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Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Markus 2 on 03.06.14 20:36

Could well be something significant in that place. The richest man in Portugal owns that ground. .It may be nothing related to Madeline but think of the other child abusers, think of HDLG and the hiding places , tunnels, bodies where supposed to have been found .I hope if they find anything related to child murder whether the McCann's are involved or not that those responsible are brought to justice. But like someone has already said they never betray a Masonic brother. That looks like a tunnel to me. Wonder what is in that area regarding underground activity in the past .If I remember rightly tunnels were mentioned at HDLG


Have they been mapping out underground tunnels

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by annemab on 03.06.14 20:38

But if there was anything significant in that hole, or even if they thought there might be, would a tent not have gone up over it by now?

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Guest on 03.06.14 20:39

Châtelaine wrote:But incidentally this stenching "box" was found under a metal plate ...
So what?

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by 1soapy on 03.06.14 20:42

Re: Coldwater not for real.

Nobodythereeither wrote:

Pigs might fly      


Aiyoyo wrote:


Not necessarily, don’t discount yet.
 
MET officer socially told details of the case.


So/but, the officer:


Might not be in OG.


Might give very general details.


Might be lying.


Might only be sworn to secrecy on certain matters.


Might know nothing or just share inside rumours, be fobbing off or giving selected scrag ends that are of no use or off trail.


I think you are basing your views, nobodythereeither, (which you have rightly recognized as just opinions based without fact or evidence) on very flimsy or nor well thought through stuff. Several posters here do this but thankfully, many don’t too.


I thought Aiyoyo’s point/reason was pretty reasonable and logical, don’t you?


Aiyoyo or other here could be CW and love to respond, but can't - maybe.



I’ll always stand to be corrected and never wish to offend anyone btw and you are entitled to your views.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by bobbin on 03.06.14 20:43

@Shhh wrote:Also from twitter, shame it's from a "pro"


The police are digging in an area used by local residents as a pet cemetery. #mccann cerb32
I was wondering if it is a rock or not but it does look like a donkey's head, bottom left of picture.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Shhh on 03.06.14 20:47

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@Shhh wrote:This lair thing.  If it has been hidden away, unsearched in scrubland would it be fair to assume if anything is found in it the perpretator/s were only made aware of such a hides hole through someone with local knowledge?

Yeah, good point. Anybody in mind?
My mind has gone totally blank.

Did I ever mention my husband comes from Norfolk?

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by roy rovers on 03.06.14 20:53

@annemab wrote:But if there was anything significant in that hole, or even if they thought there might be, would a tent not have gone up over it by now?
If the remains of MM were in that hole they'd have stopped digging elsewhere (unless they're looking for multiple MMs).So safe to say they were having a laugh in that picture. I bet they're enjoying the weather too - looks glorious.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Markus 2 on 03.06.14 20:55

Secret tunnels beneath the Portuguese seaside town where Madeleine McCann vanished two years ago today may hold the key to her ...

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by nobodythereeither on 03.06.14 20:55

@1soapy wrote:Re: Coldwater.

Nobodythereither wrote:

Pigs might fly       


Aiyoyo wrote:


Not necessarily, don’t discount yet.
 
MET officer socially told details of the case.


So:
·         Might not be in OG.
·         Might give very general details.
·         Might be lying.
·         Might only be sworn to secrecy on certain matters.
·         Might know nothing or just share inside rumours or fobbing off.


I think you are basing your views, nothingthereither, (which you have rightly recognized as just opinions based without fact or evidence) on very flimsy or nor well thought through stuff. Several posters here do this (and look silly afterwards if wrong) and thankfully, many don’t.


Aiyoyo's response was very logical, wasn't it?


I’ll always stand to be corrected, sorry if I've misunderstood or missed anything and never wish to offend anyone btw.

What a very strange post.

Aiyoyo wrote: "It's premature to discount CW. 

Wait until the case is over  and you will have your answer."

What is logical about that?

Unless you had read Coldwater's posts - many of which as pointed out above were shown to be completely wrong when the PJ files were released - I don't think you have any basis for saying that my views are based on "very flimsy or nor well thought through stuff".

I don't think you can have read them, as you say Coldwater's so-called detective source "might not be in OG."

Well of course he wasn't, we are talking years before OG even existed  big grin

Oh and by the way, my forum name is not nothingthereeither, so it might be good to get basic things correct before criticising others .....


ETA: Oh, and also by the way, Coldwater did not usually give "very general details", he was often very specific about things, such as the sheet of metal.

And now can we get back on topic?

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Hicks on 03.06.14 20:55

@annemab wrote:But if there was anything significant in that hole, or even if they thought there might be, would a tent not have gone up over it by now?
Exactly. I don't want to appear cynical, I really want to believe that justice for Madeleine is close, but it all look so...can't find the right word.... amateurish?

I imagine the world and it's mother will be focused on PDL through the lens of the worlds press. Would evidence be recovered in the full glare of all these cameras?

It could be the case that while everyone is watching the digging taking place something is happening elsewhere in private.

Personally, I will feel slightly gutted if all of this comes to nothing, though not totally surprised.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Shhh on 03.06.14 20:56

@roy rovers wrote:
@annemab wrote:But if there was anything significant in that hole, or even if they thought there might be, would a tent not have gone up over it by now?
If the remains of MM were in that hole they'd have stopped digging elsewhere (unless they're looking for multiple MMs).So safe to say they were having a laugh in that picture. I bet they're enjoying the weather too - looks glorious.
I'm inclined to agree.  A video would be much more telling than a picture

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by aiyoyo on 03.06.14 21:00

@annemab wrote:But if there was anything significant in that hole, or even if they thought there might be, would a tent not have gone up over it by now?

Tent is useful to shield body from press cameras but 7-year old beyond recognition remains won't be needing a tent.

The tents they'd in place is shelter/rest and refreshment place for crews and possibly also shelter for equipment (eg. PC, 3G phone etc) from heat of sun.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Markus 2 on 03.06.14 21:02

[color:e98c=000000][color:e98c=000000]http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/197591/Peadophile-ring-with-link-to-Madeleine-McCann-jailedA GROUP of rich and powerful men in Portugal have been jailed for their involvement in a paedophile ring which some believe is linked to the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

[size=18]A former ambassador, a television presenter, a doctor and a lawyer were found guilty on Friday after an eight-year investigation and a six-year trial which shook the country, with 32 men giving evidence of hundreds of crimes committed against them when they were children.

[/size]



[color:e98c=000000]Members of the ring snatched children as they slept at the state-run Casa Pia orphanages in Lisbon and took them to grand houses to endure sickening abuse.

One of the abused boys, Pedro Namora, is now a lawyer and was a key witness in the case.

He wants Portuguese detectives to continue their probe as he believes the ring may be connected to the disappearance of Madeleine at the Praia da Luz resort on the Algarve in May 2007.

Speaking to the Sunday Express, Mr Namora said: "During the summer children were taken to the summer homes of paedophiles on the Algarve. It was highly organised and involved a lot of planning and control.

"It is possible that those connected with the ring who have not been caught may be involved in Madeleine's disappearance. I do think detectives should look at this possibility. No stone should be left unturned."

Although most of the abuse involved hundreds of boys, he said some girls also fell victim to the gang.

One man arrested in the case and later released without charge was said to have had a great interest in the ancient underground tunnels running under Praia da Luz.

THEY COULD FIND THINGS RELATED TO THIS ,BUT MADDIE ? SOMEONE TURNED IN EVIDENCE ON THIS MAYBE

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by 1soapy on 03.06.14 21:11

Nobodythereeither.


I had corrected and posted your details, but not before your copy/paste. Bit superficial tit for tat to raise though, with respect. Motive was I saw a response I thought sensible and answered reasonably.


Aiyoyo logical as in – site hacked, identity found, Pro’s attack and maybe didn’t want to continue for that reason.


Regarding the rest, my last line answers all of that.


Thank you

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by rustyjames on 03.06.14 21:14

An earlier article on tunnels and a mention of Smithman.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/98630/Maddie-Did-she-vanish-in-maze-of-tunnels

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by ChippyM on 03.06.14 21:17

@roy rovers wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:

Is it just me or is the body language interesting.

Man on right bringing back of hand up to his face to stop himself gagging.
Next man in standing to attention
Girl behind him turning away and pushing past behind him at speed
There is a rubber bucket with lid in the ground behind them, I think

It could of course, like many old spaces, be full of ordure and detritus and dead dogs.  The unreliable ones
***
I agree. Peter. The body language is interesting and there's a lot of drama in these scene. I don't think seasoned coppers would turn away from a dead dog.And the woman IMO is seeking some brief comfort from a shoulder, rather then speeding away.

There may a video of this, I only have seen the photo.

Dead dog or dead person may not distinguishable just from first glance, but the stench would be enough to cause the body language.  


Oh come on they could be saying anything or having a laugh.[/quote]

 i think the woman is walking out of the frame it's just perspective that makes her appear close to her colleague. Maybe she is going to get something. I don't think she has been shocked by anything why would the woman officer be shocked but not the men?

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Guest on 03.06.14 21:22

@ChippyM wrote:
@roy rovers wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:

Is it just me or is the body language interesting.

Man on right bringing back of hand up to his face to stop himself gagging.
Next man in standing to attention
Girl behind him turning away and pushing past behind him at speed
There is a rubber bucket with lid in the ground behind them, I think

It could of course, like many old spaces, be full of ordure and detritus and dead dogs.  The unreliable ones
***
I agree. Peter. The body language is interesting and there's a lot of drama in these scene. I don't think seasoned coppers would turn away from a dead dog.And the woman IMO is seeking some brief comfort from a shoulder, rather then speeding away.

There may a video of this, I only have seen the photo.

Dead dog or dead person may not distinguishable just from first glance, but the stench would be enough to cause the body language.  


Oh come on they could be saying anything or having a laugh.

 i think the woman is walking out of the frame it's just perspective that makes her appear close to her colleague. Maybe she is going to get something. I don't think she has been shocked by anything why would the woman officer be shocked but not the men?[/quote]
***
You seriously messed up the quotes ... What you post I said, wasvsaid by PeterMac, what you quote Aiyoyo said, was a comment of mine, etc.
 sad 
Confusion is good ...

ETA AH!!! quotes are messing up themselves, like mine above ...

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Gillyspot on 03.06.14 21:24


____________________
Kate McCann "I know that what happened is not due to the fact of us leaving the children asleep. I know it happened under other circumstances"

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Tunnel vision?

Post by canada12 on 03.06.14 21:25

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id1.html

In an interview given to the Catholic newspaper The Tablet, published 16 June 2007, 
Gerry McCann told of an "extraordinary experience" inside the church in Praia da Luz just days after Madeleine's disappearance. The experience inspired him to launch the global campaign to find his daughter.


He said: "When I was praying I started thinking of all the things that were happening. There were lots and lots of ideas in my head and how we could make things better and I was really feeling very down and not sure which way to proceed. I had this mental image of being in a tunnel and instead of the light at the end of the tunnel being extremely narrow and a distant spot, the light opened up and the tunnel got wider and wider and went in many different directions. I talked to you (Kate) about it and said, 'I am not prepared to pursue one path. We are going to do everything in our power to influence things.'

"It was almost like something - I am not saying it was the Holy Spirit - came into me and gave me that image. That is when I really felt I had a clear path."

Was it a religious experience?

"I can't say it was a vision because I am not clear what a vision is but I had a mental image and it certainly helped me decide. I became a man possessed that night. The next day I was up at dawn, making phone calls."

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by nobodythereeither on 03.06.14 21:25

@1soapy wrote:Nobodythereeither.


I had corrected and posted your details, but not before your copy/paste. Bit superficial tit for tat to raise though, with respect. Motive was I saw a response I thought sensible and answered reasonably.


Aiyoyo logical as in – site hacked, identity found, Pro’s attack and maybe didn’t want to continue for that reason.


Regarding the rest, my last line answers all of that.


Thank you

Another poster has also commented on Coldwater above.

Why don't you read their posts abour Coldwater too, and respond to them in the manner you have responded to me?

You are confusing several separate issues:

1. The veracity or otherwise of Coldwater's posts (which you have not yet said that you have actually read. Have you?) and Aiyoyo's suggestion that the conclusion of this case will show him to be right or wrong. It is that that I find illogical. I believe that Coldwater has already been shown to be wrong about many of the things he stated as fact, which was apparent as soon as the PJ files were made public, but  because I don't have his posts to hand I can't be sure about that.

2. The likelihood of his/her having a British detective as a source who provided him/her with titbits about the case at social occasions.

3. The reason why Coldwater stopped posting his "inside information."

Which do you think is more likely:

a). Coldwater stopped posting because pros found out who he was and he was afraid for his family (or whatever) (Aiyoyo's given reason - which appears to be, er, purely his opinion).

b). The release of the PJ files into the public domain demonstrated that much of what Coldwater had previously posted (and which forum members lapped up) was fiction.

Or do you think it is complete coincidence that Coldwater stopped posting just at the point the case was shelved?

?

Anyway, I really don't want to continue this ridiculous conversation with you.

If you think Aiyoyo is completely logical and I'm completely illogical then fine. Think away.

ETA: And all the above is MY OPINION ONLY!!

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by ChippyM on 03.06.14 21:26

Châtelaine wrote:
@ChippyM wrote:
@roy rovers wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
Châtelaine wrote:

Is it just me or is the body language interesting.

Man on right bringing back of hand up to his face to stop himself gagging.
Next man in standing to attention
Girl behind him turning away and pushing past behind him at speed
There is a rubber bucket with lid in the ground behind them, I think

It could of course, like many old spaces, be full of ordure and detritus and dead dogs.  The unreliable ones
***
I agree. Peter. The body language is interesting and there's a lot of drama in these scene. I don't think seasoned coppers would turn away from a dead dog.And the woman IMO is seeking some brief comfort from a shoulder, rather then speeding away.

There may a video of this, I only have seen the photo.

Dead dog or dead person may not distinguishable just from first glance, but the stench would be enough to cause the body language.  


Oh come on they could be saying anything or having a laugh.

 i think the woman is walking out of the frame it's just perspective that makes her appear close to her colleague. Maybe she is going to get something. I don't think she has been shocked by anything why would the woman officer be shocked but not the men?
***
You seriously messed up the quotes ... What you post I said, wasvsaid by PeterMac, what you quote Aiyoyo said, was a comment of mine, etc.
 sad 
Confusion is good ...
[/quote]

 I didn't mean to mess anything up, just clicked quote, I was commenting with reference to the points everyone has made re. body language in the photo, no confusion intended.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Markus 2 on 03.06.14 21:28

@rustyjames wrote:An earlier article on tunnels and a mention of Smithman.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/98630/Maddie-Did-she-vanish-in-maze-of-tunnels

We don't know if that corrugate goes on any further especially if the earth has not been dug either side ,might be part of a tunnel or just one off hole. They could find a lot related to this other scandal imo
 
The archaeologist involved with these tunnels was arrested as an abuser in the Casa Pia case but later released [this was a notorious child abuse scandal centring on orphanages in Lisbon].
“Does this not send alarm bells ringing? Something not right in Portugal. Why are the PJ not searching these tunnels and the church?”


They just might have opened up another can of worms .
 
I don't think this is related to Madeline not the usual victim, seems they are taken from homes.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by 1soapy on 03.06.14 21:29

Hi nobodythereeither.

No offence meant/apologies. I am very ignorant on CW and do not know the detail to which he posted and am happy to accept that he/she was wrong on occasions and that this is justification/evidence of her/him not being all he/she claimed to be. Hope this is acceptable and we can move on and back on topic.

Thanks.

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by TellTheTruth on 03.06.14 21:29

@Shhh wrote:Also from twitter, shame it's from a "pro"


The police are digging in an area used by local residents as a pet cemetery. #mccann cerb32
Sorry, still catching up so this has probably been brought but they were not local residents, so how on earth would they possibly know of this place?

 They had only been in the area a matter of days. This gets more bizarre by the day. If they did have local knowledge then "How?" has got to be a question asked.


When I go on holiday I might find out where the best fish and chip shop might be but the local dead pet dump??? Why would any holiday maker need to know that?


I wonder if the TV is on at Rotheley Manor and they are keeping up to date with the latest developments, if they are tuned in to the internet, if they are off their food and wine...

 I hope they are quaking in their running shoes.

Poor little Maddie and I feel so sorry for those poor twins. How can they ever have a normal childhood when the truth finally emerges. empathy

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Re: Digging to start next week - UPDATE... starting today 2/6/14

Post by Markus 2 on 03.06.14 21:32

Something not right in Portugal. Certainly not in that case ,just makes me wonder have we got it right.

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