Re: Further Analysis of the Last Photo

by Guest 09.07.14 23:42

PeterMac wrote:
BlackCatBoogie wrote:
And why dress MBM in smart clothes for the last day - in the other few holiday photos she is dressed much more casually, almost scruffy.

The overwhelming evidence suggests that the photo was taken on Sunday 29th, hot, sunny and the first full day of the holiday.
Hence the new clothes, cameras everywhere . . They did what everyone does, - take PHOTOS.

Then the weather changed, and it was cold, windy (and rained on the Wednesday)
The wind died down to almost NOTHING on the Thursday evening - "Whooshing curtains are ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE !"
And only on the Friday did it open up to become a lovely holiday for all the extended family to come and enjoy

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Read it. Pro-child-neglactors. And weep.

Thanks for that info PeterMac - yes I agree that the 'last photo' was probably in reality taken on the Sunday considering weather conditions.

When I said 'why dress MBM in smart clothes for the last day I meant the apparent last day i.e. what we are being led to believe was the last day by the 'last photo'.

Apologies it is really difficult to explain what I mean.

Basically it would be interesting to see if MBM's clothes in the apparent 'last photo' have any significance especially as KH was at pains to point them out. It is possible for instance that if a substitute was used at the creche then she could have been intentionally dressed in exactly the same clothes on the 3rd May as MBM appears in in the 'last photo' - to make it appear that MBM was still alive on the 3rd to the casual observer.

Or as missbeetle says the clothes belonged to the sub and MBM was dressed in them for the day of the 'last photo'. They were then given back to the sub to wear on the 3rd.

I hope this makes sense, darn sneaky if this theory is true.

All in my own opinion nothing stated as fact.

by Guest 10.07.14 11:46

Is it possible that a temperature of 21 degrees would produce the clearly sweltering effect shown in the "last" photo?

I have severe problems with high temperatures - if it's above 26 I don't leave my darkened room! - but I can go out with no problems when it's 21.

That's why it seems odd to me but I appreciate all the research you've done on the subject, PeterMac.

by Snifferdog 10.07.14 13:06

The only genuine photos of MBM are the ones where she is wearing a light pink jersey and darker pink trousers, we see on the plane/bus and playground photos. It is my belief that they packed very little for MBM, knowing that she would no longer be with them after the first day. Just 'purporting' a theory, of course, as Gerry says he does not mind people doing so.

by Watchingthespincycle 10.07.14 17:12

What gets me about all the photos is that in none is anybody making contact of any sort with her. Looking at my old holiday photos there are lots of the kids playing and having fun, but also a good few of them either on our knees, or picked up, or even just cuddling up for the camera.
Poor little thing.

by Snifferdog 10.07.14 17:54

Yes, there does not seem to be much contact between MBM and her parents, going by the photos.

Following on from my earlier post, I suspect things were previously planned re MBM, hence no need for own toothbrush, clothes etc. MBM had only the clothes she arrived in, pink top and pants. Just Imo and theory.

by AndyB 10.07.14 19:09

PeterMac wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />

Read it. Pro-child-neglactors. And weep.

I'm probably reading the chart wrongly but to me it looks like the weather on Thursday was broken sunshine with 50% cloud cover for most of the day apart from early evening when the clouds thickened. Temperatures ranged from 7 degrees C in the early hours of the morning up to 26 degrees around noon and there was a light West South Westerly breeze.

by kimHager 11.07.14 3:04

my question is...is she really sunburned or is it bruises? this lil girl was in the creche how much of the day?? where did she get sunburned? the weather in the UK probably wasnt hot and sunny..even Scotland ans Portugal had cooler weather as summer was just underway so. ...if she was sunburned wouldnt her face be..the arms and legs are a lil harder to
get burned and it looks like bruises and kate had arm bruises also.....hmmm....dont look good at all

by kimHager 11.07.14 3:14

i just saw two pics of tennis maddy and she was opposite in each one! How dis this happen is it two pics or what? also no sunburned arms in last photo

by Guest 11.07.14 7:58

AndyB wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />

Read it. Pro-child-neglactors. And weep.
I'm probably reading the chart wrongly but to me it looks like the weather on Thursday was broken sunshine with 50% cloud cover for most of the day apart from early evening when the clouds thickened. Temperatures ranged from 7 degrees C in the early hours of the morning up to 26 degrees around noon and there was a light West South Westerly breeze.

50% cloud cover?

Not during the day... say 10am to 7pm.. that looks like 100% to me... multiple layers as well.

by Guest 11.07.14 8:22

Châtelaine wrote:Don't forget it's Mrs.Bucket speaking ...

Ha! That's it exactly, Chatelaine!

by worriedmum 11.07.14 8:45

kimHager wrote:i just saw two pics of tennis maddy and she was opposite in each one! How dis this happen is it two pics or what? also no sunburned arms in last photo

Exactly.

That is why I wondered which presentation was the original.
There is a small mark on Madeleine's calf on the tennis photo. This may or may not be the birth mark on her calf described as one of her 'distinguishing marks' on Police files. If it is a birth mark then the on the same side the strangely-discoloured arm is completely blemish-free on the 'pool photo' taken a couple of days later.

That is why I was trying to examine the tennis balls-if the logo was reversed we would be able to tell which was correct. The other way I have tried to look is by which way the 'calf-lick' fringe is pinned back. I would like to post pictures side by side for comparison, but each time I try I get the error message 'too long'--is anyone else able to place these images side by side please?

by canada12 11.07.14 10:50

Does this work for you, worriedmum? I can't put them side by side as the images are too large. But one on top of the other might work?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

by Miraflores 11.07.14 11:04

You can't really see it in these photos, but she has a dimple in her left cheek, (as does Gerry).

by AndyB 11.07.14 11:06

BlueBag wrote:
AndyB wrote:
PeterMac wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />

Read it. Pro-child-neglactors. And weep.
I'm probably reading the chart wrongly but to me it looks like the weather on Thursday was broken sunshine with 50% cloud cover for most of the day apart from early evening when the clouds thickened. Temperatures ranged from 7 degrees C in the early hours of the morning up to 26 degrees around noon and there was a light West South Westerly breeze.

50% cloud cover?

Not during the day... say 10am to 7pm.. that looks like 100% to me... multiple layers as well.

Are you looking at the lines at the very bottom of the chart? I thought those were indicating the height of the clouds with the bar chart at the top showing the amount of cloud cover. I got the 50% from the bar chart at the top and with 50% you're always going to get some clouds, which is why the line at the bottom covers almost the full width of the day. (I'm not an expert in any of this so I could well be wrong)

by Justformaddie 11.07.14 11:10

There's no way that I can see that these pics were taken days apart, I could actually say its wee maddie and big maddie! IMO

by canada12 11.07.14 11:14

Justformaddie wrote:There's no way that I can see that these pics were taken days apart, I could actually say its wee maddie and big maddie! IMO

I can't actually believe that the top two photos are of the same girl who is in the bottom two photos. Her smile / grin and mouth shape are completely different.

by Justformaddie 11.07.14 11:21

canada12 wrote:
Justformaddie wrote:There's no way that I can see that these pics were taken days apart, I could actually say its wee maddie and big maddie! IMO

I can't actually believe that the top two photos are of the same girl who is in the bottom two photos. Her smile / grin and mouth shape are completely different.

I should know this, but was the pool or the tennis pic the very first to be released?

by View-from-Ireland 11.07.14 11:28

canada12 wrote:
Justformaddie wrote:There's no way that I can see that these pics were taken days apart, I could actually say its wee maddie and big maddie! IMO

I can't actually believe that the top two photos are of the same girl who is in the bottom two photos. Her smile / grin and mouth shape are completely different.

I find it so odd that the three most famous photos of Madeleine, the one highlighting the Coloboma up close, the pool photo and the tennis ball pic all look so different. It's almost like three different girls, or pics of Madeleine a year apart. What was the point of releasing photos that displayed such variations? How could that help identify a missing person?

IMO, the pic of Madeleine in the Everton top looks quite like how she appeared in the tennis ball photo.

by Justformaddie 11.07.14 11:33

View-from-Ireland wrote:
canada12 wrote:
Justformaddie wrote:There's no way that I can see that these pics were taken days apart, I could actually say its wee maddie and big maddie! IMO

I can't actually believe that the top two photos are of the same girl who is in the bottom two photos. Her smile / grin and mouth shape are completely different.

I find it so odd that the three most famous photos of Madeleine, the one highlighting the Coloboma up close, the pool photo and the tennis ball pic all look so different. It's almost like three different girls, or pics of Madeleine a year apart. What was the point of releasing photos that displayed such variations? How could that help identify a missing person?

IMO, the pic of Madeleine in the Everton top looks quite like how she appeared in the tennis ball photo.

If the pool pic was the first one, then to me she looks like 21/2, if it was the tennis pic, she looks like she's more 51/2 or even 6, maybe she wasn't to be found IMO

by **PeterMac** 11.07.14 12:03

AndyB wrote:

Not during the day... say 10am to 7pm.. that looks like 100% to me... multiple layers as well.
Are you looking at the lines at the very bottom of the chart? I thought those were indicating the height of the clouds with the bar chart at the top showing the amount of cloud cover. I got the 50% from the bar chart at the top and with 50% you're always going to get some clouds, which is why the line at the bottom covers almost the full width of the day. (I'm not an expert in any of this so I could well be wrong)

This is just the day in question
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />
The thick black line is the temperature. (The other lines and filled in things are max / mins, and averages over many years,)
The grey blocks at the top are the cloud cover, 25% 50% 100%.
BUT since there is no 60/70/80. we may extrapolate and believe that at 2pm it was between 50% and 100 % which it achieves a little time later.
Certainly other photos taken on the Algarve that day bear this out.
(And yes there are millions on line if you care to look.)

This is a first hand account from a resident of PdL, whose previous profession required him to know everything there was to know about weather
It has been sent to the PJ, to Dr Amaral, and to Grange

Thursday, 3 May 2007 Weather continues cool and cloudy with sunny intervals, but not pool dipping weather.
Noticed first evidence of weather change, as by 7.15 pm cloud was clearing from the North. Just after 11pm night sky clear with full moon
I arrived at my apartment about 1145pm. It was a clear dry moonlit night and no sound of human or vehicular activity, and it was good to reflect that better weather had now set in.
In fact, the rains did not return until 14 June.

Friday 4 May, 2007 I was awakened at c.0750 on a fine clear morning,

Saturday 5 May, 2007. Weather continues fine and sunny.
_ _ _ _ _

Having viewed the sequence of photos above, this Commentator added the following
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

The Met sequence and the photo sequence coupled with the evidence of conditions given by the Tapas 9 confirms a typical Algarve weather pattern; thereby casting serious doubt on the McCann's date for the last photo. Wind speed is still the overriding factor in eliminating 3 May as the date of photo in my opinion. It is difficult to judge the wind conditions from the pictures on either date, but the evidence of all (on the ground at the time) consulted indicate that the photo as posed would not have been possible on 3 May.

However of much greater import - is the wind speed and cloud factor.
At 1400 on 3 May, wind speed is recorded as force 4 with a still air temperature of 17 C. Although the pool area is to some extent sheltered, with the westerly direction component the wind would be markedly chilly with a chill factor pulling the temp down to as low as 15C - definitely not suitable for scantily clad pool activity.

Of far greater importance; however, on the photo there is no sign of any disturbance of Madeleine's hair which hangs lankly below her hat. A hat which; moreover, is perched loosely on top of her head and would not remain unsupported in a Force 4 wind. Clearly, the cloud factor on 3 May would rule out such a photo.

We also see the known pattern of temperature, where the ambient air temp reaches a peak some hours AFTER solar zenith.
It on the basis of such first hand evidence that one is permitted to Purport the theory - that the Last Photo is a forgery - in that it tells a lie about itself, i.e. the date and time allocated to it.

by Guest 11.07.14 12:12

Justformaddie wrote: I should know this, but was the pool or the tennis pic the very first to be released?

From memory, the tennis ball one was published within a week and the poolside one about three weeks after 3rd May.

by AndyB 11.07.14 12:46

PeterMac wrote:
AndyB wrote:

Not during the day... say 10am to 7pm.. that looks like 100% to me... multiple layers as well.
Are you looking at the lines at the very bottom of the chart? I thought those were indicating the height of the clouds with the bar chart at the top showing the amount of cloud cover. I got the 50% from the bar chart at the top and with 50% you're always going to get some clouds, which is why the line at the bottom covers almost the full width of the day. (I'm not an expert in any of this so I could well be wrong)

This is just the day in question
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]" />
The thick black line is the temperature. (The other lines and filled in things are max / mins, and averages over many years,)
The grey blocks at the top are the cloud cover, 25% 50% 100%.
BUT since there is no 60/70/80. we may extrapolate and believe that at 2pm it was between 50% and 100 % which it achieves a little time later.
Certainly other photos taken on the Algarve that day bear this out.
(And yes there are millions on line if you care to look.)

This is a first hand account from a resident of PdL, whose previous profession required him to know everything there was to know about weather
It has been sent to the PJ, to Dr Amaral, and to Grange

Thursday, 3 May 2007 Weather continues cool and cloudy with sunny intervals, but not pool dipping weather.
Noticed first evidence of weather change, as by 7.15 pm cloud was clearing from the North. Just after 11pm night sky clear with full moon
I arrived at my apartment about 1145pm. It was a clear dry moonlit night and no sound of human or vehicular activity, and it was good to reflect that better weather had now set in.
In fact, the rains did not return until 14 June.

Friday 4 May, 2007 I was awakened at c.0750 on a fine clear morning,

Saturday 5 May, 2007. Weather continues fine and sunny.
_ _ _ _ _

Having viewed the sequence of photos above, this Commentator added the following
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

The Met sequence and the photo sequence coupled with the evidence of conditions given by the Tapas 9 confirms a typical Algarve weather pattern; thereby casting serious doubt on the McCann's date for the last photo. Wind speed is still the overriding factor in eliminating 3 May as the date of photo in my opinion. It is difficult to judge the wind conditions from the pictures on either date, but the evidence of all (on the ground at the time) consulted indicate that the photo as posed would not have been possible on 3 May.

However of much greater import - is the wind speed and cloud factor.
At 1400 on 3 May, wind speed is recorded as force 4 with a still air temperature of 17 C. Although the pool area is to some extent sheltered, with the westerly direction component the wind would be markedly chilly with a chill factor pulling the temp down to as low as 15C - definitely not suitable for scantily clad pool activity.

Of far greater importance; however, on the photo there is no sign of any disturbance of Madeleine's hair which hangs lankly below her hat. A hat which; moreover, is perched loosely on top of her head and would not remain unsupported in a Force 4 wind. Clearly, the cloud factor on 3 May would rule out such a photo.
We also see the known pattern of temperature, where the ambient air temp reaches a peak some hours AFTER solar zenith.
It on the basis of such first hand evidence that one is permitted to Purport the theory - that the Last Photo is a forgery - in that it tells a lie about itself, i.e. the date and time allocated to it.

Thanks Peter. As I suspected I was reading the chart wrongly.

There's an interesting point to come out of the testimony that you quoted. Its difficult to be certain from looking at the size of the wind arrows, which I'm assuming indicates wind speed, but the wind doesn't appear to drop until midnight. At 10pm the the arrow appears to me to be the same size as the one at 12 noon, which is slightly smaller than at 14:00, when we know it was force four. Could it have been strong enough to cause the curtains to woosh as Kate described?

by Justformaddie 11.07.14 13:22

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:
Justformaddie wrote: I should know this, but was the pool or the tennis pic the very first to be released?

From memory, the tennis ball one was published within a week and the poolside one about three weeks after 3rd May.

Ah thanks nfwtd, that girl, to me anyway, looks more like 5 or 6yrs there! No where near the girl in the pool pic IMO ofcourse