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**NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Newintown on 23.10.13 13:50

@Newintown wrote:Well, well, well, what a coincidence – tonight on More 4 (freeview 14) at 9.00 p.m. – My Big Fat Gypsy Weddings, Luck of the Irish (first shown August 2013) - a one-off special -

"In this special episode we celebrate all things Ireland, meeting Irish Travellers from both sides of the Irish Sea, exploring the special bond they share and some of the values they often don't….

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Now who would have been in Ireland before August this year to make this programme, whilst Crimewatch was in the making and when the Libel case was being sorted out, and who owns the production company and has links to the McCanns, hmmm, I wonder?
meeting Irish Travellers from both sides of the Irish Sea

I forget to mention as someone posted in an earlier thread that the sightings of blonde girls living with gypsy parents who do not look like the child is getting nearer home, so it will be interesting to see how long it will take for a sighting and a child "snatch" by Social Services in Blighty, or have the protagonists been rumbled??

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Lance De Boils on 23.10.13 14:35

@Newintown wrote:Well, well, well, what a coincidence – tonight on More 4 (freeview 14) at 9.00 p.m. – My Big Fat Gypsy Weddings, Luck of the Irish (first shown August 2013) - a one-off special -

"In this special episode we celebrate all things Ireland, meeting Irish Travellers from both sides of the Irish Sea, exploring the special bond they share and some of the values they often don't….

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Now who would have been in Ireland before August this year to make this programme, whilst Crimewatch was in the making and when the Libel case was being sorted out, and who owns the production company and has links to the McCanns, hmmm, I wonder?
Well, well. What a coincidence.

As for the programmes, I'm rather proud to be able to say I've never watched an episode. smilie

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by jeanmonroe on 23.10.13 14:41

Best one is the programme FOLLOWING that.

Catching a killer. CROCODILE TEARS!

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Guest on 23.10.13 15:48

@jeanmonroe wrote:Best one is the programme FOLLOWING that.

Catching a killer. CROCODILE TEARS!
***
If that's the same I've seen, it's a good one.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by tuom on 23.10.13 17:36

And it continues ................ gladly this child is back with his family

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/we-are-just-glad-to-have-our-son-back-29694584.html

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by margaret on 23.10.13 18:44

Some tweets are saying the 7yo Roma girl DOES belong to the family she was seized from. Good news.

Eta: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/dna-test-proves-girl-7-belongs-to-roma-family-29694850.html

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Guest on 23.10.13 19:00

Jerry Lawton@JerryLawton 26m
Gypsy rights group warns `precipitative action undertaken on the basis of appearance' can lead to `racism and discrimination' against Roma

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Guest on 23.10.13 19:01

Stephen Motson@SteMotson 3m
DNA tests prove 7-year-old girl taken from Roma family in Dublin IS their daughter http://bit.ly/1642dyq  #McCann

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by mouse on 23.10.13 19:07

This is really good news for this family. Goodness only knows how they were feeling while all this was going on...And all because a knee jerk reaction by authorities, egged on by the Mccann Campaign. Why the hell didn't they wait for the DNA test results (which I don't even think they should have had to do anyway) to come back before stealing someone's child away. All involved should feel very ashamed and a very media public apology should be made....but like that's gonna happen. It was always on the cards mind, seeing as both stories appear to have dropped off Sky and BBC Headlines. 

Disgusting behaviour by people who should know better, but then having watched the Plebgate select committee hearing today with all the Police Officers involved - corruption doesn't go near it, and the arrogance....And people still have faith in Andy Redwood and his gang....???

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by columbostogeys on 24.10.13 6:13

@mouse wrote:This is really good news for this family. Goodness only knows how they were feeling while all this was going on...And all because a knee jerk reaction by authorities, egged on by the Mccann Campaign. Why the hell didn't they wait for the DNA test results (which I don't even think they should have had to do anyway) to come back before stealing someone's child away. All involved should feel very ashamed and a very media public apology should be made....but like that's gonna happen. It was always on the cards mind, seeing as both stories appear to have dropped off Sky and BBC Headlines. 

Disgusting behaviour by people who should know better, but then having watched the Plebgate select committee hearing today with all the Police Officers involved - corruption doesn't go near it, and the arrogance....And people still have faith in Andy Redwood and his gang....???
Well neither of us are surprised are we.

I hope the Roma family have good lawyers, I would even pay into a fund to get justice for them all.

3 children taken from Roma families........its descrimination in the extreme.

What really irks me is the fact that Maddy could have been snatched from her bed by a stranger and would have been traumatised because she was taken from her family, and her parents have done everything they can to cause racism in this world...........by constantly pointing to dark skinned/gypsy types who steal your children...........

Now 3 chidren because they blonde and blue eyed living with dark skinned families aka Roma gypsys have too been snatched from theiir beds by a stranger and TRAUMATISED because they were taken from their families.....its called official abduction...........

The child maria in greece is not on any DNA database, and there are no disappearing children linked to her on the Interpol database, and out of all the thousands of phone calls and 60 so called possibilities they have all nearly been discounted and not one person has stepped forward to say the child is theirs....

I expect it will be what they said all along the child came the way it was written on the can. 

Anyway for me logically why the hell would you hide a BLONDE european in amongst darker skinned children lol...it beggars belief.........

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by ChippyM on 24.10.13 9:08

I heard the news this morning about the girl being given back to parents, I thought from the pixellated picture of her, she had brown hair with hints of blonde, hardly impossible!

   I can't believe the Daily Mails ignorance and insensitivity (mmm no wait maybe I can:titter: ) when they interviewed the family.



They asked them WHY she had blonde hair, as if the world is owed an explanation! For god's sake read some basic school level genetics and learn something about where Roma people come from!

  I hope these familes sue and get huge damages.

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Michael Moran of Interpol's Child Trafficking and CEOP

Post by Mirage on 24.10.13 9:41

On Radio 4's Today programme - an interview with Michael Moran (Irish) of Interpol's Child Trafficking and CEOP.

He was asked about the Irish and Greek Roma cases. He repeatedly refused to comment on individual cases. Helpful! Also, would not be drawn on the rights and wrongs of investigating children on the basis of racial identity (my words but the gist). Really, he had nothing to say other than it was good that people were more aware of child abduction. There was a definite feeling that, under normal conditions, the word McCann would have been inserted at this point.

When pressed on the incidence of child trafficking he said the Roma people would themselves admit there had been cases of it within their communities. Again, no examples, details. He also referred to Bulgarians in the same vein.

The whole interview seemed pretty pointless, as he would not be drawn on anything at all and had no facts or statistics to hand. I wasn't impressed.

You can probably hear the interview on Radio Four's Listen again.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by mouse on 24.10.13 10:11

@Mirage wrote:On Radio 4's Today programme - an interview with Michael Moran (Irish) of Interpol's Child Trafficking and CEOP.

He was asked about the Irish and Greek Roma cases. He repeatedly refused to comment on individual cases. Helpful! Also, would not be drawn on the rights and wrongs of investigating children on the basis of racial identity (my words but the gist). Really, he had nothing to say other than it was good that people were more aware of child abduction. There was a definite feeling that, under normal conditions, the word McCann would have been inserted at this point.

When pressed on the incidence of child trafficking he said the Roma people would themselves admit there had been cases of it within their communities. Again, no examples, details. He also referred to Bulgarians in the same vein.

The whole interview seemed pretty pointless, as he would not be drawn on anything at all and had no facts or statistics to hand. I wasn't impressed.

You can probably hear the interview on Radio Four's Listen again.
How did he have the nerve not to pass comment on a child wrongly taken away, when he is in the business of stopping child trafficking. Disgusting! He should be representing this child, and stopping this kind of knee jerk hysteria, not saying ....well it helped bring awareness of child abduction. What??? But this wasn't child abduction was it Mr Moran. And are we to think that you are perfectly happy that a family and their children have been put through utter hell...!!! For what? To bring awareness to child abduction...Oh, that's okay then.

Wouldn't be surprised if this family is offered a nice big lump sum to compensate, of course with a gagging order attached. So we won't hear anymore.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by jeanmonroe on 24.10.13 10:16

SPOOF!

I'm writing to GMP, i'm NOT a barrister, demanding that they snatch Ste's, in Hollyoaks, daughter away for DNA 'testing' as he has dark hair and his 'pretend daughter' is BLONDE!

And also, imo, Sally Webster's 'daughter' in Corrie, Rosie, has very DARK hair and Sally her 'pretendy' mother, (yeah right i'll believe you Sal) is BLONDE!

Snatch them all and DNA test them, i say!

I'm sure Poodleboy  will say the McCanns hopes have been raised following the snatches of TV  blonde and dark haired 'actors'!

Well, ONE of them MIGHT be Maddie, right?

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by russiandoll on 24.10.13 11:15

On todays Wrightstuff, newspaper review, a scathing commentary on the removal of the Roma girl from her family in Ireland. Comments about the ignorance re genetics and colouring, racial profiling and that there are fair haired and fair skinned Roma.

 An actor I recognise from only Fools and Horses, the man with the flash house and car........nail on the head. Mass hysteria about blonde girls.......everyone has got Maddie in their head and so all blonde girls linked with Madeleine.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by suzyjohnson on 24.10.13 15:51

And now it's starting to look as though little Maria's mother is a Bulgarian woman who asked the Roma family in Greece to look after her daughter because she had no money

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Seek truth on 24.10.13 20:54

Well well well !!

Looks like they're wrong about Maria too.

In Portugal news saying and showing filmof Marias family.  She is not the only one with blond hair, there's an exact boy with her looks and hair, younger than her.
 And a baby with red hair.  Theres a woman saying she gave her to them. Not sure what news it was.

So why don't we see this on our news? Or have I missed it.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by sallypelt on 24.10.13 20:56

@Seek truth wrote:Well well well !!

Looks like they're wrong about Maria too.

In Portugal news saying and showing filmof Marias family.  She is not the only one with blond hair, there's an exact boy with her looks and hair, younger than her.
 And a baby with red hair.  Theres a woman saying she gave her to them. Not sure what news it was.

So why don't we see this on our news? Or have I missed it.
I heard earlier today, that the mother or Maria has said she "sold" the child to the family she's now with.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Sockpuppet on 24.10.13 20:57

@Seek truth wrote:Well well well !!

Looks like they're wrong about Maria too.

In Portugal news saying and showing filmof Marias family.  She is not the only one with blond hair, there's an exact boy with her looks and hair, younger than her.
 And a baby with red hair.  Theres a woman saying she gave her to them. Not sure what news it was.

So why don't we see this on our news? Or have I missed it.
Channel 4 news covered it.  Looking at the family resemblance, I'm certain the DNA results will be positive.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by columbostogeys on 25.10.13 6:42

@Sockpuppet wrote:
@Seek truth wrote:Well well well !!

Looks like they're wrong about Maria too.

In Portugal news saying and showing filmof Marias family.  She is not the only one with blond hair, there's an exact boy with her looks and hair, younger than her.
 And a baby with red hair.  Theres a woman saying she gave her to them. Not sure what news it was.

So why don't we see this on our news? Or have I missed it.
Channel 4 news covered it.  Looking at the family resemblance, I'm certain the DNA results will be positive.
I PRAY THE DNA matches the mother......

Its what I said all along, why would a Roma family keep such a child. You dont hide a blonde snatched abducted child in amongst dark skinned children, I mean havent people heard of HAIR DYE.....eeeeek

It was all xenaphobia and the media using these stories to make a fast buck.

DISGUSTING.

I am now going to sit and hold my breath lol and hope the DNA proves the Roma familys story.

Like I said early on NO GOOD DEED GOES UNPUNISHED............

I was shocked too that my care worker believed all the newspaper stories about gypsies snatching children....eeeekkkk ...... she doesnt now, i sat her down and showed her all the photos first of where the family lived. She assumed from the media they lived in a hovel and when i showed her the homes they live in she was quite taken aback at how nice they were lol...

See this is the problem. Since the McCanns constant barrage of the GYPSYs did it, the poor gypsys now are the child trafficking scum of the earth...............the McCanns in their search have opened up can of xenophobia worms.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by stillsloppingout on 25.10.13 14:59

BREAKING NEWS 

The Bulgarian woman IS THE MOTHER OF MARIA FOUND LAST WEEK WITH GYPSYS IN GREECE .

SO THATS 3 FAMILYS AND NO ABDUCTIONS .

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by PeterMac on 25.10.13 15:41

@stillsloppingout wrote:BREAKING NEWS 
The Bulgarian woman IS THE MOTHER OF MARIA FOUND LAST WEEK WITH GYPSYS IN GREECE .
SO THATS 3 FAMILYS AND NO ABDUCTIONS .
Nicely put. big grin 

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by Olympicana_Reloaded on 25.10.13 15:56

Maria will have access to interpreter 'as needed', charity says

Although Maria communicates mostly in the Roma dialect and understands only a few words of Greek, the Smile of the Child charity entrusted with her care says they will use a state-appointed interpreter 'as needed'

Maria, the girl at the centre of the high-profile case in which a Roma couple have been charged with abducting her, will be provided with a state-appointed interpreter "as needed", the children's charity entrusted with her care said on Friday.

The girl was removed by last week by police from a Roma couple who were raising her as their own. They were subsequently remanded to jail on charges of child abduction and holding false papers. Meanwhile, DNA results confirmed that Maria is the biological child of a Bulgarian Roma couple.

After being taken from the camp, Maria, who turns 5 in January, was given to the care of the Smile of the Child organisation, a private charity. Taken first to a hospital, she was moved to one of the charity's homes on Thursday.

She "communicates mostly in the Roma dialect and understands only a few words of Greek", according to Kostas Yannopoulos, the head of the private charity that has been looking after her since she was taken into care.

But when asked earlier this week by the Irish Times why no interpreter was engaged to assist Maria in communicating verbally, Yannopoulos said: "We didn't risk it."

On Friday, a spokesman for the charity clarified that "it is the competency, responsibility and the role of the public prosecutor and the authorities to appoint an interpreter". Panagiotis Pardalis said that one was appointed earlier this week while she was in hospital within the context of the "psychiatric evaluations" and "all the procedures that needed to be performed on the girl for the nature of the investigation" against the couple.

The "charity's role is to take care of her with an interpreter as needed," he earlier said in a tweet, without revealing under what conditions this would be.

But despite the acknowledgement that the child cannot effectively communicate in Greek, Smile of the Child representatives have claimed that she has not asked for her social parents or siblings – the people she was living with.

"She's happy now because probably for the first time she's got the care and tenderness that a child needs in this age. She has toys to play with and people to take care for her," Yannopoulos said earlier this week.

"She didn't ask for anybody," he stressed, admitting that she was unusually calm for a child taken into care, something he accepted was "not normal".

"Usually [children taken into care] oppose like Maria was opposing the first day. She was crying when she got into the car with our social workers and the psychologist. Usually the other children [taken into care] continue to ask for the so-called mothers, or mothers of fathers, although they are exposed on the streets, abuse them etc. Somehow they are asking for these people, either their parents or not," said Yannopoulos.

He added: "Please look at the picture that the police had taken while she went to the police and the second picture from the next two days at the hospital from the ones we took. Look at her face. She is calm. There is no anxiety. This is not normal."

He maintained that Smile of the Child is solely concerned with keeping "her calm and happy".

"We are not the ones that should ask questions of Maria. If Maria wants to talk to us eventually, she will talk to us, feeling secure and safe that our people are the ones to want to protect her. She managed to learn more in this four days, she managed to learn more Greek words, and she managed to communicate through paintings and ... at the same time also her dolls," he said.

But members of Maria's wider social family in the Roma settlement where she was found have insisted that she was well looked after and cared for deeply by the people now accused of abducting her.

Yannopoulos, however, is dismissive of these claims.

"This argument is now coming up that they took care of her. But whatever they did, it was against the law, was against the child's protection and the child's dignity," he says, who is keen to underline that he believes Maria's case to be part of a much wider European problem.

"It should be tackled like this because these children are exposed like Maria to form of slavery. It's a whole system, a business system, that is exploiting children," he says, underlining that only some "gypsies", as he refers to Roma, are engaged in this.

"We have gypsies who are working in the fields, who have families and love their children. But there some gypsies who are following another track. They see the camps as a closed circuit where they can deal drugs and other illegal activities."

When pressed if evidence exists that she was mistreated by her purported parents, Yannopoulos avoids going into detail, maintaining that his charity has received reports of sightings and photographs, which he says he has passed on to the police, of Maria being "exposed to begging" in various parts of Greece.

Concerns

But despite the charity's insistence that it is acting in the child's best interests, questions have been asked about how the case has been handled by the authorities.

"The question is why would the police take a child to a private organisation and not a state organisation, when there are state organisations, such as Mitera children's hospital?" said Thalia Dragonas, a social psychology professor at the University of Athens.

She added: "Why would the children be taken away from its home environment? There has been no indication of the child being abused. In that sense, why would it be in the benefit of the child to be taken away from its home environment."

She said the issue is much greater than an individual child and concerns the children at Roma settlements all around the country.

"What about the rest of the children? Who cares about those children? Why on earth did they pick that child? Because she was fair-haired? What about the other children in the family, in the Farsala settlement, and in all the settlements in the country?"

She noted that during his recent visit to Italy, Prime Minister Antonis Samaras only focused on the well-being of Maria but did not mention the situation faced by other Greek Roma children.

"We are trying to make the outmost for this little girl to - you know - have a nice, comfortable, helpful life for the remaining part of this tragedy she is going through," Samaras said, in a press conference with his Italian counterpart, Enrico Letta. 

http://www.enetenglish.gr/?i=news.en.politics&id=1567

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by PeterMac on 25.10.13 17:48

Looking at the photos of the Roma settlements in Greece and in Bulgaria is one not entitled to think that ALL their children should be taken into care.
The same applied to the Irish itinerants who drift around Britain, pretending to be Gypsies, living by crime, and causing unbelievable squalor everywhere they land.

We had various strategies for getting them to leave once they had set up.
One was to say we were coming round the next morning with the Social Services to check on the children's documentation, their welfare and their level of education
The other was to give them 24 hours notice to produce receipts for the best items in their caravans.

Usually by dawn there was just the usual heap of filth, burned out copper wire, melted lead, and a midden left for the Council to clear up.

Their way of life might have been appropriate to 10th century India, or the 12th Century middle east, but surely not any longer.

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Re: **NEW** Roma children WERE their parents' AFTER ALL - Children wrongly removed and harmed [WAS: On News in Ireland today]

Post by whmon on 25.10.13 17:52

@PeterMac wrote:Looking at the photos of the Roma settlements in Greece and in Bulgaria is one not entitled to think that ALL their children should be taken into care.
The same applied to the Irish itinerants who drift around Britain, pretending to be Gypsies, living by crime, and causing unbelievable squalor everywhere they land.

We had various strategies for getting them to leave once they had set up.
One was to say we were coming round the next morning with the Social Services to check on the children's documentation, their welfare and their level of education
The other was to give them 24 hours notice to produce receipts for the best items in their caravans.  

Usually by dawn there was just the usual heap of filth, burned out copper wire, melted lead, and a midden left for the Council to clear up.

Their way of life might have been appropriate to 10th century India, or the 12th Century middle east, but surely not any longer.
Well said that man!

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