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UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by petunia on 26.10.13 19:54

@susible wrote:No, they most certainly cannot just back out, it's a full scale police investigation and contrary to some people's beliefs the McCanns do not have any power or control over anything.  As far as both the PJ and SY are concerned, a crime was committed, a young child disappeared from an apartment and they've got to solve that crime...what the McCanns want is irrelevant
thumbsup thumbsup  that's my feeling too susible.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by lj on 26.10.13 20:18

@Woofer wrote:
@Lance De Boils wrote:
@ProfessorPPlum wrote:Off topic but whenever I see this in my kitchen I now think of PeterMac...it must be the blue :-) 

Brilliant! big grin
Will Marmite now be linked to PM as well?

spit coffee spit coffee 

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Guest on 26.10.13 20:52

Portugal is a great place to be, right now

We got lost driving and found two policemen who started giving us directions
But then, perceiving we didn't understand them, just looked at each other, then at us, got on their motors and escorted us, one in front, one bringing up the rear, out of Oporto on our way

If it's in the hands of the Portuguese, Maddie will be allright

If she's alive, that is

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Lance De Boils on 26.10.13 21:08

Sorry to butt in with a question:

Has anyone here got subscription to academic journals?

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by thetruthbeknown on 26.10.13 21:19

@Lance De Boils wrote:Sorry to butt in with a question:

Has anyone here got subscription to academic journals?
I did have a subscription to academic journals (mainly psychology ones though)..but I have a few on file, what was it you were looking for in particular?

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Lance De Boils on 26.10.13 21:23

@thetruthbeknown wrote:
@Lance De Boils wrote:Sorry to butt in with a question:

Has anyone here got subscription to academic journals?
I did have a subscription to academic journals (mainly psychology ones though)..but I have a few on file, what was it you were looking for in particular?
I'm really interested in reading some of this guy's papers.

http://www.city.ac.uk/arts-social-sciences/academic-staff-profiles/professor-chris-greer

There's at least one he wrote about this case, but I'd like to read some of his other stuff too.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by thetruthbeknown on 26.10.13 21:29

@Lance De Boils wrote:
@thetruthbeknown wrote:
@Lance De Boils wrote:Sorry to butt in with a question:

Has anyone here got subscription to academic journals?
I did have a subscription to academic journals (mainly psychology ones though)..but I have a few on file, what was it you were looking for in particular?
I'm really interested in reading some of this guy's papers.

http://www.city.ac.uk/arts-social-sciences/academic-staff-profiles/professor-chris-greer

There's at least one he wrote about this case, but I'd like to read some of his other stuff too.
I don't personally have any of his works, but he is a very nice guy, and im sure if you sent him a direct message on twitter, and told him of your interest in particular areas of his work, he may well be able to direct you to where you can find his writtings https://twitter.com/chrisrhgreer

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by whmon on 26.10.13 21:29

@Lance De Boils wrote:
@thetruthbeknown wrote:
@Lance De Boils wrote:Sorry to butt in with a question:

Has anyone here got subscripYou could try lookingtion to academic journals?
I did have a subscription to academic journals (mainly psychology ones though)..but I have a few on file, what was it you were looking for in particular?
I'm really interested in reading some of this guy's papers.

http://www.city.ac.uk/arts-social-sciences/academic-staff-profiles/professor-chris-greer

There's at least one he wrote about this case, but I'd like to read some of his other stuff too.
You could try looking for him on LinkedIn. See what groups he's in, join one and ask him for a link on what you want to read.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by JackieL on 26.10.13 21:40

@Greycatofoxford wrote:So ironic, the Crimewatch programme, which they wanted, has unleashed a whole new level of anger and disbelief with FB sites etc growing hourly, the  decision to go for the libel trial was a spectacular " own goal" as has been said, their greed and desire to be famous victims may have been their downfall, it would be interesting to know just how they are coping right now!
I am also aware that in times gone by they were never off the TV, no sign of them in the last week or so, also, I know several Rothley residents and they tell me that the village has dramatically changed its stance towards them, sympathy is in very short supply!!! hee her her
Hear hear - the libel trial really was one step too far.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by PeterMac on 26.10.13 21:43

@Portia wrote:Portugal is a great place to be, right now
We got lost driving and found two policemen who started giving us directions
But then, perceiving we didn't understand them, just looked at each other, then at us, got on their motors and escorted us, one in front, one bringing up the rear, out of Oporto on our way
Do you remember the film "One Foot in the Algarve" ?
That is what happened then ! Mr Mr 

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Sceneset on 26.10.13 22:12

As I understand it, if any/all of the Tapas 9 are made 'arguidos' (persons of interest) by the PJ and subsequently refuse to comply with a request to attend interview or participate in a reconstruction,  the Portuguese judiciary can request their extradition from the UK through the appropriate legal process.

Extraditions to/from other European countries are usually effected within a couple of days of the process being completed and it's improbable that anyextradition lawyer would be able to find cause or reason for delay unless there are particularly pressing extenuating circumstances.  In this event, it's unlikely any stay of execution of the warrant for extradition would be of lengthy duration.

Thank for that reply and info Ultima Thule

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Guest on 26.10.13 22:21

Well so far only the Sunday Times has Madeleine on front page tomorrow......


Madeleine Clues hidden for 5 years


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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Guest on 26.10.13 22:26

WTF.......

PORN STAR LINK TO MADDIE



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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by sofa on 26.10.13 22:28

This is getting seriously sad, if if come from the MC  I would say desperation

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Correira Da Manho today

Post by worriedmum on 26.10.13 22:35

PJ analyzes phone signals in case Maddie




Kate and Gerry will make rebuilding the day of the disappearance of Maddie

Antennas let you know what zone they were suspects and witnesses.




(automatic translation)





http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/




Sorry I can't get the page to paste, worth scrolling down the page from the link above to see the picture they have put with this header, IMO

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by sallypelt on 26.10.13 22:40

PJ analyzes phone signals in Maddie case


The Judicial Police was already on the ground to realize that mobile telephone masts are located near the Ocean Club, in Lagos, the resort where Madeleine McCann disappeared on May 3, 2007. The purpose of the inspectors will make triangulation Cellphones crucial witnesses and possible suspects that may be identified in the process, which has now been reopened. The signals from the antennas of mobile phones allow you to narrow down the area in which each person was on the night of the disappearance
 
The inspectors of the Judicial Police were in the village of Praia da Luz for nearly a month, where they have a new analysis of the ground.
 
During the day yesterday, the Judicial Police was also listening to some witnesses who had been identified as important in the reanalysis of the case made ​​by the inspectors of Porto for two years. Efforts have elapsed throughout the day.
 
When the Morning Post found for now is not expected to need to be carried out searches.


 
 
One of the fundamental steps for research will also be reconstituted, that never came to be made and, as reported yesterday the CM, have now been accepted by the McCanns. Kate and Gerry proved to be available to participate in the reconstruction and show, so the inspectors where they were the night of the crime. Remember that the couple was having dinner in a restaurant of the resort, while Madeleine and the two twin brothers were sleeping in the room.
 
The research focuses now on PJ abduction theory and the possibility of the girl, who at the time was about to complete four years have been taken from the room by pedophiles
 
GOOGLE TRANSLATION


http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/noticias/nacional/portugal/pj-analisa-sinais-de-telefones-no-caso-maddie

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by sallypelt on 26.10.13 22:56

jUST POSTED ON JOANA'S BLOG

The Judiciary Police (PJ) reopened the investigation concerning the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and they warrant that this time the parents of the girl who disappeared in Praia da Luz, Algarve, days before her fourth birthday, on May 3, 2007, are not suspects. To the DN the Portuguese police disclosed that there are “new evidence” about what has happened to the child while she slept together with her two twin siblings, in the apartment at the tourist resort. They do not disclose the existence of suspects and only reveal that internally, in the coming days, a team will be created to resume the investigation.

When, last week, on the 17th, the PJ hierarchy met with the Scotland Yard assistant commissioner Mark Rowley and DCI Andy Redwood, who heads the approximately 37 agents working in the British investigation, the decision to request the reopening of the investigation to the Public Ministry (MP) was communicated.

The Portuguese police denies any pressure from the English, stressing that they did not cooperate directly with the Scotland Yard investigation. However, information gathered by the English police, mainly related to the past of some people that were referenced in the case files, would have complemented the analysis by the investigation team in Portugal.

“There were elements gathered that have to do with events before the disappearance of the child and others after. Relating them with those contained in the process already archived have raised a more than reasonable doubt about what happened to the child,” said a source close to the investigation to the DN, adding that a in meeting with Gerry and Kate McCann, and the lawyers of the couple, the PJ asked “absolute silence” about the investigation.

At the headquarters of the London Metropolitan Police who have been working on the case for over a year [sic, for over two years], Scotland Yard said to have found new relevant information, based on the forty thousand documents and clues collected by the police forces from Portugal, UK and eight different companies of private detective and just a few days ago they showed e-fits of a suspect.

A source of the PJ that hasn't, however, worked for this process, does not set aside the divulgation of images of the same kind if appropriate. It acknowledges, however, the important of the work done by the Regional Section of Criminal Investigation and Prevention of the PJ from Porto, led by the coordinator Helena Monteiro. Notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation, that team was on the field since March last year, searching for leads to follow and in order to fill any eventual gaps in the initial investigations.

That reanalysis task has “helped identify new evidence, which by imposing further investigation, meet the requirements set by article 279º no 1 of the Code of Criminal Procedure for the reopening of the investigation.” said the PJ in a statement. “Similarly to what happens in all the cases of missing children, notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation concerning her disappearance, and as was always publicly stated, the Judiciary Police continued to be attentive to any and all information likely to enable the understanding of the whereabouts of the minor Madeleine McCann, the circumstances in which her disappearance occurred and the identity of its author(s),” the PJ clarified.

Also yesterday, a note from the Attorney General's Office (PGR) said that the Public Ministry (MP) decided to reopen the investigation. It was on July 21, 2008 that the PGR announced the archival of the process concerning the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and removed the status of arguidos from the parents of the English minor and Robert Murat, with the proviso that they could reopen the process at any time if “new elements of evidence” surfaced, evidence which they now claim to exist as the result of the identification of witnesses who were never heard.

Experience in missing people cases

With the investigation archived since July 2008, it was the National Direction of the PJ who, in March 2011 [sic, 2012], assigned to a team of investigators from the North Directorship the task to re-analyse the whole wide range of information in the process, with the objective of identifying information whose further understanding could be revealed useful and possible. Leading the group of four inspectors was the coordinator Helena Monteiro, with experience in missing people cases, namely the young lady from Lamego, Carina Ferreira, whose body was found after a month of searches at the bottom of a ravine near a motorway. Helena Monteiro has worked, among other areas of investigation, in the fight against violent criminality.

Diário de Notícias, October 25, 2013, paper edition

Refs.

Oporto PJ goes through Madeleine McCann case with a fine toothed comb March 2012

Loose ends of the case only cleared up with the process reopened March 2012

Virtual reconstitution tests witnesses’ version March 2012

Maddie Case: Vanishing Revisited March 2012

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by SchrodingersBody on 26.10.13 22:57

@sallypelt wrote:PJ analyzes phone signals in Maddie case


The Judicial Police was already on the ground to realize that mobile telephone masts are located near the Ocean Club, in Lagos, the resort where Madeleine McCann disappeared on May 3, 2007. The purpose of the inspectors will make triangulation Cellphones crucial witnesses and possible suspects that may be identified in the process, which has now been reopened. The signals from the antennas of mobile phones allow you to narrow down the area in which each person was on the night of the disappearance
 
The inspectors of the Judicial Police were in the village of Praia da Luz for nearly a month, where they have a new analysis of the ground.
 
During the day yesterday, the Judicial Police was also listening to some witnesses who had been identified as important in the reanalysis of the case made ​​by the inspectors of Porto for two years. Efforts have elapsed throughout the day.
 
When the Morning Post found for now is not expected to need to be carried out searches.


 
 
One of the fundamental steps for research will also be reconstituted, that never came to be made and, as reported yesterday the CM, have now been accepted by the McCanns. Kate and Gerry proved to be available to participate in the reconstruction and show, so the inspectors where they were the night of the crime. Remember that the couple was having dinner in a restaurant of the resort, while Madeleine and the two twin brothers were sleeping in the room.
 
The research focuses now on PJ abduction theory and the possibility of the girl, who at the time was about to complete four years have been taken from the room by pedophiles
 
GOOGLE TRANSLATION


http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/noticias/nacional/portugal/pj-analisa-sinais-de-telefones-no-caso-maddie
Phone evidence simply tells you where a phone was, not who was in posession of it at the time. Unless they already have statements that declare who had their phones and when.
Theoretically they could map every single phone handset movement via triangulation, timings and mast pings.
It's an awful lot of data, but they have spent a few million quid.

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translation

Post by worriedmum on 26.10.13 23:13

thank you Sallypelt.

At the bottom of the page under the heading 'refs' it says ''Virtual reconstitution tests witnesses’ version March 2012''

Do you know if this is an old newspaper article it is referring to?

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by GRACEFUL1 on 26.10.13 23:14

@sallypelt wrote:jUST POSTED ON JOANA'S BLOG

The Judiciary Police (PJ) reopened the investigation concerning the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and they warrant that this time the parents of the girl who disappeared in Praia da Luz, Algarve, days before her fourth birthday, on May 3, 2007, are not suspects. To the DN the Portuguese police disclosed that there are “new evidence” about what has happened to the child while she slept together with her two twin siblings, in the apartment at the tourist resort. They do not disclose the existence of suspects and only reveal that internally, in the coming days, a team will be created to resume the investigation.

When, last week, on the 17th, the PJ hierarchy met with the Scotland Yard assistant commissioner Mark Rowley and DCI Andy Redwood, who heads the approximately 37 agents working in the British investigation, the decision to request the reopening of the investigation to the Public Ministry (MP) was communicated.

The Portuguese police denies any pressure from the English, stressing that they did not cooperate directly with the Scotland Yard investigation. However, information gathered by the English police, mainly related to the past of some people that were referenced in the case files, would have complemented the analysis by the investigation team in Portugal.

“There were elements gathered that have to do with events before the disappearance of the child and others after. Relating them with those contained in the process already archived have raised a more than reasonable doubt about what happened to the child,” said a source close to the investigation to the DN, adding that a in meeting with Gerry and Kate McCann, and the lawyers of the couple, the PJ asked “absolute silence” about the investigation.

At the headquarters of the London Metropolitan Police who have been working on the case for over a year [sic, for over two years], Scotland Yard said to have found new relevant information, based on the forty thousand documents and clues collected by the police forces from Portugal, UK and eight different companies of private detective and just a few days ago they showed e-fits of a suspect.

A source of the PJ that hasn't, however, worked for this process, does not set aside the divulgation of images of the same kind if appropriate. It acknowledges, however, the important of the work done by the Regional Section of Criminal Investigation and Prevention of the PJ from Porto, led by the coordinator Helena Monteiro. Notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation, that team was on the field since March last year, searching for leads to follow and in order to fill any eventual gaps in the initial investigations.

That reanalysis task has “helped identify new evidence, which by imposing further investigation, meet the requirements set by article 279º no 1 of the Code of Criminal Procedure for the reopening of the investigation.” said the PJ in a statement. “Similarly to what happens in all the cases of missing children, notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation concerning her disappearance, and as was always publicly stated, the Judiciary Police continued to be attentive to any and all information likely to enable the understanding of the whereabouts of the minor Madeleine McCann, the circumstances in which her disappearance occurred and the identity of its author(s),” the PJ clarified.

Also yesterday, a note from the Attorney General's Office (PGR) said that the Public Ministry (MP) decided to reopen the investigation. It was on July 21, 2008 that the PGR announced the archival of the process concerning the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and removed the status of arguidos from the parents of the English minor and Robert Murat, with the proviso that they could reopen the process at any time if “new elements of evidence” surfaced, evidence which they now claim to exist as the result of the identification of witnesses who were never heard.

Experience in missing people cases

With the investigation archived since July 2008, it was the National Direction of the PJ who, in March 2011 [sic, 2012], assigned to a team of investigators from the North Directorship the task to re-analyse the whole wide range of information in the process, with the objective of identifying information whose further understanding could be revealed useful and possible. Leading the group of four inspectors was the coordinator Helena Monteiro, with experience in missing people cases, namely the young lady from Lamego, Carina Ferreira, whose body was found after a month of searches at the bottom of a ravine near a motorway. Helena Monteiro has worked, among other areas of investigation, in the fight against violent criminality.

Diário de Notícias, October 25, 2013, paper edition

Refs.

Oporto PJ goes through Madeleine McCann case with a fine toothed comb March 2012

Loose ends of the case only cleared up with the process reopened March 2012

Virtual reconstitution tests witnesses’ version March 2012

Maddie Case: Vanishing Revisited March 2012
Joana Morais said...

    @1 Read the article, just, read it - and notice the mention of churnalism above. Do you really think this journalist had a nice chat with someone from the current PJ investigation? Not at all, this article is just a pastiche, a collage of bits and pieces of other articles, part was taken from the SY press release, the other from the PJ statement, another from a previous article published in the JN 2 years ago. This journo is clueless, he makes factual mistakes with the years. Try to understand, most journalists today don't investigate, they copy paste previously churn press releases from news agencies. Why translate it? Because there's a possibility that this bit «They do not disclose the existence of suspects and only reveal that internally, in the coming days, a team will be created to resume the investigation.» might actually be truthful.
    26/10/2013 22:58

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Hongkong Phooey on 26.10.13 23:22

@SchrodingersBody wrote:
Phone evidence simply tells you where a phone was, not who was in posession of it at the time. Unless they already have statements that declare who had their phones and when.
Theoretically they could map every single phone handset movement via triangulation, timings and mast pings.
It's an awful lot of data, but they have spent a few million quid.
Thats true however there is evidence of the parents deleting texts and calls on the night their daughter goes missing........... so instead of going looking for her they spent their time 'inventing' a timeline and deleting items on their phones.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by sallypelt on 26.10.13 23:30

@worriedmum wrote:thank you Sallypelt.

At the bottom of the page under the heading 'refs' it says ''Virtual reconstitution tests witnesses’ version March 2012''

Do you know if this is an old newspaper article it is referring to?
worried mum, all that came from Joana's link. I just copied and pasted what was there.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by sallypelt on 26.10.13 23:41

candyfloss wrote:WTF.......

PORN STAR LINK TO MADDIE


What a disgusting, filthy, rotten rag of a paper. The sooner they close it down, the better. I wouldn't wipe my....................oh never mind. It's because of gutter press journalism, such as this, that decent newspapers are fighting to prevent having restrictions imposed on them.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Mirage on 26.10.13 23:47

I see there has been some discussion on mobiles. Forgive me if I have missed something in the debate but it is late!

Mobile phone masts vary in sophistication. I think you have to bear in mind that in 2007 in rural Portugal, you will meet a problem tracking pings. Masts in rural areas, even today, can have limited vectors, the most receptive being located in city centres. And mobile phone signals can be bounced about the landscape until they find the second best azimuth, often registering on a mast some 15 to 20 miles away from source due to escarpments or hills that block and bounce the signal round the blockage to a neighbouring mast. The only way you can approach analysing sporadic pings is when a mobile phone is in transit and then you can track a likely pattern. But this is not an exact science and is not the preferred source of primary evidence to present to a court of law.

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Re: UPDATE CASE REOPENED IN PORTUGAL - McCanns apply for 'assistant' (assistente)status

Post by Christina on 27.10.13 1:09

@Ayniia wrote:"The PJ was already on the ground to realize what mobile telephone masts are located near the Ocean Club , in Lagos, the resort where Madeleine McCann disappeared on May 3, 2007 . The purpose of the inspectors is to make triangulation of mobiles from crucial witnesses and possible suspects that may be identified in the process , which has now been reopened . The signals from the antennas of mobile phones allow you to narrow down the area in which each person was on the night of the disappearance .
The inspectors of the PJ were in the village of Praia da Luz about a month ago , where they made a new analysis of the terrain.
During yesterday , the Judicial Police was also listening to some witnesses who had been identified as important in the reanalysis of the case made ​​by the inspectors of Porto for two years . Efforts have elapsed throughout the day .
Correio da Manhã found for now is not expected to need to be carried out searches.
One of the fundamental steps for research will also be the reconstruction, that never came to be made and , as reported yesterday by CM , have now been accepted by the McCanns . Kate and Gerry proved to be available to participate in the reconstruction and show to the inspectors where they were the night of the crime. Remember that the couple was having dinner in a restaurant of the resort , while Madeleine and the two twin brothers were sleeping in the room.
The research focuses now on PJ abduction theory and the possibility of the girl, who at the time was about to complete four years have been taken from the room by pedophiles ." (translated by google and corrected by me,bold and color by me also)
http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/noticias/nacional/portugal/pj-analisa-sinais-de-telefones-no-caso-maddie
This. Not seen much/any discussion on it but it seems to be very important. Thank you Ayniia! And it seems to have been overlooked for now. Clicked the link and it's current, so the PJ a month ago were looking again at the pings and the terrain. Stuff's happening. Bloody interesting times..

Christina

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