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The Iraq war Inquiry

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The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 17:03

Anyone taking an interest in this. Do you think it is going to be a whitewash and waste of time and money. It will sure be interesting when Tony Blair, and Gordon Brown give evidence!!

Do you think we were justified to go to war, my personal opinion is definitely NO!!

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Finally on 03.12.09 17:50

Hi

I am with you on that - a definite "No" from me too.

Take care

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Majic on 03.12.09 19:10

Total whitewash I'm afraid. I have no confidence in the findings when they come

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 19:13

Me neither Majic. They're not likely to say Tony Blair took us into an illegal war are they. It just won't happen. Waste of the publics time and money imo.

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 19:14

I'd like to see the government redeem itself by being open, honest, transparent and using it as a learning experience but have to admit I'm not convinced....

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 19:19

clarity wrote:I'd like to see the government redeem itself by being open, honest, transparent and using it as a learning experience but have to admit I'm not convinced....

Yes, that would be good wouldn't it. Perhaps with the General election coming up the might just be transparent in order to get people back on side, but on thinking about it nah........ Just thought though, does it conclude after the election???

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Majic on 03.12.09 19:19

candyfloss wrote:Me neither Majic. They're not likely to say Tony Blair took us into an illegal war are they. It just won't happen. Waste of the publics time and money imo.

I agree, they have even said that no one will be blamed, so Blair get's a free ride even if he does testify. I just don't see any value in looking into this, I think we already know that the justification for the war was made up to a degree and the plan to invade Iraq was well in hand long before 9/11.

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 19:24

@Majic wrote:
candyfloss wrote:Me neither Majic. They're not likely to say Tony Blair took us into an illegal war are they. It just won't happen. Waste of the publics time and money imo.

I agree, they have even said that no one will be blamed, so Blair get's a free ride even if he does testify. I just don't see any value in looking into this, I think we already know that the justification for the war was made up to a degree and the plan to invade Iraq was well in hand long before 9/11.


Have they said that noone will be blamed? Then what is the point then??

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Majic on 03.12.09 19:27

candyfloss wrote:


Have they said that noone will be blamed? Then what is the point then??

Well exactly, it's to explore the circumstances surrounding the UK going to war, so you can imagine, it's fairly laid out in front of them, they could just read the papers at the time.

Maybe we might get an official explanation to the 45 minutes lie, then again, I'm not even confident of that

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 03.12.09 19:37

Do you know Majic, we bang on about the McCann case debating and arguing, but at the end of the day thousands, upon thousands of innocent people have been killed or should I say murdered by our government and the USA, we are still fighting a war in Afghanistan, and getting nowhere. Hundreds of our soldiers dead, and god knows how many Americans, and where is it getting us. We are the most hated nation in the world apart from the USA. All I see, is it is bringing us more terrorism.

Some bad, bad decisions have been made, and now they have no way out without losing face.

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Two objections to the Iraq war

Post by Tony Bennett on 12.12.09 0:47

candyfloss wrote:Do you think we were justified to go to war, my personal opinion is definitely NO!!
We were not justified in going to war for the simple reason that the war was illegal under international (U.N.) law. You are only allowed to go to war under international law in self-defence. That was why the U.N. did not pass any resolution in favour of our war with Iraq.

I had a second objection to the war which I put in writing to my M.P. Bill Rammell at the time, some months before we actually declared war.

I said that if we went to war in Iraq, as well as having interfered with Afghanistan, it would further inflame Muslim opinion against the West in general and Britain and the U.S. in particular.

And so it has proved, I fear.

I think the 7/7 attack in London and the dreadful Madrid bombings might not have happened had we kept out of Afghanistan and Iraq.

+++++++++++++++

P.S. A footnote. There was a thriving Christian community in Iraq under Saddam Hussein. There was no persecution of them - contrast that with e.g. Saudi Arabia. All that has gone since Britain and the U.S. attacked Iraq. The natives have turned on the Christians, unfortuantely linking them in their minds with the Westerners who attacked them, and by now the community is virtually decimated

http://www.persecution.org/suffering/newssummpopup.php?newscode=9622

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 12.12.09 16:39

Tony Blair being interviewed by Fern Britton today has admitted he would still have gone in just to get rid of Saddam!


It was never about WMD.

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A crime against peace

Post by Tony Bennett on 15.12.09 21:21

candyfloss wrote:Tony Blair being interviewed by Fern Britton today has admitted he would still have gone in just to get rid of Saddam!

It was never about WMD.
Wikipedia on the right to go to war under international law:

A crime against peace, in international law, refers to "planning, preparation, initiation, or waging of wars of aggression, or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances, or participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the foregoing". This definition of crimes against peace was first incorporated into the Nuremberg Principles and later included in the United Nations Charter. This definition would play a part in defining aggression as a crime against peace.

An important exception to the foregoing are defensive military actions taken under Article 51 of the UN Charter. Such defensive actions are subject to immediate Security Council review, but do not require UN permission to be legal within international law. "Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations." (UN Charter, Article 51) The Security Council will determine if the action is legally the "right of individual or collective self-defence", or it may appoint another UN organ to do this
.

++++++++++++++

I think Tony Blair may be guilty of going to war illegally and he might also be guilty of war crimes.

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Guest on 15.12.09 22:34

So are you going to do a book, leaflet drops and stuff against Blair then Bennett?

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Nits on 05.01.10 14:58

Well I think it is very sad that Doctor David Kelly isn't alive to tell his side of the story.

Yep I reckon it will be white wash I also reckon a few surface questions will be answered, which like all these things will just generate more questions.

IMHO the 2nd Iraq war should never have happened and it should have all been sorted out the first time around.

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Doug D on 14.05.16 12:53

Not that we’re likely to forget that we are still waiting, but:
 
HaveIGotNewsForYou‪@haveigotnews 21h
21 hours ago
   
World's oldest person dies at 116, after seeing WW1, WW2, the lightbulb and space flight, but not the Chilcot Report.

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Doug D on 22.05.16 10:07

And this is after all the ‘maxwellisation’ nonsense.
 
Dread to think how bad it must have been before that:
 
Chilcot will savage Blair and generals
 
‘Brutal’ verdict on MI6 chief and Jack Straw
 
Tim Shipman, Political Editor
May 22 2016, 12:01am, 
The Sunday Times
 
Tony Blair, Jack Straw and Sir Richard Dearlove will face serious “damage to their reputations” from the Chilcot report into the Iraq War, which has delivered an “absolutely brutal” verdict on the mismanagement of the occupation.
 
A senior source who has discussed the report with two of its authors has revealed that Blair “won’t be let off the hook” over claims that he offered British military support to the American president at the time, George W Bush, a year before the 2003 invasion.
 
Dearlove, the former head of MI6, and other intelligence chiefs will be criticised for failing to prevent…………
 
Rest hidden behind paywall
 
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/chilcot-will-savage-blair-and-generals-bjwhg9c69
 
Might have to go against my principles and actually buy the paper today, but at least it will keep me in enough firelighting supplies for most of next winter.

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The Iraq War-Chilcot Inquiry

Post by willowthewisp on 22.05.16 13:24

Hi DougD, thanks for the posting on Chilcot and all of the work you have done on this forum with regard to abuses of Law.
Quite astounding that saintly Jack Straw and Teflon Antony Blair, he of allegedly(Cash for questions,mode) and his role in the Hillsborough cover up,along with his possible abuse of process, when his Son(who now wants to become an MP)escaped a criminal conviction in procuring illegal drugs to an undercover News Paper reporter? 
Now Lord Jack Straw's son would not be able to stand for Parliament if he had a Criminal record and thanks to his Fathers input into the above named illegal drugs charges issue,he can go a head with his Political career?
Mr Malcom Rifkind and Mr Jack Straw were cleared of any "Misconduct" by the Parliamentary process after a truly through investigation of charges of procuring extra income in their positions as Lords, by scurrilous Channel 4 Documentary,"Cash for Questions"?
"Oh what a web we weave in Order to Deceive"

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Re: The Iraq war Inquiry

Post by Doug D on 30.05.16 17:23

Tony Blair hints he could refuse to accept Chilcot's Iraq war verdict
 
Report, expected to be highly critical of Blair, had focused on claims he committed UK to invasion before telling parliament and public
 
Tony Blair comments on long-awaited Chilcot inquiry
 
Andrew Sparrow Political correspondent
 
Sunday 29 May 2016 11.38 BST
 
Tony Blair has suggested that he will refuse to accept the verdict of the Chilcot inquiry if it accuses him of committing Britain to invading Iraq before he told parliament and the public.
 
In an interview on the BBC’s Andrew Marr Show on Sunday, the former prime minister said he did not think anyone could say he did not make his position clear ahead of the 2003 war that led to the toppling of Saddam Hussein.
 
Sir John Chilcot is due to publish his long-awaited report into the war on 6 July. It is expected to be highly critical of Blair and other political and military figures.
 
During the inquiry hearings there was particular focus on evidence suggesting Blair had given a firm commitment to back President George W Bush’s decision to invade while he was publicly saying a final decision had not yet been taken.
 
Asked if he would accept Chilcot’s conclusions, Blair told Marr: “It is hard to say that when I haven’t seen it.”
 
He continued: “But I think when you go back and you look at what was said, I don’t think anyone can seriously dispute that I was making it very clear what my position was.”
 
Blair also said that when the report comes out, he would be taking to the airwaves to defend himself rather than going to ground.
 
“The thing that will be important when it does happen is that we have then a full debate,” Blair said. “And I look forward to participating in that. Make no mistake about that. It is really important we do debate these issues.”
 
Blair may not have seen the full report, but it is understood that he has seen the key passages criticising his conduct, as part of the Maxwellisation process that allows people facing criticism from a report like this to see and respond to its draft conclusions.
The Sunday Times recently quoted an unnamed source with knowledge of the report saying that Blair “won’t be let off the hook” over claims that he told Bush he would support an invasion of Iraq in 2002, a full year before the decision was publicly confirmed.
 
At the Hay literary festival in Powys, Wales, author Tom Bowers took aim at Blair on Sunday by suggesting that criticism of his role in the Iraq war would not go far enough.
 
Bower is the author of a scathing biography of Blair that portrays him as a man with few policies and no ideology. Bower told the festival: “Chilcot in my view will criticise the wrong people, the easy targets ... the cabinet secretary, the chief of the defence staff, who was not told the truth. The man obviously to blame is Blair.
 
“He will be criticised perhaps for undermining government, for having no plan for post-war Iraq ... but he won’t be blamed for lying, that will not happen.”
 
Bower suggested that Chilcot himself was too close to the establishment, in that he was heavily involved in the second Iraq inquiry conducted by the cabinet secretary, Sir Robin Butler.
 
His book argues that Blair worked hard to gain power but had no idea what to do with it when he got it. It was a government without ideology and by its second term it was too late to get one as he was being weakened by Gordon Brown and was on the “treadmill to Iraq”, he says.
 
The Chilcot report is expected to be especially damning about the British and American failure to prepare for the aftermath of the invasion, which triggered years of violent sectarian conflict and virtual civil war.
 
But there will be particular interest in what it says about Blair’s candour regarding his pre-war intentions because his critics claim he lied to the public about his plans. Whether or not Chilcot will accuse Blair of dishonesty on that scale remains to be seen.
 
In his Marr interview, Blair also denied claims that remarks he made in an interview on Saturday about how it would be “very dangerous” if a leftwing populist took power were aimed at Jeremy Corbyn.
 
“I wasn’t talking about Jeremy Corbyn, by the way. I was talking about the general populism there is in the world today,” he claimed.
 
In a BBC interview broadcast on Saturday, Blair had said: “It would be a very dangerous experiment for a major western country to get gripped by this type of populist policymaking left or right.” This was widely taken as a reference to Corbyn because Blair was responding to a question that specifically mentioned him.
Blair said he was “not being disloyal” to the current Labour leader and, although he said he was waiting to see what policies Corbyn produced, he insisted: “I don’t disrespect him as a person, or his views at all.”
 
He also said he would be backing Labour at the general election even if Corbyn remained leader. “I’ll always tell people to vote Labour because I’m Labour. That’s just the way I am,” he said.
 
In the Marr interview, Blair also dismissed claims that his wealth and globetrotting lifestyle meant he was now out of touch with the views of people who used to support him.
 
“What I say to that is, if you are reading stuff in the press about what I do nowadays, don’t read it or believe it. Go and look at my website and you’ll see what I actually do,” he said.
 
“I spend 80% of my time on unpaid work. I have just literally spent weeks in the Middle East on the Middle East peace process. I have two foundations. I employ around 200 people. I have to raise the money and make the money for all of them. What we actually do is very good and exciting work around the world, but you won’t read a bit of it here.”
 
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/29/tony-blair-hints-he-could-refuse-to-accept-chilcots-iraq-war-verdict?CMP=share_btn_tw

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