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MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Phoebe on 07.05.18 18:39

It seems that unlike Gerry's stellar career path (well according to Tracey K he's an "eminent" cardiologist) poor Julian Totman has remained a lowly N.H.S. G.P. having recently joined the team at the Harcourt Medical Centre in Salisbury. Still, if a chap is the type to wander aimlessly around in "horrible" clothing (not the attire Jane expected to see being sported by a Mark Warner customer, according to her) then he may have been destined for mediocrity! This is especially true given that said chap seems mightily confused between the simple act of "coming from" and "going to" where night creche is concerned. If Jane Tanner looked a fool during the McCanns' reconstruction when Gerry made a liar of her, then poor Totman appears to be an even bigger incompetent! Dear dear!! tut tut.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by plebgate on 07.05.18 20:20

Yes you gotta wonder why this GP didn't contact the Tapas group and tell them that he could have been Tannerman (as phoebe pointed out up thread).
 
Oh hang on could it be because the pjs Tanner described weren't what one would describe as a match to the ones Dr Totman's daughter was wearing (photos shown in various newspapers) and the description of the abductor didn't match him either.  Why would he recognise himself as an egghead.   big grin   Oh and he also was walking in the wrong direction.    

Err as verdi asked up thread - are we all supposed to be really thick with poor memories.   Is it any wonder the newspapers are struggling with nonsense like this being printed?

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by sharonl on 07.05.18 21:13

@Verdi wrote:Oh joy!  Thank the lord for the rising Sun every day of our lives, where would we be without this enrichment?


Tannerman or Totman or Crechman or McCannman - take yer pick.  It's ripe for the plucking.

big grin   You forgot Mitchell and Edgars' Victoria Beckham lookalike. 

Is it really that difficult to distinguish between, the faceless man, Tannerman. Murat,  Victoria Beckham and Julian Totman?

And what happened to the guy who, according to Andy Redwood, turned up after 6 years with both his own and his daughters clothing, that they were wearing that night?


And, If Totman was known to the McCanns, or had even just spoken to them, they would have been well aware that he was the man who Jane Tanner saw.  Why on earth then, did they get those e-fits drawn up and why did Gordom Brown pressurise the Portuguese Police into publishing them?

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by worriedmum on 07.05.18 21:26

@sharonl wrote:
@Verdi wrote:Oh joy!  Thank the lord for the rising Sun every day of our lives, where would we be without this enrichment?


Tannerman or Totman or Crechman or McCannman - take yer pick.  It's ripe for the plucking.

big grin   You forgot Mitchell and Edgars' Victoria Beckham lookalike. 

Is it really that difficult to distinguish between, the faceless man, Tannerman. Murat,  Victoria Beckham and Julian Totman?

And what happened to the guy who, according to Andy Redwood, turned up after 6 years with both his own and his daughters clothing, that they were wearing that night?
...shouldn't there be a tractor there somewhere?
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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 07.05.18 21:27

OK I take the point, only one reference was really necessary thumbsup

So Gerry McCann was acquainted with Julian Totman as he'd played tennis with him a few times - my mistake, I said I could be wrong and I was.  I'm rubbish at christian names only, I need the surname (preferably with the forename) to be able to associate with any one individual.  Julian could be anybody to me, particularly as this Totman wasn't a key player or even a witness.

Doesn't however make the tabloid report any more credible - less so I would say.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by sharonl on 07.05.18 21:34

@worriedmum wrote:
@sharonl wrote:
@Verdi wrote:Oh joy!  Thank the lord for the rising Sun every day of our lives, where would we be without this enrichment?


Tannerman or Totman or Crechman or McCannman - take yer pick.  It's ripe for the plucking.

big grin   You forgot Mitchell and Edgars' Victoria Beckham lookalike. 

Is it really that difficult to distinguish between, the faceless man, Tannerman. Murat,  Victoria Beckham and Julian Totman?

And what happened to the guy who, according to Andy Redwood, turned up after 6 years with both his own and his daughters clothing, that they were wearing that night?
...shouldn't there be a tractor there somewhere?

Yes, and a white van, and another vehicle going down the street the wrong way or speeding or something.

Don't forget all the other suspects that were lurking around the area between 9 and 10 on the evening on May 3rd.  Paedophiles, gypsies, disgruntled maids, cleaners, care takers, people lurking under the stairway, teenagers out for a cigarette.    It must have been buzzing.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 07.05.18 21:41

Right - it's official, whitevanman it is !

I'll wager there is not one single legitimate sighting over the years, even if not orchestrated by team McCann, you bet the witnesses were out for money, like the reward on offer by Murdoch's News of the World.

It's all a diversion, just like this latest Totman - he's halfway there before you start. Totmanman ?

As an aside, I wonder if Sonia Poulton ever tried to interview Andy Redwood.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Jill Havern on 07.05.18 23:10

So now he has been eliminated by Grange a long time ago, and we now know exactly who he is . . .


 . .   why is he still on the Find Madeleine website ? ? ? ?


Answers on a 100 Euro note, please
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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 07.05.18 23:59



Two children - one two year old girl and one three year old boy. Did the Totman couple only dump one child at the night crèche on the night of 3rd May?


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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by suzyjohnson on 08.05.18 1:25

From Jane Tanners statement of 10 May 2007


'....... Her husband ROB, MO and DP left the beach a little earlier they having gone to the tennis courts, it was the night of the men's tennis. When she, together with the friends and children, returned from the beach, at 18h20, they went to the tennis courts having seen that all the men, including GM, were on the court. They stayed to talk to them them for about 20/30 minutes .........' 


So Jane Tanner spent 20 - 30 mins at the side of the court watching Julian Totman play tennis on 3 rd May, and when she saw him again, 2 hours later, she didn't recognise him?

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 08.05.18 1:28

@suzyjohnson wrote:From Jane Tanners statement of 10 May 2007


'....... Her husband ROB, MO and DP left the beach a little earlier they having gone to the tennis courts, it was the night of the men's tennis. When she, together with the friends and children, returned from the beach, at 18h20, they went to the tennis courts having seen that all the men, including GM, were on the court. They stayed to talk to them them for about 20/30 minutes .........' 


So Jane Tanner spent 20 - 30 mins at the side of the court watching Julian Totman play tennis on 3 rd May, and when she saw him again, 2 hours later, she didn't recognise him?

Well spotted - very well spotted 2thumbs

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Basil with a brush on 08.05.18 1:50

@Verdi wrote:Bogus leads - the story so far, give or take..

Twelve, thirteen and fourteen are actually quite funny. Twelve looks like he's trying to emit something foreign from his lips. Thirteen appears to be mouthing a good ol Chas and Dave 'Gertcha' and fourteen....well, if it was drawn up in the stone ages, it would probably be fine. It's ridiculous. If I was the sketch artist and the witness screamed ''Yes, that's him. You've nailed it!'' I'd be straight on the phone to my boss saying ''We're going to need back up Guv, you'll not believe what's walking the streets.''

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 08.05.18 2:05

I think they're all funny - in fact censored hilarious.

Jill Havern posted this some while ago - see image no. 7..

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/gallery/the-worst-e-fits-ever-3049586

If the intelligent #makesuthink tabloid includes eggman, it must be serious smilie !

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Verdi on 08.05.18 2:08

@willowthewisp wrote:Hi Verdi,you see,they weren't telling porkies after all,as DCI Andy Redwood is now cleared of any wrong doing with Tannerman,Totman,Smithman moments,perverting the course of justice,we just reinvent them that the Police cocked it up after all,simples!

Max Bygraves due to next appear,"I wanna tell you a story"?



Not like that - like this ....


.... and it's goodnight from me snooze

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Phoebe on 08.05.18 2:22

Jane nearly tripped up in her rogatory interview before hastily improvising. Even she was forced to acknowledge that  "Juian Totman"  wouldn't have been walking in the direction she claimed if he had been bringing his child back from creche.

And also you said that, you know, your immediate assumption or not probably even thought about it that much at the time, but you thought he might have been carrying a child home from the crèche?”
Reply    “Yeah, well I think you did see people, I mean, not that late at night, and, again, that should have made me think more, but especially sort of, you know, earlier on you’d see them carrying children in pyjamas to the, the crèche where you can leave them at night and then pick them up again”.
 
4078    “Would that fit in with the direction he had come from?”
Reply    “Well, again, no.  Well, it would have been, I mean, at that time, you would of more expected him to be going the other way, coming back from the crèche maybe.  But he could have gone, if he’d have gone that way and then cut down, there is a way you could have cut down to the crèche, going that way, so.."


i wonder how Dr. Totman will get out of this bind. He can hardly now claim he was dropping his child TO creche when she "saw" him at 9.10-15pm. As Verdi has pointed out where was 3 year old William Totman while daddy was marching about with his little sister in her bare feet and pyjamas so late on such a cold night that Jane needed to borrow her hubby's fleece and the wind was whooshing the McCanns' curtains.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Crackfox on 08.05.18 8:29

Just to add to the already rapidly thickening plot but KM identifies Julian T in her May 6 statement as the man GM was playing tennis with after his lesson and before rest of group arrived.


The lesson ended an hour afterwards, close to 4:30PM. Gerry continued playing tennis with a guest called Jxxxxn who belonged to his tennis group, while she went for a jog along the beach, for around half an hour. She saw the others of the group, children and grownups

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by suzyjohnson on 08.05.18 8:32

If Dr Totman was Tannerman, then the creche records should show exactly what time his children were collected from the night creche, which should correlate with Jane Tanner's sighting at 9.15 pm.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by skyrocket on 08.05.18 8:37

I posted yesterday in a rush - never advisable!

I stated that I had looked at this a while ago and discounted Dr Julian Totman because of his size/appearance - which is correct. At the time I went through all MW fathers with young daughters.

But I failed to notice yesterday that I had also discounted Totman as Tannerman because in 2013 Andy Redwood had specifically stated the father was carrying his 2 year old daughter. Taking the announcement on face value we have to assume Redwood was stating the age correctly - he was a senior detective.

On this basis, I had narrowed the field down to only 2 possibilities: Mr M Handy or Mr A Heselton. Both of whom had a 2 year old daughter (and no other children). I struggled to find any images of these 2 online. 

Totman's daughter was 3 years old at the time so why state the child being carried was two? Was either Heselton or Handy lined up to come forward and then backed out?

The Sun article states that Totman gave a statement in Portugal to the GNR (soldiers) - this would never have happened but may be simple confusion over the police set up in Portugal. His statement, if any, would have been to the PJ. Are we to believe that the PJ had Totman's statement and still agreed to entertain Jane Tanner's sighting as the 'abductor' or that they simply overlooked what he had told them? 

I still come back to the question: Why would a professional family man (Totman) agree to get involved?

I hate to say this, but IMO, this latest revelation with Totman does give more weight to the argument that Smithman is not all that he seems. Two apparently upright citizens (Smith/Totman); 2 sitings of men carrying young girls, in similar pyjamas, with bare feet, around about the right time and place to be implicated in an abduction of a young girl in almost the same pyjamas - what are the chances? And, I mean that, what are the chances?

Just as an aside, Stephen Carpenter tells us that the Mcs met Julian Totman on the Sunday morning when they all attended the tennis 'coffee morning' (possibly the party witnessed by Carol Tranmer from her Aunty Pamela Fenn's balcony, and a get together strangely absent from the T9 accounts apart from a passing mention by Matt Oldfield).
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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by suzyjohnson on 08.05.18 9:01

Out of interest, did Dr Totman do any searching? He was in the next block along from the Tapas group. Was he out after 10 pm, in his Tannerman outfit searching the streets, where half the town would've seen him?

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Crackfox on 08.05.18 9:12

I thought Julian T was the father of W*****m who was in Madeleine's creche group. I thought their daughter was younger - two? Still question remains why wasn't he cleatly identifiable to JT who would have surely known him and more troublingly how did she confuse him for Murat?

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by skyrocket on 08.05.18 9:32

@Crackfox - yes, thanks, you're completely right, Totman's daughter was 2 years old. Bank holiday madness on my part - pity the delete function has been removed. Totman's daughter is shown as 2 years on the Guest Sheets in the files but her age has been copied over as 3 years next to the sheets. 

So back to Totman being about 6'1" as the main reason I discounted him! 

The rest of my post stands.
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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Crackfox on 08.05.18 10:07

Do you know if the daughter attended the creche, skyrocket? Yep at 6'1" he's pretty unmissable! I don't think he was the only tennis bubby to help thicken the plot - there was another one who spotted a spotty fella loitering I seem to remember? The sort of bloke a ten year old would conjure up if they wanted a nasty man in their story.

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by skyrocket on 08.05.18 10:27

@Crackfox - Hi. Yes, if you look at the creche records (for what they are worth IMO) Miss Totman seems to have been to various am/pm sessions in Sarah Williamson's group of the Toddler 2's (all 3 x Toddler 2 groups, of 4 children each, occupied the tented creche behind the Tapas Bar).
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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by Phoebe on 08.05.18 11:55

Team McCann are going to have a hell of a problem now in trying to claim that Totman and Smithman must be the same person. If Totman was seen close to his apartment carrying his two year old daughter at 9.15 p.m. then there is no logical explanation for why he would be where Smithman was seen with a child 45-50 mins later. If he was collecting his child then he would have had her in her bed within minutes of being seen (despite going the wrong way, from his apartment rather than to it) if he was dropping his child to the creche then that is in the complete opposite direction from the Smith sighting 45 mins later and his child would presumably, have been in the night creche at 9.50 pm. In any case, Totman's child was 2 yrs old and both Martin and Aoife Smith are sure the child they saw was around 4 yrs old. No, Tannerman-Totman cannot be Smithman. So, I look forward to Op. Grange re interviewing the Smiths, especially since Martin Smith has reiterated his belief that it was Gerry McCann that he saw. That should be interesting!

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Re: MADDIE BOGUS LEAD

Post by NickE on 08.05.18 12:06

@Jill Havern wrote:The plot thickens.  Dr. Totman-man was a friend / acquaintance / tennis partner
Would he not have contacted Team M in the years between ?  Through professional channels.  To help ?


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-10MAY.htm






P.J. POLICE FILES: GERRY MCCANN'S STATEMENT 10 MAY 2007
www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk
official inquiry files and documents gerry mccann's statement 10 may 2007

------ That they bathed the children, the deponent having left at 18H00 for a tennis game only for men, at which were: DAN, tennis instructor; JULIAN, with whom he had played tennis several times; and CURTIS, with whom he had also played.

It certainly does.
We have Gerry McCann who worked with the Gov connected COMARE back in the time and we have Weinberger who worked inside Porton Down for the Gov backed company Enigma and later "Diasolve" and involved clinical trials for subjects under 18 years.
It's claimed that Totman also worked inside Porton Down.
These Dr's,(and all the other doctors+a muliti millionaire) the same week, in a low season Pdl, a coincidence?
Very unlikley.

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