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A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Praia on 18.01.12 17:12

Yes jd. But focus in on that one book, they did not want the public to focus in on it. You realise who wrote it?

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:18

@PeterMac wrote:
Avocatus:
Many thanks, I had no real idea of that as a firm possibility.
I don't think it is. I believe the DNA showed that Gerry is the bio father. AIH, rather than AID. Don't have the reference to hand but I am fairly sure it is in the PJ documents.

Hmmmm, well I expect one day this will all come out at a trial (I hope)...

PS

I heard CR offered Goncalo to settle out of court for 600,000 (half) if GA gave in - nope, GA wants the livbl case, I think to have his day in court! Brave man!!!

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"One good thing to come out of all this is that there is so much in the press, nobody knows what is true, and what isn't." - Gerry McCann: Police CATS (Case Administration and Tracking System) Number 19309 - NB: The 19309 number is still on the Police database, but all data within the file appears to have been ERASED...

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:22

@tigger wrote:
@Praia wrote:Petermac, I do not trust any of the DNA reports. We can not be sure they were working with Madeleine's DNA at all. That is a massive problem.
The FSS were leaned on, no doubt about it, and they will soon be closed down and the cover up at their end is complete.

I agree with you there and if I were having a baby, if at all possible -I'd certainly not go for G's DNA once I'd had a look at his relatives as well!

However, we will have to live with the fact that none of the DNA evidence is admissible. That was the purpose of the cover up. imo.
I do think it was a really big shock. They never expected to have either the villa or the rental car searched, those clod-hopping PJs should have stuck with 5a which was beautifully laid out as an abduction site, complete with stalking paedophiles.

Hi

Why is none of the DNA evidence not permissible in court?

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Guest on 18.01.12 17:23

@Advocatus wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:
Avocatus:
Many thanks, I had no real idea of that as a firm possibility.
I don't think it is. I believe the DNA showed that Gerry is the bio father. AIH, rather than AID. Don't have the reference to hand but I am fairly sure it is in the PJ documents.

Hmmmm, well I expect one day this will all come out at a trial (I hope)...

PS

I heard CR offered Goncalo to settle out of court for 600,000 (half) if GA gave in - nope, GA wants the livel case, I think to have his day in court! Brave man!!!

Don't think I have read that, do you have a link please?
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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:39

candyfloss wrote:
@Advocatus wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:
Avocatus:
Many thanks, I had no real idea of that as a firm possibility.
I don't think it is. I believe the DNA showed that Gerry is the bio father. AIH, rather than AID. Don't have the reference to hand but I am fairly sure it is in the PJ documents.

Hmmmm, well I expect one day this will all come out at a trial (I hope)...

PS

I heard CR offered Goncalo to settle out of court for 600,000 (half) if GA gave in - nope, GA wants the libel case, I think to have his day in court! Brave man!!!

Don't think I have read that, do you have a link please?

'Fraid not, been reading so much the last few weeks on this case I lose track - probably were some forum or twitter comments, at any rate this type of thing would never go public from Clarrie's side, CR... I would not be surprised if the libel case was dropped at the last minute, there is so much that can be said in court... but then again other cases are pending, with each defendant eager to have their day in court...

If I find it I will certainly post it.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:45

@Genbug wrote:I personally believe that Madeleine was definately a McCann. Whether Gerry is her biological father, none of us can know (although I have no reason to suspect he isn't), but she is definately the child of one of the clan, despite Kate saying she looks like her, I think she is the image of Gerry's family, especially Philomena.

Philomena? That's a scary thought!

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:53

@tigger wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:
Avocatus:
Many thanks, I had no real idea of that as a firm possibility.
I don't think it is. I believe the DNA showed that Gerry is the bio father. AIH, rather than AID. Don't have the reference to hand but I am fairly sure it is in the PJ documents.

There are particular psychological problems with IVF parenthood, according to Dr. Ludke. If the normal procedure did not work and IVF had to be used to have a child, then, if a not so perfect child is born there is an almost automatic distance from the parents. According to Dr. Ludke, this is quite common. Apart from that, many families will have a favourite child in any case. Maddie was clearly a big disappointment, the twins seem to be just what they wanted. There need be no other father anywhere for this to have happened.

IVF/Turner's syndrome? Colic, constant need for attention, growth problems (height well below the average) - other threads have far more detail.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 17:56

@jd wrote:
Maddie was clearly a big disappointment, the twins seem to be just what they wanted

Yes this is how it seems

Yes, always being shipped off to relatives, relatives always visiting to take the poor girl off Kate's hands whilst Gerry plays golf, and goes to regular as clockwork 'conferences' (are there THAT many conferences every year???) every weekend, a wonderful set-up! Shocked

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 18:02

@Praia wrote:Petermac, I do not trust any of the DNA reports. We can not be sure they were working with Madeleine's DNA at all. That is a massive problem.
The FSS were leaned on, no doubt about it, and they will soon be closed down and the cover up at their end is complete.

____________________
"One good thing to come out of all this is that there is so much in the press, nobody knows what is true, and what isn't." - Gerry McCann: Police CATS (Case Administration and Tracking System) Number 19309 - NB: The 19309 number is still on the Police database, but all data within the file appears to have been ERASED...

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 18:25

Many thanks sijm, I will be reading this asap!



If The book A estrela de Madeleine is to be seen as giving us clues then maybe there is a good clue here, if I may, I would like to point a few out.

1.At the begining of the book reference was made to chip implants as follows, Buying a book does not give us the power to "know" the truth, as if it were a chip that is implanted in us etc ect..

Could this be a hint that a chip was implanted into Madeleine?


Well I have long thought the whole case was ideal propaganda for pushing the population chipping agenda. No doubt there are illegal experiments going on right now in various countries to see how these chips work etc etc. It may well be MBM was a guinea pig, so to speak.

One other theory, which I find very unlikely, was that of the real biological father (or someone else, KM herself says 'they' (the kidnappers) were a couple) attempting a snatch - if that was a risk, why would the parents bait the man so to speak with absolutely minimal security?

TPTB have been planning this for decades, and G Brown was really pushing the electronic RFID ID card (of course followed by compulsory chipping) at the time...


Would a microchip keep your child safe?
December 18, 2003, BBC


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/3307471.stm

The VeriChip can track subjects who are within 5 miles, but
officials want to develop a new chip that can use satellite technology
to track people who are farther away and may have been kidnapped.




Mexicans get microchipped over kidnapping fears



Affluent Mexicans worried by soaring
kidnapping rates are spending thousands of dollars to implant tiny
transmitters under their skin so satellites can help find them even when
stuffed in the boot of a car.




2, Chief Joao Tavares rings Francisco Meireles telling him a Dutch newspaper has received a map supposedly shows the location of the childs body. they meet the Dutch journalist, they have been in Portugal three days even hired sniffer dogs.

The Potuguese police feel like arresting them for endangering the investigation, The journalist takes a letter out of his bag and produces a document called a spermogram.a document that is issued when someone has a sperm analysed in a laboratory, there is no identification of the subject but he notices a SEQUENCE OF NUMBERS on the lower right hand corner, he contacts a doctor who informs him that the sequence identifies, THE LAB, THE NUMBER OF THE TEST,THE INDIVIDUAL THAT WAS SUBJECT TO THE ANALYSIS.

Could this be THE 5,THE 2,THE 3, THE 1? sequel of numbers


Very interesting!




Also they go to Lisbon where they identify the individual, who tuerns out to be a Public Servant, devorced and with evident problems of self assurance and regulation.

The man confesses all, all he wanted to do is help and will seek psychiatric help. but the Numbers alert is noted by me, it fits that clue in the book.

Just one more thing noted, The report Maddie was seen still in her Pyjamas several days after her disapearance, anyone know with who?


Can't help there. But that resort was apparently teeming with medics, the McCann's said they were off at meetings, so something was going on - as Gerry said on the bus to the wives and children, "F*** off, I'm not here to enjoy myself!"

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"One good thing to come out of all this is that there is so much in the press, nobody knows what is true, and what isn't." - Gerry McCann: Police CATS (Case Administration and Tracking System) Number 19309 - NB: The 19309 number is still on the Police database, but all data within the file appears to have been ERASED...

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 18:28

@Praia wrote:Yes jd. But focus in on that one book, they did not want the public to focus in on it. You realise who wrote it?

Hi - does anyone have a link to the full English translation please?

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Praia on 18.01.12 19:10

The English translation is on the Maddie case Files in the Reference section, A estrela de Madeleine, the star of Madeleine, on page one of ref. section.
Cristovao is an ex PJ colleague of Sr Amaral, he also worked on the Joana case and wrote a similar book on that case. He has written on child abuse cases.
This book should be read by anyone interested in the Madeleine case. I look forward to discussing issues it highlights.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 20:39

@Praia wrote:The English translation is on the Maddie case Files in the Reference section, A estrela de Madeleine, the star of Madeleine, on page one of ref. section.
Cristovao is an ex PJ colleague of Sr Amaral, he also worked on the Joana case and wrote a similar book on that case. He has written on child abuse cases.
This book should be read by anyone interested in the Madeleine case. I look forward to discussing issues it highlights.

Many thanks Praia,

These are the links I have, just wondering if I missed anything, thanks again!

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic11923.html

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id105.html


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"One good thing to come out of all this is that there is so much in the press, nobody knows what is true, and what isn't." - Gerry McCann: Police CATS (Case Administration and Tracking System) Number 19309 - NB: The 19309 number is still on the Police database, but all data within the file appears to have been ERASED...

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Guest on 18.01.12 21:46

@Advocatus wrote:
@Genbug wrote:I personally believe that Madeleine was definately a McCann. Whether Gerry is her biological father, none of us can know (although I have no reason to suspect he isn't), but she is definately the child of one of the clan, despite Kate saying she looks like her, I think she is the image of Gerry's family, especially Philomena.

Philomena? That's a scary thought!

Could have been worse - could have resembled uncle John omg
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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Genbug on 18.01.12 22:30

Haha, seriously, look at pictures of Philomena AND Uncle John, I can definately see a resemblance with Madeleine. I personally don't see this beautiful child they all talk about, I see a rather funny looking little girl in most of the pictures. Of course her family will think she was beautiful, we all think our kids are, but I don't see it.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Praia on 18.01.12 22:54

Remember the PJ's question about handing Madeleine over to a relative's care? Back to another McCann relative? The PJ knew what they were asking, imo.
Healy had Madeleine in nursery from 8 am some days, then a nursery worker went home with them, gave her her tea and put her to bed.
The Christmas 2005 is totally off the wall, send a 2 year old hundreds of miles away when it is your first family Christmas as five, supposedly the parents dream for so long. Madeleine was 2! So Grandad McCann had died early in the year, Christmas would be a sad time for Granny McCann. Why not spend the day all together, she could be with the twins too. Or was Madeleine sent to comfort her Granny and real mother. How could Healy have let her go away at Christmas at 2 years of age.
I wish the public whose purse strings were opened by the TM Christmas appeals knew where Madeleine was for the twins first Christmas.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Nina on 18.01.12 23:03

@Praia wrote:Remember the PJ's question about handing Madeleine over to a relative's care? Back to another McCann relative? The PJ knew what they were asking, imo.
Healy had Madeleine in nursery from 8 am some days, then a nursery worker went home with them, gave her her tea and put her to bed.
The Christmas 2005 is totally off the wall, send a 2 year old hundreds of miles away when it is your first family Christmas as five, supposedly the parents dream for so long. Madeleine was 2! So Grandad McCann had died early in the year, Christmas would be a sad time for Granny McCann. Why not spend the day all together, she could be with the twins too. Or was Madeleine sent to comfort her Granny and real mother. How could Healy have let her go away at Christmas at 2 years of age.
I wish the public whose purse strings were opened by the TM Christmas appeals knew where Madeleine was for the twins first Christmas.

Hello Praia. Sick isn't it? Two years old and sent away for Christmas. I wonder how she got there, did they take her or was she taken? Poor poor little girl, no wonder she looked so unhappy and cut off on some of the photographs.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 18.01.12 23:22

@Nina wrote:
@Praia wrote:Remember the PJ's question about handing Madeleine over to a relative's care? Back to another McCann relative? The PJ knew what they were asking, imo.
Healy had Madeleine in nursery from 8 am some days, then a nursery worker went home with them, gave her her tea and put her to bed.
The Christmas 2005 is totally off the wall, send a 2 year old hundreds of miles away when it is your first family Christmas as five, supposedly the parents dream for so long. Madeleine was 2! So Grandad McCann had died early in the year, Christmas would be a sad time for Granny McCann. Why not spend the day all together, she could be with the twins too. Or was Madeleine sent to comfort her Granny and real mother. How could Healy have let her go away at Christmas at 2 years of age.
I wish the public whose purse strings were opened by the TM Christmas appeals knew where Madeleine was for the twins first Christmas.
Y

Hello Praia. Sick isn't it? Two years old and sent away for Christmas. I wonder how she got there, did they take her or was she taken? Poor poor little girl, no wonder she looked so unhappy and cut off on some of the photographs.

Perhaps sent via a giant blow up billboard lorry? Maybe via a Renault Scenic?

It is all tragically sad. There are no adequate words to describe my feelings right now. Roll on February, let's get some action going, let's get The Truth of the Lie published in the UK - even though I do not agree fully with the conclusions, that book would be enough to change the UK publics already jaded perception of the MCCanns.

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by jd on 19.01.12 0:37

But will it be reported in the UK?...Don't get your hopes up because I don't think it will happen in the slightest. These sick animals have not gone to this extent for them to be exposed in the UK media. They have got it covered and everyone scared to comply. We will have to expose this scam another way...and we shall!

smethurst and kennedy....mmmmmmmmm...enjoy while you can winkwink

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Advocatus on 19.01.12 2:36

@jd wrote:But will it be reported in the UK?...Don't get your hopes up because I don't think it will happen in the slightest. These sick animals have not gone to this extent for them to be exposed in the UK media. They have got it covered and everyone scared to comply. We will have to expose this scam another way...and we shall!

smethurst and kennedy....mmmmmmmmm...enjoy while you can


A simple way would be to photocopy the book, it is not very long after all, and hand it out to passers by at say rail stations. Remember, the injunction has been lifted in PT, so it can be published AND distributed in the UK - but no-one has the cojones to do it. No publisher, that is.

It could be given away like the Big Issue every day. Or sold for a couple of quid, like the Big Issue, and funds go to raising awareness.

Anyways, I am spreading the word, I do sense awareness is shifting, the McCann's will soon be reviled by the majority.

Of course, if they are innocent, all they need to do is ask the PT to re-open the case, and Kate can start by answering the 47 questions, how's about that then!?

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christmas 2005

Post by Guest on 19.01.12 8:24

I`ve seen quotes from Eileen Mccann which say that Madeleine spent Christmas with her. But that could be interpreted as being with the rest of the Mccann family, not on her own. Do we know for sure that she was there on her own?
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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by jd on 19.01.12 9:16

@alison wrote:I`ve seen quotes from Eileen Mccann which say that Madeleine spent Christmas with her. But that could be interpreted as being with the rest of the Mccann family, not on her own. Do we know for sure that she was there on her own?

I know what you mean but I don't think this is the case from her wording...She said "Madeleine came up for Xmas and the following year the family came up..."

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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Guest on 19.01.12 9:25

Good extraction jd. In my head just like Alison I also queried this, as I had never heard of that before. Then I came to the same conclusion as you.
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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Guest on 19.01.12 9:38

I know what you mean, but I think the full quote says that the following year the family came up for New Year. I think what Eileen was trying to say was that in 2005 she saw Madeleine at Christmas time but in 2006 it was not until the New Year.
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Re: A theory, was Madeleine their natural child

Post by Newintown on 19.01.12 13:20

@sijm wrote:If The book A estrela de Madeleine is to be seen as giving us clues then maybe there is a good clue here, if I may, I would like to point a few out.

1.At the begining of the book reference was made to chip implants as follows, Buying a book does not give us the power to "know" the truth, as if it were a chip that is implanted in us etc ect..

Could this be a hint that a chip was implanted into Madeleine?

2, Chief Joao Tavares rings Francisco Meireles telling him a Dutch newspaper has received a map supposedly shows the location of the childs body. they meet the Dutch journalist, they have been in Portugal three days even hired sniffer dogs.

The Potuguese police feel like arresting them for endangering the investigation, The journalist takes a letter out of his bag and produces a document called a spermogram.a document that is issued when someone has a sperm analysed in a laboratory, there is no identification of the subject but he notices a SEQUENCE OF NUMBERS on the lower right hand corner, he contacts a doctor who informs him that the sequence identifies, THE LAB, THE NUMBER OF THE TEST,THE INDIVIDUAL THAT WAS SUBJECT TO THE ANALYSIS.

Could this be THE 5,THE 2,THE 3, THE 1? sequel of numbers

Also they go to Lisbon where they identify the individual, who tuerns out to be a Public Servant, devorced and with evident problems of self assurance and regulation.

The man confesses all, all he wanted to do is help and will seek psychiatric help. but the Numbers alert is noted by me, it fits that clue in the book.

Just one more thing noted, The report Maddie was seen still in her Pyjamas several days after her disapearance, anyone know with who?

re: the report that Maddie was see in her pyjamas several days after her disappearace

There was a taxi driver who came forward I believe who said that he took a small child resembling Maddie and 2 adults somewhere in his taxi (I can't remember where to now) . I remember reading it in the newspapers. Perhaps someone on the forum may have kept a copy of the article.
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