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The Coronavirus Debate - Page 21 Mm11

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The Coronavirus Debate

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Post by JimbobJones on 04.12.20 12:50

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
By "sterilizing", he meant freeing people's bodies from the targeted virus.

Ya think? YOU dont know what he meant, only he does. You can assume all you like, it changes nothing . . .  Wouldn't he have said "immunising" if he meant freeing bodies from a targeted virus?

I could never stand that pompous oaf john snow or whatever his name is. He is always really up himself. The elder statesmen of autocue reading.
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Post by Jill Havern on 04.12.20 12:52



The Richie Allen Show Thursday December 3rd - BOMBSHELL Fertility Info On New Pfizer Vaccine!

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Post by Jill Havern on 04.12.20 13:07

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
By "sterilizing", he meant freeing people's bodies from the targeted virus.

Ya think? YOU dont know what he meant, only he does. You can assume all you like, it changes nothing . . .  Wouldn't he have said "immunising" if he meant freeing bodies from a targeted virus?

I could never stand that pompous oaf john snow or whatever his name is. He is always really up himself. The elder statesmen of autocue reading.
He might not have meant 'sterilizing' in the sense of making someone infertile, but 'sterilizing' in the sense of making something free from bacteria - like sterilizing a baby's bottle.

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Post by BlueBag on 04.12.20 13:13

The people who want to save us want to reduce the population.

That must be confusing for them.
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Post by Jill Havern on 04.12.20 13:18


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Post by crusader on 04.12.20 14:22

It's got nothing to do with theories or anything else, it's about free will. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, or tells you.

If you, me or anyone else doesn't want to take it, then nobody should be co- erst or forced into it. End of.
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Post by Verdi on 04.12.20 15:32

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:It's got nothing to do with theories or anything else, it's about free will. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, or tells you.

If you, me or anyone else doesn't want to take it, then nobody should be co- erst or forced into it. End of.

Amen!

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Post by Verdi on 04.12.20 15:37

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Post by Verdi on 04.12.20 15:52


If we’ll all be wearing masks for years to come, will we ever return to the ‘old normal’?

A vaccine is imminent, but Covid's seismic change to our behaviour means we might not flock back to sports stadiums and theatres just yet

By Harry de Quetteville 3 December 2020 • 7:57pm

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We may dream of how things were, but they may never be the same



It was like having both the tortoise and the hare in the same room. “We must take things slooooow,” was the gist of deputy chief medical officer Jonathan Van-Tam’s message about life now that a vaccine is on these shores.

“Nonsense, we’re going to whizz to the finish line,” Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, seemed to say.

Can they both be right? Will Covid, as Prof Van-Tam suggests, be with us forever, eternally sticking its blasted spike protein where it’s not wanted? Will masks become a fixture? Will we be slathering ourselves with sanitiser for life? Will our vaccine-inspired immunity last until we croak safely in our sleep at 107, or will the need for boosters and perhaps just plain old habit see us continue politely to shuffle backwards when someone gets too close and instill a flicker of unease over hugs for granny and grandpa, even at Christmas 2021 – and possibly for evermore?

On the other hand, will the PM get his dearest wish that life returns “pretty much as close to normal”? Will maternity wards soon be filled with “EV-Day” sproglets, conceived in the joyful abandon that accompanies universal End of Virus celebrations? Will nurses sweep sailors off their feet for impromptu snogs to illustrate their feat of medical arms, the victory over social distancing?

Not if JVT has anything to do with it: “Do I think there will come a big moment, where we have a massive party and throw off our masks and hand sanitiser and say that it’s behind us, like the end of the war? No, I don’t.”

Well, thanks a million, Jonny.



But sadly, he’s only telling us what most of knew already. Sure, it may not just have been the Prime Minister dreaming of some vast bacchanalian revel. We all wanted to have a giant knees-up and get on with life as before.

But in our hearts we know there are some things that are simply too big to reverse. VE Day may have drawn a line under the conflict but it did not undo the social transformation of the war, as Churchill discovered to his electoral cost even before the fighting was finished.

And as we all know with this battle, the impact of this virus has not been purely physical; it has been psychological. “I’m not an anxious person,” says Prof Dame Til Wykes at the Institute of Psychiatry, Psychology and Neuroscience, King’s College London. “But at the beginning of the pandemic, when I went out, I was quite anxious the first few times.” Today, the same will be true. Like prisoners coming to the end of their terms, many will have needed to acclimatise to the prospect of finally getting out.

It is more than a purely individual impulse. Social and cultural bonds enforce behaviours, too. How many of us, the moment that the Government’s decision to allow Christmas gatherings put responsibility for the consequences squarely onto our own shoulders, actually cancelled festive plans – our duty to parents and grandparents suddenly thrown into stark relief?

Indeed, amid turmoil, options can cause distress, says Xiaowei Xu at the Institute for Fiscal Studies, who has studied the mental health impact of Covid. For many, she says, “the first lockdown was actually a relief, because it was finally clear what was going on”. The Covid Social Study, which surveys volunteers in real time, shows that anxiety decreased from the end of March.

Previous pandemics have created lasting changes in behaviour. “For Ebola, there was clearly a change in the way people greeted each other, which was often with hugs. Only over time is that beginning to come back,” says Dame Til.

In Asia, where face masks’ popularity blossomed after the SARS pandemic of 2002, covering the nose and mouth is an enduring obligation to others. “It’s thought of as being polite.”



“In a post-vaccine world, most people will try to revert to their usual behaviours,” she says. “But some behaviours are quite difficult to roll back easily.” Don’t bin that mask too soon, then.

In some cases, happily, knowledge will sweep away caution. Scientists look back on the early days of the HIV pandemic, when little was known about precise causes, and shudder at the way “suspect” groups were shunned. “The more information we have, the more that determines our social behaviours,” says Dame Til. For example, as evidence for transmission becomes clearer and clearer (at the moment, it suggests infection through the air is far more prevalent than through touching), we may resume shaking hands. But, she says, frequent handwashing is likely to be here to stay.

Underpinning such uncertainty are the vaccines themselves, about which much remains unknown – like long-term efficacy: for whom, at what age and for how long? Like whether they will prevent us spreading the virus SARS-Cov-2, or only prevent us getting Covid-19, the disease it causes.

Until we know for sure, says Dame Til, our behaviour will be shaped by a combination of benefit to ourselves and obligation to others.

We may want to go back to the football stadiums and jump up and down with 62,301 strangers when our team scores against Arsenal, but surveys suggest those most vulnerable to Covid are wary. Theatres, too, know they have a job on their hands to reassure their, often older, patrons to return to the velvet and gilt confines of West End auditoriums, which felt built for pygmies even pre-pandemic. Where we were merely annoyed with coughing audience members before, will we now be anxious?



Xiaowei Xu’s work shows that at the beginning of lockdown – as the world closed – it was the young, in particular young women, who worried most. But now, as the world contemplates opening again, that may be changing. “Over time, it does seem like [the old] have adapted less,” she says.

Sadly, JVT is right. “We’re going to be living with the behaviours that we have adopted at the moment to prevent the spread of the virus for a while yet,” says Dame Til.

Indeed, like car crash victims learning to walk again, the mechanisms may be put in place to return to normality, only for us to find that our social muscle memory has vanished and needs to be rebuilt – through experiences that may feel artificial, perhaps sometimes even painful.

So it may not be a joyous tumult when and if we reach the safety of the other side. Rather, we may smile a little wanly at each other and wonder exactly what we have to say, having so little to report.

Yet that may not be so bad, finally, to reacquaint ourselves with the company of strangers – to take some time to get used to the idea of a world in which other people are no longer a source of danger. For that, horribly, is the reality of what we have all been living with this year.

The battle against the virus may, hopefully, be ending – in our bodies, at least. But the battle in our minds has only just begun.



Xiaowei Xu’s work shows that at the beginning of lockdown – as the world closed – it was the young, in particular young women, who worried most. But now, as the world contemplates opening again, that may be changing. “Over time, it does seem like [the old] have adapted less,” she says.

Sadly, JVT is right. “We’re going to be living with the behaviours that we have adopted at the moment to prevent the spread of the virus for a while yet,” says Dame Til.

Indeed, like car crash victims learning to walk again, the mechanisms may be put in place to return to normality, only for us to find that our social muscle memory has vanished and needs to be rebuilt – through experiences that may feel artificial, perhaps sometimes even painful.

So it may not be a joyous tumult when and if we reach the safety of the other side. Rather, we may smile a little wanly at each other and wonder exactly what we have to say, having so little to report.

Yet that may not be so bad, finally, to reacquaint ourselves with the company of strangers – to take some time to get used to the idea of a world in which other people are no longer a source of danger. For that, horribly, is the reality of what we have all been living with this year.

The battle against the virus may, hopefully, be ending – in our bodies, at least. But the battle in our minds has only just begun.

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....................

The muzzle indefinitely to adorn the visage? To that I say bignono !

I won't die from an errant virus, firstly I'll go deaf because I can't hear what people are saying, then agoraphobia, most likely develop a respiratory disease and acne - then suffocate to death.


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Post by Doug D on 04.12.20 15:56

So much for bio-secure bubbles! 

More tests in two days in the hope that it will have miraculously gone away!

South Africa v England: First ODI postponed after positive coronavirus test


Last updated on 1 hour ago1 hour ago.From the section Cricket


England's first one-day international against South Africa in Cape Town on Friday was postponed after one of the hosts' players tested positive for coronavirus.


Cricket South Africa (CSA) said a player tested positive on Thursday following the Twenty20 series.
The first ODI of the three-match series, due to begin at 11:00 GMT at Newlands, was postponed at about 10:00.


The rearranged games will now take place on Sunday, Monday and Wednesday.


CSA said it agreed with the England and Wales Cricket Board to postpone the series opener by two days "in the interests of the safety and well-being of both teams, match officials and all involved".
England director of men's cricket Ashley Giles said: "Our number one priority is the health and safety of the England team and management group, and the correct decision was made."
Chief medical officer Dr Shuaib Manjra said South Africa will re-test all players and hotel staff on Saturday.


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Post by Verdi on 04.12.20 15:57

Thought for the day.

Why do people wear a muzzle when driving alone? Yesterday I saw a bloke driving an international transport container, about 4 metres above ground level - why was he wearing a muzzle? Has thevirus now discovered the art of flying?

Better watch those air corridors.

Humbug!


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Post by JimbobJones on 04.12.20 16:08

Hmmm, just WHAT is it they intend to inject everyone with? REAL vaccines have to be developed from inert particles of the target in question. In this case SARS-cov2. NO-ONE has even managed to identify, let alone isolate it. The existing research is ALL based on a computed algorithm for a make believe virus. Much like the Oxford Analytica's make believe global warming data.

The development of REAL vaccines takes between ten and fifteen years. The fastest on record took FIVE YEARS to develop. For Ebola.

So, whatever it is, it is NOT a vaccine.

The historic failure to develop any kind of vaccine for the common cold (coronavirus) seems to have been quietly forgotten about. If they could have come up with a vaccine for the common cold (coronavirus) they would have made countless billions . So dont think they didn't try.
So, what is it they intend to inject into everyone?
Just asking for a friend.
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Post by Doug D on 04.12.20 17:14

Well, well, well. Not getting enough positive results, so it must be the Lateral Flow Tests that are wrong!


I know Dr Mike Yeadon's article is complicated, but I think this is exactly what he was saying in his long paper that I posted yesterday at [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], the LFT tests are actually capturing about the right number of cases if you take away the 'false-positives' from the PCR results.

 [size=32]Covid: City stops care home tests over accuracy fears[/size]


By Rachel Schraer Health reporter Published 1 hour ago


Greater Manchester councils have become the latest to pause rapid testing for care home visitors over concerns they fail to detect enough infections. 
Data suggests the rapid kits miss about a third of the most infectious cases picked up by conventional lab tests.
Lateral flow tests are being used in England so residents can see family indoors for the first time since March.
The government has described rapid testing as way of reducing, rather than eliminating, risk.
The rapid lateral flow tests work by taking a nose and throat swab, shaking it in fluid until any viral particles come off, and then dropping the fluid onto a plastic stick - a bit like a pregnancy test.
They take about half an hour to show a result - one line on the paper strip means the test has worked and two lines means virus is present.
Their speed, and the fact they don't need to be taken to a lab, mean these tests - in theory - can be used to make on-the-spot decisions such as deciding if someone can go into premises like a care home or event venue. 
Manchester's decision follows similar assessments by Sheffield and Liverpool.
 
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.........................................

snipped from Mike Yeadon at [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]:
 
‘At the end of October, the British Army was called in to help Liverpool City Council find the cases which the ONS PCR testing survey predicted should be there but which were no longer being found in the numbers expected. It was possible that people were no longer coming forward to be tested, though there is no way to be sure of this. Despite not having sought consent from the parents of school children and the absence before the survey began of proper protocols and ethics review, scores of thousands of people were tested using a lateral-flow test (LFT). (See here and here for more details on the LFT.) These look rather like the familiar pregnancy test kits you can purchase over the counter. They look similar, because they use related tried and trusted technology to detect virus proteins in the swab, not RNA. All tests have limits and weaknesses. However, the LFTs are not subject to the same flaws as PCR – specifically the risk of over-amplification and of cross-contamination before the test is actually run. LFT has similar sensitivity and specificity in the lab to PCR. It is certainly capable of identifying the same proportion of those truly infected as PCR.
In brief, the army found very few people with positive LFT results, only slightly higher than the background operational false positive rate: just over 0.3%,
 values expected when the tests are used in the real world. Since testing began, the positive rate has tended to a mean of 0.7% which might mean a few people were positive. My own experience of reading around this area is that this (around 0.7%) is almost certainly the true false positive rate when, in the real-world, careful but inexpert people administer the LFT. It meant that, in the city in the centre of the national hotspot for COVID-19, almost no one had the virus. This experiment has been repeated for 8,000 people in Merthyr Tydfil resulting in 0.77% testing positive. That these two test series have returned such similar values suggests that this is indeed the true, operational false positive rate for the LFT, though another test series will be helpful in refining that possible interpretation. Some leapt to criticise the LFT, as if it was its fault that it couldn’t find the expected cases. Of course, to many of us, the results were exactly what we’d expected, because we were by then sure that PCR was wildly over-reading. PCR has gone wrong before and Occam’s razor indicated that this was by far the most likely explanation for the otherwise inexplicable failure of PCR “cases” to correlate with symptomatic disease. These are the kind of results expected in populations protected by herd immunity. They’re completely inconsistent with a city and town in the grip of a highly-infectious respiratory virus…….

 
……….Until we end the use of PCR mass testing, there is no chance that “cases” will reduce to very low levels. Lateral flow tests must become the gold standard test for COVID with PCR only used for confirmatory diagnosis. This will minimise the number of PCR tests that need to be performed allowing testing to return to competent NHS laboratories. Without such an intervention, even if the virus stopped circulating, I believe we’ll still hear of tens of thousands of “cases” every day, and several hundred deaths.
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Post by Doug D on 04.12.20 17:26

That’s a comfort!
 
‘Professor Karol Sikora says distribution of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine in the UK "is chaos", and that "only half the number of vaccine vials have arrived."
The former head of the WHO cancer programme told Mike Graham on talkRADIO "the actual administration is relatively trivial as a procedure" but added "you do have to have health professional standing by" in care homes in case of adverse reactions.’
 
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Post by BlueBag on 04.12.20 19:58

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:That’s a comfort!
 
‘Professor Karol Sikora says distribution of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine in the UK "is chaos", and that "only half the number of vaccine vials have arrived."
The former head of the WHO cancer programme told Mike Graham on talkRADIO "the actual administration is relatively trivial as a procedure" but added "you do have to have health professional standing by" in care homes in case of adverse reactions.’
 
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Death is an official adverse reaction.

But... but... MHRA says they are safe.
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Post by Doug D on 05.12.20 9:49

 Miracles will never cease.


 If you test positive, just take another test two days later and all is well with the world! 


 ‘The entire Proteas team…..’ so this includes the person with the previous positive result.


 I notice there is no suggestion in the media of it having been a ‘false positive’, as they’re not allowed to suggest such things.


 All such crap!


‘South Africa have not revealed which player tested positive and they do not know how he contracted the virus.
Both teams have been living in separate areas of the same bio-secure hotel and are not able to mix with the public.
"This test surprised us because we have confidence in the integrity of bio-secure environment," team doctor Dr Shuaib Manjra told Cricket South Africa.
He said officials had been unable to identify the "source" and were were "speaking to the player, looking at security cameras and other information".
"I can categorically state no player is able to leave the hotel environment... unless leaving in an official vehicle with an official driver," Dr Manjra said.
"There is command centre here led by the colonel from the police force," he said. "They strictly enforce the bio-bubble and wouldn't allow anyone to leave."


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South Africa v England: ODI series to start on Sunday after negative coronavirus tests
Last updated less than a minute ago


England's one-day international series against South Africa will begin on Sunday after the hosts' players tested negative for coronavirus.


The first game of the three-match series had been set to take place on Friday but was called off after a positive test in the Proteas squad.


The players were tested again on Friday evening after the match was cancelled and returned negative results.


The series opener will take place in Paarl from 08:00 GMT on Sunday.
 
The last two games are in Cape Town on Monday and Wednesday.


"The entire Proteas team has returned negative results from the Covid-19 tests that were conducted yesterday evening in Cape Town," a Cricket South Africa statement read………


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Post by BlueBag on 05.12.20 11:40

It's so bleedin obvious that the test is nonsense.

We don't have any true journalists in the mainstream media.

We don't have any opposition in Parliament.

They should all be screaming at the Government about this.
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Post by Jill Havern on 05.12.20 11:49

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:It's so bleedin obvious that the test is nonsense.

We don't have any true journalists in the mainstream media.

We don't have any opposition in Parliament.

They should all be screaming at the Government about this.
Why would they do that when the plan is coming together very nicely for them all?

You know, I was never interested in politics until Brexit. I wish I'd kept my head in the sand - Brexit, covid, US election...it all sickens me.

lalala  <<<<<<<<<<< every single member of my family.

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Post by Verdi on 05.12.20 11:57

Obama, Bush and Clinton pledge to film themselves getting Covid vaccine

Published

1 day ago

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A shite between two stools

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Post by Jill Havern on 05.12.20 12:01

If they all get done for treason it might be a lethal injection.

That oughta wipe the smiles orf their faces.

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Post by Verdi on 05.12.20 12:04

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote: lalala <<<<<<<<<<< every single member of my family.

Merry surgical mask Christmask!


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The Coronavirus Debate - Page 21 Empty Re: The Coronavirus Debate

Post by Verdi on 05.12.20 12:11

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:If they all get done for treason it might be a lethal injection.

That oughta wipe the smiles orf their faces.

I was going to say it's a club but thinking on, it's more like a cult.

Here's another ancillary object to add to the portfolio..

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A jolly jape

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The Coronavirus Debate - Page 21 Empty Re: The Coronavirus Debate

Post by Verdi on 05.12.20 15:19

I continue to follow reports concerning a particular region.

For many weeks the number of new infections has been reported to be 3,400 in any one 24 hour period, give or take a score or two, showing a similar reflection on the number of reported recoveries. Deaths also remain static, again give or take a few.

How can this be - how can the number of infections infections/recoveries/deaths be so constant for so many weeks? It doesn't make any sense, at least not to me.

This is not new, a similar pattern has been seen since March this year, only the number range has increased, in leaps, over the months.

dontgetit

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The Coronavirus Debate - Page 21 Empty Re: The Coronavirus Debate

Post by pauloalexandre on 05.12.20 19:57

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
By "sterilizing", he meant freeing people's bodies from the targeted virus.

Ya think? YOU dont know what he meant, only he does. You can assume all you like, it changes nothing . . .  Wouldn't he have said "immunising" if he meant freeing bodies from a targeted virus?
It's silly to think that he said they were going to make a great part of the UK population infertile... on national television.

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The Coronavirus Debate - Page 21 Empty Re: The Coronavirus Debate

Post by JimbobJones on 05.12.20 20:31

I'm sure you realise psychopaths sometimes get lost in the unfathomable evil of their actions, and do not understand how abhorent what they are saying and doing is perceived by normal humans. Then there are those who deliberately let slip what they know . . .
I think we are a bit too far down a very dark road to start suggesting things might be too "silly". You dont believe in the old "they wouldnt do that" excuse, do you?

 . . . was this show broadcast live by any chance?

I ask once again: Wouldn't he have said "immunising" if he meant freeing bodies from a targeted virus?
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