The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Welcome to 'The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann' forum 🌹

Please log in, or register to view all the forums as some of them are 'members only', then settle in and help us get to the truth about what really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann.

Please note that when you register your username must be different from your email address!


FACT FILE

Page 2 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 21.05.12 16:32


Sigh':'




I wonder if I shall
have to defend myself ad nauseam.


Rainbow fairy, as you
have no doubt posted on assumptions that I believe that Madeleine was
abducted from apartment 5a,/am a mccann spy, it says a lot about you.
Why don't you bother to check first? It is evident that you wish to
label me a troll or a mccnn spy but its s'funny, all the way from
beautiful, sunny South Africa, living on a smallholding far from the
madding crowd, gee these mccs do go to great lengths!


I read this blog, and
others like it. I also read Blacksmith Bureau whose publications I
love. I can fully understand why he has removed his blog section.
(and no I am not comparing myself to Blacksmith, one has to spend too
much time answering spiteful posts such as these.)



I read this blog as I
LIKE TO KEEP AN OPEN MIND. - Which means – entertaining other
possibilities, including the one that you expound – Madeleine is
dead - accidently or otherwise– her parents are involved in her
disappearance. I also entertain the idea that she NEVER ARRIVED in
Portugal in April 2007. How do you back up your evidence, -
Mccannspeak PJ Statements? Creche records? - Tapas 7 rogatory
interviews? - Nannys statements? - Doctored photos? sorry I cannot
see these to be facts, as some are known to be proven liars, creche
records cannot be trusted and the nannys too contradictory, we also
know that the mccs have had private interviews with at least one of
them.




Which brings me to Andy
Redwood, who stays innocent of complicity in my eyes till proven
otherwise. Many bloggers here are of the opinion that the enquiry is
a whitewash because he spoke on a TV show stating that Madeleine was
either alive or dead, basically 50/50. This makes sense to me as
there is as yet NO CONCRETE EVIDENCE that she died in 5a. We do know
that someone died there but who is to say it is Madeleines cadaverine
and blood as this has never been proven.

Extract from: You can read entire document on Mccann Exposure


MINISTERIO PUBLICO DE PORTIMAO

SUMMARY

The tasking for this operation was as per
my normal Standard Operating Procedures. The dogs are deployed as
search assets to secure evidence and locate human remains or Human
blood.


The dogs only alerted to property
associated with the McCann family. The dog alert indications MUST be
corroborated if to establish their findings as evidence.


Therefore in this particular case, as no
human remains were located, the only alert indications that may
become corroborated are those that the CSI dog indicated by forensic
laboratory analysis.


My professional opinion as regards to the
EVRD’s alert indications is that it is suggestive that this is
‘cadaver scent’ contaminant. This does not however suggest a
motive or suspect as cross contamination could be as a result of a
number of given scenarios and in any event no evidential or
intelligence reliability can be made from these alerts unless they
can be confirmed with corroborating evidence.








So yes I do believe the
dogs 100% but the dogs cannot tell us whose blood and cadaverine it
was. It could well have been planted there. No not by the PJ but by
the mccs themselves, knowing they would incriminate themselves as I
believe to have been the plan, and knowing that it could not be
proved as the DNA from the sample would not show the sample to be
that of Madeleine. This way they could create maximum newsworthy
exposure, knowing nothing could be pinned on them barring child
neglect. When the time was right and the cup was full they started
suing and made a LOT of money to add to the overflowing Maddie fund
one. This way they could sit pretty and call the shots. MANY HAVE
DONE A LOT MORE FOR A LOT LESS.

I believe the Met is
going through every bit of evidence as they should be, even Metodo
3's boxes (how I should love to be privy to those! Must have some
interesting bits in them...as to exactly why and what the Metodo 3
was hired for in the first place (apart from faked sightings). The
Met have been to Spain 3 times, I wonder why?


The age progression
photo as released by the Met looks to me to be the best one so far.
I can see a lot of Gerry there, especially around the eyes. I am
sure the Met used original photos of Madeleine for this, and would
have requested co operation from the mccanns with this. (I don't
think TM would have dared to give them the photoshopped ones. The
Met would have needed to work very closely with them on this.
Perhaps even examining family photos to examine features etc to make
sure the age progression was as accurate as possible.





So in a nutshell, to my
mind Madeleine never was in PDL in April May 2007. (The Met are
investigating this case as if it had happened in Britain).




I said that I no longer
wish to post here for the very reason that I cannot debate any other
theory here as evidenced by your replies to my posts. The theory
that Madeleine is dead and died on one of these days 29(sorry
Russiandoll) to 3rd has been debated without being able
to go any further, and has no more definite proven facts than the
theory I have mentioned here.

and is now literally
“going around in circles”
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by russiandoll on 21.05.12 17:53

A shame you feel that you can no longer post.....I for one am intrigued by the idea Maddie might never have been in Portugal, or at least maybe not at OC.......the lack of DNA evidence is bizarre.
There are all sorts of weird theories elsewhere.......there was a swinging holiday which took place at the same time as an intell op in the area and this intell work had to be protected, Gerry used leverage for asssistance, he had info on the royals being involved in death of Diana [ !!]......I have not read yet that she was abducted by aliens, or given her name and special eye mark, that Maddie was the Holy Grail.
So your theory that she never was in Portugal is interesting. Where do you think she was in May 2007 and what happened to her?
I have also read elsewhere that Maddie died in Portugal at an earlier date, was stored and then May 07 was disposed of.
If these can be put forward then so can yours surely? Some of them are truly bonkers.

____________________



             The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie — deliberate,
contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
unrealistic.
~John F. Kennedy

avatar
russiandoll

Posts : 3942
Reputation : 13
Join date : 2011-09-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by friedtomatoes on 21.05.12 18:00

The theory that she died in Portugal on a previous holiday and was stored somewhere and then disposed of on the next PDL holiday is IMO plain bananas.
big grin

That a shred of time and energy should be wasted on something like that is sad. JMHO. I think the way out theories benefit the Mccanns, if they were involved. It gives them ammo to call all doubting thomases nutters.

friedtomatoes

Posts : 591
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-04-24

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by rainbow-fairy on 21.05.12 23:49

@friedtomatoes wrote:The theory that she died in Portugal on a previous holiday and was stored somewhere and then disposed of on the next PDL holiday is IMO plain bananas.


That a shred of time and energy should be wasted on something like that is sad. JMHO. I think the way out theories benefit the Mccanns, if they were involved. It gives them ammo to call all doubting thomases nutters.
And THE most bonkers theory of all that has certainly benefitted the McCanns is the one they themselves have posited, against all available evidence - predator abductor. Yes it happens rarely, but in this case the chances are so vanishingly small they are just about non-existant.

____________________
"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.
avatar
rainbow-fairy

Posts : 1971
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2011-05-26
Age : 43
Location : going round in circles

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by tigger on 22.05.12 5:55

@rainbow-fairy wrote:
@friedtomatoes wrote:The theory that she died in Portugal on a previous holiday and was stored somewhere and then disposed of on the next PDL holiday is IMO plain bananas.


That a shred of time and energy should be wasted on something like that is sad. JMHO. I think the way out theories benefit the Mccanns, if they were involved. It gives them ammo to call all doubting thomases nutters.
And THE most bonkers theory of all that has certainly benefitted the McCanns is the one they themselves have posited, against all available evidence - predator abductor. Yes it happens rarely, but in this case the chances are so vanishingly small they are just about non-existant.

I should post a 7th option in the topic which is a close contender for the maddest theory: suggested by the McCanns themselves - namely that she was abducted but died during the abduction - this in the window of 5 mins or so given. The abductor(s) then cleaned the place up, made the bed and thoughtfully took the corpse with them.
All options have to be listed, if only to eliminate them. Personally, it leads me to believe they'd been there before.

____________________
Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate.
avatar
tigger

Posts : 8114
Reputation : 50
Join date : 2011-07-20

View user profile http://fytton.blogspot.nl/

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Gillyspot on 22.05.12 7:23

One of the reasons there are so few verifiable facts in this case is that the McCanns & their tapas friends changing statements don't add up. But as Gerry McCann said confusion is good so no one knows the truth- FACT

http://video.stv.tv/bc/news-Gerrry_McCann_brings_Madeleine_campaign_-20070824-gerry-mccann-brings-madeleine-campaign-to-scotland/

____________________
Kate McCann "I know that what happened is not due to the fact of us leaving the children asleep. I know it happened under other circumstances"
avatar
Gillyspot

Posts : 1470
Reputation : 6
Join date : 2011-06-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 8:09

Ok Russiandoll here goes,

Many strange theories abound. The only known facts we actually are that the mccs their twins, the tapas 7, their respective children, Murat et al were present in Portugal at the time of Madeleine's disappearance and the dogs detected blood and cadaverine in apt 5a, as this is in the PJ files. (plus various other incidents included in these files). All the rest cannot be backed up with fact. That the mccs and their friends were swingers is hearsay plus all the other conspiracy type of stories. These weird and wonderful stories I believe were perhaps put out by he mccs themselves. Creating an opportunity of much suing and libel to fill the mccoffers. They know that nothing claimed can be pinned on them, therefore they can sue with impunity, laughing all the way to the bank. They can stage many a slip of the tongue thereby creating even more speculation. Reminds me of Gmac saying about all the confusion created is Good!

Some questions I should like to know the answer to:

Could G or K mcc have access to be able to create an empty CATS file?

Could the mccs and Possibly their friends, (or some of them or perhaps just Murat). have conspired to plant various stories around their missing child to fill out a plan created by themselves, in order to create many reasons to sue newspapers and the public who question the case, knowing nothing concrete can be pinned on them? Perhaps they knew/know a well connected person in say, the Sun who has some dirt on an important (therefore highly blackmailable) public figure? The blackmail tool perhaps being obtained by blackmail?

There must be a good reason for their smirking, untouchable relaxed attitude on talk shows, for which they get another injection of da mooley. The fund being as always uppermost in their minds.

I don't know where M is, and whether she is alive or dead as stated by A Redwood, but I believe they are really trying to find out, and where she is, dead or alive. I think the mccs know the Met is onto them, another reason for the frantic mcSpin and early release of book?

If it was not M that left for Portugal in 2007 it must have been a substitute child and I do have my suspicions as to whose child it was. She is a beautiful, innocent little girl the same age as Madeleine with large brown eyes and dark eyelashes, related to M---t. Who sometime during or after the staged abduction was returned safely to the UK. Many of the doctored photos of Madeleine show this childs beautiful eyes.

I think that mccs relatives know the true story and where she is, but for reasons of their own prefer to say nothing. Perhaps this thing got much larger than was envisioned due to the rapid growth of the internet. So no paedo swinging drug fuelled events methinks, and no children left to themselves. The PJ must have realized that they could not be charged even with child neglect as must have seen evidence to the contrary when they investigated.

I should like to know what you think Russiandoll, is any of the above is possible to your mind?

____________________
“‘Conspiracy stuff’ is now shorthand for unspeakable truth.”
– Gore Vidal
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

The interesting views of Snifferdog

Post by Tony Bennett on 22.05.12 8:29

Snifferdog, here is a selection of your views as expressed on this thread in the past two days:

May 21

1. I read Blacksmith Bureau whose publications I love.

2. I read this blog as I LIKE TO KEEP AN OPEN MIND.

3. I entertain the idea that Madeleine NEVER ARRIVED in Portugal in April 2007.

4. There is as yet NO CONCRETE EVIDENCE that Madeleine died in 5A.

5. We do know that someone died there but who is to say it is Madeleine’s cadaverine and blood as this has never been proven.

6. I do believe the dogs 100% but the dogs cannot tell us whose blood and cadaverine it was. It could well have been planted there. No, not by the PJ but by the McCanns themselves, knowing they would incriminate themselves as I believe to have been the plan, and knowing that it could not be proved as the DNA from the sample would not show the sample to be that of Madeleine. This way they could create maximum newsworthy exposure, knowing nothing could be pinned on them barring child neglect.

7. The age progression photo as released by the Met looks to me to be the best one so far. I can see a lot of Gerry there

8. So in a nutshell, to my mind Madeleine never was in PDL in April/May 2007

9. I said that I no longer wish to post here because I cannot debate any other theory theory I have mentioned here.

May 22

10. Many strange theories abound. The only known facts we actually have are that the McCanns, their twins, the Tapas 7, their respective children, Murat et al were present in Portugal at the time of Madeleine's disappearance and the dogs detected blood and cadaverine in Apt 5A…All the rest cannot be backed up with fact.

11. That the McCanns and their friends were swingers is hearsay…These weird and wonderful stories I believe were perhaps put out by the McCanns themselves, creating an opportunity of much suing and libel…

12. If it was not M that left for Portugal in 2007 it must have been a substitute child and I do have my suspicions as to whose child it was. She is a beautiful, innocent little girl the same age as Madeleine with large brown eyes and dark eyelashes, related to Murat, who sometime during or after the staged abduction was returned safely to the UK. Many of the doctored photos of Madeleine show this child’s beautiful eyes.


+++++++++++++++++++

I would like to let you know that I find them...very interesting

____________________

The amazing symbiosis between bees and flowers:

https://answersingenesis.org/evidence-for-creation/god-created-plant-pollinator-partners/  

avatar
Tony Bennett
Researcher

Posts : 14899
Reputation : 2991
Join date : 2009-11-25
Age : 70
Location : Shropshire

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by russiandoll on 22.05.12 9:01

Hi Snifferdog.
I am still ploughing on reading, I read some of the files once released then after borrowing the book from my library last year, it rang so many alarm bells that my unease and suspicions only increased and I started to read blogs and came here to read and then wanted to post my thoughts and enter debate.
I am trying to decide if the paedo aspect of the case is a diversionary tactic, despite the worrying Gaspar and DP issues.
Swinging while an intell op was ongoing.........what happened focused more attention on Praia da Luz not less, so I need to read more about what and why things happened acc to that theory.

My initial thoughts on reading some of the files once they were released.....an accident followed by panic.
Then read more....too much in place too rapidly for panic, despite the mess up and contradictions/inconsistencies. I am thinking of the embassy presence, the setting up of the fund and the publication of the iconic photo, which appears to show Maddie at a younger age than the alleged Dec 06.

The dogs do not lie. There might not have been a death in 5a, but there was either a body there long enough for cadaverine to develop, so moved from elsewhere, or blood and cadaverine were planted by the couple, the scent could have been transferred from items of clothing and a dr would have easy access to a vial to store blood. It seemed implausible, but possible to my mind at the time if the whole thing was a hoax to make money. I speculated then that Maddie was alive and well and had been either left in the UK or elsewhere with a family member in on the plan, or had been to Portugal to be taken by arrangement to a place of safety.
This was my Maddie alive and all a scam for money scenario.

Maddie not alive....... a plan to make money from a faked abduction, then a fatal accident intervened and all had to be done on the hoof, hence the mess-up.
A seems a risk too far, as the more people involved the riskier, but there is something wrong with the creche sheets and the phone activity is very interesting.A sub to avoid risk would need to be in place from the outset, so maybe Maddie was not in OC but elsewhere nearby [Burgau, see topic on Burgau and Murat], if Maddie was in OC however and met her fate after starting at creche, a sub would be a risk they would have to take.
I was coming to the conclusion the little one passed away not long after arrival, 29th, but this means involving another adult in the subterfuge.....who would loan you a daughter for this charade? 30th April and May 2nd dates on which there is a lot of silence........so significant imo.
Maybe my original idea was not so crazy after all....that she never went to Portugal or if there was never at OC.
Do you believe the smirks are because the couple know Maddie is safe and well, maybe hidden in plain sight?
Or do you believe she is dead and if so, what do you think happened to her and how does the scam fit in?
I find it a step too far to accept until I see more evidence , the theory that a plan to dispose of her was hatched as part of a money making scam.
But I do not believe she is alive........I am like everyone else here trying to work out what happened to her and when.

____________________



             The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie — deliberate,
contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
unrealistic.
~John F. Kennedy

avatar
russiandoll

Posts : 3942
Reputation : 13
Join date : 2011-09-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by jd on 22.05.12 9:24

I think the planting of cavader & blood theory by the mccanns is just as ludicrous as their abduction theory
avatar
jd

Posts : 4151
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by PeterMac on 22.05.12 10:03

Remember Occam's Razor.

____________________

avatar
PeterMac
Investigator

Posts : 10170
Reputation : 177
Join date : 2010-12-06

View user profile http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by rainbow-fairy on 22.05.12 10:30

@jd wrote:I think the planting of cavader & blood theory by the mccanns is just as ludicrous as their abduction theory
Totally agree jd. Whilst it is theoretically possible, its also theoretically possible that Maddie was a lizard hybrid. Slightly possible, but really really not likely Wink

____________________
"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.
avatar
rainbow-fairy

Posts : 1971
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2011-05-26
Age : 43
Location : going round in circles

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Lady-Heather on 22.05.12 10:32

Many people appear to consider the substitute theory to be out of the question, and that it's more likely that the parents killed her or allowed her to die and then hide the body. And then, that they were able to go out running/meeting the pope/various day trips like nothing had happened. I personally find the latter to be the least plausible, although not impossible by any means.

I am 99% convinced that this a hoax. My suspicions starting as far back as the 'Donegal' thread started by Daisy (thank you Daisy). In that thread there is a reference to a website gives support to the Irish roots story invented by (sorry, reported on) and elaborated on in the Irish & national press. Through a bit of digging and research I came to the conclusion that the site was almost certainly a fake, which then inspired me to look for other signs of make-believe and deception. There’s a lot of it out there. The initial photos that were given out on the night of the 3/4th, that appeared to have been pre-prepared (even the PJ didn’t buy that one). The crèche sheets, the photoshopping, the proximity of the press and others involved in media production.

The cadaver dogs - do I believe they made a mistake? No. They found what they found. But if there was a substitute and there was no body present in the apartment, then how did the cadaver odour get there? Is there any other explanation, however implausible? If not then there must have been a body. If there is another explanation(s), then until we can eliminate those possibilities (impossible for us on an internet forum) then they continue to remain as possible alternative hypotheses.
avatar
Lady-Heather

Posts : 140
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2011-10-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 10:55

Thank you Tony and Russiandoll for your considered replies. Jd; I, like you, are quite entitled to own opinion, and I should like to read why you regard the planting of cadaverine and blood by the McCanns as ludicrous. The McCanns are doctors and would have access to human cadaverine causing material. Let me give you an example: Years ago I had to have a stage 3 melanoma removed from my leg. This involved removing a lot of the surrounding tissue and a skin graft. When I left the hospital I was not given back the piece they cut out. This gets sent to the hospital's incinerator to be burnt with other such things. Doctors who work with this sort of thing are not squeamish, as they deal with human flesh often. Unused blood donated, or samples taken are destroyed I presume in the same manner. So it is quite conceivable that the McCanns had access to aforementioned items.

Russiandoll, I don't know whether she is alive or dead, just the same as I would not know of anyone I had not heard from for a while, and not being able to contact, is still alive (not that I ever knew or met Madeleine). I can only give my opinion here, which is: That she is alive or dead and never left for PDL in April/May 2007. It is possible to arrange a fraudulent ID. The photos supplied by the McCanns would make it difficult to identify Madeleine, and the videos of her look quite blurry. Everyone was looking for a little girl who looked a lot younger with a colomboma. So to take a leaf from the Met I would have to say 50/50. I think they put out that photograph of Madeleine in the hope that if she is alive she may very well be able to be recognized through it, and I think they took a lot of trouble compiling it.

If one does entertain the idea that Madeleine is still alive, then the McCanns strange lack of concern for their daughter, behaviour and utterings are more understandable to me.

This way there is the least amount of people conspiring, directly involved in this case (some been drawn in through circumstance). No wild allegations at all really.

____________________
“‘Conspiracy stuff’ is now shorthand for unspeakable truth.”
– Gore Vidal
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by jd on 22.05.12 10:58

I should like to read why you regard the planting of cadaverine and blood by the McCanns as ludicrous

This is not a film and is my opinion
avatar
jd

Posts : 4151
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 11:00

@PeterMac wrote:Remember Occam's Razor.
I am curious Petermac. Are you referring to a razor the PJ found?

____________________
“‘Conspiracy stuff’ is now shorthand for unspeakable truth.”
– Gore Vidal
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 11:04

@jd wrote:
I should like to read why you regard the planting of cadaverine and blood by the McCanns as ludicrous

This is not a film and is my opinion
O.K. If you wish to keep this to yourself it's fine.
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by jd on 22.05.12 11:05

@Snifferdog wrote:
@jd wrote:
I should like to read why you regard the planting of cadaverine and blood by the McCanns as ludicrous

This is not a film and is my opinion
O.K. If you wish to keep this to yourself it's fine.

I most certainly will I can assure you!
avatar
jd

Posts : 4151
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Occam's razor

Post by Guest on 22.05.12 11:06

avatar
Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Nina on 22.05.12 11:08

Cadaverine is from a dead body, not a body part unless it is from a dead body where cadaverine is present. A body part taken from a live body, will if not incinerated 'go off' but that isn't cadaverine. The products of surgery, after examination are incinerated because it would be like keeping meat out in the open, yes they would eventually smell, but not like cadaverine, and they would be a health risk to the public.
The only way cadaverine could be obtained is through access to a morgue imo.

____________________
Not one more cent from me.
avatar
Nina

Posts : 2861
Reputation : 339
Join date : 2011-06-16
Age : 75

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 11:18

Jean wrote:http://searchcio-midmarket.techtarget.com/definition/Ockhams-razor

Pre PeterMac, I'd never heard of it either!
That is interesting Petermac. I had never heard of it either.
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 11:39

@Nina wrote:Cadaverine is from a dead body, not a body part unless it is from a dead body where cadaverine is present. A body part taken from a live body, will if not incinerated 'go off' but that isn't cadaverine. The products of surgery, after examination are incinerated because it would be like keeping meat out in the open, yes they would eventually smell, but not like cadaverine, and they would be a health risk to the public.
The only way cadaverine could be obtained is through access to a morgue imo.
Nina I meant removed before being incinerated. A part such as this would produce cadaverine in the same way as a whole cadaver would. I am sure cadaverine can be a health risk, but the risk can be contained by shrink wrapping. Although the thought of having such items in ones possession is revolting, doctors who have to deal with such things are pretty used to it.
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by jd on 22.05.12 11:45

Maybe they packed it in their luggage prior to leaving for the holiday....sure it went through security checks and customs no problem
avatar
jd

Posts : 4151
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Snifferdog on 22.05.12 11:49

@jd wrote:Maybe they packed it in their luggage prior to leaving for the holiday....sure it went through security checks and customs no problem
Yes perhaps Jd. I think they would have made a pretty innocent picture, just a group of doctor friends and children off on a family holiday.
As with all crimes committed, there are risks involved for the perpetrators.
avatar
Snifferdog

Posts : 1008
Reputation : 16
Join date : 2012-05-11
Location : here

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FACT FILE

Post by Nina on 22.05.12 11:56

@Snifferdog wrote:
@Nina wrote:Cadaverine is from a dead body, not a body part unless it is from a dead body where cadaverine is present. A body part taken from a live body, will if not incinerated 'go off' but that isn't cadaverine. The products of surgery, after examination are incinerated because it would be like keeping meat out in the open, yes they would eventually smell, but not like cadaverine, and they would be a health risk to the public.
The only way cadaverine could be obtained is through access to a morgue imo.
Nina I meant removed before being incinerated. A part such as this would produce cadaverine in the same way as a whole cadaver would. I am sure cadaverine can be a health risk, but the risk can be contained by shrink wrapping. Although the thought of having such items in ones possession is revolting, doctors who have to deal with such things are pretty used to it.
Hi Snifferdog, cadaverine is produced from within a body through chemical changes that start in the body within minutes of death that depend on factors such as age. size and ambient temperature as to how quickly it becomes evident to the human that there is a corpse close by. To a dog though which has been specifically trained to detect cadaverine they can detect cadaverine long before the actual smell is evident by us mere humans. I am a bit pressed for time at the moment but I will try to find more information for you as to how it is formed. It certainly isn't cadaverine that would be from an amputated limb or organ taken from a live person. That scent would be merely the scent of off meat, though yes that is foul, but not the scent of cadaverine..

____________________
Not one more cent from me.
avatar
Nina

Posts : 2861
Reputation : 339
Join date : 2011-06-16
Age : 75

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 2 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum