Re: Mikaeel Kular

by Upsy Daisy 17.01.14 9:17

Bobbin I was thinking the same - where in a flat of five children would one child be sleeping alone? Living room sofa? Also, why the mum not check during night if he had been unwell. The caravan park they are talking about nearby is Gipsy Brae.

by **Enid O'Dowd** 17.01.14 9:17

Wouldn't the mother before going to bed, secure the flat ie put on a chub lock and/or security chain? If she had done that how could a 3 year old exit via the front door?

Any person whether or not there were young children in their home would take elementary precautions at night even if they lived in what they would consider a 'safe' area.

Is it possible that the flat only had a yale lock and set at a level a 3 year old could reach?

Are there regulations about how far above the bottom of a door a lock must be to minimise the possibility of small children getting out?

by Upsy Daisy 17.01.14 9:23

Especially if he is only 2ft tall. My just turned 4 daughter can reach but if not, can stand on her step.

by Tangled Web 17.01.14 9:26

I'm inclined to think that, even if he had got himself up, dressed and out of the flat without waking anybody else up (unlikely at 3yrs) he'd have been spotted wandering the streets. A toddler walking the street in the middle of the night/early hours of the morning would stick out like a sore thumb. Things are not looking good for this little boy and, I assume, that as the question has been asked 'who saw him in the last 24hrs?' that there is no record of him attending preschool that day either??

by Guest 17.01.14 9:29

Tangled Web wrote:I'm inclined to think that, even if he had got himself up, dressed and out of the flat without waking anybody else up (unlikely at 3yrs) he'd have been spotted wandering the streets. A toddler walking the street in the middle of the night/early hours of the morning would stick out like a sore thumb. Things are not looking good for this little boy and, I assume, that as the question has been asked 'who saw him in the last 24hrs?' that there is no record of him attending preschool that day either??

I think you underestimate the reticence of most blokes to involve themselves in the welfare of a random toddler, even out in the streets in the early hours of the morning.

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 9:33

Enid O'Dowd wrote:Wouldn't the mother before going to bed, secure the flat ie put on a chub lock and/or security chain? If she had done that how could a 3 year old exit via the front door?

Any person whether or not there were young children in their home would take elementary precautions at night even if they lived in what they would consider a 'safe' area.

Is it possible that the flat only had a yale lock and set at a level a 3 year old could reach?

Are there regulations about how far above the bottom of a door a lock must be to minimise the possibility of small children getting out?

Generally a flat has only one door for exit to the outside world.
It is much safer to lock it from inside in a way that is easily openable from the inside. but not to secure it with extra lock or chain that it hampers quick exit in case of fire or emergency, especially when there are 5 children living within it.

by Nina 17.01.14 9:35

aiyoyo wrote:
Enid O'Dowd wrote:Wouldn't the mother before going to bed, secure the flat ie put on a chub lock and/or security chain? If she had done that how could a 3 year old exit via the front door?

Any person whether or not there were young children in their home would take elementary precautions at night even if they lived in what they would consider a 'safe' area.

Is it possible that the flat only had a yale lock and set at a level a 3 year old could reach?

Are there regulations about how far above the bottom of a door a lock must be to minimise the possibility of small children getting out?

Generally a flat has only one door for exit to the outside world.
It is much safer to lock it from inside in a way that is easily openable from the inside. but not to secure it with extra lock or chain that it hampers quick exit in case of fire or emergency, especially when there are 5 children living within it.

Is there a balcony to the flat?

by soundworks 17.01.14 9:36

something fishy about this just like the one this forum is trying to do justice for

very similar and I think that the poor child has died and its a cover up

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 9:43

PeterMac wrote:Police still INSISTING there is no evidence of "abduction".

QUITE !

The Police state: there is no evidence of 'CRIMINALITY" (whatever that means)

But a team of about eight forensics and dogs have been combing the flat and the surrounding areas.
Plus all the CCTV were looked at.
Whatever happened you'd would expect something to have been captured on the Apt CCTV or CCTV in surrounding area.

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 9:50

Nina wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:
Enid O'Dowd wrote:Wouldn't the mother before going to bed, secure the flat ie put on a chub lock and/or security chain? If she had done that how could a 3 year old exit via the front door?

Any person whether or not there were young children in their home would take elementary precautions at night even if they lived in what they would consider a 'safe' area.

Is it possible that the flat only had a yale lock and set at a level a 3 year old could reach?

Are there regulations about how far above the bottom of a door a lock must be to minimise the possibility of small children getting out?

Generally a flat has only one door for exit to the outside world.
It is much safer to lock it from inside in a way that is easily openable from the inside. but not to secure it with extra lock or chain that it hampers quick exit in case of fire or emergency, especially when there are 5 children living within it.

Is there a balcony to the flat?

Dunno, but dont think so as balcony is not typical feature of flats in UK.

by Jemmied_Shatter 17.01.14 9:55

00I really fear for the well being of this little boy. Ask yourself; What is the likelehood of a 3 year old getting up in the middle of the night, leaving the place they are with their parents and siblings then opening the outside door and walking off alone unaided? Then be missing for over 24 hours? It just doesn't happen.

sad

by Tangled Web 17.01.14 9:56

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
Tangled Web wrote:I'm inclined to think that, even if he had got himself up, dressed and out of the flat without waking anybody else up (unlikely at 3yrs) he'd have been spotted wandering the streets. A toddler walking the street in the middle of the night/early hours of the morning would stick out like a sore thumb. Things are not looking good for this little boy and, I assume, that as the question has been asked 'who saw him in the last 24hrs?' that there is no record of him attending preschool that day either??

I think you underestimate the reticence of most blokes to involve themselves in the welfare of a random toddler, even out in the streets in the early hours of the morning.

I get where you're coming from, my husband said the same thing, but I know he couldn't just leave a toddler wandering the streets. He'd take him to the police station or call the police from the street whilst watching him I'd have thought.

by littlepixie 17.01.14 10:06

My Mum found a little girl a few months ago who had opened the front door and wandered off right out of a long cul-de-sac and had crossed a road that at times is very busy. The childs' house was a bungalow with a UPVC front door. She managed to tell my mum where her house was and when my Mum took her back the childs' Mother hadn't even noticed she had gone. The little girl was 2/3 and was in her nightclothes.
Apparently it is very common for people with these type of front doors to forget to lock them with the key and burglars will go along a street testing the doors to find out which are open.
This little boy lived in a flat though. I wonder whether these flats have a "rubbish chute" as flats used to have.
I hope he is found soon. Children don't just disappear.

by **PeterMac** 17.01.14 10:08

Sky reported just asked the Supt whether there was any corroboration of the mother's story that she put the child to bed in at 9pm ! !
There was a significant gulp, before she said it was part of the enquiry.

Last person to see alive . . . !

ETA
And now they are saying missing for X hours "according to his mother . . ."

And the papers are saying they HAVE spoken to the father, and later in the same article that they want to talk to the father.
Lots more than they are letting on to.

by Rasputin 17.01.14 10:19

This must be Deja vu for Martin Brunt ...I do hope Scotland Yard are watching and taking notes on how this investigation is taking shape, nothing and No one appear to be being ruled out.

by Tangled Web 17.01.14 10:27

I think that this little boy was wearing 'day' clothes because he went 'missing' during the day and not because he dressed himself during the night sad

just my opinion but hope I'm wrong.

by **Tony Bennett** 17.01.14 10:29

Upsy Daisy wrote:Evening TB. Was watching superintendant's face/eyes for anything to suggest they had an inkling. What do you think happened based on statements released so far?

I have called out two obvious lies in this case.

I had better not go any further, as I've been told I may go to prison for having, in the past, continually questioned what the parents of another missing child have said about their child's disappearance.

I have apologised to those parents for having questioned their account of events.

by jeanmonroe 17.01.14 10:30

The Police state: there is no evidence of 'CRIMINALITY" (whatever that means)

AS OPPOSED to WHAT?

"There WAS 'evidence of criminality' in the 'disappearance' of Madeleine McCann"?

IF there was i'd very much like to see it.

SY/MET, to my knowledge, have never produced a scintilla of evidence that criminality was involved in Madeleine case.

By 'criminality' do they mean pyshical 'evidence' like 'forced entry through flat door, jemmied window etc?"

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 10:33

No CCTV has been released despite Police having looked at them.
No confirmation whether the boy was seen leaving the Apt or not.

It was reported key members of family had been interviewed.
No idea whether 5 children belong to one dad or how many dad ?
But Mikaeel Kular's dad has not been on the scene much.
No confirmation whether there was custody dispute issue, or how often the dad comes to visit them, or how he gains access to them.

At the moment the Police is reading from Police Manual on Missing Child, saying very little, keeping it very close to the chest.
But with passage of time, no sign of abduction, and not found yet, it's looking ? (what people feared).

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 10:39

Tangled Web wrote:I think that this little boy was wearing 'day' clothes because he went 'missing' during the day and not because he dressed himself during the night just my opinion but hope I'm wrong.

His gloves were missing too......so......?
Cannot imagine a 3YO leaving on own volition having the mind frame to put on gloves.

by aiyoyo 17.01.14 10:41

jeanmonroe wrote:The Police state: there is no evidence of 'CRIMINALITY" (whatever that means)

AS OPPOSED to WHAT?

"There WAS 'evidence of criminality' in the 'disappearance' of Madeleine McCann"?

IF there was i'd very much like to see it.

SY/MET, to my knowledge, have never produced a scintilla of evidence that criminality was involved in Madeleine case.

By 'criminality' do they mean pyshical 'evidence' like 'forced entry through flat door, jemmied window etc?"

As opposed to him leaving on his own volition.

Anything alternative to that points to criminality of one kind or another.

by jeanmonroe 17.01.14 10:42

Tangled Web wrote:I think that this little boy was wearing 'day' clothes because he went 'missing' during the day and not because he dressed himself during the night just my opinion but hope I'm wrong.

-------------------------------------------

I'm leaning towards this also.

WHO, other than the mother saw this child BEFORE 9pm on the day?

Say, between 12 noon on the day and the 7:15am the next day, and only the mother's 'report'?

When was the child last seen by anyone other than the mother?

by **PeterMac** 17.01.14 10:47

Tony Bennett wrote:
I have apologised to those parents for having questioned their account of events.

Yes, but which account ?
As I remember there were several, and the number has been increasing ever since.
The parents even had different accounts at the start, one of them famously two different accounts on his own, until it got co-ordinated by someone else.

by Tangled Web 17.01.14 10:58

jeanmonroe wrote:
Tangled Web wrote:I think that this little boy was wearing 'day' clothes because he went 'missing' during the day and not because he dressed himself during the night just my opinion but hope I'm wrong.
-------------------------------------------

I'm leaning towards this also.

WHO, other than the mother saw this child BEFORE 9pm on the day?

Say, between 12 noon on the day and the 7:15am the next day, and only the mother's 'report'?

When was the child last seen by anyone other than the mother?

At 3 years old I'm guessing he would've attended a preschool or nursery school. I'm sure that the police would've made contact with them and the fact that the question was asked yesterday 'has anybody seen him in the last 24 hours' leads me to believe that there is no 'independent' witness that has seen this little boy on that day. Also, were his brothers and sisters told he was poorly and to leave him in his bedroom alone to rest? They wouldn't have seen him either then.

by Mirage 17.01.14 10:59

PeterMac wrote:
Tony Bennett wrote:
I have apologised to those parents for having questioned their account of events.
Yes, but which account ?
As I remember there were several, and the number has been increasing ever since.
The parents even had different accounts at the start, one of them famously two different accounts on his own, until it got co-ordinated by someone else.

Kate will probably bring out out a compendium of accounts if we wait long enough.