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* GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by bobbin on 11.06.17 13:49

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@jeanmonroe wrote:The DUP and their 'thoughts'

Evolution and creationism

DUP politician Edwin Poots has expressed his views that the planet is a “young earth” created just 4,000 years ago.

“You’re telling me that cosmic balls of dust gathered and there was an explosion. We’ve had lots of explosions in Northern Ireland and I’ve never seen anything come out of that that was good,” he told the Radio Times.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

REPLY:  Actually, he said 'created about 4,000 BC' i.e. 6,000 years ago, and a huge amount of scientific data support that date, both for the creation of the earth and for the rest of the universe.

Poots is totally right about explosions: they produce chaos not order. What we see in the universe is an ordered universe, which  obeys certain scientific laws. And if we look with an unprejudiced eye at the created world, we will surely see overwhelming evidence of design everywhere. Which came first? - the flower that produces pollen, or the bees that use the pollen to make honey? Both must have been created at the same time. Which came first: the butterfly, the larvae. the caterpillar or the chrysalis? - or did a master Creator design this truly awesome process? And which came first - the chicken, or the egg? -  a question that no evolutionist can ever answer.
 

We should surely allow children to see the scientific facts relating to origins and let them make up their own minds on the evidence.

But, no. In 2013, the National Curriculum was changed so that children from 8 years old should be taught, quote:


“Pupils should be taught to…recognise that living things have changed over time and that fossils provide information about living things that inhabited the earth millions of years ago”.


Why should children not also hear the views of those scientists who say that the scientific evidence does not support evolution andf supports creation? 

That's all that Eswin Poots wants to achieve. Surely on this forum we are all against indoctrination - and want our children to be told about alternative views, and the evidence for each theory?

Otherwise we are in danger of moving towards totalitarianism.     


   

     

http://www.newsjs.com/nz/moroccan-fossils-shake-up-understanding-of-human-origins/dZOj1Fi5MMyuMGMrQDnCxeH_vSj-M/

The science shows that evolution has played a very big part in today's 'human condition'.
If you google 'how the continents have changed over the millions of years' there are many animated presentations showing the change of landmass. For too long, evolutionary theory has been dismissed.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Verdi on 11.06.17 14:01

@polyenne wrote:Once again the democratic UK have had their chance, voted and we have a result. What will be will be, let's just get on with it and leave the toys in the pram
That's the problem with the country - too much complacency.  Just take everything that's thrown at you without complaint.

Hundreds and thousands fought (and too many died) through two world wars to make Britain great and look what we're left with - chaos by the hand of the democratically elected governments.  Through the democratic process, a referendum was held to decide whether the UK should remain in the EU, the democratic majority wanted out but how is that progressing?  The public didn't vote for an undemocratic 'out' with provisos and stipulations and negotiations - they voted 'out' full stop!

As an aside, when voting for the conservative party, did the electorate also knowingly vote for the DUP?  I think the answer to that is a resounding NO!  Let's not complain though - let's just go along with it, as always.

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CORBYN: I CAN STILL BECOME PRIME MINISTER

Post by Tony Bennett on 11.06.17 14:29

From the BBC News report this afternoon: "CORBYN: I CAN STILL BECOME PRIME MINISTER"  

QUOTE >>

Mr Corbyn said his party was "quite ready and able to put forward a serious programme of government", which he said "obviously has massive support in this country."

He also said he believed that the Great Repeal Bill - the Conservative plan to copy across all EU laws into UK law - would now become "history" - and that there would be "something different" in a few weeks' time.

UNQUOTE

Comment by TB:  The Great Repeal Bill will remove the power of the European Union to make laws affecting the United Kingdom. In other words, it would allow us to make our own laws again, which is exactly what we voted for in the Brexit referendum.

For Corbyn to welcome the fact that this Bill may not now be passed into law shows his true colours; he would rather wreck Brexit in order to try to wreck the elected government of the country.

The powers-that-be will strain every nerve to prevent Brexit. Those who voted Brexit and believe in Brexit will have to work extremely hard in the coming weeks and months.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Verdi on 11.06.17 21:36

@Tony Bennett wrote:The powers-that-be will strain every nerve to prevent Brexit. Those who voted Brexit and believe in Brexit will have to work extremely hard in the coming weeks and months.
I don't believe anyone involved in the decision making process, i.e. the politicians, are keen to proceed with Brexit, unless the final withdrawal draft includes bi-lateral agreement as to specifics.  So, whilst the UK electorate voted in the referendum to leave the EU unconditionally, the electorate have no say in how negotiations proceed or what provisos implementation is eventually agreed upon.

I completely understand your point of view as regards reliance on the elected government representatives to act in the best interest of the people but that's where it all goes belly up - they don't do they!

In my view Brexit is not, or at least shouldn't be, negotiable.  I would like to see a totally independent Britain - no strings no ifs no buts no maybes.  Of course I realise such a simple expectation is but a dream.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by jeanmonroe on 12.06.17 12:44

After yesterdays 'reshuffle' there are NOW 21 'remainers' and only 7 'brexiteers' in her new 'cabinet'!



jta: 'Queen's speech'...........DELAYED?

First time in 'history' apparently.

My last 'words' on this 'election'.

'irony' alert!

Theresa May will not be 'my' PM..............'Never! Never! NEVER!'

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 12.06.17 15:02

Democracy in action.

Government currently making deals with a tiny minority party over issues that were not put forward to the electorate.


After yesterdays 'reshuffle' there are NOW 21 'remainers' and only 7 'brexiteers' in her new 'cabinet'!


6.


Boris Johnson is a remainer. He was the self appointed controlled opposition during the Brexit campaign.


How did this happen?


There are more ways than one to usurp the will of the people.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Verdi on 12.06.17 21:33

May tells MPs: I got us into this mess and I will get us out




Theresa May has apologised to Tory MPs for the party's election performance, telling them "I got us into this mess I'll get us out of it."

Addressing a meeting of backbenchers, the PM reportedly said she would serve as "long as you want me to do".

One senior backbencher told the BBC that she had appeared "contrite and genuine but not on her knees".

It comes amid confusion over whether the Queen's Speech will be delayed as talks continue to form a government.

A senior minister has said he was "optimistic" that the Conservatives and Democratic Unionists will reach an agreement in the coming days to allow a proposed Tory minority government get its plans for the year ahead through the Commons, possibly as early as next Monday.

But First Secretary of State Damian Green said he could not confirm the Queen's Speech will proceed as planned on 19 June.

Labour said the government was "in chaos" and continued to be "in denial" about the message voters had sent about their opposition to an "extreme Brexit".

Read on..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40251999

Promises are like piecrusts - Skipton renowned pork pies of course!

waiting

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by polyenne on 12.06.17 22:14

She'll get some kudos if she totally fessed up to a complete shitsack, tears up the manifesto and, listening to the people, writes a new one, forgets the DUP (she doesn't actually need them, she has a majority) and cracks on with delivering a Brexit that the majority vote called for.

All the BS being spouted is beginning to remind me of the post-referendum period. Most of it is shameless, needless and pointless.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Verdi on 13.06.17 0:53

Has British democracy let its people down?

Mark Easton Home editor

  • 12 June 2017
  • From the section UK


Parliamentary democracy is one of the British values that English schools are now required, by statute, to promote during lessons - not debate, not discuss - promote.

If some teachers interpret their new role as propagandists for this kingdom's existing system of governance, that would be a shame, because right now our democracy is not serving this country particularly well.

Far from providing the stability and legitimacy it promises, our peculiar democratic system has served to expose and deepen social divides.

It has contrived to leave our country perilously vulnerable at a critical moment in its history.
Rather than seeking to close down critical challenge of our form of democracy, we need a serious and urgent conversation about how we can improve matters.

No-one voted for a country led by a wounded prime minister, without a clear negotiating position on Brexit with days to go before the talks on our country's fate begin, having to do humiliating backroom deals to get even the most routine domestic legislation through Parliament.

The rest of the world looks on bewildered at Britain's capacity to turn a huge political challenge into a potential catastrophe.

Yes, turnout was the highest since 1997, and there are signs that young people may have participated in larger numbers than in previous elections.

These must be encouraging signs for the democratic process.

But almost a third of the electorate still didn't bother to exercise their democratic right.

And for nine out of 10 of those that did last week, the victorious party in their constituency didn't change.

In many seats, that has been the case for decades.

Read on..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40245805

Has British democracy let its people down?  I say yea not nay!

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by jeanmonroe on 13.06.17 2:34

I know, I KNOW! I wasn't going to say 'anything' more but.................

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/fears-northern-ireland-peace-new-10611994

Fears are mounting for the Northern Ireland peace process as fresh revelations emerged about the DUP following their deal with the Tories.

The warning came as the Mirror reveals the close links between members of the hardline unionist party and paramilitary organisations.

This includes connections with a group that organised an illegal shipment of arms into Northern Ireland.

One current DUP MP Sammy Wilson chaired the first meeting of loyalist paramilitary organisation Ulster Resistance in November 1986.

But Ms Foster been accused of failing to give a robust rejection of the support of paramilitary groups for the DUP .

Last year, 2016, Ms Foster refused calls to sack convicted armed robber and alleged UDA boss Dee Stitt from his job at the head of a publicly-funded charity.

She posed for pictures with Stitt, who is the chief executive of Charter NI, which is running a £1.7million employment scheme in east Belfast as part of the Stormont Executive’s £80 million Social Investment Fund.

North Down UDA commander and convicted armed robber Dee Stitt with Arlene Foster

'Dee Stitt, you say? nahhh, never heard of him' said Arlene.


'Arlene Foster, you say?, nahhh, never heard of her' said Threese.

Supporters of the unionist party yesterday, 12th June 2017, called for the reinstatement of banned Orange marches to be included in the coalition talks.

The Portadown Loyal Orange Lodge said it wanted the Drumcree March - banned twenty years ago as part of the peace process - restored.


thinking

WHAT could possibly go WRONG, with a DUP/CON 'pact'?

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The Spectator's warning against inrolerant liberals

Post by Tony Bennett on 13.06.17 23:47

@jeanmonroe wrote:I know, I KNOW! I wasn't going to say 'anything' more but.................

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/fears-northern-ireland-peace-new-10611994

Fears are mounting for the Northern Ireland peace process as fresh revelations emerged about the DUP following their deal with the Tories.


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

FROM THIS WEEK'S SPECTATOR MAGAZINE

Memo to London-based liberals: not everyone shares your point of view.

Some people — brace yourself for this — have different opinions to yours.

Amazing, I know. But true.

So please dial down your hysteria about the DUP.

Because I know you think it makes you look super-tolerant to bash the supposed rednecks and religious fruitcakes of Northern Ireland who’ve never attended a gay wedding or made a donation to Greenpeace, but it of course does the opposite — it exposes your own intolerance.

The fury over the DUP is reaching fever pitch. Once it had been revealed that May would be working with the DUP, people were out in force to mock and sneer at these ‘religious fundamentalists’ and ‘climate-change deniers’ —the greatest thoughtcrime of our era — who are antsy about gay marriage and opposed to the legalisation of abortion in Northern Ireland. This party doesn’t even believe in dinosaurs, guffawed internet wags, after it was revealed that some DUP members hold creationist views.


Some even took to the streets of Westminster yesterday to rage against the DUP. A few hundredimpeccably right-on young people carried placards branding the DUP ‘anti-gay, anti-women, anti-green’. (It amazes, and terrifies, me that being critical of the politics of environmentalism is now casually put alongside homophobia and misogyny as an unspeakable evil. That’s pretty fundamentalist too, no?) One protester’s comment summed up the flimsiness of the fury. ‘I didn’t know who the DUP were, I had to Google them,’ he said. From Googling a party to railing against it in the space of minutes: the modern mindset summed up.


In ‘cosying up to the assorted bigots that make up the DUP’, May has created a situation that echoes The Handmaid’s Tale, said one columnist. People are sharing memes of May meeting the DUP dressed as one of the women from the Channel 4 production of The Handmaid’s Tale. Yes, really, they think that because this party isn’t pro-choice and doesn’t love gay marriage then it’s basically the Sons of Jacob from Margaret Atwood’s  dystopian tale, threatening to reduce women to slaves of men.


Everyone needs to calm down. For two reasons. First because the DUP’s views are relatively common in Ireland and, I dare say, in many parts of Britain. Look, I know this is inconvenient, and you’d prefer it if everyone in the country was a carbon copy of you and your lovely friends, but some people out there are religious. They have traditional views. They think marriage should be between a man and a woman and they think abortion is morally wrong. They aren’t evil. They aren’t fundamentalists. They just don’t agree with you.


And the second reason everyone needs to calm down is because there’s not a smidgen of a chance that the DUP’s attitudes on something like abortion — which is still outlawed in Northern Ireland — will spread through Britain courtesy of May and her desperation to hold on to power. Indeed, DUP sources have confirmed that they have ‘no interest in including controversial social issues such as gay marriage or abortion in any deal’. 


Why has there been a meltdown over the DUP if its social views pose no threat whatsoever to mainland British laws? Because those people always looking for an outlet for their outsized sense of moral superiority cannot resist the temptation to pontificate against Others. Against ‘deplorables’, in Hillary’s words. Against the backward. Against — let’s not sugar-coat it — the inferior. They need this. It’s the means through which they assert their moral perfection. There’s an ironically religious bent to it all: my views are next to godliness and those people — those climate-change-denying, gay-marriage-questioning heretics — must not be allowed to breath the same political air as me.


And all the while we have Labourites like Jeremy Corbyn mixing with Islamist groups that share all these same social views, except in an even more extreme form. Yet the people beating the streets over the DUP say nothing. What a double standard. 

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 14.06.17 8:43

I'm truly sick of this.

When you see the words "softer Brexit" (constantly repeated now, did they ask the public?) read "meaningless Brexit".

We are being stitched up before our eyes.

What a scam the election was.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 14.06.17 10:02

Diane Abbot is well again.

ah... bless.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40268505

And still Shadow Home Secretary it seems.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by polyenne on 14.06.17 10:32

Just shows how contemptible these politicians are. They take us all for mugs and plebs. Undoubtedly some are as they gullibly swallow everything they read and hear.

Others investigate, dig deeper, enlighten themselves and assess the"other" view. Many are on this forum.

I'm sick of it too...........and getting sicker !!
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by jeanmonroe on 14.06.17 14:38

'SERIOUS' question.

Does anyone, here, 'know', how many of the recently elected 318 Conservative MP's are 'Catholic'? ('devout, lapsed, or otherwise')

And has anyone, here, 'heard their views', singular or 'collectively', on the proposed DUP/CON 'pact'?

If there are, say, 15/20, wouldn't that possibly 'negate' the DUP/CON 'agreement' (for a 'majority') for a start, and couldn't 'they' (Tory 'Catholic' vote), at any time, vote against proposed Conservative/DUP future 'legislation' and 'bring down' the Government.?

Just 'asking', as always.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 14.06.17 15:30

English Catholics don't care about Northern Irish matters.

No impact whatsoever.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by interestedobserver on 14.06.17 15:44

Good news about Diane Abbott.
She says she is 137% better.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by jeanmonroe on 26.06.17 12:02

SO, there we have 'it'

'We ain't got no effing money!'

'There's NO magic money tree!'

No 'mandate' May gives the 'no magic money tree' a little 'shake' and, like 'magic', £1.5 BILLION flutters down, to the ground, FOR the DUP, to 'prop up' her, self inflicted, minority 'government'.

CONCLUSION:

There IS, indeed, 'a magic money tree'!

It's just that the Tories won't tell us......... where it IS!

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 26.06.17 14:11

Did the electorate vote on any of this during the election?

Now the Government rips up it's manifesto and does whatever it wants - just like the deal the Lib Dems.

Business as usual and not at all democratic.

Did we vote on a party with a promised agenda?
Did we vote on a local individual in a first past the post contest who is free to vote for his constituents?
Did we vote for a pseudo-president - a Prime-Minister as the Queen has no real power (yeah right...)?

I haven't got a clue.

None of it matters because we don't matter - we are just there every 5 years to make it seem legitimate.

Still... even that is better than the EU.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Verdi on 26.06.17 16:05


Tories and DUP agree UK government deal


The deal will see the DUP support Theresa May in Parliament and £1bn extra cash for Northern Ireland.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-40403434

That's not a deal - it's bribery!

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by kaz on 26.06.17 17:06

FROM THIS WEEK'S SPECTATOR MAGAZINE

Memo to London-based liberals: not everyone shares your point of view.

Some people — brace yourself for this — have different opinions to yours.

Amazing, I know. But true.


The penny drops.

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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by BlueBag on 26.06.17 17:59

@kaz wrote:FROM THIS WEEK'S SPECTATOR MAGAZINE

Memo to London-based liberals: not everyone shares your point of view.

Some people — brace yourself for this — have different opinions to yours.

Amazing, I know. But true.


The penny drops.
Excellent.

The London Lovies are a problem.

None of them live at the coal-face of mutli-culturalism - except for rich none-British people obviously who don't get their prayer-mats out 5 times a day and like a glass of wine.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by Truth4Maddie on 26.06.17 19:27

Once the deal was reached, the Prime Minister said: "I welcome this agreement which will enable us to work together in the interest of the whole United Kingdom, give us the certainty we require as we embark on our departure from the European Union, and help us build a stronger and fairer society at home.
What about England, Wales & Scotland?

"The agreement we have come to is a very, very good one, and we look forward to working with you."
FOR WHO EXACTLY?

I can't see this shabby, propped up government lasting more than 6 months.
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Re: * GENERAL ELECTION, Thursday 8 JUNE 2017 * How will you vote? - POLL added

Post by jeanmonroe on 27.06.17 12:13

Theresa May sends out, to Tory party/DUP 'membership', for 'consultation', images, of how to make Downing Street 'look' more erm, 'patriotic'.

Option 1



Option 2



Option 3



jta: 'Cash for ash' (RHI) has been now been usurped by.....'Cash for Sash'

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