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Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Tangled Web on 30.04.14 9:02

@PeterMac wrote:Parents divorced
He was 15
Mother was on holiday ! !

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616326/Boy-suspects-mother-holiday-Gran-Canaria-Further-details-emerge-teenager-accused-stabbing-teacher.html
Boy suspect's mother 'was on holiday in Gran Canaria': Further details emerge about teenager accused of stabbing teacher
Mother of Ann Maguire murder suspect 'heard news while on holiday'
Yesterday, it is understood she was going back to Leeds
The loner enjoyed violent video games and heavy metal bands
Boy lived with his mother after she divorced his father, it was said

Would it be a combination of bullying, feeling alone, being left alone and playing these violent video games that would drive a child to do this or do the video games desensitise children so they really don't know what they're doing?

It worries me as my eldest son is 12 and in his first year at secondary school. The pressure to play these games is immense and the child can be bullied for not being allowed to play them. His friends have been allowed to play them since the age of 8 and some even younger.

I'd like to think that if my son felt secure, knew right from wrong and didn't spend hours alone in his room online, then nothing in a video game could make him kill somebody. Am I wrong? It is a worry of mine.

Such a tragic waste of life.


Tangled Web.


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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by russiandoll on 30.04.14 9:30

There is a chance that the psychiatric assessment which has been done to establish his fitness for questioning might have diagnosed a severe psychotic episode. He might be suffering from schizophrenia,


   I was disgusted last night to hear the crass remark and insensitivity of a radio presenter, Julia Hartley- Brewer, when commenting on this tragedy for the Sky news review.  The point she was making I disagreed with, but even if it had some merit, it was so badly worded it was astounding.

 She said that if this had happened in America, there would have been a massacre. That was in the second show, repeating what she had said an hour earlier.
 Then she had said that as awful as it was, at least it had been a knife , not a gun.

 She failed to grasp a few things, firstly that for the family of Mrs Maguire, multiple stab wounds as a cause of death would be possibly more horrific than hearing she had died from gunshot wounds.
 She failed to grasp that the young Americans who went into schools and shot teacher[s] and students either had as their targets multiple people, or went into a shooting frenzy and fired their weapons indiscriminately.
 She failed to grasp that in the confines of an average British classroom, with one female adult and his peers for company, this attacker could have inflicted wounds on the teacher and run amok stabbing indiscriminately at some of his classmates, there could have been more deaths and injuries in this incident.

There have been no reports of this boy targeting anyone other than Mrs Maguire, which to me indicates that his focus was only her.

 Whatever point JHB was trying to make  [ she also said we have learnt the lessons from Dunblane , no elaboration on that remark]... to be a broadcaster who knows about language and to have said AT LEAST IT WAS A KNIFE was appalling imo.

 The presenter Anna Botting should have had a word with her in the break and got her to clarify her remark. Instead she was allowed to almost repeat it an hour later with AB replying " indeed" to JHB's opinion, stated as fact, that this would have been a massacre if it had happened in the USA, as if a teenage gunman could never shoot a teacher and not target students.

 if I had been the man sitting with her , I would have left during the break out of disgust.
 I hope that no members of this family come across this be grateful for small mercies stuff, because the boy who killed their wife/ mother had a knife in his hand and not a gun.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Tony Bennett on 30.04.14 9:38

@Tangled Web wrote:

Would it be a combination of bullying, feeling alone, being left alone and playing these violent video games that would drive a child to do this or do the video games desensitise children so they really don't know what they're doing?

It worries me as my eldest son is 12 and in his first year at secondary school. The pressure to play these games is immense and the child can be bullied for not being allowed to play them. His friends have been allowed to play them since the age of 8 and some even younger.

I'd like to think that if my son felt secure, knew right from wrong and didn't spend hours alone in his room online, then nothing in a video game could make him kill somebody. Am I wrong? It is a worry of mine.

Tangled Web.

Good morning Tangled Web.

These are important matters you raise.  

There is, first of all, a real problem of addiction to these games - for adults or children.

That is unhealthy, whether it is Mario, Pacman, or something much more sinister and violent.

It will probably benefit every child to strictly limit the amount of time they play on video/computer games each day.

There are countless examples of people who have committed the most gruesome crimes based at least in part on watching violent scenes on films, TV or videos/DVDs, computer games etc.

Off the top of my head are these examples: Anders Breivik (shot dead 77 people in Norway), some of the U.S. school massacres, Vincent Tabak who murdered Joanna Yeates in Bristol...so many others if I had time to look up all the references.

In terms of violence, there are things like cowboy films which we all watched without I think becoming unduly desensitised to violence.

But today, some videos, video and computer games etc. portray a very sinister, personalised form of violence - cruel, sadistic. (Take the film 'The Hunger Games' for example - these films sow seeds in manhy children's minds).

I note that WLBTS reacted rather defensively on this thread because he admits to making computer games. I hope WLBTS that the games you produce are wholly non-violent, in which case the only damage done is if children spend too much time on them. Having said that, there are some very good educational games out there - Cool Math Games for example which helps primary school children to learn maths and solve problems.

IMO there will be no problem regarding watching video games, even the odd violent ones, for children who know they are dependably loved and have been taught boundaries.

However, in so many ways, we are gradually sinking, morally, these days...the boundaries of what is acceptable are widening all the time and at quite a pace. Even dependably loved children from 'good' homes can be subtly drawn into many wrong things.

So keep an eye on your son's viewing habits  thumbsup

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Tangled Web on 30.04.14 11:03

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@Tangled Web wrote:

Would it be a combination of bullying, feeling alone, being left alone and playing these violent video games that would drive a child to do this or do the video games desensitise children so they really don't know what they're doing?

It worries me as my eldest son is 12 and in his first year at secondary school. The pressure to play these games is immense and the child can be bullied for not being allowed to play them. His friends have been allowed to play them since the age of 8 and some even younger.

I'd like to think that if my son felt secure, knew right from wrong and didn't spend hours alone in his room online, then nothing in a video game could make him kill somebody. Am I wrong? It is a worry of mine.

Tangled Web.

Good morning Tangled Web.

These are important matters you raise.  

There is, first of all, a real problem of addiction to these games - for adults or children.

That is unhealthy, whether it is Mario, Pacman, or something much more sinister and violent.

It will probably benefit every child to strictly limit the amount of time they play on video/computer games each day.

There are countless examples of people who have committed the most gruesome crimes based at least in part on watching violent scenes on films, TV or videos/DVDs, computer games etc.

Off the top of my head are these examples: Anders Breivik (shot dead 77 people in Norway), some of the U.S. school massacres, Vincent Tabak who murdered Joanna Yeates in Bristol...so many others if I had time to look up all the references.

In terms of violence, there are things like cowboy films which we all watched without I think becoming unduly desensitised to violence.

But today, some videos, video and computer games etc. portray a very sinister, personalised form of violence - cruel, sadistic. (Take the film 'The Hunger Games' for example - these films sow seeds in manhy children's minds).

I note that WLBTS reacted rather defensively on this thread because he admits to making computer games. I hope WLBTS that the games you produce are wholly non-violent, in which case the only damage done is if children spend too much time on them. Having said that, there are some very good educational games out there - Cool Math Games for example which helps primary school children to learn maths and solve problems.

IMO there will be no problem regarding watching video games, even the odd violent ones, for children who know they are dependably loved and have been taught boundaries.

However, in so many ways, we are gradually sinking, morally, these days...the boundaries of what is acceptable are widening all the time and at quite a pace. Even dependably loved children from 'good' homes can be subtly drawn into many wrong things.

So keep an eye on your son's viewing habits  thumbsup


Good morning to you too, Mr Bennett and thank you for your comments. I suppose it's like anything really, moderation is key. It's fine to play these games but lots of stability, love and things like family time, going out with friends and sports are also needed for a well-rounded upbringing. Fingers crossed our son continues to be the bright, well mannered, considerate young man he is now  smilie

I've made us sound like The Waltons! We are far from it.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by PeterMac on 30.04.14 11:11

@Tony Bennett wrote:
In terms of violence, there are things like cowboy films which we all watched without I think becoming unduly desensitised to violence.
I am not sure about that.
The cowboy films taught that a .45 bullet would make a small flesh wound and could be dug out with a penknife, rather than the reality of blowing the arm or shoulder apart.
They taught that you could smash an opponent on the jaw with all your force, and that he would then stand up and do the same to you, over and over again.
The reality is that most fights end after one blow, the victim with a broken jaw and teeth, and the assailant with a broken hand.
Films teach that you can kick a man repeatedly whilst he is on the floor and two frames later he will get up. The reality strikes home when a young person who has kicked someone int he head finds himself in the dock accused or Murder.
And more recently we have the strange juxtaposition of slow and fast motion, so that a hero can outrun an explosion and then do one of those strange long jumps with arms and legs continuing to run in the air, lasting for several seconds.

Modern computer games seem to glorify violence and crime.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by tigger on 30.04.14 11:22

@PeterMac wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:
In terms of violence, there are things like cowboy films which we all watched without I think becoming unduly desensitised to violence.
I am not sure about that.  
The cowboy films taught that a .45 bullet would make a small flesh wound and could be dug out with a penknife, rather than the reality of blowing the arm or shoulder apart.
They taught that you could smash an opponent on the jaw with all your force, and that he would then stand up and do the same to you, over and over again.
The reality is that most fights end after one blow, the victim with a broken jaw and teeth, and the assailant with a broken hand.
Films teach that you can kick a man repeatedly whilst he is on the floor and two frames later he will get up.  The reality strikes home when a young person who has kicked someone int he head finds himself in the dock accused or Murder.
And more recently we have the strange juxtaposition of slow and fast motion, so that a hero can outrun an explosion and then do one of those strange long jumps with arms and legs continuing to run in the air, lasting for several seconds.

Modern computer games seem to glorify violence and crime.  

Old ones did as well, there were indications in the James Bulger case tharthe boys were fond of a particular horror film (for children!) and that it seemed to have inspired the way they killed James Bulger.


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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Guest on 30.04.14 11:34

I don't know if it was ever confirmed that those boys had ever seen the film - Chucky was it?

I agree with what's been said that video games by themselves aren't going to turn a normal well-adjusted person into a homicidal maniac.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by whatliesbehindthesofa on 30.04.14 12:05

@Tony Bennett wrote:
I note that WLBTS reacted rather defensively on this thread because he admits to making computer games. I hope WLBTS that the games you produce are wholly non-violent, in which case the only damage done is if children spend too much time on them. Having said that, there are some very good educational games out there - Cool Math Games for example which helps primary school children to learn maths and solve problems.

I don't feel the need to obtain your seal of approval of the games that I've been involved in writing.

I find the reference to 'damage' being done rather ironic, when you are campaigning for 'intelligent design' to be taught alongside evolution in schools.

What if the games I write are not wholly non-violent? Are you saying that I'm involved in damaging children?

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by whatliesbehindthesofa on 30.04.14 12:28

I'm actually rather proud of what I do and have done in my career for a long time now.

As an example, I was part of a small team that wrote an online game that has been played by millions of people over the last ten years. Based on how much of that game I developed, and the time it would take on average to play through it, I estimate that I've provided somewhere around 50 million hours of entertainment just through that game, and that was something that took 9 months to write. It is a very nice feeling to write some character dialogue that will be read by millions of people the next Monday or Tuesday morning.

It hasn't all been 'violent' stuff by the way, I'm not a fan of violent games in general. But the definition of 'violence' here is bound to be highly subjective.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Cristobell on 30.04.14 12:29

@Tangled Web wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:Parents divorced
He was 15
Mother was on holiday ! !

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616326/Boy-suspects-mother-holiday-Gran-Canaria-Further-details-emerge-teenager-accused-stabbing-teacher.html
Boy suspect's mother 'was on holiday in Gran Canaria': Further details emerge about teenager accused of stabbing teacher
Mother of Ann Maguire murder suspect 'heard news while on holiday'
Yesterday, it is understood she was going back to Leeds
The loner enjoyed violent video games and heavy metal bands
Boy lived with his mother after she divorced his father, it was said

Would it be a combination of bullying, feeling alone, being left alone and playing these violent video games that would drive a child to do this or do the video games desensitise children so they really don't know what they're doing?

It worries me as my eldest son is 12 and in his first year at secondary school. The pressure to play these games is immense and the child can be bullied for not being allowed to play them. His friends have been allowed to play them since the age of 8 and some even younger.

I'd like to think that if my son felt secure, knew right from wrong and didn't spend hours alone in his room online, then nothing in a video game could make him kill somebody. Am I wrong? It is a worry of mine.


Such a tragic waste of life.


Tangled Web.

No, you are not wrong Tangled Web - any child who is loved enough will not grow up to be a criminal  smilie 

I'm afraid I do not know where the quote comes from, but I do that it is true.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Cristobell on 30.04.14 12:50

I think if we look at pictures on cave walls, we will see examples of running, jumping and killing people, indeed, any art form, the Old Masters produced graphic scenes of massacre, rape and violence that would chill most viewers to the bone.  Among the reading material available to me when I was 'imprisoned' in the convent, were dozens of books depicting the ways and means in which Martyrs were hung, drawn, quartered and beheaded and burned at the stake.  Almost every day, we were forced to go to church and stare at the imagine of a half naked man nailed to a cross with blood seeping from his hands, feet and sides and a crown of thorns on his head.  Lets get things into perspective, violence is not a new phenomenon.    

Graphic violent games, like graphic violent films do not turn people into rampaging murderers, and the evidence for that is staggering.  If one person in ten million sees a violent film and acts out their fantasies, there are 9m+ who did not.  The two boys who took Jamie Bulger had a lot more problems than watching horror videos unsupervised.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ultimaThule on 30.04.14 13:03

@Cristobell wrote:
@Tangled Web wrote:
Would it be a combination of bullying, feeling alone, being left alone and playing these violent video games that would drive a child to do this or do the video games desensitise children so they really don't know what they're doing?

It worries me as my eldest son is 12 and in his first year at secondary school. The pressure to play these games is immense and the child can be bullied for not being allowed to play them. His friends have been allowed to play them since the age of 8 and some even younger.

I'd like to think that if my son felt secure, knew right from wrong and didn't spend hours alone in his room online, then nothing in a video game could make him kill somebody. Am I wrong? It is a worry of mine.


Such a tragic waste of life.


Tangled Web.

No, you are not wrong Tangled Web - any child who is loved enough will not grow up to be a criminal  smilie 

I'm afraid I do not know where the quote comes from, but I do that it is true.
This is yet another sweeping generalisation that has no basis in truth and is an insult to all of those loving and law abiding parents who've watched helplessly as the children they adore engage in criminal behaviour.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Cristobell on 30.04.14 13:11

I stand by what I said UT, and it is based on empirical evidence.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Tony Bennett on 30.04.14 13:23

@ultimaThule wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
No, you are not wrong Tangled Web - any child who is loved enough will not grow up to be a criminal   

This is yet another sweeping generalisation that has no basis in truth and is an insult to all of those loving and law abiding parents who've watched helplessly as the children they adore engage in criminal behaviour.
There is surely no need to fall out about this.

The following principles could probably be agreed:

* A child who is dependably loved asnd secure means a child who is less likely to commit crime

* Love alone is insufficient; things like discipline, traning and poverty also play a part

* Even loved, well-brought-up children can go off the rails, when they reach maturity, they can make their own life choices, sometimes very wrong.

I have to add, uT, that 'adoring' your child is quite different from 'loving' him/her

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by Cristobell on 30.04.14 14:03

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
No, you are not wrong Tangled Web - any child who is loved enough will not grow up to be a criminal   

This is yet another sweeping generalisation that has no basis in truth and is an insult to all of those loving and law abiding parents who've watched helplessly as the children they adore engage in criminal behaviour.
There is surely no need to fall out about this.

The following principles could probably be agreed:

* A child who is dependably loved asnd secure means a child who is less likely to commit crime

* Love alone is insufficient; things like discipline, traning and poverty also play a part

* Even loved, well-brought-up children can go off the rails, when they reach maturity, they can make their own life choices, sometimes very wrong.

I have to add, uT, that 'adoring' your child is quite different from 'loving' him/her
I'm cool Tony  smilie 

For many years I have been tubthumping about parenting classes in schools as part of the curriculum.  So many young parents are absolutely clueless, they are either isolated geographically from their families, or they reject their wisdom of their mums, aunts etc, and demonstrate their love for their children through possessions, its easier than spending time with them.  

I once sat and watched a young mum in an Asda cafe, put her beautiful designer clad baby in a highchair, place a bag of chips and a bottle in front of the tot, while the mum sat and concentrated on the screen of her phone.  The baby was cooing and babbling and reaching out to her, but not once did the mum look up from her phone.  It was one of the saddest things I have ever seen. 

We are in a sorry state, children dare not go outside because of the danger of abductors lurking on every corner, so parents stick them in front of computer screens and supply them with a waitress service of non stop junk food and fizzy drinks, to spare the little blighters from becoming upset. Giving children everything they want is interpreted by many as proof of love, and its not confined to the lower and working classes.  I watched the Educating Essex programme with Mr. Drew last night and as one of the boys refused to attend his class, his mother offered, and ran and got him, every kind of drink she could think of, in order to get him to behave. She was run ragged showing her love for her child, but he still continued to act like a monster. In enabling his behaviour she is in effect ruining any life he may have in the future.  I don't doubt that the Mother's love is real, but it isn't love.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ultimaThule on 30.04.14 14:37

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:
No, you are not wrong Tangled Web - any child who is loved enough will not grow up to be a criminal   

This is yet another sweeping generalisation that has no basis in truth and is an insult to all of those loving and law abiding parents who've watched helplessly as the children they adore engage in criminal behaviour.
There is surely no need to fall out about this.

The following principles could probably be agreed:

* A child who is dependably loved asnd secure means a child who is less likely to commit crime

* Love alone is insufficient; things like discipline, traning and poverty also play a part

* Even loved, well-brought-up children can go off the rails, when they reach maturity, they can make their own life choices, sometimes very wrong.

I have to add, uT, that 'adoring' your child is quite different from 'loving' him/hera
I fully endorse and agree with your principles, Tony, and in particular your recognition that love alone is insufficient to ensure that a child won't grow up to be a criminal or engage in criminal behaviour.  

Fwiw, I chose the word 'adore' to avoid having to use more words to counteract the suggestion of insufficient love being the cause of criminality.  For me, 'adoring' a child does not equate to pampering or spoiling or tolerating unacceptable behaviour and in this instance my use of the word simply signifies the enormity and the depth of the love that caring parents instinctively feel for their children.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.14 15:15

She was stabbed in front of a full classroom, I wonder whether the rest of the class made any attempt to restrain the boy?

Won't be easy when he'd a knife but not impossible either if a group of them tackle or distract him.

Some 15 year-olds can be big burly and strong.

I know it is easier said than done, but I just can't get my head round how she could be attacked in a crowd and not received help in useful time.

Very tragic for her family, a senseless loss of life in such a violence manner is something the family won't get over ever


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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ultimaThule on 30.04.14 15:32

There's more information here, aiyoyo: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616315/Stabbed-teacher-Ann-Maguire-screamed-children-attacker-struck.html

A violent attack of this nature which is made without warning can cause a sense disbelief in onlookers which may make them slower to react than if there had been some verbal exchange before the attack occurred, but it seems that Mrs Maguire's only thought was to spare her pupils the trauma of seeing her succombe to her injuries.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ChippyM on 30.04.14 15:42

I'm disapointed (but not surprised) to see the media go down the usual route of focusing on this kids interests. He was a Goth, a heavy metal fan, into the occult ("apparently" he may have watched a couple of films or read one or two books!) he was 'obsessed' with video games. It would be a sensible stances to accept a possibility that he had mental health issues which caused him to lose control and he would have done this regardless of the music or games he was into.? Maybe he had a psychotic episode caused by drugs or a chemical imbalance.

   The reports of the particular teacher being well liked and so kind re-inforce this theory for me, it was a totally irrational thing to do, it doesn't seem as if she had done anything to make her a target for the pupil.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ChippyM on 30.04.14 15:47

@ultimaThule wrote:There's more information here, aiyoyo: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616315/Stabbed-teacher-Ann-Maguire-screamed-children-attacker-struck.html

A violent attack of this nature which is made without warning can cause a sense disbelief in onlookers which may make them slower to react than if there had been some verbal exchange before the attack occurred, but it seems that Mrs Maguire's only thought was to spare her pupils the trauma of seeing her succombe to her injuries.


 According to that article he may have held a grudge against her because she gave him detention, still an extremely over the top reaction that you would expect of someone severe mental problems.

   I would have thought he concealed the knife and inflicted quite serious injuries quickly which I agree would have been a shock for the pupils, she then left the room as he chased her, it must have happened very quickly.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by whatliesbehindthesofa on 30.04.14 16:06

Those kids are also victims, from witnessing something that will most likely traumatise them for the rest of their lives.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.14 16:19

@ultimaThule wrote:There's more information here, aiyoyo: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616315/Stabbed-teacher-Ann-Maguire-screamed-children-attacker-struck.html

A violent attack of this nature which is made without warning can cause a sense disbelief in onlookers which may make them slower to react than if there had been some verbal exchange before the attack occurred, but it seems that Mrs Maguire's only thought was to spare her pupils the trauma of seeing her succombe to her injuries.

I've seen that, but is that a basis to stop them coming to her help ?

They didn't have to comply to her instruction under the circumstances surely ?

I'm thinking if she can still manage to shout at them at that stage, she can't have known she was going to die from her injuries.
 More likely she was concerned for their safety when she ordered them out; she didn't want them facing the same danger.
If the boy meant to target only her it's likely the boy had a grudge against her; unless he is a dormant case of a nutter who suddenly went lost control and could go on a stabbing spree randomly at people in the class.  

It was reported he was punished by having his mobile phone confiscated, not sure whether it was by this teacher or not, but if it was it is maybe just a case of a spoilt kid who got whatever he wants at home and never punished for anything, and so couldn't swallow the discipline melt out at school.  Maybe it's simply a question of not understanding the need for boundary and resentful of punishment.  We shall see what pans out.

To attempt to find an excuse, including trying to attribute it to some mental illness to try and rationalise such behavior is too convenient IMO.  
It is easy from retrospect to want to find an excuse that can support the madness of it, otherwise a mentally normal being committing a senselessly violent act just assault our values.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.14 16:31

@ChippyM wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:There's more information here, aiyoyo: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616315/Stabbed-teacher-Ann-Maguire-screamed-children-attacker-struck.html

A violent attack of this nature which is made without warning can cause a sense disbelief in onlookers which may make them slower to react than if there had been some verbal exchange before the attack occurred, but it seems that Mrs Maguire's only thought was to spare her pupils the trauma of seeing her succombe to her injuries.


 According to that article he may have held a grudge against her because she gave him detention, still an extremely over the top reaction that you would expect of someone severe mental problems.

Not necessarily. Kids who are never punished at home may not accept outside-home punishment with good grace.
They believe if their parents do not punish them no one else has the right to do so.
Not saying he falls into this category ....just saying there are kids who won't accept NO for an answer ever, resent being punished, and can harbour resentment without sense of reasoning or understanding. Especially where confiscation of mobile phone is concerned as most kids these days live and die by their cell phone. It's a tool they use to play games, whatsapp, text, access internet...it's an absolute must to them they have it on them 24/7 and taking it away from them even temporarily can be drastic and can cause drama.


   I would have thought he concealed the knife and inflicted quite serious injuries quickly which I agree would have been a shock for the pupils, she then left the room as he chased her, it must have happened very quickly.

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by ChippyM on 30.04.14 16:53

Aiyoyo, I agree that upbringing has probably played a part. Some parents let their kids do whatever they want when they are little and don't think it could be a problem when they hit puberty and get much bigger and more aggresive.  I also think some parents don't realise how divorces and new partners can affect their children.  I think it's likely to be a combination of things but then again their are millions of unhappy teenagers who don't carry out murder when they are peed off.

 When you say 'dormant nutter' who just started stabbing people, it could be a sign of schizophrenia, for some reason it comes through when some boys hit their late teenage years. I'm not saying all schizophrenics are violent though, most are not .

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Re: Teacher stabbed to death in West Yorkshire High School

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.14 17:34

It is yet to be established whether he killed her to get even, or he's an undiagnosed schizophrenics, but he's underlying psychological or mental issue that much is clear.


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