, that morning, I’d only ever gone to the Millennium twice for breakfast which is where they went for breakfast that, that was the only place you could have breakfast err and I didn’t go because it was too much of a rush having the tennis lesson supposedly starting at quarter past nine, to trail all the way down there for breakfast and then have to rush back and play tennis.”

4078 ”Play tennis on a full stomach.”

Reply ”So I, I was the one, I just stayed in the apartment and got myself a bit of toast and a cup of coffee whereas the others…”

But then a bit later in the same statement says:

4078 ”Tell me about the Wednesday then as far as you can remember from there.”

Reply ”Well that morning I did go to the Millennium with Dave and Fiona err for breakfast because there was no tennis and I think we, we sat there and I think, I seem to recollect seeing Kate and Gerry then who were sitting with us and I think they’d just finished their breakfast or something, again I’m not clear on that.”

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DIANE-WEBSTER-2.htm

Did DW go for breakfast at the Millennium or have it back at the apartment on the Wednesday?
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Re: Breakfast Arrangements

Post by Nina on 26.05.12 9:13

@jd wrote:I am confused. DP in his interview to the British Police quite clearly states that all the couples had breakfast in the Millenium restaurant but GM & KM breakfasted at home

Dianne Webster says:

Reply ” Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday I remember it rained....Err but on the Wednesday morning it was err delayed if you like, it wasn’t cancelled, we did have it later.
4078 ”Right.”

Reply ”Err and that, that morning, I’d only ever gone to the Millennium twice for breakfast which is where they went for breakfast that, that was the only place you could have breakfast err and I didn’t go because it was too much of a rush having the tennis lesson supposedly starting at quarter past nine, to trail all the way down there for breakfast and then have to rush back and play tennis.”

4078 ”Play tennis on a full stomach.”

Reply ”So I, I was the one, I just stayed in the apartment and got myself a bit of toast and a cup of coffee whereas the others…”

But then a bit later in the same statement says:

4078 ”Tell me about the Wednesday then as far as you can remember from there.”

Reply ”Well that morning I did go to the Millennium with Dave and Fiona err for breakfast because there was no tennis and I think we, we sat there and I think, I seem to recollect seeing Kate and Gerry then who were sitting with us and I think they’d just finished their breakfast or something, again I’m not clear on that.”

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DIANE-WEBSTER-2.htm

Did DW go for breakfast at the Millennium or have it back at the apartment on the Wednesday?

Hi jd. I take this as she didn't go if she had early tennis as it was too far to rush there and back on an empty stomach but because it was raining and the tennis was delayed so yes she did go for breakfast and she 'recollect seeing Kate and Gerry' but no mention of any of the children, just adults.

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