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An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

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An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Watching The Detectives on 09.01.14 11:32

Whilst browsing through old newspaper reports, I came across a Mirror article from Sept 2007 (link below).

I was surprised to see the following statement in the article, as I do not recall seeing it discussed anywhere - rather the opposite, i.e. that the flat had been cleaned so well that there was little evidence of even the McCanns having been there.


"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.

It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tell-us-504076

Is there any further info or discussion on this anywhere? Thanks.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 11:39

@Watching The Detectives wrote:
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."

I can't for the life of me imagine any context in which this sentence would make sense.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by MissDaisy on 09.01.14 11:42

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@Watching The Detectives wrote:
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."

I can't for the life of me imagine any context in which this sentence would make sense.
A bed?

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 11:50

@Watching The Detectives wrote:Whilst browsing through old newspaper reports, I came across a Mirror article from Sept 2006 (link below).

I was surprised to see the following statement in the article, as I do not recall seeing it discussed anywhere - rather the opposite, i.e. that the flat had been cleaned so well that there was little evidence of even the McCanns having been there.


"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.

It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tell-us-504076

Is there any further info or discussion on this anywhere? Thanks.


Sept 2006, Madeleine disappeared in 2007??

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Watching The Detectives on 09.01.14 11:55

Ooops! Thanks - corrected now.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by ultimaThule on 09.01.14 11:58

The Mirror article (below) was published on Thursday 6 September 2007 which is the day before the McCanns were made arguidos and 3 days before their return to England on Sunday 9 September 2007.

It seems that wee Gerry has been 'furious' for a very long time and no doubt the pair of them were 'upset' when one of their all-important runs was interrupted by 'an aide'.   

"By Mirror.co.uk:

McCANNS IN DNA TORMENT No one admitted UK tests had arrived No one will reveal what results are No one informed us of breakthrough
Police in Portugal are refusing to tell Madeleine McCann's parents the results from DNA tests on blood and other scraps of forensic evidence taken from their flat.
Detectives were given the test results yesterday morning - but last night they had still not bothered to get in touch with Kate and Gerry.
The couple only learned of the results after news was leaked to the media of a "significant breakthrough" by British scientists who painstakingly analysed the tiny evidence fragments.
Last night it was claimed Portuguese police are now likely to make new arrests within the next 48hours.
Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been.
A friend of the McCanns last night said Gerry was furious that police had not got in touch to tell them the test results had arrived from the UK.
He and Kate learned the news when an aide interrupted their afternoon run.
The friend said: "Gerry was upset that detectives had not bothered to let them know about the results.
"It's bad enough not telling them what the results are, let alone not telling them they even have the results.
"As the parents of the child you would expect the police to let you know of any major developments.
"They have Gerry's mobile number and can call him at any time but he was not called by the police before he found out from the media.
"That's bound to be frustrating. They used to have a good working relationship with the police. Not any more."
Gerry and Kate's spokeswoman Justine McGuinness confirmed: "The Portuguese police have not phoned the McCanns and have not told them about the tests results."
Evidence taken from the McCann's flat in Praia da Luz during a review of the investigation by UK police were sent to Birmingham's Forensic Science Service laboratory a month ago.
It included blood flecks discovered by British sniffer dogs on the wall in the bedroom where Madeleine was last seen alive on May 3.
The FSS experts obtained at least one DNA profile from some of the samples using a sophisticated technique called Low Copy Number analysis.
It allows scientists to find a genetic fingerprint from a tiny sample by "growing" it into extra copies suitable for repeated testing.
But it takes several weeks to produce a definitive result compared to as little as eight hours for a standard DNA test.
Sources say a large volume of material sent to the UK is still being examined.
But experts made the breakthrough after focusing on material most likely to show results.
Tests for the presence of four-year-old Madeleine's blood, saliva and hair were carried out first.
Experts also searched for forensic traces that would link potential suspects to Madeleine's disappearance. A source linked to the investigation said any developments made by the FSS were passed on to Leicestershire police immediately.
That information was then given to the Portuguese authorities. The source said: "The FSS has been in close liaison with Leicestershire police on a regular basis.
"Information is always being fed back which Leicestershire police then pass on to the Portuguese authorities. On something so important, any information would not be sat on - it is always being fed back. The Portuguese are leading on the investigation and they have to be the ones to act on any information. What happens now is up to them, but people should be keeping a very close eye on events over there in the next few days."
Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa, the man leading the Portuguese inquiry, last night refused to say if they had received the test results.
He said: "The lines of investigation are the same since the beginning - they are all open.
"We said the results are important for one of the lines, the one that considers the hypothesis of the little girl being dead.
"At this moment we are taking special attention on the hypothesis of death."
British ex-pat Robert Murat, 33, remains the only official suspect in the case. He has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing.
A spokeswoman for the FSS said their tests on the blood were "ongoing".
She added: "There has been a lot of speculation. But the tests are ongoing. There has been no change in that.
"It's a live investigation and we are working with the police."
The Low Copy Number technique was developed by British scientists about five years ago.
A source said: "The scientists have had to take their time before sending any results over to Portugal because the Low Copy Number technique is very delicate and much more difficult than normal DNA testing. This kind of thing is only done when there are no more tests left to do.
"It is often requested by cold case review detectives investigating a crime decades later."
The technique has helped catch solve some of the world's most notorious killers.
It helped British police investigating the "Trophy Rapist" attacks around the M25 motorway identify Antoni Imiela as their prime suspect.
And FSS tests on the handties used to bind Joanne Lees in the Australian outback gave local police the DNA profile of killer Bradley Murdoch.
Meanwhile, the McCanns will take part in a major religious festival in Praia da Luz this weekend.
The couple, from Rothley, Leics, will attend an ecumenical service in the village church of Nossa Senhora da Luz on Saturday night as part of the Festival of Our Lady of Luz.
The family spokeswoman said: "They have been part of the community in Praia da Luz for over four months now.
"The church community has given them a lot of support. They particularly want to take part in what is a very important festival for this small and quiet religious community. It is their way of saying thank you."
MCCANNS V POLICE
Relations between the Portuguese police and the McCanns have been fraught throughout the investigation.
May 07
Despite desperate pleas from the McCanns, police refuse to reveal what Madeleine was wearing the night she vanished. Eventually, the couple ignore police protocol and issue their own press statement describing Madeleine's pink pyjamas.
June 17
Police spokesman Olegario Sousa accuses McCanns of damaging the crime scene.
He said: "The presence of so many people, especially in the room where the little girl slept with her brother and sister, could have complicated the work of the forensic team.
"At the very worst they would have destroyed all the evidence. This could prove to be fatal for the investigation."
Aug 10
More than three months after Madeleine disappeared, Gerry voices concerns at the slow speed of the investigation.
He also demands to see evidence to support leaked police claims they believed Madeleine was dead.
Gerry said: "I want to see the evidence which has caused their shift in the investigation. It's so important to us as parents that if there is evidence, we need to know about it.
"They haven't said that she's dead, on multiple occasions they believed they were looking for a missing child but there's been a shift.
"There has been a shift in the investigation and the way it was proceeding previously.
"Everything we have done in the last 100 days has been with the belief that Madeleine was taken alive. I do not know of any specific evidence now that alters that. I think, as parents, if there is evidence then we need to know about it."

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 11:59

@MissDaisy wrote:
Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@Watching The Detectives wrote:
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."

I can't for the life of me imagine any context in which this sentence would make sense.
A bed?

Actually after I posted I did think it could mean a cot. Don't really wanna go there, but....

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 12:01

@ultimaThule wrote:
It seems that wee Gerry has been 'furious' for a very long time and no doubt the pair of them were 'upset' when one of their all-important runs was interrupted by 'an aide'.   


Yeah I had to laugh at the bit about the "aide" too. Who do these people think they are?

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by tigger on 09.01.14 12:19

Textusa has recently posted a long article on DNA, spots, etc. always worth a read. In an area where it should not have been, the ceiling?  I don't think the cots are an issue, they weren't used as leaked by a source (Gerry and Kate McCann who consistently have talked about the twins being on a bed, Philomena (I shall call her the nightingale from now on.. big grin ) sang about Maddie sleeping in between the twins).

Right from the start an effort was made to move into political speech patterns: 'No comment'  The JFK speech by Gerry - I think soon after that  distressing mass on the 12th - an aide for goodness' sakes.
We're going to have to contact the College of Heralds  pretty soon on how to properly address the pair.

Which reminds me of an off-topic but true story.

The College of Heralds was consulted as to what the rules of precedence are when the Aga Khan visited the UK.

The answer: 'The Aga Khan is considered to be a direct descendant of God by his followers, an English Duke takes precedence.'

We're going to have to ask where the McCanns fit in pretty soon.... spit coffee

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 12:31

@tigger wrote:Textusa has recently posted a long article on DNA, spots, etc. always worth a read. In an area where it should not have been, the ceiling? 

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 09.01.14 12:36

@admin wrote:
@tigger wrote:Textusa has recently posted a long article on DNA, spots, etc. always worth a read. In an area where it should not have been, the ceiling? 

In the name of research I'm now going to see if I can get any of my bodily fluids to reach the ceiling.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Daisy on 09.01.14 12:38

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@admin wrote:
@tigger wrote:Textusa has recently posted a long article on DNA, spots, etc. always worth a read. In an area where it should not have been, the ceiling? 

In the name of research I'm now going to see if I can get any of my bodily fluids to reach the ceiling.
  wow  lol...

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by ultimaThule on 09.01.14 13:07

@tigger wrote:Textusa has recently posted a long article on DNA, spots, etc. always worth a read. In an area where it should not have been, the ceiling?  I don't think the cots are an issue, they weren't used as leaked by a source (Gerry and Kate McCann who consistently have talked about the twins being on a bed, Philomena (I shall call her the nightingale from now on.. big grin ) sang about Maddie sleeping in between the twins).

Right from the start an effort was made to move into political speech patterns: 'No comment'  The JFK speech by Gerry - I think soon after that  distressing mass on the 12th - an aide for goodness' sakes.
We're going to have to contact the College of Heralds  pretty soon on how to properly address the pair.

Which reminds me of an off-topic but true story.

The College of Heralds was consulted as to what the rules of precedence are when the Aga Khan visited the UK.

The answer: 'The Aga Khan is considered to be a direct descendant of God by his followers, an English Duke takes precedence.'

We're going to have to ask where the McCanns fit in pretty soon.... spit coffee
In matters relating to heritable traits I find it somewhat comforting to think that God may have had a penchant for cigarettes, whiskey, and wild, wild wo/men and, in this respect at least, s/he is most probably not remarkably different from the average English duke, or duchess for that matter.  smilie 

As for god's self-appointed annointed, in his imaginings I have no doubt the wee one considers he ranks above Her Maj when, in truth, both he and his spouse occupy a place way below the salt and beyond the pale.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by ultimaThule on 10.01.14 13:56

Having once been enchanted by the sound of nightingale may I ask you to please not associate Phil with this most melodic of birds, Tigger, and by way of substitution may I suggest the corncrake whose rasping call seems, to my ear, to have something of a Glasgae accent?

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 10.01.14 15:41

The very irritating sound of the magpie could also I feel be compared with the dulcet tones of Philomena. I didn't know what a corncrake sounds like until now. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcGKfsgh0o4 Yes, that's irritating too.


Admin, do you think that your T-shirt would be more appropriate in a fetching shade of pink?

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by suep on 10.01.14 17:07

"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


So allow me to be pedantic
.they have DNA which matches that of a known individual whom they consider to be a potential suspect.
This DNA was found in an area of the apartment that this known individual should not have been

This suggests to me that
there were other areas of the apartment that the known individual could legitimately be expected to have been.
or the area the DNA was found does not match the areas the known individual has stated s/he had been.


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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by ultimaThule on 10.01.14 17:33

Have a listen to this one, NFWTD: http://www.arkive.org/corncrake/crex-crex/video-13a.html

As I find this bird pleasing to the eye it occured to me I was doing it a disservice by associating it with Phil but, on misreading 'underparts' as 'underpants', the fact that the nether regions of both sexes become less grey outside of the breeding season amused me sufficiently to offer it as an alternative to tigger's choice.

There's a crow's nest in my pear tree and its occupants, together with the family of extremely argumentative magpies that live a few doors away, make a hell of a racket on occasion.  Even so, I'd far rather hear them blethering on than listen to the monotonously grating voice of the no longer wee lassie of the Ullapool swamplands.  smilie

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by ultimaThule on 10.01.14 17:53

@suep wrote:"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


So allow me to be pedantic
.they have DNA which matches that of a known individual whom they consider to be a potential suspect.
This DNA was found in an area of the apartment that this known individual should not have been
                         
This suggests to me that
there were other areas of the apartment that the known individual could legitimately be expected to have been.
or the area the DNA was found does not match the areas the known individual has stated s/he had been.

Apologies, suep, it wasn't my intention to divert attention from your logical, rather than pedantic, thinking.  

The information which we have access to doesn't include that which the PJ and SY hold in their confidential files.  Nevertheless, it seems to me there is more than sufficient evidence to support a prima facie case against the McCanns and at least 5 of the Tapas 7 and I fail to understand why no action has been taken against them. 

It simply beggars belief that millions of UK £'s and Portuguese euros have been poured into this case over a period of almost 7 years without any tangible result.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 10.01.14 17:56

@ultimaThule wrote:
@suep wrote:"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


So allow me to be pedantic
.they have DNA which matches that of a known individual whom they consider to be a potential suspect.
This DNA was found in an area of the apartment that this known individual should not have been
                         
This suggests to me that
there were other areas of the apartment that the known individual could legitimately be expected to have been.
or the area the DNA was found does not match the areas the known individual has stated s/he had been.

Apologies, suep, it wasn't my intention to divert attention from your logical, rather than pedantic, thinking.  

The information which we have access to doesn't include that which the PJ and SY hold in their confidential files.  Nevertheless, it seems to me there is more than sufficient evidence to support a prima facie case against the McCanns and at least 5 of the Tapas 7 and I fail to understand why no action has been taken against them. 

It simply beggars belief that millions of UK £'s and Portuguese euros have been poured into this case over a period of almost 7 years without any tangible result.

IIRC the DNA was found to be that of a previous occupant staying at the apartment - it is in the PJ files.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by bobbin on 10.01.14 18:34

candyfloss wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:
@suep wrote:"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


So allow me to be pedantic
.they have DNA which matches that of a known individual whom they consider to be a potential suspect.
This DNA was found in an area of the apartment that this known individual should not have been
                         
This suggests to me that
there were other areas of the apartment that the known individual could legitimately be expected to have been.
or the area the DNA was found does not match the areas the known individual has stated s/he had been.

Apologies, suep, it wasn't my intention to divert attention from your logical, rather than pedantic, thinking.  

The information which we have access to doesn't include that which the PJ and SY hold in their confidential files.  Nevertheless, it seems to me there is more than sufficient evidence to support a prima facie case against the McCanns and at least 5 of the Tapas 7 and I fail to understand why no action has been taken against them. 

It simply beggars belief that millions of UK £'s and Portuguese euros have been poured into this case over a period of almost 7 years without any tangible result.

IIRC the DNA was found to be that of a previous occupant staying at the apartment - it is in the PJ files.
ETA deleted comment not relevant, it's an old article

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Daisy on 10.01.14 20:07

candyfloss wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:
@suep wrote:"Sources said the DNA of a potential suspect had been among the material from the holiday flat.
It is thought it was found in an area where the individual should not have been."


So allow me to be pedantic
.they have DNA which matches that of a known individual whom they consider to be a potential suspect.
This DNA was found in an area of the apartment that this known individual should not have been
                         
This suggests to me that
there were other areas of the apartment that the known individual could legitimately be expected to have been.
or the area the DNA was found does not match the areas the known individual has stated s/he had been.

Apologies, suep, it wasn't my intention to divert attention from your logical, rather than pedantic, thinking.  

The information which we have access to doesn't include that which the PJ and SY hold in their confidential files.  Nevertheless, it seems to me there is more than sufficient evidence to support a prima facie case against the McCanns and at least 5 of the Tapas 7 and I fail to understand why no action has been taken against them. 

It simply beggars belief that millions of UK £'s and Portuguese euros have been poured into this case over a period of almost 7 years without any tangible result.

IIRC the DNA was found to be that of a previous occupant staying at the apartment - it is in the PJ files.
Thanks Candyfloss, that will be  Paul  & Saleigh  Gordon then. Paul Gordon cut himself shaving & bled for a while in 5A the week before the McCann's stayed he says in his  statement. I find this particular statement very interesting for more reasons than one.

"While we were in Portugal there were no incidents worthy of record, beyond this man that I have described, however there was one occasion when I cut myself shaving in the bathroom of the apartment. I would say that the cut bled for about 4 5 minutes and that it took some time until the cut stopped bleeding, during which period I walked around the apartment with paper tissues trying to stop the blood. Aside from this, to the best of my knowledge no one else cut themselves nor did anyone die in the apartment."




"I want to add that since January this year I have received numerous phone calls, messages and visits from the press regarding the collector of donations, which in turn put me in contact with other people such as Brian Kennedy, Kate and Gerry McCann. I feel that this is a constraint that makes it difficult to take the more correct decision.
I tried always to cooperate with the police in every way possible, telephoning them at the first available opportunity as soon as the news broke about the disappearance of Madeleine. There are certain times when I feel like a pawn in chess."


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAUL_GORDON.htm

What the heck does  PG mean by this?



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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by worriedmum on 10.01.14 20:18

Yes indeed, I wonder what he meant by 'the more correct decision?'

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Guest on 10.01.14 22:00

@Daisy wrote:

What the heck does  PG mean by this?



I've always felt this comment is very akin to David Payne's (from memory, so I'm paraphrasing) "Yes, but not right now" or whatever it was. Just these weird sentences, left to hang without any clarification sought.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by PeterMac on 10.01.14 22:33

@Daisy wrote: Aside from this, to the best of my knowledge no one else cut themselves nor did anyone die in the apartment.

This is without doubt the most perfect example of someone taking the PISS.

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Re: An old newspaper report - but is any more known & has it been discussed anywhere?

Post by Daisy on 10.01.14 22:37

@PeterMac wrote:
@Daisy wrote: Aside from this, to the best of my knowledge no one else cut themselves nor did anyone die in the apartment.

This is without doubt the most perfect example of someone taking the PISS.
Yes that bit really struck me too. Like he's been instructed to say those very words. A statement that appears totally out of context.

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