Re: CW was actually very clever I think

by Humanist 29.11.13 15:10

I am sitting here wondering how many of those 3 000 responses they got, how many told the investigating team that they had followed
the advice of Kate and Gerry pty litd and had sent all the precious images on their phones/cameras. All those pictures they had sent on to the poor, sweet couple in Rothley, who really need to do the whole investigation themselves because of the ineptitude of police force in Portugal.

I also imagine that many of those people still have those images on their computers. A lot of them will have. And a lot of them probably forwarded them onto Mr Redwood instead.

His tone has indeed changed and there is no way on earth he is going to be part of a whitewash. No way at all.

by Humanist 29.11.13 15:21

A lot of compassion arises for me now what Kate must be enduring.
A lot.
She never would have chosen this for herself.

She looks awful and I say that in a heartfelt way. Her beauty is gone.
Everyone is commenting on it.

I can see a legal claim from defense to prosecutor to just look at her
and see that she has suffered enough. It looks it.

And then I think everything in this case has been orchestrated.
Has her twisted face also being orchestrated. If she was sleeping three weeks
after her daughter was missing and looking as beautiful and radiant as a rose
and indeed only very recently has she that haunted concentration camp look.
Botox will paralyse muscles to make a face more beautiful
and also more tortured.

What I hate most about Madeleine's disappearance is it has really eroded a lot of trust.

by Cristobell 29.11.13 15:22

Humanist wrote:I am sitting here wondering how many of those 3 000 responses they got, how many told the investigating team that they had followed
the advice of Kate and Gerry pty litd and had sent all the precious images on their phones/cameras. All those pictures they had sent on to the poor, sweet couple in Rothley, who really need to do the whole investigation themselves because of the ineptitude of police force in Portugal.

I also imagine that many of those people still have those images on their computers. A lot of them will have. And a lot of them probably forwarded them onto Mr Redwood instead.

His tone has indeed changed and there is no way on earth he is going to be part of a whitewash. No way at all.

Hi Humanist, I too am trying to get my head around that 3,000+ figure. It is almost 7 years after the event, as you say, it may appeal to those who never heard back from the McCanns, but even so, it is a huge number. It may of course be those on the periphery of what took place in PDL on 3rd May 2007. Some who would not speak to the McCanns private detectives and feared coming forward. Still wouldn't amount to 3,000 though. Unless everything that is odd about the McCanns is finally coming to light.

I agree his tone has changed considerably. This is stern, angry gop, determined to get to the bottom of what happened. And I don't think the McCanns are co-operating, their website still has Tannerman, which is not only distracting but could be considered obstructive.

by Humanist 29.11.13 15:27

I know this should be under another great one from Blacksmith but it fits in here right now.

http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.com/2013/11/trauma-time-again-part-ii.html
Trauma part 2.

Sheer brilliance.
Game. Set. Match.

Anyone in Brighton wanting to run as MP - I think there will be a electoral vacancy soon.

by canada12 29.11.13 15:33

Is it possible that the McCanns' website is still showing Tannerman because it hasn't been updated in a long time? Is it possible that the McCanns are not being allowed to update the website? ie - has it been seized for some reason by SY? As evidence, mayhaps?

by Woofer 29.11.13 15:37

Bishop Brennan wrote:There definitely seemed to be a change between the two CW programs. Redwood seemed angry this time, compared to his more chatty approach in CW1. He clearly didn't want to be on TV (never mind showing up at the studio), said nothing at all, and didn't blink once in his astonishingly brief "update".

Yes, he seemed angry alright, as if he didn`t want to be addressing the public at all. In fact, besides the anger, he appeared robotic and I wondered if he was real.

Chilly Heat mentioned that this case may encompass a far wider circle than the McCanns - hence its going to take many more months and in a way I wish we never heard anything from AR until its all rounded up and completed. The tractorman scenario could have been an unspecific piece of gossip from someone connected to the PJ which the MSM exaggerated for sales.

by Humanist 29.11.13 15:39

canada12 wrote:Is it possible that the McCanns' website is still showing Tannerman because it hasn't been updated in a long time? Is it possible that the McCanns are not being allowed to update the website? ie - has it been seized for some reason by SY? As evidence, mayhaps?

Very good point.

by Newintown 29.11.13 15:48

Shrike wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:
currio wrote:
Shrike wrote:
Greycatofoxford wrote:I notice, that as the days become weeks with the FUND closed, it seems unlikely that it is being " updated " and more likely that there is a connection to increased speculation as to the purpose of the fund.
Regarding the fund and what looks like a possible closure of donations either forced (by SY?) or advised I was wondering if anybody has tried to donate not through the "Donate" button within the store but by a bank transfer for example. Does anybody know somebody who has tried and failed as this could be a further indication that the "fund" has been stopped?

I was thinking of doing a transfer of a quid to check this but am in 2 minds as even the thought of giving a penny to these people is abhorrent IMO.

An interesting thought though.........
@Shrike
$i don\'t know$ .....that's been bugging me too.....there's even an address to post it to, if your real anxious ...I'm sure plenty old Granny's will have their Xmas donation in with the card...

Surely if there is more to it, all of this would have been wiped...
Oh come on, if cash were stuffed into envelopes (or christmas cards) and simply marked Mccanns@Rothley, it will get there, and you can bet your bottom dollar the Mccanns wont reject it. Ditto bank transfer.
The pertinent question is: are these donations properly recorded in the books of the Fund, as is legal requirement of the Fund Constitution and By-laws I would imagine. Who's in charge of accounting for cash donations received at Rothley would be a valid question if the auditors were thorough in their job.
But Aiyoyo that is not the point of my comment/question. My point was - has anybody tried a bank transfer and failed as those have have/forced the Donation buttons into dormancy/extinction, whatever has happened, might also have forced the account to be closed. Cash is a different thing but that has no relevance to what I am thinking. If the bank account is closed then it looks like something is definitely going on behind the scenes? As I said, just a thought!

Shrike, banks charge their customers to make a bank transfer. I did one about 6 weeks ago, they charged me about £15 (I can't remember the exact amount), although it may depend on the amount of money being transferred, so I doubt if anyone of sound mind would want to pay a bank charge for sending money to the McCanns' "private" fund.

With regard to the fund and it not be accessible, I only hope the McCanns have not decided to close it whilst moving the money elsewhere before the end of year accounts have to be submitted, otherwise SY may spend the next few years trying to find out where it's all gone, that's if SY are looking into it. As it's a private fund and not a charity I would imagine they can do anything with it they like, although not having a financial background I'm only guessing.

by oakeso 29.11.13 15:49

Shrike wrote:Regarding the fund and what looks like a possible closure of donations either forced (by SY?) or advised I was wondering if anybody has tried to donate not through the "Donate" button within the store but by a bank transfer for example. Does anybody know somebody who has tried and failed as this could be a further indication that the "fund" has been stopped?

I was thinking of doing a transfer of a quid to check this but am in 2 minds as even the thought of giving a penny to these people is abhorrent IMO.

An interesting thought though.........

Yes, I agree, it would be very interesting. If they've been advised/decided not to collect any more from the public the bank account would remain open until the company is wound up. But if it was forced then the transactions would likely be stopped.

I can't recall but don't believe they were selling the book from the online store, I thought the link was to another source like amazon. But now the link for the book is directing to the poster page. Whatever the issue there can't be any legal/criminal element attached to selling/promoting the book so I'm beginning to wonder if it's simply a site/server problem.

by aiyoyo 29.11.13 15:55

Shrike wrote:
aiyoyo wrote:
currio wrote:
Shrike wrote:
Greycatofoxford wrote:I notice, that as the days become weeks with the FUND closed, it seems unlikely that it is being " updated " and more likely that there is a connection to increased speculation as to the purpose of the fund.
Regarding the fund and what looks like a possible closure of donations either forced (by SY?) or advised I was wondering if anybody has tried to donate not through the "Donate" button within the store but by a bank transfer for example. Does anybody know somebody who has tried and failed as this could be a further indication that the "fund" has been stopped?

I was thinking of doing a transfer of a quid to check this but am in 2 minds as even the thought of giving a penny to these people is abhorrent IMO.

An interesting thought though.........
@Shrike
$i don\'t know$ .....that's been bugging me too.....there's even an address to post it to, if your real anxious ...I'm sure plenty old Granny's will have their Xmas donation in with the card...

Surely if there is more to it, all of this would have been wiped...
Oh come on, if cash were stuffed into envelopes (or christmas cards) and simply marked Mccanns@Rothley, it will get there, and you can bet your bottom dollar the Mccanns wont reject it. Ditto bank transfer.
The pertinent question is: are these donations properly recorded in the books of the Fund, as is legal requirement of the Fund Constitution and By-laws I would imagine. Who's in charge of accounting for cash donations received at Rothley would be a valid question if the auditors were thorough in their job.
But Aiyoyo that is not the point of my comment/question. My point was - has anybody tried a bank transfer and failed as those have have/forced the Donation buttons into dormancy/extinction, whatever has happened, might also have forced the account to be closed. Cash is a different thing but that has no relevance to what I am thinking. If the bank account is closed then it looks like something is definitely going on behind the scenes? As I said, just a thought!

Oh, wrong end of the stick then, sorry.

You're talking about bank transfer which would mean directly into the Fund.
A fund neither SY or anyone for that matter has the power to stop them operating unless it has been proven as fraud and they're charged for the crime.
Short of that, no one can stop their fund collection via donation button unless they themselves choose to stop it.
Perhaps people are reading too much into their web shutdown for overhaul.
If the donation button is done away, it might be because it had served its purpose and past its sell by date because donation is drying up.
Hard to imagine the arrogant pair believe the Police are onto them.

by chillyheat 29.11.13 15:57

The Fund is probably under investigation....IMO or...
Death in absentia, The seven year rule is somehow, possibly involved. Maybe ???

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declared_death_in_absentia

by chillyheat 29.11.13 16:12

Theres no doubt in my mind that AR has recently put his hand on the McCanns shoulders and said "We can no longer presume Madeleine is alive". The McCanns cant and wont agree to that. If they start to agree with Redwood now, then he will have broken the so called pact. Hence Tannerman still on the site.
The only other thing I cant shrug off is what about all the involvement of the Security Services. What is their role in this, if indeed they are still involved...The shadowy ones will do as they please.

by Guest 29.11.13 16:38

The fund was set up on the basis of an abduction and the belief she was alive. If SY have proof/evidence that she is dead then the fund would have to be stopped or the fund's terms of reference changed to make the public aware of the fund's new agenda. However, to announce to the public that there is evidence of Madeleine being dead is not something that the McCanns or SY would want the world to know for many reasons so my belief is that they have been advised by their lawyers through SY to close the fund under the veil of 'updating' .

by Guest 29.11.13 17:58

melisande wrote:The fund was set up on the basis of an abduction and the belief she was alive. If SY have proof/evidence that she is dead then the fund would have to be stopped or the fund's terms of reference changed to make the public aware of the fund's new agenda. However, to announce to the public that there is evidence of Madeleine being dead is not something that the McCanns or SY would want the world to know for many reasons so my belief is that they have been advised by their lawyers through SY to close the fund under the veil of 'updating' .

Which infers the child is dead, and they know it

by Mikey 29.11.13 18:04

More than a couple of thoughts come to mind of course, but I wished to limit this. It has indeed been a thought provoking thread, and one of the better ones. Long ago I believed and stated (elsewhere) that SY could not possibly ignore the infamous couple as potential suspects. That would beggar belief. To do their jobs, they simply had to consider all avenues. It must be the case surely? So, taking that assumption:

Irrespective of how one may or may not read into the CW shows (which I have never had the chance to see; not aired here in Africa) but taking the very greatest likelihood that poor Madeleine is dead, plus the fact that she was likely never 'abducted', then the struggle must remain to being able to formulate an adequate case on that basis.

Now, the thoughts that come to mind are; what potential charges could any of the party face that are indirectly involved, i.e. in the farcical cover-up? How likely is it that they will ALL keep tightly to their original agreement/bond/story? Surely they do not ALL wish to face serving a jail sentence? Should this be the case.

As an aside... the fund. What on earth becomes of all the money, that without doubt would have been taken and dispersed of fraudulently, etc, etc? The mind begins to boggle...

At the end of the day, I wish to see the truth prevail, whatever the outcome. I know what I tend to believe, but belief is neither proof or conviction. I feel very sorry for the twins, and it will be better for them the sooner this comes to a close... lastly, in terms of justice... I wish this for Madeleine.

My hope is that the team from SY, preferably jointly with the Portuguese, will bring said closure.

by sallypelt 29.11.13 18:12

jeanmonroe wrote:
Smokeandmirrors wrote:Have the Twitter weirdos had anything to say about it?
Nope.

~~Kate~~ TrulyJudas is getting her nails done!

No 'turning stones' for those manicured hands.

Having her nails done? Don't believe the liar. It never leaves the computer. It has tweeted more than SIX HUNDRED TWEETS in two days. It has no fingers left to have any nails.

by Mikey 29.11.13 18:18

Portia wrote:
Which infers the child is dead, and they know it

What puzzles me a lot, continually, is how can they possibly resolve the libel case when there is so clearly a great degree of suspicion that the pair are in some way implicit in the disappearance?

One obvious outcome (perhaps preferable) given the current state of play, is to find for the defendant. The trouble is, does this not open the door wide for a counter claim? And then who pays for all the costs? The fund... the public?

This leaves only one other possibility, if it exists (or something similar), which is to delay it indefinitely?

Between Portuguese law, and British, I have no idea, but surely the fact that there is an active case must have an impact on being able to serve fair justice to a Libel suit?

by Cristobell 29.11.13 18:28

I really don't know how they are going to get past suppressing the Smith sighting for five years, and wonder if this will be mentioned in the summing up of the Defence. Obviously withholding vital information from the public must have been hugely damaging to the Search, far more than so than Goncalo's book.

They haven't proved their case thus far. They are claiming damages for depression and stress they suffered as a result of Goncalo Amaral's book. They were not able to produce a single qualified psychologist to support their individual claims. The claims that the twins may come across GA's book in the future were nothing compared to the sensational and shocking headlines in the UK as a result of their parents' demands for financial compensation and refusal to have the case hear in camera. Who exactly is harming the twins' wellbeing?

by Guest 29.11.13 18:32

I think that we can rule out Kate as being that lovely creature on Twitter - unless there was a break last night when Crimewatch was on!

by Mikey 29.11.13 18:49

Cristobell wrote:I really don't know how they are going to get past suppressing the Smith sighting for five years, and wonder if this will be mentioned in the summing up of the Defence. Obviously withholding vital information from the public must have been hugely damaging to the Search, far more than so than Goncalo's book.

They haven't proved their case thus far. They are claiming damages for depression and stress they suffered as a result of Goncalo Amaral's book. They were not able to produce a single qualified psychologist to support their individual claims. The claims that the twins may come across GA's book in the future were nothing compared to the sensational and shocking headlines in the UK as a result of their parents' demands for financial compensation and refusal to have the case hear in camera. Who exactly is harming the twins' wellbeing?

Hello Cristobell. It is precisely this, if they themselves have brought much of this upon themselves, not simply by the possibility of being complicit in a crime, but by the deliberate actions to deceive, withhold information, etc, how can a judge rule in their favour?

by Mikey 29.11.13 19:00

Back on topic of CW: I wonder, how many of the purported 3 to 3.5 k calls were from people telling them it was the parents?

(Just curious... if there were any such calls)

by ultimaThule 29.11.13 19:01

Humanist wrote:A lot of compassion arises for me now what Kate must be enduring.
A lot.
She never would have chosen this for herself.

She looks awful and I say that in a heartfelt way. Her beauty is gone.
Everyone is commenting on it.

I can see a legal claim from defense to prosecutor to just look at her
and see that she has suffered enough. It looks it.

And then I think everything in this case has been orchestrated.
Has her twisted face also being orchestrated. If she was sleeping three weeks
after her daughter was missing and looking as beautiful and radiant as a rose
and indeed only very recently has she that haunted concentration camp look.
Botox will paralyse muscles to make a face more beautiful
and also more tortured.

What I hate most about Madeleine's disappearance is it has really eroded a lot of trust.

You must indeed be a humanist of the most noble kind because I cannot find it within me to summon up one iota of compassion for this woman.

It may be that she is beginning to resemble the equivalent of Dorian Gray's hidden portrait, rather than the ever youthful visage he was able to present to the world due to his Faustian pact with the devil, but to my mind KM's face is merely showing evidence of certain physical and mental disorders I've long suspected she is afflicted by.

Of course it could be that being married to one such as her chosen spouse has also taken its toll on her once radiant looks. Childhood and other experiences can impact on an adult's physical appearance, and I have no doubt this couple are the product of dysfunctional families. Nevertheless, KM at least was raised to tell right from wrong and there can be no excuse for her failure to do right by her first-born child.

I agree that 'She never would have chosen this for herself'. However, my interpretation of this statement is that her choice did not extend to the possibility that her lies would be found out and that she would lose all credibility and come to be reviled in her local community as well as in wider society.

It's inconceivable that KM was unaware of the saying 'the truth will out' before she embarked on an immense deception intended to save her skin, and it seems almost poetic justice that her skin appears to be undergoing a transformation as the full extent of her lies have been, and continue to be, revealed in an appropriately excoriating manner.

Such compassion as I have in this matter is exclusively reserved for a delightful little 3 year old girl who was sacrificed on the altar of her parents' greed. Regardless of what justice is meted out to them in the here and now, their callous indifference to her welfare and wellbeing, in life as well as in death, is something for which they will ultimately be more properly held to account by their Catholic god who may, or who may not be, more merciful than I can be towards this excessively selfish, self-obsessed, self-absorbed, self-centred, and demonically deceitful pair.

by chillyheat 29.11.13 19:17

Mikey wrote:Back on topic of CW: I wonder, how many of the purported 3 to 3.5 k calls were from people telling them it was the parents?

(Just curious... if there were any such calls)

http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/Police-received-5-000-calls-Madeleine-McCann/story-20239609-detail/story.html

It looks worse if they read the local...... big grin

by ultimaThule 29.11.13 19:29

While we may guess at who the majority of those calls named as being the e-fit suspect, who's to know whether one or more of them contained valuable information from invdividuals who were in Luz on the night of 3 May 2007 and it's highly unlikely AR will have revealed any of the content of those calls to the McCanns.
No wonder they're beginning to look a tad overwhelmed by the success of their Crimewatch appeal big grin

by Mikey 29.11.13 19:34

ChillyHeat wrote:
Mikey wrote:Back on topic of CW: I wonder, how many of the purported 3 to 3.5 k calls were from people telling them it was the parents?

(Just curious... if there were any such calls)
http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/Police-received-5-000-calls-Madeleine-McCann/story-20239609-detail/story.html

It looks worse if they read the local......

Have to admit... reading that brought a smile to my face too. Could be more than 50%... by a fair margin. Curiously, it also made me ponder... is there anyone outside of the UK that doesn't have at least some doubts?