When Gerry met Robbie

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When Gerry met Robbie

Post  Get'emGonçalo on Wed May 05, 2010 2:07 pm

"Evidence " that Robert Murat knew Gerry McCann was printed in '24 Horas' in September 2007. Alarm bells rang in Team McCann. In January 2008 '24 Horas' as a reputable source for reporting of the facts on the McCann case had all but been crucified on the cross of misinformation and confusion. The process employed was simplicity itself, it's unravelling was anything but.

The sign out time for the Mark Warner creche on Sunday the 29th of May shows Gerry McCann signing the twins out from the creche at 14:45PM. *Note
In the police files a cleaner/maid at the Ocean Club reported to police how on that same Sunday she saw Madeleine McCann with her mother Kate and the twins leaving apartment 5A to go upstairs to another apartment in the complex. 'Upstairs' could mean to Tanner and O'Brian's apartment, but equally it could also have meant to Wilkins and O'Donnells apartment, as they were all housed on the top floor of the same block as the McCanns, block 5.

Original Portuguese statement:
'Refere que esta situação ocorreu no Domingo, dia 29 de Abril, um pouco antes de terminar o seu horário de trabalho (13H30), uma vez que gozou folga na tarde desse dia. Seriam cerca de 13H15, tendo-se ali deslocado para dar uma ajuda a sua mãe que se encontrava a efectuar limpeza no apartamento I, daquele mesmo bloco (5), que se situa no primeiro andar.------Recorda então em concreto que a menina, acompanhada da mãe e dos irmãos, como já disse, saíram do seu apartamento @A), dirigindo-se as escadas que permitem o acesso ao piso superior.------Esteve muito perto de todos eles, talvez distância IN chegou a observar a menina, antes do seu desaparecimento, na companhia dos T PR ER O IO IB P ID U A BL A IC R O EP D R E O P D O U R Ç T ÃO IM AO IS MINISTÉRIO DA JUSTIÇA POL~CIA JUDICIÁRIA inferior a um metro, tendo ficado a observar por momentos a sua movimentação porque achou engraçado.------A Madeleine seguia na fiente com um prato na mão, talvez de plástico, onde trazia um pedaço de pão. Quanto a roupa com que trajava, recorda apenas uma saia cuja descrição não consegue fazer. Notou, porque achou graça, o tipo de calçado que usava, tratando-se de ténis, pensa que de cor clara, que tinham umas luzes junto da sola, as quais acendiam cada vez que pisava o solo..................'*Source

Google Translate:
'The witness states that this occurred on Sunday, April 29th, shortly before completing her schedule of work, which was due to end at 13.30PM, a little while later that day. 'It would have been about 13:15PM. I was moved over there to lend a hand to a mother who was cleaning her apartment in the same block, block5, on the first floor'.

The witness recalls the girl (Madeleine) was accompanied by her mother and siblings, 'they left the apartment (XA),and went towards the stairs that give access to the upper floor. He (the man) was then very close to all of them, perhaps close as he came to watch the girl before her disappearance, he was in the company of --REDACTED **NAME REPRODUCTION FORBIDDEN BY THE MINISTRY OF JUSTICE - POLICIA JUDICIAL**REDACTED-- who was less than one meter away'.

'Madeleine' she said 'went in with a plate in her hand, maybe a plastic plate, upon which was carried a piece of bread'. As for the clothes Madeleine wore, she only remembers seeing a skirt, the exact description of which she cannot recall. She noticed Madeleine appeared kind. As for the type of shoes she was wearing at the time, 'she wore tennis shoes', she thinks 'they were light in color, and the shoes had lights along the side of the sole, the sort which lit up every time she stepped on the ground....'


The witness said that a little while later she saw Gerry McCann leave apartment 5A, alone, and that he proceeded to follow on from his apartment to the other apartment where he joined with his family members. The cleaner is quite specific about the time, as she shared a few words with Kate, and she also noted 'the twins were each carrying a plastic plate and each held a piece of bread in their hands'.

The cleaner was due to clock off at 13:30PM. She told police she saw Kate and all the children about 15mins before her shift was due to end. The creche record sign out time for that day shows the twins were still in the creche at 13:15PM and it also states that they weren't to be signed out, by Gerry McCann, until 14:45PM, which was over an hour and a half later. The cleaner said she saw Gerry McCann shortly after 13:15PM. She saw him as he exited 5A and followed on behind his family group towards the other apartment. The McCanns were here seen somewhere where the written record suggests they could not have been, and they were seen in the company of another man partnered with another person, both of whom the Portuguese police have refused to name.

In that the man whom the cleaner said she saw that day with the McCanns she also proposes in her statement was there to reconnoitre the scene for a likey grab of Madeleine, and that the only male person to be made a suspect in the investigation apart from Gerry McCann himself was Robert Murat, it now appears that the cleaner is identifying the presence of Robert Murat in the company of Gerry McCann along with his family and a strange woman.

Michaela Walczuch, was a female friend to Robert Murat,and was proclaimed an Arguido, according to the Daily Mail, on January the 6th 2008, (published online Jan 7th 2008). The Daily Mail called Francisco Pagarete, Murat's lawyer to explain Walczuch's new legal status. Pagarete's response was that the original newspaper report concerning Walczuch's involvement, which was published earlier by 24 Horas the Portuguese newspaper was incorrect. Pagarete went on to say that he believed Walczuch, was unfairly perceived or indeed portrayed as an official suspect, and he angrily denied the fact that he had ever said Walczuch had been formally named as arguida in any event.

Pagarete's original statement to 24 Horas was, "Both (Walczuch and Murat) were initially notified as witnesses, and when they showed up of their own free will to the interrogations they were made arguidos." The newspaper report in January 2008 said, 'Mr Pagarete had revealed that she was initially interviewed as a witness and later made a suspect in November 2007 , six months after Mr Murat had been made an arguido.' According to Pagarete the PJ interviewed Walczuch twice, once in May and then again in November 2007.

It is notable that Miss Walczuch when questioned as a witness in May, was sharing an apartment with her estranged husband Luis Antonio and their daughter. Luis Antonio 's interview, which occured at the same time was not mentionned by Pagarte, but Robert Murat's interview was. Pagarete said of the two seperate interviews Walczuch had endured exactly the same thing each time, and that was that Walczuch had on each occaison been made a 'suspect' if not 'arguida' by the Portuguese police, which is non sensical to say the least and is probably illegal, but I am not a Portuguese lawywer as is Mr Pagarete. In January 2008 speaking to The Daily Mail, Pagarete then denied he had ever said any such thing in the first place let alone repeat his assertion on two seperate occaisons.

Pagarete's denial came seven months after the start of the police's fruitless investigation and prosecution of the McCanns. The prosecution of the McCanns by the PJ had by then been blocked at every point. Any attempt to charge the McCanns had been met either with simple refusal or virtual non compliance on what appeared to be grounds of insufficient evidence. The direction of the investigation was stalled. The investigation next revereted to reanalyse the police's only other suspect in the case, Robert Murat. Now it was that Murat's confidantes and known relationships were to become the focus of renewed police interest. They were all to be examined, and rexamined, and in far more detail than they had previously.

Walczuch was never deemed an official arguida yet Pagarete stated she was. Pagarete managed to confuse the press with his initial reports and his subsequent denials concerning the status of Walczuch. This assault trough the media had the effect of only creating confusion, confusion that was to serve in part to undermine 24 Horas reputation as a worthy source of information.

There is no obvious explanation for Pagarete's statements, only that it seems they were designed to confound and distance Murat from Walczuch. It is here that Pagarete's words if considered in the light of the maid's testimony, which Pagarete would have been privvy too, could be said to offer some indication as to who it was that accompanied Murat and the McCanns on Sunday the 29th at the Ocean Club in Luz.

Pagarete himself hinted as much in his denial when in January 2008 he said, "I never said Michaela was a defendant in this case. I said she might be a suspect in the public's eyes but I never said she was a suspect from a legal point of view". There would only be one reason as to why Pagarete would suggest such a thing in the first place, and that was the fact that the close association between Murat and Walzcuch had been widely advertised in the Portuguese press.

Meanwhile 'Correiro da Manha', another Portuguese paper, had been quick to run with the ball. Murat and Walczuch were two, and who they asked was their third associate, the one the police were looking for but at the same time were not naming.

'Actualidade' another Portuguese newspaper were most insistent that they too had identified Murat and Walczuch as two of three persons linked together by relationship in the case of Madeleine McCann.

Quite by coincidence the style of shoes the twins were photographed wearing was seen to change just after the Ocean Club maid's statement and description of Madeleine's footwear was given to the police.
The above picture was taken on the 4th of May 2007 and in it the twins can be seen wearing light coloured shoes, but not ones that resemble tennis shoes.
This picture was taken on May the 22nd 2007, about 1 week after the maid's description. The twins are now seen sporting their new white tennis syle shoes.

The only question that now remains was could it have been that the missing third person the police were so desperately seeking but not naming was none other than Gerry McCann himself.

*Source : LINK to entire police file : www.scribd.com/doc/22150697/03-volume-iiia+Mario+Domingos+Moreira+ocean+club&cd=16&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www.scribd.com/doc/22150697/03-volume-iiia+Mario+Domingos+Moreira+ocean+club&cd=16&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:O7nId7ZtOLUJ:www.scribd.com/doc/22150697/03-volume-iiia+Mario+Domingos+Moreira+ocean+club&cd=16&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

*Note: It has been suggested the time shown was the sign in time for the afternoon. So far this has not been verified.

Jill Havern, Forum Owner

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Re: When Gerry met Robbie

Post  chillyheat on Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:39 pm



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Re: When Gerry met Robbie

Post  ultimaThule on Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:55 pm

Thank you for bumping this thread, ChillyHeat, otherwise it would have escaped my attention and, no doubt, the attention of others who've joined this site comparatively recently. 

There's a lot to digest and mull over and I hope to post here within the next 24 hours or so.


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Re: When Gerry met Robbie

Post  russiandoll on Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:02 pm

It was the Paynes' place on the floor above,  wasn't it?  Tanner and O Brien were on same level as McCanns? Wasn't it the Paynes hosting the usual big get-togethers at lunch time, I recall DP speaking about the safety issues around their balcony area.

 Wilkins and O Donnell were not accommodated in block 5 , they were nearby in block 4  [. from the PJ files ]

 Following various informal conversations related to the area of research, we were contacted by a British citizen named Jeremy Michael Wilkins, holder of passport no. 205...., owner of mobile phone no. +44788...., living in ....London...He spends his holidays at, "WATERSIDE GARDENS," block G4,


             The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie — deliberate,
contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
~John F. Kennedy


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