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What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

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Which of the following do you think the evidence now suggests?

1. Madeleine was abducted between about 9.10pm and 10.00pm Thursday 3 May
 
2. As per Amaral's book, Madeleine died after 6pm on Thursday 3 May
 
3. Madeleine died BEFORE 6pm on Thursday 3 May
 
4. Madeleine died on Wednesday 2 May
 
5. Madeleine died on Tuesday 1 May
 
6. Madeleine died on Monday 30 April
 
7. Madeleine died on Sunday 29 April
 
8. Madeleine died on Saturday 28 April
 
9. Something else happened to Madeleine
 
10. I just can't say
 
 
 
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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by Verdi on 17.03.16 15:43

@Google.Gaspar.Statements wrote:Thank you for posting that video clip April28th, I hadn't seen it before.

If that's supposed to be Gerry, Madeleine and Kate then where were the twins?
You mean to say you've never watched the Crimewatch 2013 Madeleine McCann Special, produced in collaboration with Operation Grange and featuring their very own concoction of a holiday re-enactment?  Shame on you - this is unmissable light entertainment..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZ8jmdWlB8Y

Around 9 minutes in you can see the poolside fun and more.  Enjoy!

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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by Verdi on 17.03.16 16:11

@April28th wrote:  This clip also backs up what I said further up the page in response to you, Verdi. Even Gerry and Kate (Kate by proxy not correcting it) describe a 'dress' when describing the last photo. You're quite correct in quoting it was a smock top and shorts, but I'd wager Gerry (like myself) just described it as a dress not knowing the correct term. And from Fatima's perspective, she could've either seen it as a dress because of her height, or it got described as a dress in translation.

Either way, this was the only day she wore anything even resembling a dress, so I take it as accurate personally.


Before the subject takes on a new life of it's own, I should clarify that my original post was disputing your claim that the cleaner 'accurately' described what Madeleine was wearing.  If you recall, I posted up an extract from both the cleaners statement and KM's description taken from her autobiography, which shows clearly that the cleaner did not even fully describe what Madeleine was wearing - let alone accurately.

I'm very interested to learn how you know that the day the cleaner allegedly saw Madeleine with her family was the only occasion that Madeleine wore anything even resembling a dress.  Granted the only three photographs showing Madeleine during that week she is wearing 1. a pink trouser and top ensemble 2. a pair of shorts and t-shirt and 3. the smock top with broderie anglais shorts taken at the swimming pool but I've never seen any information anywhere indicating the content of her wardrobe packed for the holiday.  As most likely the case of the errant pyjamas, I strongly suspect that the luggage contained more than three outfits for a three, nearly four, year old child.

The difficulty with this case right from the beginning has been the veracity (or not if you prefer) of the McCanns word and that of their friends.  As I see it, everything they have ever muttered should be taken with a sack load of salt, without evidence of something tangible to back-up their story - so far I've never seen that evidence.  Mr. Amaral was faced with the same problem, he was initially ill-informed which led to wrong conclusions as regards the direction of the investigation.  Of course had he been allowed to continue as the nvestigation evolved it would have taken on a whole new perspective - as was beginning to emerge when Eddie and Keela were deployed.  Mr. Amaral was removed from the case and so it ended.. 




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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by April28th on 17.03.16 20:13

@Verdi Oh I understood where you were coming from, hope I wasn't seeming to misrepresent what you said. I'm of the belief that if there was a dress worn on a different day, we would've seen it in some fashion back then. And because of this belief and lack of credible sightings after Fatima's, I believe she died on that day or the early hours of the next. And that's why I attribute the 'last photo' to being literally that, and why I excuse the misappropriation of the word 'dress', for the reasons I've outlined.

I can absolutely see your point and don't mean to dismiss you in any way. We just have a difference of interpretation here, mainly borne of different conclusions about the true last day. If I were to believe there was another day then I'd perhaps allow for an outfit we never saw, but in the absense of such evidence I go with what I see. :)
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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by Verdi on 17.03.16 20:32

@April28th wrote:@Verdi Oh I understood where you were coming from, hope I wasn't seeming to misrepresent what you said. I'm of the belief that if there was a dress worn on a different day, we would've seen it in some fashion back then. And because of this belief and lack of credible sightings after Fatima's, I believe she died on that day or the early hours of the next. And that's why I attribute the 'last photo' to being literally that, and why I excuse the misappropriation of the word 'dress', for the reasons I've outlined.

I can absolutely see your point and don't mean to dismiss you in any way. We just have a difference of interpretation here, mainly borne of different conclusions about the true last day. If I were to believe there was another day then I'd perhaps allow for an outfit we never saw, but in the absense of such evidence I go with what I see. :)
No problem, we agree on the important points that's the main thing which from where I'm standing, with or without the cleaner's statement, remain intact.

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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by Tony Bennett on 28.03.16 10:33

@April28th wrote:
This clip also backs up what I said further up the page...Verdi. Even Gerry and Kate (Kate by proxy not correcting it) describe a 'dress' when describing the last photo. You're quite correct in quoting it was a smock top and shorts, but I'd wager Gerry (like myself) just described it as a dress not knowing the correct term. And from Fatima's perspective, she could've either seen it as a dress because of her height, or it got described as a dress in translation.

Either way, this was the only day she wore anything even resembling a dress, so I take it as accurate personally.

This clip is indeed important as confirmation of the cleaning lady's (Fatima's) detailed evidence of an event on lunch-time, Sunday 29th, when Madeleine was clearly alive. She describes it very accurately. Nothing vague at all about it.

But after that, as HideHo has clearly shown in her article last year, statements about Madeleine being seen alive boil down to uncorroborated statements by the parents or their friends, or vague statements by others with little or no checkable details provided.

Indeed, the reconstruction of the events of 3 May 2007 on the BBC Crimewatch McCann Special are revealing in other ways, such as the clip of Gerry playing tennis and Madeleine going around picking up the tennis balls, which does not seem to be confirmed by any of the statements surrounding the tennis balls photo. 

They should have included a clip of Kate rushing back to the flat to hunt for the camera she forgot to take with her that day

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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by HiDeHo on 28.03.16 10:52

Lets ask a question...  Why would they release a younger Maddie photo..?


There could be a few reasons but this is one possible reason....


IF the photo was taken Sunday would they want to risk people remembering Maddie looking like that 'days ago' when they wanted people to think it was taken that day?


If people were told she looked like that earlier that day... (and she wasn't around) how many would say, 'no, I didnt see her today looking like that in that outfit but I remember seeing her a few days ago'

That would jeopardise an effort to claim the photo was taken on Thursday (IF that was the case)

Why would they risk people saying, 'I don't remember seeing her'. It seems apparent that other children resembled the younger pic. A safer bet?
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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by tinkier on 28.03.16 14:02

@HiDeHo wrote:Lets ask a question...  Why would they release a younger Maddie photo..?


There could be a few reasons but this is one possible reason....


IF the photo was taken Sunday would they want to risk people remembering Maddie looking like that 'days ago' when they wanted people to think it was taken that day?


If people were told she looked like that earlier that day... (and she wasn't around) how many would say, 'no, I didnt see her today looking like that in that outfit but I remember seeing her a few days ago'

That would jeopardise an effort to claim the photo was taken on Thursday (IF that was the case)

Why would they risk people saying, 'I don't remember seeing her'.  It seems apparent that other children resembled the younger pic.  A safer bet?
I always remember the article written by Bridget O'Donnell http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann Bridget stated.…"We would joke about the fact there were 10 blonde three-year-old girls in the group". So yes I would agree, a safer bet to put out a younger looking photo if more of the group of 10 little blonde three-year-olds looked a little younger than MBM. Confusion is good!
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Re: What happened to Madeleine? - A poll to assess recent evidence

Post by Nina on 28.03.16 14:06

thumbsup
@tinkier wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:Lets ask a question...  Why would they release a younger Maddie photo..?


There could be a few reasons but this is one possible reason....


IF the photo was taken Sunday would they want to risk people remembering Maddie looking like that 'days ago' when they wanted people to think it was taken that day?


If people were told she looked like that earlier that day... (and she wasn't around) how many would say, 'no, I didnt see her today looking like that in that outfit but I remember seeing her a few days ago'

That would jeopardise an effort to claim the photo was taken on Thursday (IF that was the case)

Why would they risk people saying, 'I don't remember seeing her'.  It seems apparent that other children resembled the younger pic.  A safer bet?
I always remember the article written by Bridget O'Donnell http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann Bridget stated.…"We would joke about the fact there were 10 blonde three-year-old girls in the group". So yes I would agree, a safer bet to put out a younger looking photo if more of the group of 10 little blonde three-year-olds looked a little younger than MBM. Confusion is good!
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