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Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by sallypelt on 11.08.14 14:03

Marlie wrote:
@sallypelt wrote:
Marlie wrote:I don't know sallypelt, the first statement was made in Portugal using an interpreter and the second was made in his local garda station, a bit of a difference for me. 

In the first statement he said that smithman wore light trousers but wasn't sure about the remainder of the clothing. We don't know what other questions were asked. 

But now he's being asked specific questions at his local station, they may have probed him about say if his top was lighter or darker in colour than the trousers, if he had long/short sleeves so no doubt easier for him to answer.

To the best of my knowledge he didn't sell his stories unless there is something that I missed. I don't know if they were involved in efits however if they were couldn't it have been after his interview in Jan?

Marlie. I have no idea whether Martin Smith is telling the truth, or whether he's been "got at". All I am going on is the inconsistencies in his statements. This is what we are judging the Tapas members on. I don't do hypocrisy.

I've taken this off below thread as requested. I hope that I'm not going too far off topic, just to say sallypelt I was in no way inferring that you are a hypocrite, I was simply trying to tease through the differences, that's all.

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t10089p220-buried-by-mainstream-media-new-film-due-soon

No offence as intended or taken, Marlie. I wasn't suggesting anyone was calling ME a hypocrite. I was referring to the fact that when there are inconsistencies in the PJ statements, we can't put one person's statement as being lost in translation, and in another case, say that the people are lying. As I have said, we can't have it both ways. All we can do is look at the evidence we have before us, because that's all we have. I am without doubt that those of us on the outside don't know a fraction of what the police etc. So what anyone says on any forum, is just a person's interpretation of what is already known. That's not to take away the credit from anyone on here who has done some incredible research into different aspects of this case, and have backed up everything they have said. Sometimes they have got it wrong, because that's the nature of research. When researching common names, for example, it easy to go down the wrong road, but credible research will cross-reference every piece of information found.

However, it's not always possible to do this, because of the lack of further information, and this is where things can take a wrong turn. That's not to say the person doing the research is out to mislead anyone. When a mistake is pointed out, we go back to where we went off track and retrace our steps from there.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by sallypelt on 11.08.14 14:07

@jeanmonroe wrote:http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P16/16_VOLUME_XVIa_Page_4135.jpg

He has been contacted by Mr Brian Kennedy who is supporting the McCann family to take part in a photo fit exercise. He has given no stories or helped in any photo fits.
---------------------------------------------------------

So, M Smith did NOT help 'produce' the e-fits/photo fits DCI was so er, excited, about showing/promoting to the UK public, of Smithman/men!

WHERE did the 'producers' of DCI Redwood's 'revelation' e-fits 'moment' ACTUALLY get the e-fits from?

Did they, the 'compilers' just take a wild 'guess' as to what an 'abductor/suspect' MIGHT look like, in their 'imagination'?

Good job they haven't seen my OH! Or he'd be in 'nick' right now!  winkwink 

Yes, Jean, where DID they come from, because if we are to stay true to the information in the files, and as I have been banging on about most of the morning, we can't cherry pick what we want to believe and what we want to dismiss. By Martin Smith's own admission, he has given "no stories or helped in any photo fits". Should we be looking elsewhere? smilie 

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Angelique on 11.08.14 14:14

I think the "efits" came from Exton - but thats another thread.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 14:16

@Cristobell wrote:If the sighting by the Smith family is fabricated, why the need for Martin Smith to drag his wife, his children and his grandchildren into the lie?  Why implicate the entire family including the minors in a criminal offence?  If he fabricated the entire story to implicate the missing child's father and get his friend Robert Murat off the hook, he could have put forward any scenario that would have protected his family, something that is a priority even for the most hardened of villains.

Cristobel - it was only Martin, Peter and Aoife that said they saw a man. AFAIK Mary, his wife, never made a statement.  I don`t know why you keep saying Martin would implicate the children - they are too young, the eldest being a step-son of Peter at 13yrs and the others much younger.  I doubt the police would rely on their untarnished testimonies (that`s if they noticed anything and anyway kids usually do what their parents tell them).

If they are lying the only people that would have committed a criminal offence would be Martin, Peter and Aoife.

I haven`t come to a conclusion on this matter myself.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Cristobell on 11.08.14 14:19

@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:If the sighting by the Smith family is fabricated, why the need for Martin Smith to drag his wife, his children and his grandchildren into the lie?  Why implicate the entire family including the minors in a criminal offence?  If he fabricated the entire story to implicate the missing child's father and get his friend Robert Murat off the hook, he could have put forward any scenario that would have protected his family, something that is a priority even for the most hardened of villains.

Cristobel - it was only Martin, Peter and Aoife that said they saw a man. AFAIK Mary, his wife, never made a statement.  I don`t know why you keep saying Martin would implicate the children - they are too young, the eldest being a step-son of Peter at 13yrs and the others much younger.  I doubt the police would rely on their untarnished testimonies (that`s if they noticed anything and anyway kids usually do what their parents tell them).

If they are lying the only people that would have committed a criminal offence would be Martin, Peter and Aoife.

I haven`t come to a conclusion on this matter myself.
Aoife made a statement and she was 12 at the time Woofer.  She is Martin Smith's daughter.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 14:30

@jeanmonroe wrote:
@Woofer wrote:Jean Monroe - do you know this for sure - is there a link?

"He didn't go anywhere NEAR the police 'investigating' the 'kidnapping' in PDL he had 'heard about' on the 4th May 2007."


He says so HIMSELF. (in his 'statements')

EXCLUSIVE: Tourist met rude man carrying child in blanket on night Madeleine vanished

By SANDRA MURPHY, VANESSA ALLEN..................................Daily Mail (paper version only)

3rd January 2008.

Though the Smith family believe they met an almost identical man closer to 10pm, the coincidence prompted them to contact police after they returned to Ireland. Mr Smith said: "Luz is such a small place and so quiet, we felt a duty to tell police and let them decide if it was important."

...........the COINCIDENCE PROMPTED THEM  to CONTACT police  AFTER they RETURNED TO Ireland!

on the 9th May 2007.

So NO 'feeling a DUTY' to 'telling' police 'anything' and letting the police decide, what was IMPORTANT, between 4th May and up to, and until AFTER, 9th May 2007?

His words, not mine!
Jean - well, why is he saying in the Mirror article that he reported it to the Portuguese police but they were not interested?  They knew it might have been Maddie and Mr. and Mrs Smith and Aoife were still there until the 9th. (Peter had already gone home on the 4th).

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 14:32

@Cristobell wrote:
@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:If the sighting by the Smith family is fabricated, why the need for Martin Smith to drag his wife, his children and his grandchildren into the lie?  Why implicate the entire family including the minors in a criminal offence?  If he fabricated the entire story to implicate the missing child's father and get his friend Robert Murat off the hook, he could have put forward any scenario that would have protected his family, something that is a priority even for the most hardened of villains.

Cristobel - it was only Martin, Peter and Aoife that said they saw a man. AFAIK Mary, his wife, never made a statement.  I don`t know why you keep saying Martin would implicate the children - they are too young, the eldest being a step-son of Peter at 13yrs and the others much younger.  I doubt the police would rely on their untarnished testimonies (that`s if they noticed anything and anyway kids usually do what their parents tell them).

If they are lying the only people that would have committed a criminal offence would be Martin, Peter and Aoife.

I haven`t come to a conclusion on this matter myself.
Aoife made a statement and she was 12 at the time Woofer.  She is Martin Smith's daughter.

ok, that changes things somewhat.
Anyone know the ages of them all in 2007?

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by jeanmonroe on 11.08.14 14:36

@Angelique wrote:I think the "efits" came from Exton - but thats another thread.

Same question applies to Exton.

Where DID Exton 'get' their e-fits from?

Given that they neither resemble either JT's 'Tannerman' MET Police's 'Crecheman' OR Smiths 'Smithman' .......who did NOT 'see' his FACE, as it was 'covered by child' so they say.

Perhaps he/them, e-fits, are a couple of villians that gave Andy the 'slip' years ago!  winkwink 

"I'll get you, Butler!"

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by PeterMac on 11.08.14 14:41

@pennylane wrote:
@tiny wrote:I also believe the Smith family, i also believe it was Gerry carrying Madeleine.
Me too, tiny!  thumbup

OK.
Let us look at G carrying M, or G carrying NOT-M
Gerry has to get up from the Tapas table, go to the apartment, pick up Madeleine, exit, shut the apartment, and then walk to the 'sighting point"
Google maps gives us this
" />
and suggests 6 minutes walking time
" />

from the point he then has to go somewhere else, to finally dispose of, or temporarily hide what he is carrying
and then he has to return to the Tapas bar by some unspecified route.

The six minutes of google time is only for walking, so add several more for entering and exiting the apartment, setting the scene and so on
between 10 and 15 therefore merely to go TO wherever he has chosen.
Add some more for hiding / disposing - assuming he did
Add another 10 or so to go back.
Realistically (if we can ever use that word again) we have to find a "window of Opportunity" of somewhere well over half an hour, probably nearer 45 minutes
with most of that time being AFTER 10 pm
So he cannot have returned to the apartment to start the searching, shouting, screaming, wailing, phoning the world, opening and closing shutters (and mending them !) and all the rest, until around 10:30

And if what he was carrying was a different unconscious child, he has to put that one back as well, give it back to the parents, put it back in bed, or whatever.

Can you at least see why I am having problems with those two particular scenarios.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by jeanmonroe on 11.08.14 14:45

Jean - well, why is he saying in the Mirror article that he reported it to the Portuguese police but they were not interested?  They knew it might have been Maddie and Mr. and Mrs Smith and Aoife were still there until the 9th. (Peter had already gone home on the 4th).
----------------------------------------------------
What DATE is the Mirror 'article'?

Mr Smith STATES that he was ONLY 'prompted' to CONTACT the police AFTER he returned, with his family, to Ireland, which was on 9th May 2007.

If the article is dated AFTER 9th May 2007 then he wouldn't have contacted the local PJ before then, otherwise he would have said, "I contacted the local PJ immediately the moment i heard about the kidnapping on 4th May 2007, and told them what my family saw, but they weren't interested'

Has M Smith ever said he did that?
-------------------------------------------------
3rd January 2008.

Though the Smith family believe they met an almost identical man closer to 10pm, the coincidence prompted them to contact police after they returned to Ireland. Mr Smith said: "Luz is such a small place and so quiet, we felt a duty to tell police and let them decide if it was important."

...........the COINCIDENCE PROMPTED THEM to CONTACT police AFTER they RETURNED TO Ireland!

on the 9th May 2007.
-------------------------------------------------------
I can't 'speak' for M Smith as to why he 'said' this or that, obviously.

If, IF, the Smith family HAD gone to the PJ on the 4th May 2007, i'm almost certain that the PJ could have gotten a reasonable e-fit from THEM, if they had seen his 'face', instead of giving us................... EGGMAN!

And circulated the Smiths 'e-fit' from late 4th May 2007 onwards.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by sallypelt on 11.08.14 14:48

@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:If the sighting by the Smith family is fabricated, why the need for Martin Smith to drag his wife, his children and his grandchildren into the lie?  Why implicate the entire family including the minors in a criminal offence?  If he fabricated the entire story to implicate the missing child's father and get his friend Robert Murat off the hook, he could have put forward any scenario that would have protected his family, something that is a priority even for the most hardened of villains.

Cristobel - it was only Martin, Peter and Aoife that said they saw a man. AFAIK Mary, his wife, never made a statement.  I don`t know why you keep saying Martin would implicate the children - they are too young, the eldest being a step-son of Peter at 13yrs and the others much younger.  I doubt the police would rely on their untarnished testimonies (that`s if they noticed anything and anyway kids usually do what their parents tell them).

If they are lying the only people that would have committed a criminal offence would be Martin, Peter and Aoife.

I haven`t come to a conclusion on this matter myself.
Aoife made a statement and she was 12 at the time Woofer.  She is Martin Smith's daughter.

ok, that changes things somewhat.
Anyone know the ages of them all in 2007?

Woofer according to Martin Smith's later statement  it states:



"Re – Investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann

I took an additional statement from Mr Smith as requested. His wife does not want to make another statement."


So, this tells me that Mary Smith must have given a statement at some point. So this is another piece of information we don't have access to.

On another point, in reference to the Mirror article (and we all know who put these out, don't we? And if we have any doubt, watch Richard Hall's videos, and they remove all doubt) where Martin Smith said he tried contacting the PJ but the "weren't interested" but at NO time, during his statements to the Portuguese OR the Leicestershire police, did Martin Smith say that he ever tried to contact the PJ before his first statement, taken on 26.5.2007. So, is the Mirror article a load of codswallop, like the rest of MSM tosh?

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Cristobell on 11.08.14 14:50

@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
@Woofer wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:If the sighting by the Smith family is fabricated, why the need for Martin Smith to drag his wife, his children and his grandchildren into the lie?  Why implicate the entire family including the minors in a criminal offence?  If he fabricated the entire story to implicate the missing child's father and get his friend Robert Murat off the hook, he could have put forward any scenario that would have protected his family, something that is a priority even for the most hardened of villains.

Cristobel - it was only Martin, Peter and Aoife that said they saw a man. AFAIK Mary, his wife, never made a statement.  I don`t know why you keep saying Martin would implicate the children - they are too young, the eldest being a step-son of Peter at 13yrs and the others much younger.  I doubt the police would rely on their untarnished testimonies (that`s if they noticed anything and anyway kids usually do what their parents tell them).

If they are lying the only people that would have committed a criminal offence would be Martin, Peter and Aoife.

I haven`t come to a conclusion on this matter myself.
Aoife made a statement and she was 12 at the time Woofer.  She is Martin Smith's daughter.

ok, that changes things somewhat.
Anyone know the ages of them all in 2007?
The ages of the children are given in Martin Smith's statement Woofer.  Apart from Aoife 12, the other kids were 13, 10, 6 and 4.  Its very likely the other children have since been interviewed Woofer and statements taken from the other adults in the group. 

Given the very limited evidence available to us, I don't see how anyone can conclude they were lying.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 14:57

Thanks Cristobel.
 I would be amazed to hear a 12 year old lied.

We`ll have to wait and see what RDH makes of that.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by jeanmonroe on 11.08.14 15:03

Cristobel
---------------------------------------

Can you at least concede that the DCI Redwood's Smithman/men 'revelation' e-fits/photo-fits were produced with absolutely NO 'help', at all, from M Smith?

3rd January 2008.

"He, Martin Smith, has given no stories or helped in any photo fits." Drogheda Police.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 15:10

@jeanmonroe wrote:Jean - well, why is he saying in the Mirror article that he reported it to the Portuguese police but they were not interested?  They knew it might have been Maddie and Mr. and Mrs Smith and Aoife were still there until the 9th. (Peter had already gone home on the 4th).
----------------------------------------------------
What DATE is the Mirror 'article'?

Mr Smith STATES that he was ONLY 'prompted' to CONTACT the police AFTER he returned, with his family, to Ireland, which was on 9th May 2007.

If the article is dated AFTER 9th May 2007 then he wouldn't have contacted the local PJ before then, otherwise he would have said, "I contacted the local PJ immediately the moment i heard about the kidnapping on 4th May 2007, and told them what my family saw, but they weren't interested'

Has M Smith ever said he did that?
-------------------------------------------------
3rd January 2008.

Though the Smith family believe they met an almost identical man closer to 10pm, the coincidence prompted them to contact police after they returned to Ireland. Mr Smith said: "Luz is such a small place and so quiet, we felt a duty to tell police and let them decide if it was important."

...........the COINCIDENCE PROMPTED THEM to CONTACT police AFTER they RETURNED TO Ireland!

on the 9th May 2007.
-------------------------------------------------------
I can't 'speak' for M Smith as to why he 'said' this or that, obviously.

If, IF, the Smith family HAD gone to the PJ on the 4th May 2007, i'm almost certain that the PJ could have gotten a reasonable e-fit from THEM, if they had seen his 'face', instead of giving us................... EGGMAN!

And circulated the Smiths 'e-fit' from late 4th May 2007 onwards.
The Mirror article was 16th October 2013, two days after the Crimewatch programme.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccann-key-witness-accuses-2433328
 
I`m not suggesting he went to the PJ - it sounds as if he spoke to `local officers` which could have meant it was a GNR officer that did not take it seriously.

I don`t know why he is running down the PJ because he went back to Portugal on the 26th and gave another statement and Goncalo obviously took him seriously because he was on the verge of inviting him back.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Cristobell on 11.08.14 15:19

@jeanmonroe wrote:Cristobel
---------------------------------------

Can you at least concede that the DCI Redwood's Smithman/men 'revelation' e-fits/photo-fits were produced with absolutely NO 'help', at all, from M Smith?

3rd January 2008.

"He, Martin Smith, has given no stories or helped in any photo fits."
Why would I do that?  I believe the efits come from the Smith family.  I simply don't accept that someone sitting at a keyboard in the UK, with no inside knowledge of the case, knows more about what the Smith family saw that night, than the family do themselves.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by jeanmonroe on 11.08.14 15:25

Woofer

I`m not suggesting he went to the PJ - it sounds as if he spoke to `local officers` which could have meant it was a GNR officer that did not take it seriously.
--------------------------------------------------

"HEARSAY and SUPPOSITION m'lady"  winkwink 

"Could have", "might have", "may of meant"  etc',

Blame it on the 'pleb'!

Normally you deal in 'facts' Woofer.

not 'interpretations'.

I COULD 'say' "my daughter's was definitely abducted by a paedophile predator burglator' when actually i may have MEANT to say 'my daughter was abducted, probably, although i have absolutely no evidence to back that statement up with"

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 15:25

@Cristobell wrote:
@jeanmonroe wrote:Cristobel
---------------------------------------

Can you at least concede that the DCI Redwood's Smithman/men 'revelation' e-fits/photo-fits were produced with absolutely NO 'help', at all, from M Smith?

3rd January 2008.

"He, Martin Smith, has given no stories or helped in any photo fits."
Why would I do that?  I believe the efits come from the Smith family.  I simply don't accept that someone sitting at a keyboard in the UK, with no inside knowledge of the case, knows more about what the Smith family saw that night, than the family do themselves.

And if you read the Mirror article I gave a link to, Martin Smith actually says he provided details for an efit.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 15:28

@jeanmonroe wrote:Woofer

I`m not suggesting he went to the PJ - it sounds as if he spoke to `local officers` which could have meant it was a GNR officer that did not take it seriously.
--------------------------------------------------

"HEARSAY and SUPPOSITION m'lady"  winkwink 

"Could have", "might have", "may of meant"  etc',

Blame it on the 'pleb'!

Normally you deal in 'facts' Woofer.

not 'interpretations'.

I COULD 'say' "my daughter's was definitely abducted by a paedophile predator burglator' when actually i may have MEANT to say 'my daughter was abducted, probably, although i have absolutely no evidence to back that statement up with"
Admittedly the Mirror article may not be fact - just seems odd that Smith said that he had in fact reported it to the local officers soon after. It`s because I find it totally unreasonable of the Smiths to have left it 12 days. I want to believe the Smiths are legit.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Guest on 11.08.14 15:33

Irish Central 14/10/13 wrote:An Irish couple will feature in a major campaign on British television on Monday to find those responsible for the 2007 disappearance of toddler Madeleine McCann from a Portuguese resort.



Drogheda couple Martin and Mary Smith have provided key evidence to a new investigation by British police into the McCann case.

New computer generated images of  a man the Smiths say they saw carrying a young girl through a side-street in the resort of Praia da Luz at the time Madeleine vanished are to be broadcast on BBC television on Monday night.

The Irish Sun report that the computer e-fits of the prime suspect were composed from statements and descriptions given by two members of the Smith family.

Drogheda man Martin was holidaying on the Algarve with his wife Mary, daughter Aoife, son Peter and other family members at the time Madeleine disappeared.

They have again told police of their experience on the night in question when they saw a man carrying a young girl, three or four years old and in a deep sleep, down a street in the seaside resort.

Martin has told the BBC programme that the man was carrying the child along the middle of a deserted side street in an uncomfortable position with her head slumped against him.

The report says she had pale ‘typically British’ skin, blonde shoulder-length hair and wore light coloured or pink pyjamas which match the description of those Madeleine was wearing that night.


The Smiths gave descriptions to Portuguese police two days after the disappearance but no e-fits or sketches were ever produced until now.

The man described by the Smiths is now the central figure in a new gallery of potential suspects to be released by English police’s Operation Grange inquiry into the case.

The images will be broadcast in a special edition of BBC One show Crimewatch on Monday night.
Madeleine’s mum Kate told the programme: “We’re not the ones that have done something wrong here.

“It’s the person who’s gone into that apartment and taken a little girl away from her family.”
Detective Chief Inspector Andy Redwood said: “The e-fits are clear and I’d ask the public to look very carefully at them.”

The Irish Sun reports that one image shows the suspect square-jawed and chubby-faced. In the other he is leaner.

A Scotland Yard police spokesman said: “It’s two different people’s version of the same suspect.”
The Smiths saw the man at around 10pm, around the same time that Kate discovered Madeleine was missing from the family’s apartment.

The BBC programme, which is also to be broadcast in Germany and Holland, features a full reconstruction of the events in Praia da Luz on the night Madeleine disappeared.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/irish-couple-key-witnesses-as-british-police-launch-new-enquiry-into-madeleine-mccann-case-227647711-237782841.html

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by jeanmonroe on 11.08.14 15:35

@Cristobell wrote:
@jeanmonroe wrote:Cristobel
---------------------------------------

Can you at least concede that the DCI Redwood's Smithman/men 'revelation' e-fits/photo-fits were produced with absolutely NO 'help', at all, from M Smith?

3rd January 2008.

"He, Martin Smith, has given no stories or helped in any photo fits."
Why would I do that?  I believe the efits come from the Smith family.  I simply don't accept that someone sitting at a keyboard in the UK, with no inside knowledge of the case, knows more about what the Smith family saw that night, than the family do themselves.

Well, i concede THAT, Cristobell, nobody knows more than what the Smith family themselves know.

What i asked was were the DCI Redwood's revelation photo-fits/e-fits drawn up WITHOUT the help of M Smith?

The Smithman/men e-fits/photo-fits were drawn up by the OTHER Smith family 'members' with no help from, at all, M Smith, as he has said, on record, to Drogheda Police..

Is that what you believe?

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 15:44

@PeterMac wrote:
@Woofer wrote:
If that was the case, surely he would have come forward and said `hey, that was me` - no one could have been unaware of the publicity at that time.

Many years ago I was in New York.  During my stay there were two murders.  One in Manhattan one in Queens
I have no idea what happened in either investigation and if I was described or seen on CCTV.
I was not involved, I was nowhere near either scene, and have never bothered to do anything to find out.

So why would someone not involved in any way "Come forward"
Tannerman didn't !

Peter - IMO the two aren`t comparable. The Maddie mystery has been full on for years all over the world.

And you don`t honestly believe that OG`s Tannerman is real do you?

____________________
The constant assertion of belief is an indication of fear - Jiddu Krishnamurti

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Woofer on 11.08.14 15:52

Marlie wrote:
Irish Central 14/10/13 wrote:An Irish couple will feature in a major campaign on British television on Monday to find those responsible for the 2007 disappearance of toddler Madeleine McCann from a Portuguese resort.



Drogheda couple Martin and Mary Smith have provided key evidence to a new investigation by British police into the McCann case.

New computer generated images of  a man the Smiths say they saw carrying a young girl through a side-street in the resort of Praia da Luz at the time Madeleine vanished are to be broadcast on BBC television on Monday night.

The Irish Sun report that the computer e-fits of the prime suspect were composed from statements and descriptions given by two members of the Smith family.

Drogheda man Martin was holidaying on the Algarve with his wife Mary, daughter Aoife, son Peter and other family members at the time Madeleine disappeared.

They have again told police of their experience on the night in question when they saw a man carrying a young girl, three or four years old and in a deep sleep, down a street in the seaside resort.

Martin has told the BBC programme that the man was carrying the child along the middle of a deserted side street in an uncomfortable position with her head slumped against him.

The report says she had pale ‘typically British’ skin, blonde shoulder-length hair and wore light coloured or pink pyjamas which match the description of those Madeleine was wearing that night.


The Smiths gave descriptions to Portuguese police two days after the disappearance but no e-fits or sketches were ever produced until now.

The man described by the Smiths is now the central figure in a new gallery of potential suspects to be released by English police’s Operation Grange inquiry into the case.

The images will be broadcast in a special edition of BBC One show Crimewatch on Monday night.
Madeleine’s mum Kate told the programme: “We’re not the ones that have done something wrong here.

“It’s the person who’s gone into that apartment and taken a little girl away from her family.”
Detective Chief Inspector Andy Redwood said: “The e-fits are clear and I’d ask the public to look very carefully at them.”

The Irish Sun reports that one image shows the suspect square-jawed and chubby-faced. In the other he is leaner.

A Scotland Yard police spokesman said: “It’s two different people’s version of the same suspect.”
The Smiths saw the man at around 10pm, around the same time that Kate discovered Madeleine was missing from the family’s apartment.

The BBC programme, which is also to be broadcast in Germany and Holland, features a full reconstruction of the events in Praia da Luz on the night Madeleine disappeared.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/irish-couple-key-witnesses-as-british-police-launch-new-enquiry-into-madeleine-mccann-case-227647711-237782841.html
Thanks Marlie - very interesting.
If we are to believe these reports, Martin Smith did report his sighting to Portuguese police on the 5th.

And - "A Scotland Yard police spokesman said: “It’s two different people’s version of the same suspect.”
which I`ve always thought.  Tony has always disagreed with this I know and said it has got to be two different men.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Cristobell on 11.08.14 15:57

@jeanmonroe wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
@jeanmonroe wrote:Cristobel
---------------------------------------

Can you at least concede that the DCI Redwood's Smithman/men 'revelation' e-fits/photo-fits were produced with absolutely NO 'help', at all, from M Smith?

3rd January 2008.

"He, Martin Smith, has given no stories or helped in any photo fits."
Why would I do that?  I believe the efits come from the Smith family.  I simply don't accept that someone sitting at a keyboard in the UK, with no inside knowledge of the case, knows more about what the Smith family saw that night, than the family do themselves.

Well, i concede THAT, Cristobell, nobody knows more than what the Smith family themselves know.

What i asked was were the DCI Redwood's revelation photo-fits/e-fits drawn up WITHOUT the help of M Smith?

The Smithman/men e-fits/photo-fits were drawn up by the OTHER Smith family 'members' with no help from, at all, M Smith, as he has said, on record, to Drogheda Police..

Is that what you believe?
I have no idea how the efits were drawn up, none of us have.  At the time of that statement, Martin Smith may not have contributed to the efits, but at a later stage may have, we just don't know. Logic dictates that they would all have offered whatever assistance they could.

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Re: Why I believe Smithman is real and likely to be Gerry by Pat Brown

Post by Rob Royston on 11.08.14 15:57

From Peter Mac's earlier post it is obvious that it would take some time to get from the apartment to the Smith sighting spot and still do all the other actions required.
Could a vehicle have been used. There is an out of the way parking area just up from the sighting and to the right, you can see a few cars parked there on Google Maps.
What makes me believe it was Gerry is the trouser buttons described by Aoife Smith. She was at the top of the steps when the man passed and she made this observation. Coupled to her parents recognition of Gerry as he came off the aircraft and the fact that he owned such unusual trousers is it more than just a coincidence?

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