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The Show Must Go On

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Basil with a brush on 07.06.18 1:11

I'm not much of a contributor I know, but I do check here regularly for any updates/news.


I like to think I have a fair knowledge regarding this mystery (at least compared to those closest to me) but nowhere near the Mods/longer serving members. Therefore, I'll only post to pose a question that's niggling me or agree/disagree with another member.


Most of the knowledge I've acquired is a direct result of finding this place.


Sometimes wish (as Verdi pointed out) that I had more time to be involved.


Would just like to say though, regarding the recent arrival of a somewhat 'mad professor', that I thought his presence here was all handled in a most helpful, informative and patient manner, while at the same time, seemingly coming under fire from what appeared to be some very unfortunate comments from him.


I have a lot of respect for this place and it's people. You have my continued support and praise in your search for the truth. Albeit just from the sidelines.


Hope the show does indeed go on until the truth is eventually out.


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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Verdi on 07.06.18 1:28

Great stuff Basil, thank you thumbsup !

Readers are just as important to CMoMMs continued success, as active posters.  As you know this is an investigative, research, information centre - just as long as the message is out there, mission accomplished!

Having said that, if ever you have a flash of inspiration and see something worthy of scrutiny or renewed scrutiny - stick it here!

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Jill Havern on 07.06.18 8:26

@Copodenieve wrote:
@Jill Havern wrote:
@Copodenieve wrote:I’ve learnt so much from this forum over the years I’ve been reading it, but it’s true that not much is happening a lately, except for the Horan saga, which I think you all handled brilliantly. Another one bites the dust!
This may sound like a stupid idea, but I’ll throw it on the table anyway; maybe people would be more inclined to participate in the forum if they were invited to help out a little. I’m sort of imagining a virtual class room where some of you more experienced researchers could propose certain assignments on different areas of the case and then discuss the completed research. It wouldn’t need to be public, it could be a private virtual room so that there is no risk of libel, and then if anything interesting transpires, those findings could be posted on the forum to be discussed openly.
Teach us :)

Hi Copodenieve, I like your idea of a private 'virtual classroom' and this can easily be arranged should you or any of our other members be interested in helping.

CMOMM already has several private research sections where we investigate various topics 'behind the scenes', without fear of being 'Carter-Rucked' again roll , before posting items of potential interest on the open forum.
Yes, I'm on the team Jill.  I helped out with couple things with the guidance of CMOMM member and I'm still checking regularly to try and obtain more information.  smilie . I'm interested in being in the virtual classroom as a pupil. I promise to be a good girl  Mrs
The Virtual Classroom is now open for business. You have been added so you should be able to see it.

There's nothing in there yet though blushing1 cos the paint is still drying. spray

HiDeHo should be along shortly to dish out your first assignment.

In the meantime I'll create a new usergroup (which will show up at the bottom of the forum and people can request to join to help and offer ideas).
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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Jill Havern on 11.06.18 16:18

Any offers from members to help Lizzy would be gratefully received in her Virtual Classroom.

Let Lizzy, Verdi or me know by private message please. thumbsup
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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by HiDeHo on 11.06.18 16:33

@Jill Havern wrote:
@Copodenieve wrote:
@Jill Havern wrote:
@Copodenieve wrote:I’ve learnt so much from this forum over the years I’ve been reading it, but it’s true that not much is happening a lately, except for the Horan saga, which I think you all handled brilliantly. Another one bites the dust!
This may sound like a stupid idea, but I’ll throw it on the table anyway; maybe people would be more inclined to participate in the forum if they were invited to help out a little. I’m sort of imagining a virtual class room where some of you more experienced researchers could propose certain assignments on different areas of the case and then discuss the completed research. It wouldn’t need to be public, it could be a private virtual room so that there is no risk of libel, and then if anything interesting transpires, those findings could be posted on the forum to be discussed openly.
Teach us :)

Hi Copodenieve, I like your idea of a private 'virtual classroom' and this can easily be arranged should you or any of our other members be interested in helping.

CMOMM already has several private research sections where we investigate various topics 'behind the scenes', without fear of being 'Carter-Rucked' again roll , before posting items of potential interest on the open forum.
Yes, I'm on the team Jill.  I helped out with couple things with the guidance of CMOMM member and I'm still checking regularly to try and obtain more information.  smilie . I'm interested in being in the virtual classroom as a pupil. I promise to be a good girl  Mrs
The Virtual Classroom is now open for business. You have been added so you should be able to see it.

There's nothing in there yet though blushing1 cos the paint is still drying. spray

HiDeHo should be along shortly to dish out your first assignment.

In the meantime I'll create a new usergroup (which will show up at the bottom of the forum and people can request to join to help and offer ideas).


Lol @ 'paint is still drying'  That made me chuckle as my work involves spending many hours waiting for paint to dry :)

You have caught me at a (temporarily) bad time, with some commitments (that I haven't even been able to do for the last week)  but I will try to keep an eye and answer all questions...

I'm usually around after midnight UK time (I'm in Toronto)

I feel sure that, like myself, once you start to see the days activities separated into hourly timeframes and see differences in what each of them claim, you will be fascinated by what they claim and  why they expect us to believe what they say :)
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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Verdi on 11.06.18 17:00

@HiDeHo wrote:You have caught me at a (temporarily) bad time, with some commitments (that I haven't even been able to do for the last week) but I will try to keep an eye and answer all questions...

I think the general idea is for CMoMM members to volunteer to assist with your research project - the project you've been working on for many years but haven't had time to complete.

You need to explain exactly what assistance you require before members can decide if they are right for the job, or willing to volunteer their time.

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by sar on 11.06.18 17:22

Have a plus one from me.  Thanks to all.

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by HiDeHo on 11.06.18 18:10

I have given an overview of how I searched for the discrepancies between statements... and subsequently what can be achieved. It's on the 'Virtual' thread and I have  explained what would be helpful.

I'm looking for anyone that could go through 'tables' and highlight any differences between statements during each hour as, although I recognised some of them as I was doing the tables...the vast majority of the statements have not yet been compared to other statements during each hour.

If it seems confusing, I'll try to explain a little more...
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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Jill Havern on 11.06.18 20:17

As you're online Nick, could you please go over to the Paulo Reis thread and help him out with a query about Bell Pottinger? I'm sure it was you who found the info that Resonant was in PdL the week before Madeleine went missing.

https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t15230-help-with-the-statistis-from-uk-about-child-abuse
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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Verdi on 12.06.18 0:58

@HiDeHo wrote:I have given an overview of how I searched for the discrepancies between statements... and subsequently what can be achieved. It's on the 'Virtual' thread and I have  explained what would be helpful.

I'm looking for anyone that could go through 'tables' and highlight any differences between statements during each hour as, although I recognised some of them as I was doing the tables...the vast majority of the statements have not yet been compared to other statements during each hour.

If it seems confusing, I'll try to explain a little more...

Apologies, I couldn't understand your post on the Virtual Classroom thread but now I get the gist of your project.

If I might say, it would be a good idea to break it down into workable units, otherwise it's a bit daunting for the potential volunteer. If that's possible confused .

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by HiDeHo on 12.06.18 15:05

@Verdi wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:I have given an overview of how I searched for the discrepancies between statements... and subsequently what can be achieved. It's on the 'Virtual' thread and I have  explained what would be helpful.

I'm looking for anyone that could go through 'tables' and highlight any differences between statements during each hour as, although I recognised some of them as I was doing the tables...the vast majority of the statements have not yet been compared to other statements during each hour.

If it seems confusing, I'll try to explain a little more...

Apologies, I couldn't understand your post on the Virtual Classroom thread but now I get the gist of your project.

If I might say, it would be a good idea to break it down into workable units, otherwise it's a bit daunting for the potential volunteer.  If that's possible confused .

I thank you VERY MUCH for your comments because this is huge for me....

I have always said, and recognised, that we all come to this case with different abilities, knowledge, time etc and everyone uses their knowledge and experience in different ways.  Everyone's 'voice' is important and needs to be heard....and I believe it is, hence CMoMM and FB groups have been so successful in discussions and scrutinising the case.

When I first heard about the case I told someone I would not give an opinion until I had knowledge.... the rest is history. :)

I  launched into trying to understand what went on that week as soon as the files were released...

I started with the files we had available as they were gradually made available to us.  I wanted to know the waiters that were on duty that night and I collated all Millenium and Tapas  staff rota...all their statements and what THEY said.

I then took all the statements of the T9 and others (Nannies, Jez Wilkins, Stephen Carpenter etc) and started to compile them into timelines.

I went through EVERY statement and took ANY activity they claimed from their statements and placed it into timetables at the approximate hour that they claimed to have been doing something.

I basically took EVERYTHING they claimed they did and gave it a timetable of their own.

One can read statements and they seem quite credible... BUT I wanted to know if everyone claimed the same thing for a particular activity and the only way to do that was to COMPARE the activities against each other.

To do that I had to create timetables involving several people for each hour of each day.

Lo and behold, I was able to see OBVIOUS differences in their claims....not ones attributed to memory but SPECIFIC and likely contrived claims that told me something was not right...

Over the years I started to collate each major discrepancy and by 2010 came up with about 50 (that I had recognised while doing the tables) discrepancies.

Once put into the timeline of that week it became apparent that these discrepancies started BY Tuesday morning...

Thats when I realised SOMETHING had likely happened BEFORE Tuesday morning that they were all trying to hide...

Although many of us realised that something happened to Maddie earlier, there is nothing in the files to indicate WHICH day... but using the logic that if it was  a normal holiday and nothing happening to Maddie until Thursday evening it would not create ANY discrepancies except memory issues... 

In other words if they were all telling the truth about the week, there should be nothing of importance in their statements except the truth of the holiday, and basically everyone agreeing.

I could not account for anything that would create a reason to try to cover up what they did during the week, EXCEPT ONE THING...

Something happened to Maddie before Tuesday morning.

THE FILES (their own statements) therefore 'tell' me she was no longer around after Tuesday morning (the mini tennis is so riddled with discrepancies (maybe lies) that it is impossible to believe she was there)

All of this is possible to understand ONLY from scrutinising the timetables and the timetables. 

This is where CMoMM comes in regarding the 'Virtual' thread, and the offer to help.

I was still compiling the timetables at the time I started the videos (2011) and therefore did not get back to scrutinise and compare statements of the tables I had already put together, so the offer to help would mean that MANY discrepancies that I overlooked through lack of time, could be recognised.

It could be said (in some cases) that there were LIES and they were trying to cover up Maddie not being around the Ocean Club during that week.

-------

To get back to your comment Verdi....

This explains why I have difficulty in explaining many of my findings and why it takes so many years before they are accepted as being possible/credible.

Because I have had the time and opportunity (and motivation) to scrutinise that 'week' I have it all clear in my mind and s like a 'movie of the week' in my head and entering another scenario (eg 'one child in and one child out') fits in perfectly but you have made me realise that for all these years, when I see things so clear, and although I have always tried to explain everything in detail... it is apparent that others have not been as fortunate as me and therefore only see 'snippets' within a scenario and dont see the big picture.

Something that is as clear as day to me, is not understood by others and maybe I have not recognised that others have not perceived each scenario in the same way as myself. Hence my struggle to be understood, and hence others (justified) struggle to understand me.

I have experienced this myself when someone shows me info that they have full understanding of but I can't understand it because I dont have the full context of their knowledge.

You have brought (thankfully) to my attention that what I thought was explained as simply as I could, was actually only 'simple' in my eyes and by explaining the full scenario of what is needed has become confusing...I apologise for that.

Maybe its because it is so involved I needed to give the full explanation to avoid members spending their precious time on looking for info that is irrelevant.

I may have 'rambled' above but I feel it is necessary to understand how the timetables were created, to help in understanding what the project entails.

Only NOW do I realise why I have had so much difficulty explaining the discrepancies and the importance of the timetables....

I need FEEDBACK so Verdi, I am counting on you lol :)


The Virtual Classroom is now open for business!
https://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t15222-the-virtual-classroom-is-now-open-for-business#387137

'REGARDLESS... for this exercise it is about spotting the differences and contradictions in their statements and adding them here so we can decide if it could be important.'


Using this as an example of what may be found.... Gerry, Kate and Fiona ALL have different explanations...  It is an example of what needs to be checked on the tables...

Differences between their statements.




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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by Verdi on 12.06.18 15:55

high5 grouphug

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Re: The Show Must Go On

Post by HiDeHo on 12.06.18 16:56

Ohhh... did that explain? lol
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