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Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Miss Pandora on Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:42 pm

MILLIE wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:The EVRD dog Keela alerted to minute particles of blood behind the sofa but, insofar as what is known of the results of analysis of these particles, this finding can only be said to be blood which came from a human body, or bodies, when either alive or from seepage from an open wound immediately after death Millie

The late Eddie (RIP) alerted to the odour of cadverine behind the sofa and in or by the bedroom wardrobe which indicates that at some point in time a dead body, or a significant part thereof, was present in those two locations as it is improbable that cadaverine could be transferred by any other means.

Neither of the dogs' findings can be seen as indication that death occurred in the apartment.
Thank you for that, Ultima. I had wondered.   thumbsup

Maddie could have been sleeping in parents bedroom. Scent of cadverine was in that room. If she died in bed and was moved within 90 mins to said location. Alerts simply detect presence of dead body some time after the death occurred so trail does not start till then IMO

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by poinksy on Thu Jun 12, 2014 1:28 pm

If I were a criminal profiler I would be thinking from the start.

1, How on earth did everyone get their children SOUNDLY asleep so they could all meet up at the same time. Especially since the kids were all out of normal routines, in a strange place and probably excited.

2, It has been reported that Madeleine cried on previous nights so why did the parents rule out the possibility that she may have wondered off to find them based purely on the fact that she had been unsettled on previous nights?

3, Why did they embrace Tanners sighting yet dismiss Smiths?



Very basic questions, and I have my own theory. I'm sure the whole party know the truth but the repercussions would be of great detriment to them all. Especially 7 years later and with all the police resources put into this.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:02 pm

Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Maggs Shaw on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:23 pm

@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
The incident on the shuttle has always mystified me, why would he be so miserable...a lovely family holiday, with friends...I thought that very strange behaviour.....then.....3 days after Maddie goes missing, he is seen laughing and joking while standing by some patio doors....!!   his demeanor on the patio door clip is one that could only really be described as looking, relieved!       I really would love to know what exactly he was laughing about.  That sickened me to the bone.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:33 pm

@Maggs Shaw wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
The incident on the shuttle has always mystified me, why would he be so miserable...a lovely family holiday, with friends...I thought that very strange behaviour.....then.....3 days after Maddie goes missing, he is seen laughing and joking while standing by some patio doors....!!   his demeanor on the patio door clip is one that could only really be described as looking, relieved!       I really would love to know what exactly he was laughing about.  That sickened me to the bone.
You're complete right, it's back to front really, should've been laughing and joking on the bus and well, could have at least tried to look devastated 3 days after maddie vanished IMO. But, don't think he knew he was being recorded then, silly man. What else would he be going there for if it wasn't to enjoy himself?

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by j.rob on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:36 pm

@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh


Also, who released this and WHY? 

I think it is possible that Kate is not aware of maybe certain suspicions - as in the Gasper statements. Or at least has chosen not to make herself aware. Psychologically, cannot 'go there'.

But then again, given some of the things she writes in her book, and looking at some of the statement analysis of her statements, perhaps there are some sinister shadows lurking in her own background/childhood?

I just feel so sorry for Madeleine. Because if there is anything behind the Gasper statements that is very worrying. Then factor in the Mrs Fenn statement where a child (she assumed it was a child who was older than the twins) was desperately crying one evening for an hour and a quarter. Why? And why did the crying stop so suddenly? 

And then there are a few comments from the Tapas crowd in their statements referring to a child being banged on the head, or a child being walloped. Or words to that affect. Which I think is odd.

In the early days, in interviews and also going on what she writes in her book, I got the impression that Kate was not sure whether Madeleine was alive or dead. 

Perhaps 'They have taken her' WAS Kate's understanding of what was to have happened.  

But it all got bungled (JW  bailed out?) and GM had to do the dirty work himself.

Just theorizing. Nothing stated as fact.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by MaybeMaybenot on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:43 pm

Didn't Kate say she had a bad feeling about the holiday before leaving....another red flag

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by j.rob on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:46 pm

I have some very dark thoughts around the last few days before Madeleine 'was abducted'. 

If something (unexpected) happened to her, which entailed a change of plan. Something that maybe would have required treatment. 


Gerry: 'It's a disaster.'

Robert Murat: 'this is the biggest cock-up in history.


Jeremy Wilkins: 'Matt said XXXXX to the effect that Jerry's daughter had been abducted, and that Jerry said that he had met me and wanted to know if I had seen anything. I said 'You're joking'........We then went to bed.'

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by kimHager on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:47 pm

I think that statement is what got me thinking premeditated. I too thought it was a. Strange thing to say. If ur on holiday WHY would you say that? Unless u have a oiupk motive? Gerry sounds angry and absoluteandno reason for it there. Take that and add a missing child, a possible death, kind of seems like he knew something ahead of time Imo.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:47 pm

This is all making me  puke

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by j.rob on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:47 pm

Jeremy Wilkins: 'Matt said XXXXX to the effect that Jerry's daughter had been abducted, and that Jerry said that he had met me and wanted to know if I had seen anything. I said 'You're joking'........We then went to bed.'

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by pennylane on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:50 pm

@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
I think Gerry and Kate had a spat that morning over him not helping out.  His petulant reply (minus the foul language) is a fairly typical response of someone whose been accused by their partner of not pulling their weight, and has consequently  been given a right rollicking.. probably from the time they got up that morning. I personally believe that particular bone of contention carried on throughout the holiday, and lead to the kids being sedated, and ultimately to Maddie's sad fate

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:52 pm

@kimHager wrote:I think that statement is what got me thinking premeditated. I  too thought it was a. Strange thing to say. If ur on holiday WHY would you say that?  Unless u have a oiupk motive? Gerry sounds angry and absoluteandno reason for it  there. Take that and add a missing child,  a possible death, kind of seems like he knew something ahead of time Imo.
My thoughts too but just couldn't type it. Why would something knowingly have to be done? IMO

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by j.rob on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:55 pm

I doubt that the McCanns are the most popular people on the planet.

They weren't exactly mobbed by well-wishers on the steps of the court in Portugal. 

And there was that rather desperate quote some time ago on a silly Madeleine sighting story (at a football match) where a 'source close to the McCanns' is quoted as saying something like the family will be comforted that someone is still looking for her. 

One person in the whole world, maybe.

Oh dear, how the mighty can fall. And so spectacularly too.

IMO

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Maggs Shaw on Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:03 pm

If either GM or KM crack, and I am putting my money on KM cracking eventually, it will be when the twins are old enough to 'surf' the net on their own...or, when they start their secondary education and their friends will obviously be far more aware of what is being said.  I am assuming of course that G and K are protecting and shielding the twins at the moment from any possibility of them hearing anything adverse.   But, there will come a time when the twins will walk in the door and confront their mother with the question....'Mum what really happened to Maddie, did you have anything to do with her disappearance'??   I think that is when any mother would crack, if she doesn't then she is a harder woman than she portrays at this moment in time.   The twins, in my opinion, will be the catalyst for any kind of admission from either their mother or father.    The inquisition from the twins will far outweigh even the most aggressive cross examination from any lawyer in court.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:04 pm

@pennylane wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
I think Gerry and Kate had a spat that morning over him not helping out.  His petulant reply (minus the foul language) is a fairly typical response of someone whose been accused by their partner of not pulling their weight, and has consequently  been given a right rollicking.. probably from the time they got up that morning. I personally believe that particular bone of contention carried on throughout the holiday, and lead to the kids being sedated, and ultimately to Maddie's sad fate
Possibly, must be a complete prick to dampen the rest of the party with them then all IMO

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by HelenMeg on Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:15 pm

@j.rob wrote:I have some very dark thoughts around the last few days before Madeleine 'was abducted'. 

If something (unexpected) happened to her, which entailed a change of plan. Something that maybe would have required treatment. 


Gerry: 'It's a disaster.'

Robert Murat: 'this is the biggest cock-up in history.


Jeremy Wilkins: 'Matt said XXXXX to the effect that Jerry's daughter had been abducted, and that Jerry said that he had met me and wanted to know if I had seen anything. I said 'You're joking'........We then went to bed.'
Robert Murat: 'this is the biggest cock-up in history.

I find RM's statement interesting.
He could have said - 'this is just one big cock-up..'

But to say 'biggest cock-up in history' says a lot more than that. It implies he knew this was 'monumental l' and suggests the implications were massive - IMO.  

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by suzyjohnson on Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:31 pm

@pennylane wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
I think Gerry and Kate had a spat that morning over him not helping out.  His petulant reply (minus the foul language) is a fairly typical response of someone whose been accused by their partner of not pulling their weight, and has consequently  been given a right rollicking.. probably from the time they got up that morning. I personally believe that particular bone of contention carried on throughout the holiday, and lead to the kids being sedated, and ultimately to Maddie's sad fate

I expect something like that pennylane

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Guest on Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:33 pm

On another thread I've just alluded to the issue of how 'convenient' it could be considered to be that this tragic event took place in Portugal when you consider that witnesses cannot be forced to attend in a foreign country to give evidence and, of course, the extradition laws.

Almost as if it could have been planned that way...  Just musings and speculation, no factual basis for this theory at all, of course.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by pennylane on Sat Jun 21, 2014 9:56 pm

@Justformaddie wrote:
@pennylane wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
I think Gerry and Kate had a spat that morning over him not helping out.  His petulant reply (minus the foul language) is a fairly typical response of someone whose been accused by their partner of not pulling their weight, and has consequently been given a right rollicking.. probably from the time they got up that morning. I personally believe that particular bone of contention carried on throughout the holiday, and lead to the kids being sedated, and ultimately to Maddie's sad fate
Possibly, must be a complete prick to dampen the rest of the party with them then all IMO

Indeed, and judging by the 'cheer up Gerry you're on holiday' comment, it seems others had already noticed the negative vibes and tension between the Drs McCann.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by unchained melody on Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:05 am

I watched it on a loop once and thought maybe he'd had a couple of drinks on the plane and was attempting some low humour in reply to Payne. But I think pennylane has it close above. He's in a foul mood (with someone) and is snapping away Payne's "cheer up". Kate not looking happy either.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:00 pm

@pennylane wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:
@pennylane wrote:
@Justformaddie wrote:Has anybody any idea of why gm would be so nasty on the shuttle bus to dp (I think)? Holidaying with 3 very young children would be very stressful, but the rest had young children too and, "fu@k off I'm not here to enjoy myself" to me, a red flag. I don't know why, but for some reason I just can't get my head round it. Is this something to be worked out before the rest of the pieces fit? The kids on that bus weren't messing, crying or screaming, so I'm stuck to try to find an answer to this! Any help? Ta. huh
I think Gerry and Kate had a spat that morning over him not helping out.  His petulant reply (minus the foul language) is a fairly typical response of someone whose been accused by their partner of not pulling their weight, and has consequently been given a right rollicking.. probably from the time they got up that morning. I personally believe that particular bone of contention carried on throughout the holiday, and lead to the kids being sedated, and ultimately to Maddie's sad fate
Possibly, must be a complete prick to dampen the rest of the party with them then all IMO

Indeed, and judging by the 'cheer up Gerry you're on holiday' comment, it seems others had already noticed the negative vibes and tension between the Drs McCann.
Yes, taking into account dp remark does seem understandable now, thank you for getting me passed this bit! 
Now, onto the next part of their story, onwards and upwards  thanks

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Guest on Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:11 pm

The "spat" explanation is very plausible, but the question still remains...

Who had the bright idea of uploading such a damaging video to youtube and what did they think would be achieved by doing so?

I'm guessing the answer to the first part could be DP as it appears he shot it, which makes the answer to the second part quite important.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Guest on Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:32 pm

Bearing in mind the alleged spats, reluctance to help Kate with basic chores and childcare, flirting and the putting of his own needs first (tennis, etc) how close do we think the couple were on that holiday?  Was the marriage already rocky? If the answer is yes then to embark on a cover-up so big that they are forced to remain united forever to see it through must be the result of something equally destructive and potentially damaging to them both. They must be equally at risk, imo.

Having said that, if the proverbial ever does hit the fan and they are caught, I envisage a massive Healy/McCann split occurring with each side bent on exonerating their own.

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solved Re: Could Gerry have been involved and hid it from Kate?

Post by Justformaddie on Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:46 pm

Dee Coy wrote:The "spat" explanation is very plausible, but the question still remains...

Who had the bright idea of uploading such a damaging video to youtube and what did they think would be achieved by doing so?

I'm guessing the answer to the first part could be DP as it appears he shot it, which makes the answer to the second part quite important.
Hmm.... Could dp stand to loose more than g? Or a longer jail term? Hence watch the clip, g is the bad man and was expecting something that wouldn't be enjoyable? All IMO

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