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Post by Dannz on 01.03.19 19:16

As I suggested in my previous post in this thread, since this case is clearly a difficult problem involving deception and cover up, methods and techniques used in intelligence analysis should be considered if one is looking to unravel this. One of the most important techniques used in intelligence analysis is ‘analysis of competing hypotheses’. This is discussed in Chapter 8 of ‘The Psychology of Intelligence Analysis’ by Richard Heuer. This also highlights one of the key pitfalls that i have been trying to draw attention to.
When working on difficult intelligence issues, analysts are, in effect, choosing among several alternative hypotheses. Which of several possible explanations is the correct one? Which of several possible outcomes is the most likely one? ...
 
The principal concern is that if analysts focus mainly on trying to confirm one hypothesis they think is probably true, they can easily be led astray by the fact that there is so much evidence to support their point of view. They fail to recognize that most of this evidence is also consistent with other explanations or conclusions, and that these other alternatives have not been refuted.
 
Simultaneous evaluation of multiple, competing hypotheses is very difficult to do. To retain three to five or even seven hypotheses in working memory and note how each item of information fits into each hypothesis is beyond the mental capabilities of most people. It takes far greater mental agility than listing evidence supporting a single hypothesis that was pre-judged as the most likely answer. It can be accomplished, though, with the help of the simple procedures discussed here.
Source: Chapter 8, p95:  https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/books-and-monographs/psychology-of-intelligence-analysis/PsychofIntelNew.pdf

Good effective intelligence analysis is produces from competition between alternative hypotheses.  I am interested in getting to the bottom of this.  I would expect some of the most robust and informed criticism of any 3 May theory to be given in this forum – which only helps.  My critique of the arguments made by the MMRG is not about throwing a spanner in the works at CMoMM.  We may favour different hypotheses, but that is a good thing if there can be fair honest and civil debate and competition between these. Although it may be taking different ‘sides’, it is all working to the same end and helping each other towards that.  Instead of being disruptive, it significantly improves effectiveness, much in the way that having the challenges presented by a ‘red team’ taking an adversarial role can improve effectiveness. That is how to scrutinize to the nth degree - just as PeterMac said was needed.
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_team
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Post by Jill Havern on 01.03.19 19:38

Well, carry on Dannz, but we've been here for 9 years and literally looked at everything already. We've reached our conclusions and sent our findings to the Portuguese Attorney-General. You're about 9 years too late for us I'm afraid. There's no reason at all why you can't submit your own findings.
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Post by sharonl on 01.03.19 20:33

The disappearance on May 3rd theory is far from a stone unturned, it has not only been well researched, it has been investigated by the Portuguese and the UK police on a large scale, this has proved fruitless.  Going over this time and time again leads us nowhere. 

The Portuguese AG has accepted the earlier death evidence from MMRG.  If its good enough for the investigation, its good enough for me.

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Post by Dannz on 01.03.19 20:38

@sharonl wrote:The Portuguese AG has accepted the earlier death evidence from MMRG.  If its good enough for the investigation, its good enough for me.

Has the Portuguese AG really revised the view and decided that Madeleine died earlier in the week on the evidence given by MMRG? Can you point me to the relevant letter or other communication confirming this?
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Post by Jill Havern on 01.03.19 20:48

"Justice works in silence" in Portugal Dannz. Be patient.

You've got your own section of the forum to do your own research, so as I said, please carry on.

I don't know if you've looked at the whole forum to see all the various sections where research threads have been filed away over the years. The forum is massive. Please take a look around.
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Post by Guest on 01.03.19 21:58

@sharonl wrote:The disappearance on May 3rd theory is far from a stone unturned, it has not only been well researched, it has been investigated by the Portuguese and the UK police on a large scale, this has proved fruitless.  Going over this time and time again leads us nowhere. 

The Portuguese AG has accepted the earlier death evidence from MMRG.  If its good enough for the investigation, its good enough for me.
Can you clarify the last paragraph please, the Portuguese AG have notified that they have received the 'evidence' not accepted, there's s world of a difference.
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Post by Verdi on 01.03.19 22:32

@Dannz #73

Do you know - the more I read of you the more I'm in awe of your perspecacity, no let's not under play this, let me say genius.

What a travesty that you only arrived on the scene a week ago. Just think, had you taken an interest in this case eleven years ago, not only would you have changed the course of this forum but you could have been instrumental in solving the case, had your intellectual analysis been taken on board.

Clearly your talent is wasted here on CMoMM but I strongly advise you to pass on your genius to the Portuguese authorities, or failing that the UK force responsible for assisting the official investiation - the Metropolitan Police. Particularly the neglect homicide aspect - I think they need all the help they can get.

Feel free to continue using CMoMM as a sounding board, a place to think out loud and expand on your genius if that's what it takes. Keep us informed of developments and/or progress, you could at last be the one to make that big difference where all else have failed. I can hardly contain my excitement at the prospect.

As you said, at least I think it was you, CMoMM are in no position to make that difference - as a professional in the field of law, it could be you that makes that difference.

Do the right thing - you know it makes sense thumbsup !.

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Post by Dannz on 01.03.19 22:42

It doesn't take a genius to fact check arguments. It just takes a bit of diligence.

But of course that wasn't what you were getting at in this satirical attack.
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Post by Verdi on 01.03.19 23:11

Believe me - I'm in earnest. Would I lie to you?

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Post by Verdi on 08.03.19 16:13

PeterMac's e-book

Chapter 18: Say SO, or Say NO

Was Madeleine “Abducted” ?

The PAID . . . . say "SO"

Not paid . . . . . say "NO"


In PAID we include those paid directly in money, but also those who received benefit from saying SO.
We include those who would never think of compromising a family member.
We include those who received other benefits, but more indirectly - from book sales, or TV appearances, newspaper sales, radio interviews . . .

So who are they ?

Gerry and Kate - obviously
Close family members
Clarence Mitchell
Paid shills on various web-site and social media outlets
Web site manager
Alan Pike. The crisis councillor who pretended to be a psychologist
PR firms, notably Bell Pottinger ( £ 0.5m), and Hannover (£ not known)
Summers and Swan,
Danny Collins and other authors who have wilfully avoided presenting or considering the evidence
Antonella Lazzeri
The SUN - generally
Olive Press - in the form of Jon Clarke - of Angolan basketball player fame
Other newspapers - possibly
Metodo 3 - Francisco Marco, Antonio Gimenez Raso, Julian Peribañez, Antonio Tamarit
ALPHAIG - Edgar and Cowley
Oakley - Kevin/Richard Halligen, Henri Exton,
Gary Hagland
Oprah Winfrey
MISSING PEOPLE - who have undoubtedly raised their profile, even though it has had the effect of causing people to investigate their internal waste of money.
Melissa (e-fits to fit) Little
Jim Gamble
and then
LAWYERS !

This is more tricky, since some species of lawyer have a duty to speak for their client, whether they believe them or not. That decision is not theirs to make.
English barristers are obliged to accept a brief if the fee is paid, and to argue it to the best of their professional ability. Often they deliberately do not speak to the parties concerned. Their client is the instructing solicitor.

Solicitors are slightly different. They have a role in advising the client on the best course of action - which may be to stop !
It is not clear for example whether Carter-Ruck ever investigated the McCanns’ account of events, and the performance of Mrs Martorell in the High Court tends to suggest they deliberately did NOT ask any pertinent or searching questions, perhaps in case they got answers which would have deprived them of a fee.

Carter-Ruck, in the persons of Adam Tudor and Mrs Martorell
Edward Smethurst
The 20 or so other lawyers paid - in money - by the McCanns
Isabel Duarte, who brought the ultimately failed case in the Portuguese courts

and several others.


So, from the above list of those who say SO, how many genuinely believe the story ?
It may be that some do, but of course it is not actually necessary for ANY of them to believe it. Money and family ties could provide the incentive to repeat the word “Abduction” as often as possible.

We may note that over the past few years their word of choice has become “Disappearance”. Even Mitchell now uses this form.


In NOT Paid, we include all those who although they are clearly in receipt of their salaries, are not paid directly or indirectly to do anything other than their professional duty, and to be impartial.

The Portuguese GNP
The PJ
The fingerprint expert
DCI Gonçalo Amaral,
DCI Paulo Rebelo
CI Tavares de Almeida - investigation co-ordinator - wrote final report
The public prosecutors - Magalhaes e Menezes, Gomes
The judges in the Court of Appeal - De Almeida, Manso, Branquinho,
Martin Grime (dog handler)
The British police officers sent to Portugal
The British Police advisor Mark Harrison
The British Police advisor Keith Farquharson
NPIA Criminal profiler Lee Rainbow
The British consular and Embassy staff

and so on, not forgetting many amateur researchers, and hundreds of people who have followed the evidence and the debate on the internet.

All those who had a duty to investigate and consider the evidence in any depth are of the same view. It is not believed that a single instance exists of someone with professional skills or training and taking a dispassionate and detached look at the scene, or the evidence, or the files released by the PJ, coming to the conclusion, even on balance, or even allowing a remote possibility, that there was an Abduction.

To this must now be added the name Peter Hyatt, a statement analyst, who works with, and trains law enforcement agencies in the US. He was recently invited to look at the film and the transcript of an interview with the McCanns done in Australia some years ago. It seems he had little, if any, knowledge of the research into the various issues he addressed.

His conclusion was that within the interview there is a series of ‘Embedded confessions’, as well as many outright lies. For example he identified the story about the open window and the whooshing curtains as a lie, even though he had no knowledge that this had already been so identified by consideration of the weather reports, and the lack of any such details in any other statement. He had no knowledge of the photos of the curtains trapped behind the bed and the chair, nor of the fact that Kate had previously stated that the curtains were wide open.

He went on to show how the McCanns provide all the details, about a fall, death, cuddling the dead body, and the concealment and disposal THEMSELVES. They volunteer the information, whilst believing they are denying it.

So again we have an independent person - an accredited expert - who for good reasons, which he spells out so that everyone can understand them, comes to the same conclusion as others who have come from a different angle.

Refs to the YouTube films are given below


THIRD Category

There is then a third category - lest I be accused of false dichotomy.

These include the British police officers, in Leicester and the Metropolitan forces, who seem to have failed to investigate, or to properly and impartially consider the evidence, and in some cases have presented themselves as openly supportive of the McCanns.

They include

Det Supt Stuart (call me Stu) Prior, Leicestershire Police
Det Ch Supt Hamish ( remit - as if the ABDUCTION had been in Britain) Campbell
DCI (Madeleine alive is not in accordance with all of our thinking, we have found crecheman) Redwood
DCI Nicola (haven’t yet done very much except cut the team from 38 to 4) Wall
Det Ch Supt Mike (still believe Madeleine could be found alive) Duthie

and sundry others who have had years to revise their views in light of the evidence they have collected, and that which has been sent to them, but still appear to be doing nothing substantive

The Met officers who were given a strangely restricted remit - to investigate an Abduction - seem powerless to act. One has to consider whether going outside the remit, and actually investigating, or considering the logic behind the absence of evidence, has been and is still being officially prohibited.

If so, this could amount to something else entirely.

Whether any of the members of this category actually believe there was an abduction, is an entirely different matter which cannot at present be ascertained.

* * * * *


So how has this story been perpetuated for so long ?



On Proof and Truth

[This is copied from the previous chapter, but is included here, so that the reader does not have to refer back]

We talk of Proof. Simply stating something does NOT make it so. Even if it is stated several times, the position does not alter. Charles Dodgson (Lewis Carroll) used the device humorously in the epic nonsense poem The Hunting of the Snark,


"Just the place for a Snark!" the Bellman cried,

As he landed his crew with care;

Supporting each man on the top of the tide

By a finger entwined in his hair.



"Just the place for a Snark! I have said it twice:

That alone should encourage the crew.

Just the place for a Snark! I have said it thrice:

What I tell you three times is true."

This is instantly recognisable as ridiculous nonsense, and yet it was exactly the technique used by the propaganda minister of the Third Reich.

". . in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily,"

often misquoted or paraphrased as:

"The bigger the lie, the more it will be believed."

(It is actually from Mein Kampf (1925), A.H. vol 1, ch 6 “If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it, and you will even come to believe it yourself.”)


Variants include

If you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes the truth.
If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.
If you repeat a lie many times, people are bound to start believing it.


* * * *

So the long term strategy of having the word “Abduction”, associated with the name Madeleine McCann, and endlessly repeated in newspapers, TV, radio, and books, for the past ten years, has probably led to a significant part of the population subliminally thinking it has been established as some sort of fact.
If so, the strategy of paying vast amounts to Bell Pottinger, Hannover and Clarence Mitchell was well worth the expense.

The use of frankly mendacious, not to say “ludicrous” stories to fill out this farrago has reinforced this.


The story of Madeleine whizzing down the water slide is a perfect example. In the next sentence she is said to be wearing a pink top and a blue skirt, and a sun hat. The obvious contradiction does not register in the script writer’s mind. She is then said to have played football for an HOUR. Still in the skirt and sun hat. Kate was said to be sunbathing whilst this was going on.

All this might be dismissed as journalistic hyperbole, but the FACT that there is no water slide, and that on the day in question it was dull, cloudy, cold and windy, and the FACT that Kate makes no mention of any such incident in her autobiography, giving a totally different account of events on the day in question - is also inconvenient factual detail which would otherwise spoil the story.

The damage to the truth has been done. Readers may not remember the article, nor where they read it, but the totally false impression is left.

I leave it for you, the reader, to make up your own mind

The McCanns benefit

Truth and justice suffer

Madeleine Beth McCann has no memorial.



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Post by julia_plumley on 20.03.19 15:05

Leave No Stone Unturned - Page 4 Screen11
Leave No Stone Unturned - Page 4 Screen10Hi I'm new to this forum, However I was very interested  when Salsalito was suggested as being the setting of the "make up photo" and i have noticed that trip advisor  has some visitors photos of salsalito which bear a striking resemblance to the background in the "make up photo". 
Understandably the decor may be somewhat different from 2007 but there are still a number of ornaments/ decorations at varying heights on the walls which may or may not be a coincidence.
I just thought I'd mention it.
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Post by Verdi on 20.03.19 20:45

welcome  to the forum julia_plumley.

How so?

Leave No Stone Unturned - Page 4 Madeleine-mccann-899150907

I know it's been suggested in the past but I really can't see any reason to suppose it to be even a possibility.  Before considering anything else, when would the opportunity have arisen?

Personally I don't go along with the hard line criticism leveled at the Portuguese police, I believe they conducted a professional investigation (as far as was possible) as can be expected from any European country.  I feel sure they would have uncovered some evidence or intelligence if indeed Madeleine was transported to Salsalito.

Is the photograph even real?  It doesn't look very convincing to me - which could of course raise the question as to why it was put in the public domain in the first place, only to attract harsh criticism - deservedly I hasten to add.

I feel it's looking for a clue that just doesn't exist.

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Post by Truthseeker96 on 20.03.19 23:11

Dannz #73

After reading through your post regarding her possible accidental death on the 3rd, I would like to say I belive it to be sound.

Although... I would never be one to say it was accidental. Kate immediately suggested "they've taken her".

It was pedo pedo pedo from the start, and the fact that Gerry has been reported to state and laugh about bath time with kiddies I would be very reluctant to say her death was accidental.

So it's just a suggestion but I wouldn't use the word accidental death, just death
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Post by Verdi on 21.03.19 0:00


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Post by Verdi on 21.03.19 0:10

@Truthseeker96 wrote:Dannz #73

After reading through your post regarding her possible accidental death on the 3rd, I would like to say I belive it to be sound.

Although... I would never be one to say it was accidental. Kate immediately suggested "they've taken her".

It was pedo pedo pedo from the start, and the fact that Gerry has been reported to state and laugh about bath time with kiddies I would be very reluctant to say her death was accidental.

So it's just a suggestion but I wouldn't use the word accidental death, just death

You are of course at liberty to sound out the ponderings of someone who only took an interest in the case a week or so ago, however it might be more constructive if you ponder the research of people who have dedicated years of time freely to uncover the truth of Madeleine McCann's disappearance.

Perhaps you might like to view this for starters..

https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t12619-daily-stats-on-youtube-for-richard-d-hall-s-film-when-madeleine-died#334559

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Post by Dannz on 21.03.19 0:31

@Truthseeker96 - the detection of cadaverine and blood behind the sofa suggest this was where she died. The sofa was also hastily pushed back with curtains rucked up as if done in a hurry.  

I find it much easier to imagine an accident as Madeleine tried to climb to the window than anything done to her behind the sofa. Accidental death was also indicated in Statement Analysis by Hyatt.
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Post by Truthseeker96 on 21.03.19 0:33

Verdi 

I have read through all the evidence, and watched Richards film. I have been following this closely for a long time.

I am not suggesting anyone is right or wrong just that both these theorys are entirely possible.
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Post by Truthseeker96 on 21.03.19 0:50

@Dannz

Thanks for the reply.

I understand it is easier to assume that the sofa was moved there in a hurry, after an accident occurred. 

Unfortunately there's no way to know what went on in that room, if sofas where moved for photos to be taken or other things that went on at that particular spot in the room. 

All we really know from the dogs as I understand it, is that, that must be the spot where her dead body had to have been left for a certain amount of time but that's all we know for sure.

For all we know she may have died somewhere else and had been put there after the fact to try and make it look like an accident, and then they moved her again? Maybe in Gerrys missing tennis bag.
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Post by coati mundi on 21.03.19 1:10

I've said it before and will say it again; that photo is an astonishingly inappropriate, almost creepy thing to have been released to the public, considering that the parents claim (at least sometimes) their daughter was abducted by a paedophile. Of course, we know that other times they almost suggest that she was taken by a kindly abductor, who may have looked after her all these years.

Even if you accept the story that she was messing about with her mother's make-up (which I seem to remember was put forward at one time by Kate McCann) why on Earth would you put it in the public domain? 

Strange and weird indeed!

It hardly matters, in my opinion, where it was taken.  That the McCanns should make it public is shocking in the extreme.

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Post by Verdi on 21.03.19 1:12

@Truthseeker96 wrote:Verdi 

I have read through all the evidence, and watched Richards film. I have been following this closely for a long time.

I am not suggesting anyone is right or wrong just that both these theorys are entirely possible.

If you entertain the popular story line that Madeleine 'disappeared' on the night of 3rd May 2007, you really need to take into consideration the evidence contained in the PJ files, that you are familiar with.

Consider if you will .... no family photographs apart from the controversial playground shots, the dubious tennis court image and that at the poolside;  breakfasting and lunching alone in apartment 5a;    one parent daily leaving the apartment through the front door and the other leaving through the patio door with the children -the most hazardous route considering the stone steps from the first to ground floor;  the short-cut taken between apartment 5a and the recreation facilities.

That's just for starters.

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Post by Verdi on 21.03.19 11:37


It cannot be stated beyond reasonable doubt that the McCann family of five was seen out and about together, by an independent witness, after Sunday 29th April 2007.

There is no doubt that Madeleine arrived at the Ocean Club with the rest of the group on Saturday 28th April, the playground photographs bear witness to her presence at some point - the evidence strongly indicates these photographs being taken during the weekend of their arrival at the resort. The curious 'tennis ball' image shows a seemingly composite Madeleine standing alone; the poolside photograph shows Madeleine with her father and little sister, not another soul to be seen or any sign of other holidaymakers being in the vicinity.

Having lived in such an environment, I can attest to the type of behaviour to be expected of new arrivals at a holiday resort. On arrival they are excited but travel weary, probably the most stressful time of any family's year. Later in the day (depending on time of arrival) and/or next day they find their feet, take time to check-out the resort; see what's on offer; stroll around the grounds; try the local bars and restaurants - plenty of time later for poolside fun, the beach and sports activities. In short, a holiday complex poolside area is invariably deserted on change-over days - as can be seen from the poolside photograph!

Go with the evidence.

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Post by Liz Eagles on 21.03.19 12:02

@Verdi wrote:
@Truthseeker96 wrote:Verdi 

I have read through all the evidence, and watched Richards film. I have been following this closely for a long time.

I am not suggesting anyone is right or wrong just that both these theorys are entirely possible.

If you entertain the popular story line that Madeleine 'disappeared' on the night of 3rd May 2007, you really need to take into consideration the evidence contained in the PJ files, that you are familiar with.

Consider if you will .... no family photographs apart from the controversial playground shots, the dubious tennis court image and that at the poolside;  breakfasting and lunching alone in apartment 5a;    one parent daily leaving the apartment through the front door and the other leaving through the patio door with the children -the most hazardous route considering the stone steps from the first to ground floor;  the short-cut taken between apartment 5a and the recreation facilities.

That's just for starters.

Wasn't there also speak of the parents learning short cuts to drop off their kids?

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Post by Verdi on 21.03.19 14:33

aquila wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@Truthseeker96 wrote:Verdi 

I have read through all the evidence, and watched Richards film. I have been following this closely for a long time.

I am not suggesting anyone is right or wrong just that both these theorys are entirely possible.

If you entertain the popular story line that Madeleine 'disappeared' on the night of 3rd May 2007, you really need to take into consideration the evidence contained in the PJ files, that you are familiar with.

Consider if you will .... no family photographs apart from the controversial playground shots, the dubious tennis court image and that at the poolside;  breakfasting and lunching alone in apartment 5a;    one parent daily leaving the apartment through the front door and the other leaving through the patio door with the children -the most hazardous route considering the stone steps from the first to ground floor;  the short-cut taken between apartment 5a and the recreation facilities.

That's just for starters.

Wasn't there also speak of the parents learning short cuts to drop off their kids?


Yes, that's what I was really getting at. I said the recreation facilities to include the to'ing fro'ign going on the during the day.

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Leave No Stone Unturned - Page 4 Empty Re: Leave No Stone Unturned

Post by Hobs on 22.03.19 3:25

@PeterMac wrote:Again we see how very frightened they are by the Pool Photo discussion. 

https://www.wikihow.com/Prune-Bougainvillea

1

Prune in early spring. Bougainvillea can technically be pruned at any time of the year, but the best time to do so for the integrity of the plant is in very early spring, before the plant has begun to produce buds for new flowers. 

    PeterMac
    Again we see how very frightened they are by the Pool Photo discussion.

    https://www.wikihow.com/Prune-Bougainvillea

    1

    Prune in early spring. Bougainvillea can technically be pruned at any time of the year, but the best time to do so for the integrity of the plant is in very early spring, before the plant has begun to produce buds for new flowers.



Hi Peter, et al

Please remember that when the mccann supporters bite on a specific post, comment or item of interest and name call and attempt to pour scorn and confusion in order to deflect interest from said item, it means it is highly sensitive to them and the mccanns, probably because it is incriminating and points to it not being an abduction but that the mccanns and possibly one or more of the group (payne i am looking at you) were responsible for the death, disposal and subsequent cover up of the death of Maddie.
Whether this death was premeditated as per kate telling us it was MURDER and not as a result of some other crime.

Murder because Maddie had ongoing health issues and her death was planned altruistically to prevent further suffering.

Kate and or gerry decided that Maddie was the cause of all their problems, family rows which could cause the divorce of kate and gerry as it seemed that thus vacation was a make or break trip, financial especially since we know the mccanns had serious financial problems requiring them to take at least 2 mortgage payments that were declared from the fund set up supposedly to find Maddie.
Given both their  highly skilled jobs and knowing that gerry at least would have been on paid leave for 6 months at full pay, the question arises as to how come they were in dire financial states requiring help from their families.

If they got rid of Maddie then all their problems would disappear and all would be right in their world, the perfect family.
This would explain why, after a few days, kate positively blossomed and glowed as if a huge weight had been lifted off her shoulders.
Maddie was the huge weight on her shoulder probably due to Maddie being demanding, overactive maybe.
This would also be evidence of kate fixating on sleep. getting them to bed early and having them allegedly asleep before they allegedly left for dinner or, more likely before they were taken to whatever apartment all the children were sleeping in whilst babysat by the missing adult from the table each night, sedate thew children then off to whichever apartment. ( i would be interested to see if any of Maddie;s DNA found itself into one of the tapas 7 apartments when it should not have been there. again i am thinking payne'a apartment given he liked bathing other peoples children and he had the space.

Unfortunately Maddie, who was a weight on kate's shoulders whilst alive, could have been fostered out to another family member or even social services to ease the pressure on kate who, it was clearly shown, not coping at all well with three toddlers and had family members flying down to help when they had enough time of the local nursery staff helping kate with dinner, bathing, bedtime and babysitting, along with it being claimed they had a nanny before the vacation (maybe the nursery worker?).
The impression being that kate was not to be left alone with the children for any length of time as she could harm one or more of them.
This perhaps being PND (post natal depression) or kate herself having mental health issues (perhaps saw herself in Maddie and didn't want Maddie to suffer?)
This would/could be her defense, diminished responsibility

The expectation being that with no Maddie, there would be no more fights, extra money in their pockets, especially with the fund growing to what it did (the grinning leaving the church and laughter from gerry whilst waiting for the ransom call, and smirking and barely concealed laughter in TV interviews)  the perfect family as Maddie was described, on being born, as almost perfect then kate speaking in her book regarding Maddie's perfect

Murder as a result of some other crime such as paedophilia  as demonstrated by gerry and payne according to the Drs Gaspar statements at the dining table, continuing whatever act despite knowing death would.could ensue.
Manslaughter as in  some other crime was being committed and Maddie died as a result of that such as sexual or physical abuse, overdose.

However it happened kate blossomed and looked incredibly good even down to coordinating outfits and jewelry, looking at her, no one would believe she had just had her daughter allegedly abducted by a paedophile.

Then there was a bump on her road of happiness.

Perhaps they thought that  the investigation would die down ending up as occasional passing news, them no longer being considered suspects in the abduction (death) of their daughter, Maddie and the world looking for a non existent man.
Gerry however loved the attention and kept them going on the front page for a year, there were probably rows over this as kate would have been all for letting the case die down with perhaps mentions on anniversaries.

They loved the money pouring  into the fund, no more financial worries.
There was also the release of the PJ files which was entirely unexpected and we could then see the discrepancies, the damning 48+ questions kate refused to answer and her admitting by doing so it would hinder the investigation and so.

We the public could now see for ourselves their lies and deceptive behavior.

They both thought they would be believed and could coast along on public sympathy.

It didn't work out that way.

Maddie who was perhaps the millstone around kate's neck which had lifted briefly in the first few days and weeks perhaps even months leaving kate glowing reappeared big time once the PJ files were released and we could see for ourselves the truth of the lies.
The cracks began to show.
I know it was kate being the driving force behind suing Dr Amaral.
It was she wanting him bankrupted and even dead, he knew the truth and had to be silenced at all costs.
She wanted him a broken man, his marriage dead, his book banned and well over a million euros in compensation, so much did she hate him, she tried to include Maddie in the suit, herself and gerry as a given, the twins and Maddie who at this point was a ward of court, allegedly at the request of the mccanns trying to find out what evidence the police had on them.
Luckily the courts saw sense and kicked the claim from Maddie.
However, since they included the twins in their lawsuit, they lost all the way up to the supreme court the twins are liable for their share of the costs, although i would assume their share of the costs would fall on the mccanns.

As time progressed, kate lost that glow, that blossoming.
It wasn't down to concern and fear about Maddie, that would have been visible in the first hours days and weeks.
Kate would and should have looked like shit, not sleeping, not eating, not coordinating clothing and jewelry, instead we got her looking haggard and old only in relation to losing their many court cases and by default a bucket load of cash.
They have now decided to go to the ECHR, believing they would win and Amaral would have to cough up a chit load of money and losing everything. All this because of his book revealing the truth and wanting it banned.
I would have paid to watch kate's face when she was told they couldn't sue Dr. Amaral, they could only sue the Portuguese state.
Whatever happens they would still be liable to pay everyone legal costs since ECHR cannot and will not overrule previous judgements.

To date there has still not been anything  concerning their case as in it having been accepted let alone going onto the legal conveyor belt to a verdict.
The vast majority of cases fail at the first hurdle having not been written correctly, or even having a valid case in the first place etc. and simply end up in the bin.
It takes years for a case to work its way through the court to justice.
It is not fear, despair or agony of losing her daughter that is etched on kate's face aging her prematurely, it is hatred and fury of one man, Dr Amaral, that is showing on her face.
She wants him dead because she fears him and what he knows.
When his book is translated into English and on sale in the UK i worry about her mental status, so far it is in Portuguese  in book form and available as an English translation online.
So far she has it all under control i fear she will lose it if it comes to the UK in English and in hardback.
Once his book comes out, then the questions will start online, people will want to see for themselves the files, the knowledge of a now ex lead detective.
Their supporters will have their work cut out trying to explain things away, why they didn't search, their refusal to do the reconstruction, the refusal to answer the more than 48 questions, the lack of evidence to show there ever an abductor, the contradictions in times and locations, the cadaver and blood dogs which had never been wrong, the lack of DNA evidence to show Maddie was ever there, the blood and body fluids in the apartment and hire car, cadaverine on a child's red t shirt, kate's trousers, cuddlecat behind the sofa and in the parents bedroom.

I can't wait spin

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Leave No Stone Unturned - Page 4 Empty Re: Leave No Stone Unturned

Post by JimbobJones on 22.03.19 7:41

Great post Hobs.
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