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PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Guest on 29.10.13 18:33

Hi everyone,
OK first post and it may be a stupid question.   But.. in one of hideho's videos I saw recently what I thought were huge iron doors, like massive (crematorium/oven) doors were shown.   
It was just flashed up briefly but has bothered me no end since.   Anyone have any idea where these doors were from ?

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Ayniia on 29.10.13 18:33

@ProfessorPPlum wrote:
I still don't see how it happens. Who do you call? The local crematorium? Some local criminal with an incinerator capable of leaving NO remains? Do you have a dodgy person on the inside of a hospital or a vets to do it for you? Yet another person or person(s) risking their freedom colluding with you? Or is the dark and mysterious secret services that swoop in and do it for you? 

I just...don't...get how it's possible and if you tried to do it yourself...well that would be traumatic beyond words (not to mention probably unsuccessful). 

Sorry to go into detail here, but this is what you're really saying if you say you think she was cremated.
Now I'm the one saying sorry about what I'm just about to say but,
Isn't it more traumatic hiding a child's body for 20+ days, then take it in the scenic to God knows where and bury it?
There's a lot of animal crematoriums in Portugal, at least two were investigated by the PJ in the first investigation.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Daisy on 29.10.13 18:54

@OpenMind wrote:
@Estelle wrote:Was the funeral held in Skipton?
Could you please explain this?

Not heard about this before!
There's been quite a bit of discussion about the McCann's attendance at the christening of Michael Wright's children in Skipton. Try this for starters:

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t2270-madeleine-mccann-the-role-of-michael-wright

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by MoonGoddess on 29.10.13 18:57

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but could the urn ashes on the Rothley mantle piece be forensically tested analysed?

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by tigger on 29.10.13 19:01

...and of course whoever ran such an outfit wouldn't say a word, despite a 2.5 million award for information. Apart from the risk of blackmail for the McCanns.

Imo there was an emergency, Murat had contacts, 'they' took her to a temporary hiding place which probably involved a freezer or fridge. 
Some weeks layer ( my money is on the 10th June) she was moved to a permanent resting place, most likely in Portugal.  They may not even know where. 

Evidence found in a barn some 24 km from PdL which links with 5a and fibres found in the Scenic. 

I think it's a mistake to confuse one's own feelings with the facts as far as we know them.

Gerry even told us that the circumstances were such that he could not have physically been there. 
That figures, he was smelling of roses as far as the dogs were concerned. 

I've also read theories such as Gerry going back into 5a after seeing JW, finding her dead behind the sofa and being drunk, clutched her in his arms, ran down to the beach, threw the body in the sea and ran back to clean 5a.    splat

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Praiaaa on 29.10.13 19:03

@Aoife wrote:
@ProfessorPPlum wrote:I'd like to hear some theories explaining how you (as one half of the most famous couple in the UK at that present moment) would go about getting a weighty, possibly unpleasant little bundle cremated so that you could keep the ashes on your mantelpiece (or whatever). 

I'm sitting comfortably.....coffee
Someone on the Mirror Forum suggested that they wrapped her body inside a dead dog and had it cremated in a pet crematorium without the owners knowing! One of the amazing stories arising from this case!
Yes, who'dya call...

Love the imagination re the dead dog, and the crematoria people not actually checking inside a blue bag...

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by thetruthbeknown on 29.10.13 19:08

Must say ive been surprised by the theories on here..Wasnt sure what I would find after Gerry told us in vanity fair about what people were theorising about...


“Yes, yes, I know,” Gerry says bitterly. “Kate killed her in a frenzy, Madeleine was sedated by us, she fell down the stairs—in which case you would have thought they’d have found her body. I’ve heard all that! There have been a huge number of theories in the media. But what I want to know is—who told them all that?”

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by tigger on 29.10.13 20:07

@thetruthbeknown wrote:Must say ive been surprised by the theories on here..Wasnt sure what I would find after Gerry told us in vanity fair about what people were theorising about...


“Yes, yes, I know,” Gerry says bitterly. “Kate killed her in a frenzy, Madeleine was sedated by us, she fell down the stairs—in which case you would have thought they’d have found her body. I’ve heard all that! There have been a huge number of theories in the media. But what I want to know is—who told them all that?”
Yes, lovely isn't it?  Could have been Philomena.....big grin

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by MoonGoddess on 29.10.13 20:21

@thetruthbeknown wrote:Must say ive been surprised by the theories on here..Wasnt sure what I would find after Gerry told us in vanity fair about what people were theorising about...


“Yes, yes, I know,” Gerry says bitterly. “Kate killed her in a frenzy, Madeleine was sedated by us, she fell down the stairs—in which case you would have thought they’d have found her body. I’ve heard all that! There have been a huge number of theories in the media. But what I want to know is—who told them all that?”

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by bodiddly on 29.10.13 20:58

I was under the impression that KM  is a devout catholic in which case it may be worth looking at this site.
I thought burial was preferred by Catholics although I note the ban on it was lifted at some point.
They do have specific guidelines on cremation and how the ashes are kept http://catholic-bulletin.blogspot.co.uk/2008/08/can-catholics-be-cremated.html

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Hobs on 29.10.13 21:15

I wonder if cadaverine can be detected from a cremated body? I know dogs have reacted to cadaverine in a burnt out vegicle and also trained dogs have indicated in severely fire damaged areas.

If a human body had been disposed off in a pet crematory would dogs still react?

I would think the temps would be lower than in a human crematorium, plus the mass is usually a lot smaller.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by stillsloppingout on 29.10.13 21:26

Typing on phonev.
Firstly ashes have no DNA.
Secondly Re Disposal of body .who conducts burials other than undertakers, thatby there presences would not arouse suspicion ?. 
A   a Priest ... as I keep banging on about the answer imo it.is to do with that church  IMO.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Beanie on 29.10.13 21:38

@secrets and lies wrote:I've always had the uncanny sense that Madeleine's remains are in Rothley.

Just my theory.
You and me both,  also many other people I know.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by KellyLennon on 29.10.13 21:39

@stillsloppingout wrote:Typing on phonev.
Firstly ashes have no DNA.
Secondly Re Disposal of body .who conducts burials other than undertakers, thatby there presences would not arouse suspicion ?. 
A   a Priest ... as I keep banging on about the answer imo it.is to do with that church  IMO.
I agree, am sure I read somewhere that at 3am 4th May while locals where out searching, The Mccanns asked for a priest.
Will try and find where I read that and post link

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Guest on 29.10.13 21:52

@Hobs wrote:I wonder if cadaverine can be detected from a cremated body? I know dogs have reacted to cadaverine in a burnt out vegicle and also trained dogs have indicated in severely fire damaged areas.

If a human body had been disposed off in a pet crematory would dogs still react?

I would think the temps would be lower than in a human crematorium, plus the mass is usually a lot smaller.
Cadaverine is a diamine, which would be destroyed by heat at a fairly low temperature. I don't know the specific temperature for cadaverine but as most proteins start to denature at around 41 C I don't think it would withstand a cremation. 
I think the issue with buildings and cars or just confined areas in general that have contained a corpse still having cadaverine detected in might be be that it can hang around for a long time in the air and can accumulate in corners etc depending on the airflow. I think this was thought to have been what happened in 5A with the detection in the wardrobe.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by MRNOODLES on 29.10.13 21:54

@KellyLennon wrote:
@stillsloppingout wrote:Typing on phonev.
Firstly ashes have no DNA.
Secondly Re Disposal of body .who conducts burials other than undertakers, thatby there presences would not arouse suspicion ?. 
A   a Priest ... as I keep banging on about the answer imo it.is to do with that church  IMO.
I agree, am sure I read somewhere that at 3am 4th May while locals where out searching, The Mccanns asked for a priest.
Will try and find where I read that and post link
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-488262/I-deceived-says-Portuguese-priest-comforted-Gerry-Kate-McCann.html

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by KellyLennon on 29.10.13 21:57

@KellyLennon wrote:
@stillsloppingout wrote:Typing on phonev.
Firstly ashes have no DNA.
Secondly Re Disposal of body .who conducts burials other than undertakers, thatby there presences would not arouse suspicion ?. 
A   a Priest ... as I keep banging on about the answer imo it.is to do with that church  IMO.
I agree, am sure I read somewhere that at 3am 4th May while locals where out searching, The Mccanns asked for a priest.
Will try and find where I read that and post link
This isnt the one but intresting reading all the same.

http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/07/british-priest-staged-everything.html

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by KellyLennon on 29.10.13 22:00

@MRNOODLES wrote:
@KellyLennon wrote:
@stillsloppingout wrote:Typing on phonev.
Firstly ashes have no DNA.
Secondly Re Disposal of body .who conducts burials other than undertakers, thatby there presences would not arouse suspicion ?. 
A   a Priest ... as I keep banging on about the answer imo it.is to do with that church  IMO.
I agree, am sure I read somewhere that at 3am 4th May while locals where out searching, The Mccanns asked for a priest.
Will try and find where I read that and post link
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-488262/I-deceived-says-Portuguese-priest-comforted-Gerry-Kate-McCann.html
thanks

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by dragonfly on 29.10.13 22:17

@KellyLennon wrote:
@NickE wrote:
@sami wrote:I think it more likely other things were buried in / on the way to Heulva, like blue tennis bags and items used to wrap a body in.

I do not think the items and Madeleine are together.  It's most likely she was wrapped in items close to hand, items they would not want discovered, so they needed to be disposed of separately.  Thus the alerts to the boot.

My opinion is that she is either close to PDL or else was returned to the UK and that big inflatable billboard thing that made the briefest of appearances would be my first choice for investigation.

I`ll think so to:thumbsupa: 
Intresting article regards the elusive inflatable billboard....

http://fakedabduction.com/2010/06/madeleine-finders-sudden-death-and-burial-in-skipton/

I always questioned that billboard , when I heard he died mysteriously I thought it was at odds the same way I felt when I heard David Kelly had died, here is an interesting link with some snipet
GM Blog “Some of you may have seen on the news the huge inflatable billboard which has travelled all the way from the West of Scotland to Portugal which will be used near busy roads/motorways to keep Madeleine’s disappearance high profile. We had a brief chat with Chris and Les, who drove almost non-stop from Glasgow to get here. The extraordinary length ordinary people are going to help us is truly overwhelming. We thank everyone for their efforts, no matter how small, and we know this will make a difference in our search for Madeleine.”


McCann Spin
The story sounds like Chris and Les drove all the way to Portugal through their own efforts to help the McCanns. It really does sound like they went to extraordinary lengths to help.
But what really happened?
We can reveal on Truth For Madeleine that Chris and Les were simply doing their job. The inflatable billboard was not the brainchild of Mr Lennox or Mr Harley and the pair of them didn’t pay for it either.
So how did it come about?
No surprises for guessing but it was engineered by John McCann – Gerry’s brother.
Mr Amaral has already exposed the McCanns for manipulating the politicians and media and here again is a prime example of a story that was presented to the world in a completely different way to the reality of the situation
- See more at: http://madeleinemccann.org/2008/1730/the-inflatable-billboard-the-true-story/#sthash.kKqCk2Fn.dpuf
Gavin Hollywood, Managing Director of Posters Plus Media informed us of the details of the venture;
“I supported the McCanns with some digital advertising in the UK and was approached by Gerry’s brother John about the possibility of helping with a high profile campaign at the height of the situation where time & awareness was essential. Within 5 days we had arranged the trip, logistics, printing and arranged staff to travel to Portugal (Chris & Les) with Carol-Anne Thomson our Campaigns Manager coordinating the campaign from our office and communicating with various authorities
- See more at: http://madeleinemccann.org/2008/1730/the-inflatable-billboard-the-true-story/#sthash.kKqCk2Fn.dpuf

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Mirage on 29.10.13 22:25

@mouse wrote:
@bodiddly wrote:Joana has posted another topic. Apologies if it has been mentioned already.
http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2013/10/english-police-follows-gipsy-lead.html
Hi thanks for posting that. 

Here we go again - our police going down the gypsy path once more. Will they every learn. Just what is their fixation on this group of people. Haven't they stirred up enough turmoil for the family of Maria and the Irish families...Disgusting....And I don't know where to start with the comments from that ignoramus Eamon Holmes....

Seems they don't want to address the elephant that walked into the room this week.

Just move along now, plenty more Gypsies to harass.
Sorry, not aware of what Eamon Holmes has been saying. A couple of years ago he said, on air, he and his wife had been to PdL whilst on holiday in Algarve and he had reservations about the McCanns, inferring they might be involved. Sorry, no ref for this, but it definitely happened.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by littlepixie on 29.10.13 22:43

Re Ashes having no DNA. That may be true for a human cremation but maybe a pets is different. I know when I had a cats ashes returned to me there were full canine teeth visible in them ugghh!


Evert Hoos who owned a pet crematorium voluntarily went to the PJ and gave a statement after stories appeared in the press about Maddie being cremated there.

The PJ inspected the crematorium and found it sealed. 

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/post566.html?hilit=hoos#p566

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by whmon on 29.10.13 22:47

@littlepixie wrote:Re Ashes having no DNA. That may be true for a human cremation but maybe a pets is different. I know when I had a cats ashes returned to me there were full canine teeth visible in them ugghh!


Evert Hoos who owned a pet crematorium voluntarily went to the PJ and gave a statement after stories appeared in the press about Maddie being cremated there.

The PJ inspected the crematorium and found it sealed. 

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/post566.html?hilit=hoos#p566
That made me laugh Littlepixie, thank you!

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Guest on 29.10.13 23:30

I cannot see what's funny about that.

I've had, let's say doubts, about ashes being returned to me. Without wanting to be gross, my father's ashes were the same volume as my 15kg doggie's. And my 100 kg dog ashes were just twice as much as that ...

Apart from that: that pet crematorium was well and thoroughly inspected and I cannot imagine how he [a petty criminal indeed, but ...] would have been able to fake the definite closure of his pet crematorium.

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Re: PJ searches for Maddie's body again + 'Maddie snatcher died in tractor accident four years ago' - shock new claims from Portugal Daily Star

Post by Cristobell on 29.10.13 23:39

@sweetex wrote:Hypothesis of homicide is investigated by the authorities. Follow the investigation with CM.

by Ana Isabel Fonseca/ Tânia Laranjo

The Judiciary Police has already taken steps to try to find Maddie's body, following the reopening of the case. The hypothesis that the British girl was murdered is one of the lines of investigation being followed by the inspectors. The thesis of homicide integrates the framework of a kidnapping for reasons connected to paedophilia.

The CM knows that the Judiciary Police has undertaken several steps in recent days to try to discover Maddie's body, who disappeared on the night of May 3, 2007 from her bedroom at the tourist resort of the Ocean Club in Praia da Luz, Lagos.

The inspectors in charge of the case have for that matter presented evidence supporting this hypothesis to the Public Ministry, who decided, last Thursday, to reopen the investigation.

Shortly after the disappearance of Madeleine, the PJ took steps to try to find the cadaver, but those proved fruitless. Inspectors received at the time several false leads about the possible location of the girl's corpse, who was at the time the crime, three years old.

The Judiciary Police also heard several witnesses and returned to the village of Praia da Luz. There, the inspectors took the opportunity to check the location of mobile phone masts.

in Correio da Manhã, 29 October 2013

http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2013/10/pj-searches-for-maddies-body-again.html


ETA: Wonder how reliable this is as the PJ said there is judiciqal secrecy about this case?
If this story is true, is is fairly significant.  The PJ can only look for a body if they have been pointed in the right direction, or if the telephone signals have given them an area to work in.

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