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The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Welcome to 'The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann' forum 🌹

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Post by Verdi 21.03.22 16:19

I think it would be good to have Petermac's e-book made into a 'real' book.
I don't!

The e-book has been read by millions and it leads to CMOMM every time.

yes

At one stage Richard Hall said he would be prepared to make his films into a 'real' book.
How would that be possible - by transcribing every single word throughout the entire collection of videos?

PHEW !!!  sweating


You have to first look at it's potential interest value all these years down the line.

PeterMac's e-book is available for all to see and read at no personal cost;   Richard D Hall's videos are available for all to see and watch and listen at no personal cost.

I think things are good as they are.  We don't want to get into the realms of 'a good marketing ploy' like so many others before, including....

shhhh  You know who!

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Post by Verdi 22.03.22 0:22

GB News tonight with Dan Wootton and guests..

'McCanns vow to run own £lm investigation if Met ends inquiry'


@ 1 hour 07 minutes



Well, as it looks like the end of the road for Operation Strangeways it will be very interesting to see how the McCanns intend to proceed with their private investigation.

eyebrows

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Post by Jill Havern 22.03.22 9:13

It's pretty shocking that so-called investigative journalists don't know the Maddie case, other than repeating and debating fake news.

I thought GB News would be better than that. Obviously not.

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Post by CaKeLoveR 22.03.22 9:23

Not one of them has read the bewk.
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Post by Verdi 22.03.22 11:25

It's clear to me the majority of journalists and former police officers haven't done their homework, in which case they shouldn't be reporting!

I'm going to have another look at Dan's show, my feathered ones were quite jolly (read loud) last night so I couldn't hear very well. When it started I thought Dan was a bit doubtful and the studio panel are the usual suspects with very conflicting views on world events, not my favourite group of critics.

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Post by Verdi 22.03.22 11:32

Lowbrow to Highbrow to Nobrow..

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whacky

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Post by CaKeLoveR 22.03.22 12:47

They have reinforced the abductor rubbish, and advertised the revolting bewk.  They're not journalists.
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Post by Verdi 22.03.22 12:56

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Post by sharonl 22.03.22 23:12

wow

https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/1584735/Madeleine-McCann-kidnap-portugal-praia-de-luz

£13m has been spent searching for Madeleine McCann. Not one penny more, says CAROLE MALONE
After 11 years and £13million the Met Police say they are finally winding down the hunt for Madeleine McCann. And I say this even though Kate and Gerry McCann will be devastated - it's time. Madeleine, who was three when she was abducted, would be 19-years-old now - a woman. And it's only when you visualise that you realise how long this investigation has gone on without any credible evidence to say whether Madeleine is alive or dead.
By CAROLE MALONE
21:38, Tue, Mar 22, 2022 | UPDATED: 21:38, Tue, Mar 22, 2022


Operation Grange couldn’t have gone on indefinitely as much as Kate and Gerry might have wanted it to. Just last year they said: “We’re never going to give up looking for her.” And, of course, they won’t. She’s their little girl and as long as there is breath in their bodies they’ll keep searching.

But Scotland Yard detectives have said there isn’t a scrap of definitive evidence to say whether Madeleine is alive or dead. And I suspect that’s been the case for a very long time.

Yet, every year when Operation Grange needs funds to keep it going for another year – we hear there’s a new lead or “critical lines of inquiry to pursue”. And on that basis, hundreds of thousands of pounds of taxpayers’ cash is thrown at Operation Grange.

In Kate and Gerry’s head, this money is justified. No amount of cash spent trying to find out what happened to her could be too much. But the reality is if she hasn’t been found after 11 years with all the resources that have been thrown at this case – it’s unlikely she will be. And it can’t go on forever just to spare the feelings of Kate and Gerry McCann.

Back in 2011 when Madeleine had been missing for four years Jenny Jones, a member of the Metropolitan Police authority demanded that the investigation be stopped.

She said it was difficult to justify spending millions on just one case: “It’s ludicrous,” she said. “This could take years and cost millions.”

And it has.

Over the years, I’ve wondered what the parents of other missing kids must think about the time and attention lavished on just one missing child.

On average the police spend around £2,500 of resources looking for missing kids.

Madeleine has had £13million and those families might be justified in thinking the McCanns were given preferential treatment.

That Madeleine’s life had been deemed more important than THEIR missing child. And the unfairness of that must be unbearable to live with.

Various Prime Ministers have also been reluctant to pull the plug on the inquiry not wanting to be the man/woman who gave up on Madeleine. Ditto with police chiefs.

But the time had to come when we said Enough! And it’s here.

In 2020, German authorities announced they had a suspect, the convicted paedophile, Christian Brueckner – currently in jail for raping an elderly woman – who had been tracked to the crime scene in Praia da Luz on the night Madeleine disappeared.

German prosecutor Hans Christian Wolters says German police have strong evidence that he killed Madeleine but German Law prevents him from releasing it.

Maybe this is why it’s finally been decided to halt the investigation. But, whatever it was, it had to be done. No child has ever been searched for as vigorously, or for so long.

Of course, Kate and Gerry McCann won’t stop looking for Madeleine. Their heads may tell them it’s pointless. But their hearts – and hope – will drive them on to keep searching for her.

They may spend a whole lifetime searching ... many parents of missing children do. And the burden of that is unimaginable.

But the end had to come. And the question still remains – were the authorities and the Government justified in spending years and many millions looking for one little lost girl?
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Post by sharonl 23.03.22 0:27

Milo wrote:There have been five prime ministers -- Brown, Blair, Cameron, May and Johnson since 2007.

If there has been a cover-up at the highest level, do we assume that all five are aware of what was/is being covered up? If so, how do they talk about it amongst themselves? 

I am asking because I have absolutely no idea.

I can't quite put my finger on it but for some reason I think that this is a EU coverup rather than just a UK one, maybe that is why both Labour and Tory MPs have assisted in this.

Blair, a remainer who doubled our contributions to the EU, was probably the first to protect the McCanns by sending Mitchell over to "control what came out in the press".

We later learn of Blairs' association with PACT charity linked to Missing People charity of which Kate was made ambassador.

We also have the that conference, in "Brussels". This is just for starters. I have always had a feeling that this coverup would fall apart post Brexit.

Just my thoughts thinking

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Post by Jill Havern 23.03.22 10:47



Madeleine McCann: And That's a Rap! #MadeleineMcCann #McCann #OperationGrange #ChristianBrueckner

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Post by Verdi 23.03.22 16:10

Aside from the book plug, Ms Brown can't claim exclusivity in the guise of a criminal profiler. Here on CMOMM/MMRG the majority of members past and present have drawn the same conclusions.

I do however disagree with her view that Christian Brueckner is the ideal patsy. Named famed dead and buried would be the ideal patsy - like Raymond Hewlett. Even a nuisance relative could be silenced given the right incentive, or some other method of silencing.

The Brueckner debacle has been rumbling on, with no developments I might add, for nigh on two years. If he were intended to be the ultimate closure, why drag it on for two years - involving the German authorities to boot!

Unless of course it's all an act ....

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Post by Silentscope 23.03.22 17:07

Has StA Wolters officially said that his investigation is over?

The airing of any further Documentary on the Maddie case in Germany is now apparently cancelled. 

It seems that everything will now want to be forgotten in a hurry.

Oder Unterdenteppichgekehrt / Or swept under the Carpet?
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Post by Verdi 24.03.22 0:16

Now that Operation Grange has reached the end I can only hope this farce will be forgotten sooner rather than later.

It's past it's sell by date.

yes

Jetzt, da Operation Grange das Ende erreicht hat, kann ich nur hoffen, dass diese Farce eher früher als später vergessen wird.

Das Mindesthaltbarkeitsdatum ist überschritten.

hat

Sometimes google translate is more accurate or believable than the pretence!



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Post by Verdi 27.03.22 2:04

No such luck, the show must go on..

The hunt for Madeleine McCann is winding down but three lessons are helping the search for other missing children


By Catherine Taylor
Posted 6h ago,  updated 4h ago

END OF THE ROAD Madeleine McCann inquiry to END after 11 years as fears grow prime suspect WON’T be charged - Page 3 44b87511
The search for Madeleine McCann has offered lessons in the best strategies to use to look for missing children.(Reuters: Virgilio Rodrigues)

It was a warm night in mid spring and the Ocean Club resort on Portugal's far south coast was buzzing. Lights around the pool twinkled as the McCann family, from Leicestershire in England, gathered to enjoy the evening with friends while their three kids slept off the sun and sea nearby.

Then, in one moment, everything changed.

At 10pm on Thursday May 3, 2007, Kate and Gerry McCann's eldest daughter Madeleine, a few days away from turning four, was discovered missing from her bed.

Those who witnessed the chaos that night describe Kate pacing back and forth almost catatonic with fear as she looked for her lost child and tried to protect her 18-month-old twins, Sean and Amelie. Gerry was bent over, peering under cars, behind shrubs.

"You're in this quiet little holiday resort that seemed idyllic," Gerry has said of the moment. "[Then] We couldn't get the darkest thoughts out of our minds, that somebody had taken her and abused her. I remember being slumped on the floor [calling] some of my family members and just saying, "pray for her".

In the back of everyone's mind was simply this: were they still hunting for a lost little girl, or should they be looking for a body?

Millions of dollars have been spent trying to answer that question. But almost 15 years later Madeleine is still missing and details of what happened that night remain a mystery.
Madeleine's legacy

Now, Britain's Metropolitan Police has announced the dedicated $26 million task force Operation Grange, that was set up in 2011 to solve the case, is running out of money. While investigators will continue to accept tips, there are "no plans to take the inquiry further".

When the investigation winds up Kate and Gerry McCann will be back where they began in 2007: funding their own search for their "lovely daughter", this time from a fund of donations said to be worth about $1.3 million.

"We will never give up hope of finding Madeleine alive," Gerry has said. "We need to know, as we need to find peace."

Kate said in 2017 she will do "Whatever it takes, for as long as it takes," to find her daughter.

Yet even though investigations are no closer to charging a suspect, the hunt for Madeleine – who would turn 19 on May 12 – has already left an important legacy that experts believe has changed the way police approach investigations into missing children, including William Tyrrell and Cleo Smith, and even Shayla Phillips, the subject of Australia's most recent missing child hunt.

The three most important influences drawn from the Madeleine McCann case according to Xanthe Mallett — a forensic anthropologist and criminologist from the University of Newcastle who specialises in the behaviour of paedophiles — are the early use of a strong image, the creation of a "perfect victim", and an investigation strategy that prioritises multiple lines of inquiry.

The image

As news broke of Madeleine's disappearance in 2007, Mallett was watching TV with a group of colleagues from the forensic investigation centre where she worked in England.

As the story unfolded on the screen Mallett emphasises how important early images of Maddie were building a public profile for the media and British public to get behind, helping underscore the urgency of the search.

The now iconic photo of Maddie's sweet face — messy bobbed haircut and fringe, her wide blue and green eyes with a distinctive brown mark in the right — was deeply affecting. The fact that the little girl shared such a strong likeness to her mother emphasised their bond, and the unfathomable loss.

Everyone who saw the picture felt invested in Maddie's story and wanted to know what would happen next. The result is that the disappearance of Madeleine McCann has become one of the most widely-reported missing persons cases in history.

The "mediatisation" of Madeleine McCann was helped further by the fact that social media platforms including Facebook and Twitter had just launched, in 2004 and 2007, offering novel new ways for promoting the story.

Kate and Gerry, too, understood from the start that the will to invest effort into finding Madeleine was related to keeping her story in the news.

Maddie's parents were "pillioried" for their media focus, Mallett says, but "they knew if Maddie slipped off the front page the likelihood of her being found diminished significantly, so engaging with the media and keeping her front and centre, was their best chance of getting her back."

The media narrative built Maddie's disappearance as a mystery: how does a child simply vanish? The media — and crucially, also the police — continued to invest in finding the answer.

Their regular press conferences marking investigation milestones and anniversaries were accompanied by more emotive images – often featuring the couple side-by-side holding a photograph of their daughter, reminiscent of something biblical in the way it was constructed, subtly emphasising the idea that Maddie represented a "perfect victim".

The use of an early iconic photograph is a tactic that has assisted the campaigns for William Tyrrell and Cleo Smith, too, says Mallett.

"We all know the boy in the Spiderman suit," she says. "These are images that stay with you."

A 'perfect' victim

Defining Maddie as what criminologists call a "perfect victim" – someone who in the eyes of the public is totally blameless for their situation – helped build a sense of urgency to find her, Mallett says.

The story of this little girl, snatched from her bed while on holiday, described a scenario of intense vulnerability that triggered deep emotion in anyone who heard it regardless of whether they were a parent or not.

"Of course all victims are innocent but, unfortunately, we do tend to rank this idea. You'll hear conversations like "Oh well, you know, they were doing something risky"," Mallett says. "The perfect victim is somebody who was harmed through literally no fault of their own."

Once again, this aspect of the William Tyrrell and Cleo Smith cases was successfully emphasised as a method for galvanising ongoing public interest and support.

When we have our perfect victim, our "good guy", human biology comes into play, Mallett says. The loss of a child is something we can all relate to, and it reaches deep into the human psyche, exposing existential fears about safety and survival.

"If something's happened to a child, I think that pretty much rocks everybody," Mallett says.

Humans are hardwired to protect our youngest – biologically, they represent our future and when they go missing this tears at our sense of order in the world.

The investigations that follow abductions take us deep into the lives of these children – we learn about their personalities, we see their bedrooms and backyards, and study images of their favourite toys.

Following Maddie's disappearance Kate carried around a pink soft toy belonging to her daughter and spoke of the last time she was with her daughter — reading her favourite book If You're Happy and You Know It together.

We follow investigations into their disappearances like the minutes of a sporting match. There are good guys and bad guys and the entire community becomes bonded by the emotional investment in "victory" for our team.

Yet the McCann case also exposed inequalities in the way missing person cases are handled. Gerry and Kate, both doctors, had the intelligence and insights to drive a media campaign and their privileged middle-class background also matched stereotypes about what a "perfect victim" might look like.

"Millions of dollars have been poured into [the search] and it's unique in that sense because while every missing child deserves to be found, there are lots of missing children and very few of them receive this level of investment," Mallett says.

The investigation strategy

From the beginning, the search for Madeleine McCann faced a series of sliding doors moments that became torturous "what ifs".

   What if the holiday apartment had been properly sealed off as a crime scene to preserve evidence and early investigations by Portuguese police had been more focused?
   What if crucial clues, such as reports of a man leaving the resort carrying a sleeping child, had been quickly followed up?
   What if Madeleine's parents had never been labelled as key suspects, throwing the investigation off track for weeks?
   What if Scotland Yard had opened its own investigation far sooner than 2011?

These are questions that Graham Hill has spent years pondering and says he has never shaken "serious misgivings about the quality of the search strategy".

Hill was a British detective and expert in predatory sex offenders when he was seconded to Portugal to help search for Madeleine.

He met Kate and Gerry to discuss the case, but had little comfort to offer. As the days ticked on the chances of finding Madeleine alive fell exponentially with most abducted children killed within six hours of disappearing.

"It was a difficult conversation," Hill wrote in an article for The Conversation. "But I was struck by how focused the McCanns remained throughout."

Mallett says that one of the lessons to emerge from the McCann case is the importance of running several simultaneous enquiries: "Exploring the possibility of abduction as well as misadventure as well as the child simply wandering off or something happening within the family."

With the first 48 hours crucial in maximising the chance a missing child will be found alive, there simply is not time to run only one line of investigation, then switch to the next if it is unsuccessful, Mallett argues.

This strategy of multiple investigations was helpful in finding Cleo Smith, Mallett believes, adding that the very early offer of a large reward was another clever initiative.

"Only a few days into her being missing a large reward was offered," she says. "That is very unusual and even if it didn't have a direct impact what it did do is keep Cleo in the public's mind and keep people talking about her."
Finding the perpetrator

Of course, all of these strategies feel meaningless if the child isn't found or if a perpetrator isn't brought to justice.

And notwithstanding Mallett's advice to run multiple lines of inquiry from the get-go, when a child goes missing suspicion almost always first turns to the family.

Criminologists like Mallett are trained to pick up subtle shifts that can be crucial in suggesting guilt or innocence. But Mallett and her colleagues never wavered from a belief that Kate and Gerry were innocent.

"When a caregiver is responsible for the death of a child they tend not to use the name because it almost personalises the individual," she says. "They refer to them as "he" or "she" as a way of psychologically distancing themselves. If a parent is doing that when a child is missing it's a red flag."

Kate and Gerry never stopped referring to their daughter by name. In the first emotional press conference following their daughter's disappearance, Gerry asked for "any information related to Madeleine's disappearance, no matter how trivial" and begged, "Please, if you have Madeleine, let her come home to her mummy, daddy, brother and sister."

'Predators and prey'

Mallett, like most experts familiar with the case, is convinced Madeleine was abducted and over the years suspects have ranged from lone wolf paedophiles to organised crime gangs who deliver children to sex trafficking rings.

Mallett does not believe Madeleine was taken "to order" but was more likely the victim of an individual paedophile.

"There are predators and there are prey. It's just part of the animal kingdom, isn't it," Mallett says with devastating simplicity. "And so when there's an opportunity to take advantage of a situation someone will always leverage that."

She emphasises that while an individual's perversion is responsible for some child abductions, money remains "a huge driver for sex trafficking".

"The people who traffic people don't see them as different to any other commodity. They are totally emotionally disengaged," Mallett says.

Following Cleo Smith's abduction police were quick to begin scouring the dark web for any sign of her being offered for sale. While that was thankfully not the case it remains an important consideration whenever a child goes missing, Mallett believes.

"I don't think people understand that beneath the genuine economy is the black economy that views an abducted child as nothing more than an opportunity to access a new source of revenue," she says.
'Born evil'

The latest suspect in Madeleine's disappearance does nothing to bring comfort or closure.


In 2020 German police put forward the name of Christian Brueckner, a 45-year-old convicted paedophile and rapist who was known to live close to the Ocean Club where he also worked casually.

In a rare show of certainty, German public prosecutor Hans Christian Wolters has claimed to be "100 per cent sure" Brueckner was Madeleine's abductor. Yet Wolters also says he cannot reveal the information that has led to this conclusion, saying only that "If you knew the evidence we had you would come to the same conclusion".

Wolters has suggested that ongoing charges mean information implicating Brueckner cannot be revealed, and that despite his sincere believe this is the man who took Maddie, legal complications could mean he is never brought to justice.

Mallett says her understanding of Brueckner builds a picture of "a monster".

Public records portray Broeckner as a man obsessed with pre-pubescent girls, videoed his assaults and murdered his victims after keeping them alive for significant portions of time, she says.

"This man was born evil," Mallett believes. "He is the embodiment of the bogeyman, the worst of the worst, a sadistic psychopathic offender."

Kate and Gerry have consistently said they want to know the truth of what happened to their daughter, "whatever the outcome may be".

Yet Mallett says in some ways she hopes the evidence against Broeckner is not conclusive.

"That poor family, waiting all these years to find out what happened, but the answer is literally their worst nightmare  … It would break most people," Mallett says.

How do you pick up the pieces?


As the McCann's face down another anniversary of their daughter's disappearance and another birthday without her, it's clear why they describe May as the most difficult month.

The problem of finding the person who abducted her feels almost insignificant beside the daily task of continuing to live life without her, and with the terrible knowledge of what is most likely to have happened to her.

Mallett, who has spent a large portion of her career working with the families of murder victims says "closure is never a word that they use".

"Even when they've had a resolution, it can help them move on but it will always be with them," she says. "Sometimes even 50 years later you see the trauma. It's intergenerational. It's a pain that travels through the family."

For this reason, powerful bonds can develop between families who have suffered similar tragedies.

Denise and Bruce Morcombe's son Daniel was 13 when he was abducted in 2003 while waiting at a bus stop, and later murdered.

The Morcombes had dinner with the McCanns in England in 2011 and have described the meeting "as like looking in the mirror".

"It was amazing how quickly we communicated even though it was the first time we'd ever met," Bruce has said, adding the couples shared how they coped.

Everyday life for the McCann's is now low profile – apart from their regular and deliberate engagement with the media.

Despite the enormity of what happened in Portugal in 2007, Kate and Gerry McCann have had to carry on parenting their twins who would have little memory of their big sister and yet live with the inherited trauma of what happened to her.

The family is believed to still live in Leicestershire where Madeleine grew up until her disappearance. They have a house in the village of Rothley and the twins – Sean and Amelie, now 16 — attend a nearby Catholic high school.

Gerry, a professor of cardiology, works at the University of Leicester.

Kate, a GP, stopped practising after Madeleine's disappearance to devote time to searching for her, and to charity work, but the COVID pandemic triggered her return to work in hospitals around Leicester.

The story of Madeleine McCann is one that has touched almost every corner of the globe, yet we are still waiting for the final episode. And even if a resolution is reached, it is very hard indeed to imagine there will be a happy ending.

Whether the official investigation into her disappearance by Britain's Metropolitan Police concludes or not, any parent who has lost a child to abduction knows this is a search without end.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-03-27/madeleine-mccann-abduction-missing-cleo-william-shayla/100941730
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Post by Vera Krista 27.03.22 12:21

enough of these lies.

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Post by CaKeLoveR 27.03.22 12:23

How sad that they 'have had to carry on parenting their twins'.
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Post by sandancer 27.03.22 13:23

Kate pacing backwards and forwards almost catatonic ! 

Well which one was it ?

Kate and Gerry never stopped referring to their daughter by name !

A child , the child , that child , a little girl  ! 

Which name was it Madeleine or Maddie ? 

Low profile !!! Don't make me laugh

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Post by sharonl 28.03.22 22:20

Madeleine inquiry in the UK: questions still needing answers

By Len Port -27th March 2022


Operation Grange is expected to be shelved this autumn.
Madeleine McCann has been making headline news internationally yet again as the London Metropolitan Police investigation into her disappearance is reportedly going to be shelved this autumn.

I wonder if the Met’s Operation Grange has been deeply flawed from the very start and could that have something to do with the British ‘establishment’, a network that is said to include top politicians, billionaire newspaper owners and some leading police officers? But now we’re getting into the realm of speculation. Let’s not go there. Let’s stick with some of the facts as we know them.

The UK charity Missing People says that 140,000 people go missing in Britain every year. That’s 383 a day. Two thirds of the cases examined by the charity are under 18 years-of-age. So, why did the British government, diplomats and certain other influential individuals immediately give unprecedented support to the parents of this particular missing child? That’s the first of many fundamental questions that need answering.

Operation Grange destined to fail?
The review and investigation conducted by Operation Grange, a special unit set up within London’s police force more than a decade ago, was always destined to fail, according to a well-known, distinguished London detective who said he would not get involved in the case because the official remit of Operation Grange was to investigate the “abduction” in the Algarve as if it had taken place in the UK. Why such a limited remit when suspicions hovered over Madeleine’s parents and while there was very little credible evidence that Madeleine had been abducted?

Why was Operation Grange told to turn a blind eye to the possible criminal involvement of Madeleine’s parents or their holidaying friends, which is the normal starting point in missing children’s cases? If neither the parents nor friends were involved, which may indeed be so, a standard investigation including them would have cleared their names, which the Portuguese police probe has never done.

Why did such a limited investigation, which followed the review launched in May 2011, carry on and on with British Home Office approval at a cost to British taxpayers that has reached £13 million? That’s over €15 million or more than $16 million.

People of Praia da Luz feel insulted
Why have the British news media – especially the ‘red-tops’, but also some of the ‘quality broadsheets’ – become so biased and sycophantic in their reporting by always referring to Madeleine’s “abduction” without adding a word such as “alleged” or “suspected”, and without questioning other possibilities? Why has The Sun, owned by the American-based billionaire Rupert Murdoch, been so privy to the little information dribbling out about the Operation Grange investigation? And why has the British press long been castigating the Portuguese police and implying that the peaceful resort of Praia da Luz was a den of iniquity, an insult that the local residents emphatically deny?

Has Operation Grange ever properly considered that Madeleine may have disappeared several days before her parents raised the alarm on May 3, or did that exceed their remit? A private research project carefully examined local weather conditions during the week of the McCanns’ holiday. The analysis concluded that the date and time of the so-called “Last Photo” on a camera used by Kate McCann must have been doctored. There had been plenty of time to make fake changes because the camera and photo were not presented to the Portuguese police for examination until May 24, a couple of days after Gerry McCann returned from a short visit to the UK. Operation Grange was fully informed about all this, but to no avail. Why?

Convicted paedophile Christian Bruckner and his lawyer have totally denied any involvement, yet German prosecutors claim they are 100% certain that Madeleine is dead, and that Bruckner killed her. But if they had such certainty, why have they not charged him? The German authorities did not share whatever evidence they had with Operation Grange who insist they do not know whether Madeleine is alive or dead. “It seems extraordinary our officers are so much in the dark,” said a former senior Met officer. “It begs the question, why we are still bothering to run an inquiry if the Germans are so dominant?”

Offer to help examine DNA samples ignored
Among the other things Operation Grange has showed no interest in is the remarkable offer by Dr Mark Perlin, chief scientist and executive of an American company, Cybergenetics, which is reputed to have the world’s most advanced equipment and methods to examine and identify DNA samples. Asked by an Australian news outlet if he could help in the Madeleine case, Dr Perlin said he would gladly analyse forensic samples found by specialist dogs in the McCanns’ holiday apartment and in a car they had hired 25 days after the reported disappearance. He said he could decipher 18 previously unsolvable DNA samples dating back to 2007.

A now defunct laboratory in the UK had been unable to come to any proper conclusions about them. Despite the lapse of time, Dr Perlin was optimistic that if the samples were sent to him, he and his team could accurately identify the DNA in less than a fortnight. He offered his services to Operation Grange free of charge, but he got no response. Dr Perlin extended the offer to Gerry McCann, but he did not respond either. Again, one wonders why.

Neither the British Home Office nor anyone else connected with Operation Grange have been open and transparent about the limited investigation, but questions about it will not go away because the operation is widely perceived – rightly or wrongly – as having been a sham, some sort of cover-up.

Madeleine deserves justice
Surely the public, who have long been fascinated, if not obsessed, with the most discussed and reported missing person case in history, should be allowed straightforward answers to reasonable questions.

The Portuguese people offended by British news reports and Operation Grange visits to Praia da Luz, and the British taxpayers who have funded the investigation without any say in the matter, deserve honest explanations. Most of all, Madeleine deserves justice.

https://www.portugalresident.com/madeleine-inquiry-in-the-uk-questions-still-needing-answers/
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Post by Tony Bennett 28.03.22 22:39

Great paragraph beginning:

*Has Operation Grange ever properly considered...*

Is there anywhere we can add comments to Len Port's article?

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Dr Martin Roberts: "The evidence is that these are the pjyamas Madeleine wore on holiday in Praia da Luz. They were photographed and the photo handed to a press agency, who released it on 8 May, as the search for Madeleine continued. The McCanns held up these same pyjamas at two press conferences on 5 & 7June 2007. How could Madeleine have been abducted?"

Amelie McCann (aged 2): "Maddie's jammies!".  

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Post by sharonl 28.03.22 23:11

Tony Bennett wrote:Great paragraph beginning:

*Has Operation Grange ever properly considered...*

Is there anywhere we can add comments to Len Port's article?

Here https://algarvenewswatch.blogspot.com/

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Post by crusader 29.03.22 8:33

Offer to help examine DNA samples ignored
Among the other things Operation Grange has showed no interest in is the remarkable offer by Dr Mark Perlin, chief scientist and executive of an American company, Cybergenetics, which is reputed to have the world’s most advanced equipment and methods to examine and identify DNA samples. Asked by an Australian news outlet if he could help in the Madeleine case, Dr Perlin said he would gladly analyse forensic samples found by specialist dogs in the McCanns’ holiday apartment and in a car they had hired 25 days after the reported disappearance. He said he could decipher 18 previously unsolvable DNA samples dating back to 2007.




The McCann's have said "They will leave no stone unturned" in the search for Madeleine, so why are they not putting pressure on Scotland Yard to send the samples to Dr. Perlin.

Could it be the samples no longer exist, read "lost or destoyed" here, because  they and Scotland Yard already know what the samples show.

They had no problem handing over vast amounts of money to a suspect detective agency, or contacting an ex policeman from Australia with a highly secret person finding machine.
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Post by Vera Krista 29.03.22 9:48

crusader wrote:Offer to help examine DNA samples ignored
Among the other things Operation Grange has showed no interest in is the remarkable offer by Dr Mark Perlin, chief scientist and executive of an American company, Cybergenetics, which is reputed to have the world’s most advanced equipment and methods to examine and identify DNA samples. Asked by an Australian news outlet if he could help in the Madeleine case, Dr Perlin said he would gladly analyse forensic samples found by specialist dogs in the McCanns’ holiday apartment and in a car they had hired 25 days after the reported disappearance. He said he could decipher 18 previously unsolvable DNA samples dating back to 2007.




The McCann's have said "They will leave no stone unturned" in the search for Madeleine, so why are they not putting pressure on Scotland Yard to send the samples to Dr. Perlin.

Could it be the samples no longer exist, read "lost or destoyed" here, because  they and Scotland Yard already know what the samples show.

They had no problem handing over vast amounts of money to a suspect detective agency, or contacting an ex policeman from Australia with a highly secret person finding machine.
it’s because they know the answers & probably the samples were destroyed

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Post by onehand 29.03.22 12:59

when you do a dna test, that part of the total sample always will be destroyed, so in most cases it is trying to use never more than half of the original sample, most times the sample just exists of a cotton swab, you just cut a piece of the cotton tip, under as sterile as possible circumstances. 

that small piece has to undergo some chemical handling to free the dna itself out of cells and other non dna compounds. 

so it means you can never go twice on that sample, all besides the dna itself will be gone, the dna itself is used up in the rest of the testing. 

and because those labs have to run by a lot of security in their testing, there are always control samples running aside at the same time, there is little need for that second chance of these steps.

for true retesting just the rest of the cotton tip will be present. 

to produce a dna sample for analysis there is a whole lot of handling, it is usually seen as a separate task.

that is only step 1, step 2 is to read out the dna, decoding it. even than you only have the dna.

as far as i can find, perlin's system is based in the third part of this work, and that is looking in who's dna it could be, his system does not say simply yes or no, his software true allele use a lot of statistics and most would be done by a computer.

one of the troublesome parts of dna testing is the use of the pcr technique, to get a read out you need quite a lot of dna, a sample in forensics will deliver mostly low results, so at the end of step 1 pcr is used to replicate the dna in the purified sample, but the problem with pcr technique is, it will copy every bit of dna, it is not a selective instrument to use to only replicate only the dna of exactly one living organism. 
also because of the replications, there is a strong possibility pieces of the original dna in the test are not exact copies, some parts could loose small bits, others could even gain some small bits, with small it means only to see under a very good microscope. 

because of the technique of lcn dna testing that was used on most of the mccann case samples, done in the uk, what means there is extremely very little of a sample to start with, and there are more cycles of replication done than in other ways of dna testing, there is always more chance to get pieces that just f..k up your results. 

perlins software is able to use a lot of math and statistics to look at the possibly mixed sample, so it is able to give an estimate about real or unreal mixing in other dna, or of it was more likely a possible result of the pcr replication. 

as far as i could find, he just would need the full original read outs of the test results of the samples and all of the dna of possible donors. 

the problem with those newer techniques is , it takes years before the courts except it for use in criminal cases. lcn dna testing never started very well, it was not very populair because it was very expensive, and had a very large turn over of faulty results. i most cases there is no budget for a lot of results that are named as inconclusive or mixed. 

if you look into the forensic reporting in the files you see examples like possibly from 3, to even 5 contributions of persons. perlins software is said to be able to look into the read out of the dna if it is likely to be from 3 or more people, or any number, it could be one and the same and a result of the lcn technique and the pcr replications mistakes made in it. 

all these results are usually bound into a casebook, but it is also possible the head researcher of a lab keeps them, under law he as responsible producent owns usually the results, but it is common most of it will finds its way to the forensic services of a country. i had full copies of all we used as evidence also in my case files. they are not in the pj files, and you have to look for at least a gap of 20 pages, and that are the short ones, for all samples and donors of samples to test against it must be a full ordner for this case. 

because it was ment to go to a court in portugal it is less likely their would not be a full report of all dna testing in the hands of the forensic services in portugal itself. because of ownership it could be it never would be part of the police files itself, like the video of the airport =owned by that airport, so not in the police files. 

also over so many years you get often trouble to get people who once did give their dna for this case, to find all of them to sign of a affidavit to use it again. most countries have some law that given dna can only be hold in files for a period of time, as long as it is from innocent people, who are not part of a possible crime in that case. 

and as far it is to make out of the paperwork, all dna testing in the uk was done under portuguese autority, it means the uk can do legally nothing.  so even if they have a copy of the full analysis under operation grange they can not legally give a permission to use this by a non accepted software technology out of their own state.

so to make use of the dna analitical results, you need compliance of john lowe, possibly also the cps of the uk, that is responsible for forensic services, and after that mostly the portuguese justice department. 
because the re-analysis will take place outside of the uk, the legal guardian of madeleine beth mccann, has to give permission, that are not kate and gerry mccann. the last for the use of her dna. 

dna of a natural person has the same worth as a footor a body of a natural person under law, it has the highest form of regulations because of rights of privacy. it has the most red tape they could find around it. 

so just send some to the usa is far to simple. perlins software is indeed a fair chance to get some answers, but not all answers. if all heads in this party want it, it could be possible, not that easy, but with some good willing heads it has a chance. 

only perlins analytical software does not tell if the dna is the result of a living or dead donor, or from what type of cells is a result. in that sense it will not really change what we know by know. 

more evidence that could help really is finding a way to test the tiles and grout from behind the sofa, most of it is kept in portugal. if they found a way to find out if and how much blood must have been there it could fulfill the likelihood that it was enough to leading to a dead child of that age and body. 

even if perlins system can tell it was madeleines dna, is does not really tells how it got there, madeleine had legally access to 5a, and things could have been transported on a later time containing dna to the laster rented car. it could make a certain theory stronger, more likely, but it would not be proof in itself of anything.

it would have more influence on the public frames of mind, than the investigation. i'm all into being sure about the findings, but finding dna of a victim in a place it had all legal reasons to be present works very different , than finding it on any other place she would not have any reason to be. i know every pro mccann barkes til today there was not found any blood of dna of madeleine, but they only will change it in just other non sense, like but she was there legally, or it was just escaped dna from clothes and shoes, like they already often reach out to. 

but scotland yard, or operation grange or gerry mccann are just the wrong people to ask for permission, they have both none to give. gerry could have given consent for the use of his own dna and that of the still under age twins, but not for that of madeleine, she is still ward of the courts.
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Post by crusader 29.03.22 14:09

Thanks for the info onehand.
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