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More statement analysis

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More statement analysis

Post by tigger on Wed Dec 11, 2013 5:49 am

In view of the fact that SeamusO'Riley's site recently crashed, it seems a good idea to have a look at this long post of Stewie in Forensic Linguistics.
Thanks Stewie! All those references too.  roses 


statement analysis
Stewie on Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:29 am


Statement Analysis blog is going to examine statements madein the case.....excellent news...so we can look forward to some good analysis:.

quote: As requested, we will seek to apply Statement Analysis to this case. Below is a general description of what happened from Wikipedia.com.


As the statements are located, analysis will be done, and eventually, some commentary. quote



http://seamusoriley.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/the-disappearance-of-madeleine-mccann.html

Think they will be kept busy as there have been many replies already with suggestions of where to find statements made..... thought it might be worth copying comments here:



27 comments:
Orgona said...
Peter,

you're not only great at doing statement analysis, but you can read my mind too. Or so it seems.
Looking forward to it.

Orgona
Tue Aug 31, 03:16:00 PM EDT
Techmom said...
Hi Peter,

The website, themccannfiles.com, seems to have a great number of the parents' interviews archived. There are multiple interviews posted on each of the pages linked below.


The McCanns' First Interviews 25 May 2007

The McCanns' TV Appeals/Interviews

Kate's solo interviews

and
"Various Transcripts"


Looking forward to reading your analysis (what's the multiple for analysis? analysises? analysi? lol)

>^.^<
Techmom
Tue Aug 31, 04:08:00 PM EDT
Karri (Camsmom) said...
http://www.findmadeleine.com/home.html

This is the offical Maddie website. They write updates on it, however not sure its them or someone they have hired to do the website. Its very professional.
Tue Aug 31, 05:18:00 PM EDT
Anonymous said...
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/TRANSLATIONS.htm
Tue Aug 31, 05:57:00 PM EDT
Anonymous said...
I think Techmom means http://www.mccannfiles.com/
Tue Aug 31, 06:05:00 PM EDT
hobnob said...
http://www.mccannfiles.com/index.html has all the files including all mediastements interviews with kate and gerry and sundry tapas 7 pals, transcript of the panorama program (with that you have to watch as in the transcript they say tanner says they carried whereas in the actual programme tanner says "I carried" which got everyone immediate attention.

http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/

this site has all gerrys blog comment including amended ones though a couple were whoosh clucked before we realised to save them ( the one regarding him dumping a freezer in particular no one can prove he said it though many remember seeing him say it)
It does help to watch them in videos just to see how verbally inarticulate they become considering they are doctors with lots of big sighs tuts, you know's err's and ermms. They can barely string a sentence togeather and it is fun to see how statements change from day one with the smashed shutters door hanging off told to all their relatives to open shutters and curtains blowing and unlocked patio dooors as the abduction could't have happened else.
thanks again peter for giving this your time and consideration you have a lot of people awaiting your comments with great interest. all wnating justice for a little girl neglected by her parents
Tue Aug 31, 06:05:00 PM EDT
Blaze said...
This is great! Thank you Peter for looking at this case. I hope you'll have time to do one of Gerry's blogs or one of their interviews.
Tue Aug 31, 07:24:00 PM EDT
evrli said...
LOL...:) Peter! tell your wife Thank You for me!
THANK YOU for the amanda knox, donna brock info...:)
am so behind.....:)
Tue Aug 31, 11:50:00 PM EDT
IRONSIDE said...
Hello Peter, Although Wiki give a summary you have to read the files to understand the case and the discrepancy or to put it bluntly the lies involved.

To give you an example.

The SMITH sighting....would have been perfect for the McCanns, it would have cleared them.

Here we have a family who told Police they saw a man with Madeleine at the very moment it was claimed she was abducted...just before 10pm May 3rd. A child with bare feet wearing pink pyjamas.

NOW this is very important...Gerry McCanns blog 37 days after Madeleine disappeared June 11th 2007

Read this...


After returning from the beach we did the Irish version of Crimewatch-‘Crimecall’. There are a lot of Irish tourists in and around Praia da Luz and although the awareness of Madeleine’s disappearance in Ireland is extremely high, we want to ensure that everyone is aware of the appeal and we want the Irish public to come forward with photographs of people who they do not know who were in and around Praia da Luz in the 2 weeks leading up to the 3rd May. The address to upload photographs is: to www.madeleine.ceopupload.com . We have also asked for people to contact their local police if they have seen a man matching the description of the suspect carrying a child seen around the time of Madeleine’s abduction. He is 30-40 years, 1.70-1.80m (5’7”-11”), caucasian and was wearing a dark jacket, beige or mustard coloured trousers with dark shoes. No major news on the investigation front- we still believe it is just a single phone call away.


---------------------------

UNKNOWN to Gerry Mccann the SMITHS had already returned to Portugal and given their witness statements in secret back in May.

VERY IMPORTANT the SMITH family are IRISH.


Martin Smith on seeing Gerry McCann arrive back in England and leaving the plane had the shock of his life...HE is 80% sure the man he saw that night was none other than GERRY MCCANN.

He phoned the police to give this information.

The SMITH sighting can be found in the POLICE FILES.
Wed Sep 01, 11:33:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
Seems strange that the mother screamed "They have taken her".

Who's "they"? Why didn't she say "Someone has taken her"??
Wed Sep 01, 08:38:00 PM EDT
Anonymous said...
http://mccannexposure.wordpress.com/
Wed Sep 01, 09:31:00 PM EDT
Sugarbabe said...
It also seems strange when she said -They-ve taken her- WHO did she mean , she has TWO daughters and yet everyone knew immediately she meant Madeleine. The simulated abduction was planned from the moment Madeleine was found dead in the apartment.


Take a look also at the Gaspar statements. Two Doctors who were on intimate relations with the Mccanns.

This evidence was held back from the investigation by Leicestershire Police for SIX months...it has been suggested there was paedophilia in the group, after reading this statement I also have a BAD feeling about what happened to Madeleine.

This case NEEDS to be re/opened by the Portugues police and this group of DOCTORS made to speak up...There are SEVEN other children who may be at risk.

The Statement that could help the inquiry and crack this case wide open.


http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/KATERINA-PAYNE-INCIDENT.htm
Thu Sep 02, 12:39:00 AM EDT
Sugarbabe said...
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_SMITH.htm


Peter, please read the SMITH sighting and understand this could have cleared the McCanns AND yet the Mccanns will not go near it.

Brian Kennedy the McCanns backer has meddled with witnesses , Mr Smith is one of them also Robert Murat, Paul Gordon, Jeremy Wilkins ALL have complained to the police about the pressure they have been under from TEAM MCCANN.

Complaints made to LEICESTSHIRE POLICE about Brian Kennedy and his contacting witnesses and yes their fear, have been made...People ARE afraid of the McCanns.

Leicestershire Police have REFUSED to investigate these complaints. They are not interested.


No one should under estimate how CLEVER Dr.Gerald McCann thinks he is.

The ONLY reason for McCann not to want to meet with Martin Smith and his family is because face to face Martin Smith may well say to McCann it was you I saw that night.

Would Gerry McCann himself walk through the streets with a sedated child dressed in Madeleines pyjamas to create a simulated abduction...he needed witnesses his word alone would not be enough.

Sound far fetched? then you do not know Gerry McCann.
Thu Sep 02, 12:53:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
Please be sure to watch Kate explaining the small window of opportunity in which to take Madeleine - the "whoosh cluck" video.

Another point to consider is how the Portuguese police begged Gerry not to mention Madeleine's eye defect to the public, as it could sign her death warrant. Gerry went ahead anyway, saying "We knew the abductor could do something to her eye but it was a good marketing ploy"

Last but certainly not least, Gerry's comment:“We want a big event to raise awareness that she is still missing...I think it would be later this year...it wouldn’t be a one-year anniversary, it will be sooner than that"

Apparently Gerry knew his daughter would still be missing in a year!
Thu Sep 02, 04:43:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rQazjM-bCo


Video of Kate McCann and the window of opportunity
Thu Sep 02, 04:47:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
Gerry McCann has always denied sedating the children, something made him change his mind.

Fiona Payne one of the group said in her police witness statement, she found something ODD. Kate kept putting her hands in front of the twins faces to check if they were breathing the night May 3rd after Madeleines disappearance.


The McCanns had no idea the police files would be made available to the public. The Mccanns have read the files and must have been shocked to see Fiona had made this comment in her statement..

Later Gerry changes his mind and now suggests the twins WERE sedated but not by him but by the 'abductor'

As already mentioned Gerry thinks he is SO smart he can walk on water.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ix6bKUnmOCM&feature=related
Thu Sep 02, 04:53:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
Anonymous, regarding your link to the video of Kate, explainig the 'window of opportunity' - when I checked it out it says "the video you have requested is no longer available" or words to that effect. Hopefully, it is available elsewhere.
Fri Sep 03, 05:43:00 AM EDT
evrli said...
this remionds me of the jon benet case...i believe one parent hurt the child, the other parent covered it up......

Mark Warner Ocean Club/Portugal website:

http://www.markwarner.co.uk/sun/portugal/ocean-club

shows a map/layout of the resort
Sat Sep 04, 06:24:00 PM EDT
Anonymous said...
http://mccannexposure.wordpress.com
/category/the-disappearance-of-
madeleine-mccann/60-reasons/


.
Sun Sep 05, 07:03:00 PM EDT
Techmom said...
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think Techmom means http://www.mccannfiles.com/


Yep! I goofed that one, but the links below it are good.
Thanks Anon! =)
Mon Sep 06, 01:23:00 AM EDT
Anonymous said...
As soon as the excellent blood and cadaver dogs alerted to a death in the McCanns holiday apartment the case should have been regarded as a murder investigation, and not brushed under the carpet as a possible accident.

Maybe then there would have been more cooperation from the McCanns and their friends on holiday with them. Who can believe that Kate McCann refused to answer over forty questions regarding the disappearance of her daughter! Also they refused to return for a reconstruction of that night.

More so it should be a murder investigation because of the statements made by the former friends of the McCanns who had previously been on a holiday with them. They had been so concerned when Madeleine went missing they had to go report their concern to the police about possible paedophile involvement because of what they had seen and heard on that former holiday.

The 'Gaspar statements' have so far been kept under wraps by the McCanns, yet they are available to read on the internet should anybody wish to do so.
Thu Sep 23, 11:09:00 AM EDT
Peggy from PA said...
As in the JonBenet Ramsey case the thing that seems so similar (to me) is the influential people who immediately circled the wagons around the parents. It was as if there was far more concern to protect the parents than there was for finding the truth about what happened.
Sun Nov 14, 10:36:00 AM EST
Janne said...
David Payne is a doctor who was on that famous holiday in Portugal. He is suspected of pedophilia from one friend of the McCann's. Friends name is Katherine.

Here is David Payne describing Madeleine: Extract from David Payne's rogatory statement to Leicestershire Police on 10 April 2008

24 April 2009

"Mmm..., errr... Madeleine's, errr... a very striking, errr... beautiful child, I'd almost - if I want a better phrase - call her doll-like, you know. She was very, you know, I think, you know, very unique looking child, errr...

she'd got very pretty, you know, blonde hair, errr... in a bob, she was quite a petite, errr... child and, you know, she was very bubbly, very, errr... you know, she was a very good child to, to interact with.

She was very bright, you could have a lot of fun with Madeleine, errr... and, you know, she, she was, you know, Kate and Gerry's, you know, pride and joy. They'd had a lot of trouble conceiving, you know, with IVF and everything and, you know, Madeleine was their miracle.

She was obviously very unique with the fact that she'd got the, you know, the iris defect, errr... but, you know, she was certainly a happy go lucky child, you know, she was, she would interact with the other children very well, as I said on the other, earlier recording, you know, she played very happily with Lily and, you know, indeed the other children. She was, you know, very... she is a very beautiful child and good fun."

(...)

"You know, I, you know, a fact I've come across already you know, she was a... she's a very bright child, you know, she wouldn't be the kind of mischievous child who, you know, and just try and get out of the flat and, you know, get up to mischief and that, you know, there's fun in all children but she certainly wasn't that kind of child. She was very bright."

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id236.html

Like I have always said: Gerry did it. Maybe with some help.
Mon Jan 17, 12:02:00 PM EST
Seamus O Riley said...
Jann,

thanks for the post.

I haven't studied this case and I know that people feel passionate about it.

My free time for reading is limited and I am just beginning the Knox case, but will eventually get to this one, too.

thanks,

Peter
Mon Jan 17, 01:51:00 PM EST
Anonymous said...
Hi Peter

I think with their TV interviews they stick to the script they´ve worked out and like the Knox´s won´t be interviewed by anyone with tough questions. They´ll accept the ´neglect´ questions cos that´s their alibi. However their statements to the police and the statements of their friends and family have been contradictory. Gerry has made some statements that seem to have embedded confessions in them, notoriously the challenge to the Portugues police ´Prove I killed her´. On another occasion he said ´it was terrible when we found her´ I think he then managed to add ´missing´! Surely the statement should be it was terrible when we couldn´t find her!I´ve always found it strange how the ´guilt´ and being unable to sleep well only lasted a couple of days. They don´t ever really answer the questions put to them, remind me of politicians!

There´s no doubt that some of their friends lied and that they were all in the appartment for more than an hour before police were called. Some of that time was spent writing a list of who checked the children at what time (alibi building or just defending themselves from allegations of neglect?)- on the back ripped off of one of Madeleine´s books. I think they knew she wasn´t coming back, ugh. I believe the friends were involved in the cover up and inventing a sighting of the ´abductor´ 24 hours later. There´s no evidence she was abducted.

Why would they all cover up a murder or an accidental death? And why was Gordon Brown involved in pressuring the Portugese authorities to have the case dropped? Since when does the prime minister involve himself with missing children - and send a provate plane to get the parents safely home so they don´t get arrested?

The David Payne statement is all past tense.
Sat Jan 22, 11:48:00 PM EST
Peggy from PA said...
Source: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/world/m....f-1226008595211
"Missing Madeleine McCann in US: investigator
From: Herald Sun
February 19, 2011 1:58PM

Madeleine McCann

Missing ... British toddler Madeleine McCann. Source: The Daily Telegraph

THE parents of missing Madeleine McCann have welcomed new information that suggests their daughter may be in the United States. "

This morning's news was bitter/sweet. No matter what they find, and hopefully it will be Madeleine, her little life has been impacted by a, in my view, selfish decision by her parents.
Sat Feb 19, 09:51:00 AM EST
Rachael said...
Hi Peter,

Anon at 11:48 said:

"On another occasion he said ´it was terrible when we found her´ I think he then managed to add ´missing!'"

This made me wonder... if you received this, transcribed without a pause, to read "it was terrible when we found her missing", or "it was terrible, when we found her missing"... would you still flag it as sensitive, or deceptive, since one cannot find what they are missing?

It also made me wonder how often you refer to video or audio, when available to see if there is verbal punctuation that didn't translate. Do you take that into account?

Thank you in advance, and thank you for such a neat blog!

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Mrs. Fenn's witness statement ? ..

Post by Searcher on Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:29 am

Good morning.  Have been away for a while - but coming back am interested to know more about Mrs. Fenn's original witness statement.  Grateful for a link.  Reason for asking is that on another site it was suggested that she later denied or withdrew her alleged statement of hearing Madeleine cry on the night of the 2nd for 75 minutes - saying instead that she had heard nothing.

Apologies for no ref. but it was a link from here that I followed.  Interested to know more if possible.   I have always taken Mrs. Fenn's statement as crucial.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by sharonl on Sun Jan 05, 2014 8:59 pm

@Searcher wrote:Good morning.  Have been away for a while - but coming back am interested to know more about Mrs. Fenn's original witness statement.  Grateful for a link.  Reason for asking is that on another site it was suggested that she later denied or withdrew her alleged statement of hearing Madeleine cry on the night of the 2nd for 75 minutes - saying instead that she had heard nothing.

Apologies for no ref. but it was a link from here that I followed.  Interested to know more if possible.   I have always taken Mrs. Fenn's statement as crucial.

Hi Searcher, here is the link  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAMELA_FENN.htm

I am probably in a minority but I attached very little credibility to the statements of Mrs Fenn or her niece Carole Tramner

The McCanns say that Madeleine was last seen alive on the evening of May 3rd but what evidence do we have that Madeleine was actually seen or heard by an independent person during that holiday at all?

Mrs Fenn was an elderly lady, allegedly a friend of the Murats.  She claimed that she had heard a child cry for over 75 minutes, she also claimed that she had seen off a burglar who had entered her flat, allegedly catching him by the foot as he departed via her window.  To me, it seems that all she has done here is back up the McCanns claim that the children were left alone and that there were burglars operating in the area.

The McCanns claimed to be checking every 30 minutes.  Were they being completely honest about this or did Mrs Fenn exaggerate her 75 minutes?  Are we to believe that an elderly lady in her eighties, saw off a burglar single handed?  The Policia Judiciari say that there were no reports of any burglaries in that period.

Mrs Fenn has 3 sons.  Ian Fenn who now owns the apartment is said to be a marketing manager for a london company.  The only one that I can find is Chopstix Media who has worked closely with the BBC and Virgin Media.

Carole Tranmer was in Portugal for the week, allegedly looking for property.  She claims to have visited her aunty (Mrs Fenn) twice during that week.  During her visit she backs up the McCanns claim that someone was watching the apartment by saying that from the balcony above she observed a man acting strangely around the apartments, (allegedly trying a gate to see if he could close it quietly), her description of this man matched the one given on the McCann website.  (If she did not know the tapas 9 how could know that it was not one of them?)
Carole flew home before hearing about Madeleines disappearance but went to the police later, offering a photograph of herself on her aunts balcony as evidence that she was there.

Did Mrs Fenn really hear Madeleine cry or did she have a small part to play in convincing us that Madeleine was around at that particular time?

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 05, 2014 9:04 pm

@sharonl wrote:
The McCanns say that Madeleine was last seen alive on the evening of May 3rd but what evidence do we have that Madeleine was actually seen or heard by an independent person during that holiday at all?

I'm increasingly of the belief that there are no "independent" persons in the whole case. If they're mentioned by name, they're complicit.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by sharonl on Sun Jan 05, 2014 10:06 pm

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@sharonl wrote:
The McCanns say that Madeleine was last seen alive on the evening of May 3rd but what evidence do we have that Madeleine was actually seen or heard by an independent person during that holiday at all?

I'm increasingly of the belief that there are no "independent" persons in the whole case. If they're mentioned by name, they're complicit.

Apart from Mrs Fenn and her niece there was:

Phill Edmonds who claims to have photographed Madeleine in the playground, he turned out to be the nephew of Margaret Hodge and co-director of her Stemcor Company.  When asked about the photographs he failed to produce them even though it would have been in the McCanns favour for him to do so.


The staff at the creche.  According to one news article, the four nannies were in some way linked to members of the Tapas group.  All four were despatched for employment at a MW resort in Greece shortly after Madeleine was reported missing and they had been interviewed. Why?


There were some contradictions in the statements of the nannies too.  

Cat Baker claims to have met Kate on the morning of Apr 29th when Madeleine 1st enrolled and she was allocated to her lobster group, this was normal practice for the creche, but Kate claims that she had been introduced to the nanny who had been allocated to Madeleine on the evening of 28th (even though they claim to have not gone out), how did they know at that time which nanny would have taken charge of Madeleine? Kate said that she warmed to Cat immediately.

The staff at the Millenium restaurant on the morning of Apr 29th remember the twins but cannot recall seeing Madeleine, although she may have been there.

Is there anyone else who has claimed to have seen Madeleine during that week?

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 05, 2014 10:11 pm

@sharonl wrote:[ [...]

Did Mrs Fenn really hear Madeleine cry or did she have a small part to play in convincing us that Madeleine was around at that particular time?
***
Excuse me ... ????
I have to chose between "carpet drawn from below feet", "I'm out of here", "what do you mean?", "why would you say that?", "what's your agenda?"," do I really bother to consider this?". Whilst I'm choosing, take your pick ...!

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Searcher on Sun Jan 05, 2014 10:44 pm

@sharonl wrote:
@Searcher wrote:Good morning.  Have been away for a while - but coming back am interested to know more about Mrs. Fenn's original witness statement.  Grateful for a link.  Reason for asking is that on another site it was suggested that she later denied or withdrew her alleged statement of hearing Madeleine cry on the night of the 2nd for 75 minutes - saying instead that she had heard nothing.

Apologies for no ref. but it was a link from here that I followed.  Interested to know more if possible.   I have always taken Mrs. Fenn's statement as crucial.

Hi Searcher, here is the link  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAMELA_FENN.htm

I am probably in a minority but I attached very little credibility to the statements of Mrs Fenn or her niece Carole Tramner.
  
Thankyou Sharoni; the statement on the link is helpful, and the one I have read many times before.  I am interested to know if Mrs. Fenn retracted or changed this statement sometime after, as suggested on another site.  

I can't see how or why Mrs. Fenn would make a false statement, although I do have some confusion over whether the crying happened on the night of the 1st or the 2nd.  Statement says the 1st; yet I think from memory KM talks of Madeleine saying on the morning of the 3rd at breakfast "Why didnt you come last night when Sean and I were crying?"  I may have this completely wrong in terms of the date.  

What always seems unclear is who saw the real Madeleine and when, throughout the holiday period and not just on the 2nd or 3rd.  Still so many unanswered questions!

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:15 pm

I would still like to have an answer to my question to Sharon, which questions the question:

"Did Mrs Fenn really hear Madeleine cry or did she have a small part to play in convincing us that Madeleine was around at that particular time?

I am completely open to any new information or idea, but wholeheartedly resent unfounded questions as above ...

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by marconi on Mon Jan 06, 2014 12:00 am

Mrs. Fenn stated that she heard an older child (older than 2) crying on the evening of May the 1st.

On the CMTV, Amaral told that she saw Payne on the patio at 7pm. I never saw a statement where she was telling she saw Payne. It is very well possible that the PJ did not release everything that she said and even possible that she stated more than once.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Mon Jan 06, 2014 7:49 am

@sharonl wrote:

Is there anyone else who has claimed to have seen Madeleine during that week?

The Smiths?

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Daisy on Mon Jan 06, 2014 12:45 pm

@Searcher wrote:Good morning.  Have been away for a while - but coming back am interested to know more about Mrs. Fenn's original witness statement.  Grateful for a link.  Reason for asking is that on another site it was suggested that she later denied or withdrew her alleged statement of hearing Madeleine cry on the night of the 2nd for 75 minutes - saying instead that she had heard nothing.

Apologies for no ref. but it was a link from here that I followed.  Interested to know more if possible.   I have always taken Mrs. Fenn's statement as crucial.
Hi Searcher, as far as I'm aware Mrs Fenn only made the one statement. I haven't come across any reference to a second one. Maybe the confusion comes from this video of Mrs Fenn dismissing the 'rubbish' reported in the press. The Daily Mail then reported more rubbish by claiming she was referring to her police statement and the crying incident. She clearly wasn't.



Published on Sep 1, 2012
Last night the McCanns got a boost when the police case appeared to be undermined by a pensioner who is potentially a key witness.
Pamela Fenn, 81, lives above the apartment where Madeleine disappeared and is reported to have told police she heard Madeleine screaming below.
But yesterday she broke her silence to say it was "absolute rubbish" she had made any such claims to police. Mrs Fenn said: "I didn't even know that family was in there."


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic...

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by tigger on Mon Jan 06, 2014 1:01 pm

Sean was older than two and quite big for his age, compared to his twin sister.  It's quite amazing how loud children can cry.
I think it was Sean because the narrative started with that: Why didn't you come when  Sean was crying? iirc.
The McCanns were very anxious that the police should know about the crying. As from the 4th of May!

See also: Dr. Roberts: A crying shame. McCannfiles.com

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Searcher on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:10 pm

@Daisy wrote:
@Searcher wrote:Good morning.  Have been away for a while - but coming back am interested to know more about Mrs. Fenn's original witness statement.  Grateful for a link.  Reason for asking is that on another site it was suggested that she later denied or withdrew her alleged statement of hearing Madeleine cry on the night of the 2nd for 75 minutes - saying instead that she had heard nothing.

Apologies for no ref. but it was a link from here that I followed.  Interested to know more if possible.   I have always taken Mrs. Fenn's statement as crucial.
Hi Searcher, as far as I'm aware Mrs Fenn only made the one statement. I haven't come across any reference to a second one. Maybe the confusion comes from this video of Mrs Fenn dismissing the 'rubbish' reported in the press. The Daily Mail then reported more rubbish by claiming she was referring to her police statement and the crying incident. She clearly wasn't.



Published on Sep 1, 2012
Last night the McCanns got a boost when the police case appeared to be undermined by a pensioner who is potentially a key witness.
Pamela Fenn, 81, lives above the apartment where Madeleine disappeared and is reported to have told police she heard Madeleine screaming below.
But yesterday she broke her silence to say it was "absolute rubbish" she had made any such claims to police. Mrs Fenn said: "I didn't even know that family was in there."


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic...

Thankyou Daisy; this would seem to tie in very well with what I read on the other website link - very odd though, to contradict a formal statement.  Most interesting!!  I wonder why.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Searcher on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:13 pm

@tigger wrote:Sean was older than two and quite big for his age, compared to his twin sister.  It's quite amazing how loud children can cry.
I think it was Sean because the narrative started with that: Why didn't you come when  Sean was crying? iirc.
The McCanns were very anxious that the police should know about the crying. As from the 4th of May!

See also: Dr. Roberts: A crying shame. McCannfiles.com

Hello Tigger; thankyou.  I don't have the ref. to hand but from memory Madeleine was quoted in KM's book as saying on the following morning (2nd or 3rd??) "Whey didn't you come when Sean and I were crying?".  Interested if anyone has better references and more accuracy.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Doug D on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:20 pm

Good memory searcher.

At breakfast time, Madeleine had a question for us. 'Why didn't you come when Sean and I cried last night?'

ETA KM Book page 62.Morning of the 3rd.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:25 pm

I don't believe M uttered these words.  Kate said this to "prove" M was alive on the morning of 3rd May.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by MissDaisy on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:37 pm

I think it was Sean crying Maddie, Maddie, which would explain why they were so keen to claim she was never called Maddie.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by sallypelt on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:44 pm

@MissDaisy wrote:I think it was Sean crying Maddie, Maddie, which would explain why they were so keen to claim she was never called Maddie.

Could it be that something had happened to Madeleine that night, and that's why one of the twins was crying and calling her name. Is this why Kate said that Madeleine was never referred to as Maddie, and then when on to try and convince us that Madeleine was alive on the morning of the 3rd of May by stating that Madeleine asked why she (Kate) didn't come when her and Sean were crying on the night of 2 May?

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by MissDaisy on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:51 pm

@sallypelt wrote:
@MissDaisy wrote:I think it was Sean crying Maddie, Maddie, which would explain why they were so keen to claim she was never called Maddie.

Could it be that something had happened to Madeleine that night, and that's why one of the twins was crying and calling her name.  Is this  why Kate said  that Madeleine was never referred to as Maddie, and then when on to try and convince us that Madeleine was alive on the morning of the 3rd of May by stating that Madeleine asked why she  (Kate) didn't come when her and Sean were crying on the night of 2 May?
When I was watching the recent crimewatch appeal I was thinking why would you want to emphasise the fact that your children cried for you the night before, yet you still went out the following night and left them alone again? The only explanation I could think for them mentioning is this is to purport that all was well on the 3rd May when it wasn't well at all. Just my opinions.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by tigger on Mon Jan 06, 2014 6:52 pm

From the topic: 75 minutes of crying which also has the full Dr.Roberts article in it.


Kate and Gerry's phone activity on that day.
Gerry had none at all. But Kate's mobile use is interesting. Remember the crying began at around 20.30 - which could also be right after the last call.
Lasted until 23.45.
Between 20.31 and 20.37 Kate has four phone calls in rapid succession.
Between 22.16 and 22.27 Kate has six phonecalls in very rapid succession. It has been stated elsewhere that she was in the apartment 5a during the last six calls.

KM
01-May
10.16
11.56
12.17
19.45
20.31
20.33
20.35
20.37
22.16
22.23
22.23
22.24
22.25
22.27 (Crying starts at 22.30sh)


____________________
Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate.

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Five Star on Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:11 pm

@MissDaisy wrote:I think it was Sean crying Maddie, Maddie, which would explain why they were so keen to claim she was never called Maddie.



Gerry's father was interviewed a while ago (mentioned his pro-active family) and I remember him saying  "wee Maddie"  

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:46 pm

@Five Star wrote:
@MissDaisy wrote:I think it was Sean crying Maddie, Maddie, which would explain why they were so keen to claim she was never called Maddie.



Gerry's father was interviewed a while ago (mentioned his pro-active family) and I remember him saying  "wee Maddie"  
***
Gerry's father died quite some time ago ...
Gerry's brother John mentioned his proactive family ...
And ALL of the family called her "wee" Madeleine. Scottish, I ques.

BUT, NO , SERIOUSLY ...

Can we get into a serious debate again?

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Five Star on Mon Jan 06, 2014 10:12 pm

ooops 

I sit corrected!

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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:55 pm

In their Arguido interviews KM refuses to answer 48 questions.
But GM refuses to answer only one:

7th Sept 2007
"When asked if on any occasion Madeleine was injured, he says that he has no comments."


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Re: More statement analysis

Post by Guest on Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:13 pm

dantezebu wrote:In their Arguido interviews KM refuses to answer 48 questions.
But GM refuses to answer only one:

7th Sept 2007
"When asked if on any occasion Madeleine was injured, he says that he has no comments."

***
I missed that one ... !
And it's more significant than Kate's refusal to answer any questions.
IMO, of course, IMO.
And back to reading ...

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