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Your slip is showing...

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by sonic72 on 09.03.14 5:48

Sorry, a little of topic but....

ultimaThule, you must have the forum record of most posts in the shortest space of time!

You're well on your way to 2000 posts in such a short time! You must have loads of free time!?!

You've been here 1 year less than me but made almost ten times the posts I have! I'm not the biggest poster, and I certainly don't have the time to make so many in just a few months!

You must spend a lot of time commenting on this case! I'm guessing you're retired or something?

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by bobbin on 09.03.14 7:00

@sonic72 wrote:Sorry, a little of topic but....

ultimaThule, you must have the forum record of most posts in the shortest space of time!

You're well on your way to 2000 posts in such a short time! You must have loads of free time!?!

You've been here 1 year less than me but made almost ten times the posts I have! I'm not the biggest poster, and I certainly don't have the time to make so many in just a few months!

You must spend a lot of time commenting on this case! I'm guessing you're retired or something?

What a strange comment to make, and Yes, well off topic, you must have spent quite some time observing this one poster to make such a comment.
It leads me to ask you two questions.
1. What was the point of your posting ?
2. Does it help to get closer to finding out what happened to Madeleine ?
Have you looked at how many posts other people have made, perhaps you would like to make a chart.
I don't know if it will add anything to finding Maddie but who knows, maybe it will.
I certainly didn't think that posting was a competition or a guessing game, to try to find out the personal details of other posters' backgrounds.
PeterMac, to date, has made some 6,500 posts. Plebgate some 2,600, just from looking back over the last few pages.
Is that a good place to start a chart.
Perhaps it would be better though to open a new thread for it rather than take an existing one off topic.  spin

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by Guest on 09.03.14 7:41

@bobbin statistics can be found by clicking on memberslist. Charts already there. Great forum.
Thank you to all that work so hard to keep it this way.
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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by tigger on 09.03.14 7:51

@Okeydokey wrote:
@mariola wrote:basta ya!over to you okeydokey.

It's definitely a D to the beginning of the mistake. Not sure if English is your first language. It can be v. difficult to pick these subtle variations in speech if it's not your language - I find the sounds of Portugese v. difficult to follow!

I have been going through that sequence again and what struck me now as much more important is what happens when he makes the mistake. They have been holding each other close but suddenly just after he makes the mistake he pulls away from Kate. The body language at that point speaks volumes! This for me is something full of meaning, the physical gesture is so strong (watch the sequence 12-20 seconds - it's v. clear).

I have listened again several times to the verbal slip.  

There is one mistaken word that fits:

deliquesce

It's almost a rhyme word for "request" in Gerry's Glaswegian accent (which tends to ride over the "L" and "T" in words).

Meaning:
1.

(of organic matter) become liquid, typically during decomposition.


A word that a doctor would be familiar with.

OK, pure speculation, but it was an odd and not at all obvious mistake to begin with. 

I think the word he started to say was '......we declare.....'
The whole text was put together with the help of a third party imo - the PR which had arrived that day must have had a hand in it. might even have been Pike!

It may have run a bit like this: ' show yourselves to the media as simple parents, united in grief - errm Gerry, put an arm round Kate, like this, well done, don't forget - good thinking putting in 'beautiful' . Who'd go looking for an ugly one heh?

It's very clear that the arm around Kate is very much an afterthought. He then pulls away to hold the paper with both hands.
Compare to his JFK speech not much later, the press conference where he refuses to answer the Murat question, all derived from political speech writers and the behaviour of interviewed politicians as seen on TV.

Gerry was taking his first steps of his political career that night - but so much had gone wrong they simply looked as guilty as hell imo. Yet rescue wasn't long in coming as evidenced by playing tennis within days, the joke on the balcony and the broad smiles for the adoring crowds, 9 days later.

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by sonic72 on 09.03.14 9:45

@bobbin wrote:
@sonic72 wrote:Sorry, a little of topic but....

ultimaThule, you must have the forum record of most posts in the shortest space of time!

You're well on your way to 2000 posts in such a short time! You must have loads of free time!?!

You've been here 1 year less than me but made almost ten times the posts I have! I'm not the biggest poster, and I certainly don't have the time to make so many in just a few months!

You must spend a lot of time commenting on this case! I'm guessing you're retired or something?

What a strange comment to make, and Yes, well off topic, you must have spent quite some time observing this one poster to make such a comment.
It leads me to ask you two questions.
1. What was the point of your posting ?
2. Does it help to get closer to finding out what happened to Madeleine ?
Have you looked at how many posts other people have made, perhaps you would like to make a chart.
I don't know if it will add anything to finding Maddie but who knows, maybe it will.
I certainly didn't think that posting was a competition or a guessing game, to try to find out the personal details of other posters' backgrounds.
PeterMac, to date, has made some 6,500 posts. Plebgate some 2,600, just from looking back over the last few pages.
Is that a good place to start a chart.
Perhaps it would be better though to open a new thread for it rather than take an existing one off topic.  spin
Why is my observation 'strange'?!

I'm just making conversation!

I just noticed someone had made a lot of post in a short space of time and commented on it! Nothing 'strange' about that!

As for it not finding Madeline! You have been here long enough to know that not all comments are going to be any use in finding Maddy. There's a lot of stuff on this forum that in not related to Madeleine, you're making a meal out of a passing comment!

I'm just inquisitive, nothing wrong with that!

BTW, nobody is going to find Maddy, we can hope but the reality of it is she would have been found by now. I have accepted she probably will never be found, I am not kidding myself. But I stick with this case because I hope one day justice will come through for Maddy...

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by sami on 09.03.14 9:56

@sonic72 wrote:
BTW, nobody is going to find Maddy, we can hope but the reality of it is she would have been found by now.


Why ?

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by sonic72 on 09.03.14 10:00

@sami wrote:
@sonic72 wrote:
BTW, nobody is going to find Maddy, we can hope but the reality of it is she would have been found by now.


Why ?
So do you realistically think she will be found dead or alive?

7 years down the line, many millions spent, with worldwide publicity and still nothing. We can live in hope, but realistically the chances are getting slimmer as time goes on. This is my opinion of course.

What's you're opinion Sami?

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by Guest on 09.03.14 10:03

@ Tigger
It was Alex Woolfall from Bell Pottinger, who was advising them on May 5. Yet another one, who lies with more teeth than he has in his mouth ...

He gave an interview, published by Timesonline on October 2, 2007. Timesonline is behind a pay-wall now, but fortunately Nige from mccannfiles.com has the text still on:
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id65.html

The May 5 "speech" is commented by Woolfall as:
"The McCanns wanted to do more. "They were exhausted and despairing but thinking, 'Should we go outside and say something that might get her back?' They said they wanted to head downstairs and talk to the media. They were very tired, but that was one thing they were determined to do."

Mr Woolfall went out to alert journalists and returned to the McCanns. "They wrote down what they wanted to say and went out and gave a short statement. After that, they were completely spent. You could tell there was nothing left."


It's also interesting that months after the event, Woolfall still maintains, that the McCs never mentioned "abduction" till weeks later, which is [thank you, Nige, for adding that Note] properly contradicted by

June Wright, Luz resident, speaking on the Channel 4 dispatches documentary 'Searching for Madeleine':
"I arrived at the Ocean Club reception at around about 10 to 11 and at the time that we arrived a police car arrived - and as the police officer got out a man approached him, who I now know is Gerry McCann and said that his daughter had been abducted. That there was no way that she could have opened the shutters herself, she'd definitely been taken."

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by Guest on 09.03.14 10:05

@Okeydokey wrote:
snipped

what struck me now as much more important is what happens when he makes the mistake. They have been holding each other close but suddenly just after he makes the mistake he pulls away from Kate. The body language at that point speaks volumes! This for me is something full of meaning, the physical gesture is so strong (watch the sequence 12-20 seconds - it's v. clear).

snipped

Yes, Okeydokey, certainly the shift in stance is very noticeable.

It's also interesting that people hear different things on that slip of the tongue. It's certainly not the same as the the next word which is clearly the full word 'request'. I am interested that what you hear is a word beginning with 'd'. I don't think I hear that myself though. The first word to me sounds rather like requre   with the additional 'r' (to be ended in st? or t?). Did he, I wonder, think this might have come over as 'regret?'.

Anyway, topic has moved on to another matter now, but just wanted to reply on this point.

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by sami on 09.03.14 10:48

@sonic72 wrote:
@sami wrote:
@sonic72 wrote:
BTW, nobody is going to find Maddy, we can hope but the reality of it is she would have been found by now.


Why ?
So do you realistically think she will be found dead or alive?

7 years down the line, many millions spent, with worldwide publicity and still nothing. We can live in hope, but realistically the chances are getting slimmer as time goes on. This is my opinion of course.

What's you're opinion Sami?


I don't think it can be simply stated "nobody is going to find Maddy".  Only those responsible know the truth and possibility of that.

Spending millions and shouting a lot does not equal money well spent or automatically assume a thorough and complete investigation.  The true search and investigation stopped the day Amaral was removed.  It hopefully resumed in October 2013 with the announcement from Portugal.  Therefore the true search period can be counted in days, not years, but simply days.

There has been an illusion of a multi million pound worldwide search forced upon us during the intervening years, but there has not been seven years of searching.   Worldwide publicity is of little use.  If the child was not alive when she left 5a, what help with the general public be ?

It can be stated with certainty that somebody, somewhere knows what happened and where she is.  It is very likely there is more than one person.  Therefore it cannot be stated with certainty she will never be found. 

The McCanns have spent seven years hiding in plain sight.  Not searching.

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by heinzbeanz on 09.03.14 13:37

Regarding the body language... 

Kate seems to shift around. He puts his arm around her and she seems extremely uncomfortable with this. When he moves his arm away he also moves to the right.  It seems to me he has picked up that she doesn't want to be 'comforted' . 

Very odd but intriguing given the vocal slip up.

I know that shift. If I have had a row with my husband I dont want him to hug me. my husband reacts in the same way as Gerry. Realising the contact is too much and moving away. 
What I can't understand is, if my daughter had disappeared I would be clinging to him and would welcome his arm around me. Kate is shifting around and she obviously stiffens. It's all so odd. The way he puts his arm around her seems so contrived also. Ugh


All IMO. I don't post much but really noticed this.

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by Guest on 09.03.14 13:59

IMO it was in the little script he was reading from: put your arm around her shoulder ... He did, very briefly and withdrew it with the same lack of veracity. He couldn't bear to touch her, sooner than she not wanting to be touched ... IMO, of course.

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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by tigger on 09.03.14 15:03

Châtelaine wrote:@ Tigger
It was Alex Woolfall from Bell Pottinger, who was advising them on May 5. Yet another one, who lies with more teeth than he has in his mouth ...

He gave an interview, published by Timesonline on October 2, 2007. Timesonline is behind a pay-wall now, but fortunately Nige from mccannfiles.com has the text still on:
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id65.html

The May 5 "speech" is commented by Woolfall as:
"The McCanns wanted to do more. "They were exhausted and despairing but thinking, 'Should we go outside and say something that might get her back?' They said they wanted to head downstairs and talk to the media. They were very tired, but that was one thing they were determined to do."

Mr Woolfall went out to alert journalists and returned to the McCanns. "They wrote down what they wanted to say and went out and gave a short statement. After that, they were completely spent. You could tell there was nothing left."


It's also interesting that months after the event, Woolfall still maintains, that the McCs never mentioned "abduction" till weeks later, which is [thank you, Nige, for adding that Note] properly contradicted by

June Wright, Luz resident, speaking on the Channel 4 dispatches documentary 'Searching for Madeleine':
"I arrived at the Ocean Club reception at around about 10 to 11 and at the time that we arrived a police car arrived - and as the police officer got out a man approached him, who I now know is Gerry McCann and said that his daughter had been abducted. That there was no way that she could have opened the shutters herself, she'd definitely been taken."

Thanks, I wasn't sure of the date, I thought it was the 4th. On the 5th, the first effort, they still looked as if they'd been caught shoplifting or something. But bythen they'd already been declared 'model parents' by the estmable Pike and - as you say - had the reputation management expert Woolfall to advise them.


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Re: Your slip is showing...

Post by Okeydokey on 10.03.14 1:15

@tigger wrote:
@Okeydokey wrote:
@mariola wrote:basta ya!over to you okeydokey.

It's definitely a D to the beginning of the mistake. Not sure if English is your first language. It can be v. difficult to pick these subtle variations in speech if it's not your language - I find the sounds of Portugese v. difficult to follow!

I have been going through that sequence again and what struck me now as much more important is what happens when he makes the mistake. They have been holding each other close but suddenly just after he makes the mistake he pulls away from Kate. The body language at that point speaks volumes! This for me is something full of meaning, the physical gesture is so strong (watch the sequence 12-20 seconds - it's v. clear).

I have listened again several times to the verbal slip.  

There is one mistaken word that fits:

deliquesce

It's almost a rhyme word for "request" in Gerry's Glaswegian accent (which tends to ride over the "L" and "T" in words).

Meaning:
1.

(of organic matter) become liquid, typically during decomposition.


A word that a doctor would be familiar with.

OK, pure speculation, but it was an odd and not at all obvious mistake to begin with. 

I think the word he started to say was '......we declare.....'
The whole text was put together with the help of a third party imo - the PR  which had arrived that day must have had a hand in it. might even have been Pike!  

It may have run a bit like this: ' show yourselves to the media as simple parents, united in grief - errm  Gerry, put an arm round Kate, like this, well done, don't forget - good thinking putting in 'beautiful' . Who'd go looking for an ugly one heh?

It's very clear that the arm around Kate is very much an afterthought. He then pulls away to hold the paper with both hands.
Compare to his JFK speech not much later, the press conference where he refuses to answer the Murat question, all derived from  political speech writers and  the behaviour of interviewed politicians as seen on TV.

Gerry was taking his first steps of his political career that night -  but so much had gone wrong they simply looked as guilty as hell imo. Yet  rescue wasn't long in coming as evidenced by playing tennis within days, the joke on the balcony and the broad smiles for the adoring crowds, 9 days later.

Declare might be right.  What are they declaring? Well I guess the obvious point is they are declaring their innocence. But why should anyone doubt their innocence at this stage? We know nothing about them - all they are receiving at this point is sympathy. But if the word is declare then the issue of guilt and innocence is something that is disturbing Gerry's mental processes.

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SLIPS

Post by mariola on 10.03.14 8:15

MILLIE wrote:
@Okeydokey wrote:
snipped

what struck me now as much more important is what happens when he makes the mistake. They have been holding each other close but suddenly just after he makes the mistake he pulls away from Kate. The body language at that point speaks volumes! This for me is something full of meaning, the physical gesture is so strong (watch the sequence 12-20 seconds - it's v. clear).

snipped

Yes, Okeydokey, certainly the shift in stance is very noticeable.

It's also interesting that people hear different things on that slip of the tongue. It's certainly not the same as the the next word which is clearly the full word 'request'. I am interested that what you hear is a word beginning with 'd'. I don't think I hear that myself though. The first word to me sounds rather like requre   with the additional 'r' (to be ended in st? or t?). Did he, I wonder, think this might have come over as 'regret?'.

Anyway, topic has moved on to another matter now, but just wanted to reply on this point.
Almost agree with you millie.i think it may be a recre.we RECREATED the abduction scene ad nauseam to cause as much confusion as possible!
okeydokey and tigger, can,t agree with you on this one,no D for me here .Glaswegian is my native tongue.

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