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Implications for the Libel trial

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Implications for the Libel trial

Post by PeterMac on 13.10.13 13:42

If the McCanns are now going to admit that the original time line - the one they and that Clarence Mitchell have insisted on for the last 6 years - is WRONG
Then what are the implications for Gonçalo Amaral's case.
All the McCanns now have is unreliable testimony,
All the witnesses who gave evidence on their behalf must also be discounted since they did not know of the NEW TRUE time line.
Dr Amaral knew from day 1 that what they were saying was impossible and absurd. 6 years later they seem to be on the point of admitting its impossibility.

And what are the implications for the settled case against TB.
We know it was skilfully manipulated into a breach of undertaking, and the question of libel was never addressed, but there must be some way in which His Honour Mr Justice Tugendhat could be invited to look again at what was tendered in evidence by Carter-Ruck, to ensure that there was nothing which they are now going to admit was inaccurate, wrong, or just a plain LIE.
His Honour was given huge volumes of documents and a single falsehood on the Plaintiff's bundle should - in a perfect world at least - be sufficient for him to have a second look at what he was told.

TB of course has a copy of everything they submitted !
I bet he will be recording the programme tomorrow.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Guest on 13.10.13 14:04

I don't think he has a television, PeterMac, but I'm sure he'll see it somehow.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by lj on 13.10.13 18:23

It is going to be very interesting if all at the sudden the timeline changes. It means that there have been massive lying going on, from all Tapas members. I can understand a " I was confused, I really don't remember" from one of the group, but ALL of them? After all that time, all the same lie, repeated over and over. The various meetings about the time line, and the adjusted 3 page version they all agreed on, That not a bit confused because of the stress, that's is massive obstruction of an investigation. Does Andy ever wonder why?? Or does he consider that of little interest, like he thinks that theories about what happened are of little interest. Maybe that WHY he considers that theories about what happened are of little interest, if he gives that any attention he also has to explain why the whole bunch lied with as many teeth they have in their mouth.

Maybe Monday's late show will be interesting after all!!

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Guest on 13.10.13 19:08

@lj wrote:[...]

Maybe Monday's late show will be interesting after all!!
***
I am convinced it will, JL, I am ...

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Pershing36 on 13.10.13 19:48

I know nothing about the law or court trials, but have said for ages I feared this SY investigation was just set up to aid the libel trial.

I am worried about this, Amarals book and TV program was based on the timeline we have all discussed over and over again.  If SY say it is inaccurate between 8:30 and 22:30 (been on sky news all day) then surely it discredits Amarals theories?

I hope it doesn't but this whole thing stinks.  Looks like 30 officers and maybe 10 million pounds of tax payers money has been used to win the McCann's a 1.2 million pound libel.  

If true what on earth do they have over this country?

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by sallypelt on 13.10.13 19:55

Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by bobbin on 13.10.13 19:59

@Pershing36 wrote:I know nothing about the law or court trials, but have said for ages I feared this SY investigation was just set up to aid the libel trial.

I am worried about this, Amarals book and TV program was based on the timeline we have all discussed over and over again.  If SY say it is inaccurate between 8:30 and 22:30 (been on sky news all day) then surely it discredits Amarals theories?

I hope it doesn't but this whole thing stinks.  Looks like 30 officers and maybe 10 million pounds of tax payers money has been used to win the McCann's a 1.2 million pound libel.  

If true what on earth do they have over this country?
I think it's the opposite, it GIVES credit to the Portuguese investigation. Goncalo Amaral and the PJ said, the timeline could NOT be possible. The timeline was given by the Tapas bunch. The police did NOT believe it.
SY are also saying it can't be correct.
This strengthens Goncalo Amaral's case, furthermore, this very searching and SY investigating shows that Goncalo Amaral's book and the documentary HAVE NOT diminished the search for Madeleine. big grin 

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by galena on 13.10.13 20:03

@Pershing36 wrote:I know nothing about the law or court trials, but have said for ages I feared this SY investigation was just set up to aid the libel trial.

I am worried about this, Amarals book and TV program was based on the timeline we have all discussed over and over again.  If SY say it is inaccurate between 8:30 and 22:30 (been on sky news all day) then surely it discredits Amarals theories?

I hope it doesn't but this whole thing stinks.  Looks like 30 officers and maybe 10 million pounds of tax payers money has been used to win the McCann's a 1.2 million pound libel.  

If true what on earth do they have over this country?
I don't see how that can adversely affect Amaral as he quite understandably based his theories on what the McCanns told him - if anything it will affect their credibility as witnesses and show that they themselves did more to hamper the investigation than his book did.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by plebgate on 13.10.13 20:05

@sallypelt wrote:Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737
Oh well it will give him more time to concentrate on his MP ambitions.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by tasprin on 13.10.13 20:36

@plebgate wrote:
@sallypelt wrote:Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737
Oh well it will give him more time to concentrate on his MP ambitions.
With all the rich supporters they've had, I wonder why they needed a fund at all.Their fund director Michael Linnett is married to one of the richest women in the UK. Then there is Everest windows millionaire Brian Kennedy and his lawyer friend Ed Smethhurst, Stephen Winyard, Philip Green and Richard Branson. They are all extremely wealthy people and a million or two would be a drop in the ocean to any one of them. So why on earth did the McCanns need to take money from the public, most of whom could ill afford it?

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 13.10.13 20:41

@tasprin wrote:
@plebgate wrote:
@sallypelt wrote:Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737
Oh well it will give him more time to concentrate on his MP ambitions.
With all the rich supporters they've had, I wonder why they needed a fund at all.Their fund director Michael Linnett is married to one of the richest women in the UK. Then there is Everest windows millionaire Brian Kennedy and his lawyer friend Ed Smethhurst, Stephen Winyard, Philip Green and Richard Branson. They are all extremely wealthy people and a million or two would be a drop in the ocean to any one of them. So why on earth did the McCanns need to take money from the public, most of whom could ill afford it?
Excellent, salient point Tasperin. Particularly pertinent when many people have faced a pay freeze for three years or so, and their costs of living has increased. Any donation made has been done with the best of intentions, which is to help find a child, not to fund law suits.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by lj on 14.10.13 0:31

@Smokeandmirrors wrote:
@tasprin wrote:
@plebgate wrote:
@sallypelt wrote:Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737
Oh well it will give him more time to concentrate on his MP ambitions.
With all the rich supporters they've had, I wonder why they needed a fund at all.Their fund director Michael Linnett is married to one of the richest women in the UK. Then there is Everest windows millionaire Brian Kennedy and his lawyer friend Ed Smethhurst, Stephen Winyard, Philip Green and Richard Branson. They are all extremely wealthy people and a million or two would be a drop in the ocean to any one of them. So why on earth did the McCanns need to take money from the public, most of whom could ill afford it?
Excellent, salient point Tasperin. Particularly pertinent when many people have faced a pay freeze for three years or so, and their costs of living has increased. Any donation made has been done with the best of intentions, which is to help find a child, not to fund law suits.
It's their sense of entitlement. Remember Kate's remark about buying strawberries in the expensive store (I am not current with British supermarkets)? If I accepted money from pensioners and people with Down syndrome I would make sure that I made at least the same sacrifice, which would include buying the cheap strawberries. Not so St Kate: after all it's not as if she had done something wrong.
She truly believes that she "deserves" all they get, and even more.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Ollie1 on 14.10.13 1:58

@tasprin wrote:
@plebgate wrote:
@sallypelt wrote:Kate and Gerry McCann may lose PR man after tycoon Brian Kennedy pulls funding

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-and-gerry-mccann-may-lose-pr-398737
Oh well it will give him more time to concentrate on his MP ambitions.
With all the rich supporters they've had, I wonder why they needed a fund at all.Their fund director Michael Linnett is married to one of the richest women in the UK. Then there is Everest windows millionaire Brian Kennedy and his lawyer friend Ed Smethhurst, Stephen Winyard, Philip Green and Richard Branson. They are all extremely wealthy people and a million or two would be a drop in the ocean to any one of them. So why on earth did the McCanns need to take money from the public, most of whom could ill afford it?
It is like the remark the McCann's made when they said it was their holiday too, they wanted to be rich too.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Angelique on 14.10.13 7:04

I too think that this SY investigation was all about the Libel Trial.

The ultimate goal of TM has to be the trial is put into reverse and that the McCanns win simply because of the amount of cash TM would need to pay in costs alone. But I don't see how the scenario suggested in the Crimewatch programme can possibly do this.

There have been several remarks in recent reporting saying that the Portuguese failed to investigate witnesses and ignored the Smith sighting. So "trashing" has started.




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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 14.10.13 7:09

@Angelique wrote:I too think that this SY investigation was all about the Libel Trial.

The ultimate goal of TM has to be the trial is put into reverse and  that the McCanns win simply because of the amount of cash TM would need to pay in costs alone. But I don't see how the scenario suggested in the Crimewatch programme can possibly do this.

There have been several remarks in recent reporting saying that the Portuguese failed to investigate witnesses and ignored the Smith sighting. So "trashing" has started.



My understanding is that the Smith sighting went quiet when Brian Kennedy paid Mr Smith a visit.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by galena on 14.10.13 8:04

@Angelique wrote:I too think that this SY investigation was all about the Libel Trial.

The ultimate goal of TM has to be the trial is put into reverse and  that the McCanns win simply because of the amount of cash TM would need to pay in costs alone. But I don't see how the scenario suggested in the Crimewatch programme can possibly do this.

There have been several remarks in recent reporting saying that the Portuguese failed to investigate witnesses and ignored the Smith sighting. So "trashing" has started.



I'm originally thought it was about whitewashing the McCanns but now I'm beginning to wonder if SY are actually on the side of their colleagues in the PJ and keen that the inconsistencies in the Tapas 9's original statements be exposed. The fact that newspapers are publishing stories saying that the original timeline is wrong is a massive step forward in my opinion. It suggests that the McCann's iron grip on the media is about to be broken.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 14.10.13 8:10

@galena wrote:
@Angelique wrote:I too think that this SY investigation was all about the Libel Trial.

The ultimate goal of TM has to be the trial is put into reverse and  that the McCanns win simply because of the amount of cash TM would need to pay in costs alone. But I don't see how the scenario suggested in the Crimewatch programme can possibly do this.

There have been several remarks in recent reporting saying that the Portuguese failed to investigate witnesses and ignored the Smith sighting. So "trashing" has started.



I'm originally thought it was about whitewashing the McCanns but now I'm beginning to wonder if SY are actually on the side of their colleagues in the PJ and keen that the inconsistencies in the Tapas 9's original statements be exposed. The fact that newspapers are publishing stories saying that the original timeline is wrong is a massive step forward in my opinion. It suggests that the McCann's iron grip on the media is about to be broken.
Tending to agree with you, it does seem strange after a long period of seeming sycophancy.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Hopespringseternal on 14.10.13 8:30

Not sure this belongs here, so Mods please move if not right, but I feel that if this trial goes against them or moves are made to bring the parents to court (for whatever reason) then they will claim that they cannot get a fair trial because of all the publicity. UNLESS, that's why (apart from the risk of being sued) the papers have been printing primarily TM's side of the story?

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by plebgate on 14.10.13 8:36

From the outset they wanted the publicity, so I do not see how they could use that as a reason not be have a fair trial.   Not that I believe there will ever be one.

It's been said many, many times - if they asked for the public to help then it was inevitable many would ask questions.   Can't expect people to give of their time and their money without knowing exactly what happened the night Maddie was taken.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by galena on 14.10.13 13:06

@plebgate wrote:From the outset they wanted the publicity, so I do not see how they could use that as a reason not be have a fair trial.   Not that I believe there will ever be one.

It's been said many, many times - if they asked for the public to help then it was inevitable many would ask questions.   Can't expect people to give of their time and their money without knowing exactly what happened the night Maddie was taken.
Like you I'm dubious about a trial but at the moment I would be happy if the libel action against GA was to be dropped.  Too many people have suffered as a result of the McCanns determination to stifle free speech!

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by PeterMac on 14.10.13 14:02

@galena wrote:
@plebgate wrote:From the outset they wanted the publicity, so I do not see how they could use that as a reason not be have a fair trial.   Not that I believe there will ever be one.

It's been said many, many times - if they asked for the public to help then it was inevitable many would ask questions.   Can't expect people to give of their time and their money without knowing exactly what happened the night Maddie was taken.
Like you I'm dubious about a trial but at the moment I would be happy if the libel action against GA was to be dropped.  Too many people have suffered as a result of the McCanns determination to stifle free speech!
I take the opposite view.
I would prefer the judge to admit both Kate and Gerry to give evidence - in person - under oath, and listen to what they have to say.
If they are allowed to drop the case they will always be able to McSpin it in the same way they used the archiving to maintain that they had been exonerated.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by lj on 14.10.13 14:21

If I understand it correctly the questioning will be done only by the judge. Is that correct PeterM?

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Guest on 14.10.13 17:08

That's what I understand too, jl.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by lj on 14.10.13 19:04

Hi Châtelaine! I don't expect her to ask anything more than what directly is the core of the case: damage done to their "integrity" by Dr Amaral's book. Somehow I have trouble getting integrity and the conning couple in one sentence.
Anyway; I guess all the lies and obstruction really is not relevant for that. All though it would make clear that our celebrity child neglectors are not the first class citizens they want you to think they are.

I wonder if the judge has any idea what's going on now, and I would love to know what she think of that.

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Re: Implications for the Libel trial

Post by Seek truth on 15.10.13 7:27

Over the last few days, we have watched yet another attempt at misinformation and intoxication of public opinion, which does not surprise anymore. The surprise, if it can be called that way, is the reaction of the Portuguese press which seems to be unable to see the main motivation of this campaign and turn that into the real news. The ongoing publicity campaign has the main purpose of putting pressure on the Portuguese court that has to decide. What is at stake is the independence of Portuguese courts to decide objectively, in a free manner and founded on the law. The Portuguese press in general has not yet understood, or didn't want to understand what is at stake, but the common citizen, who can think on his own and with good sense, is still alert and has already understood what is happening.

Gonçalo Amaral, October 10, 2013


http://joana-morais.blogspot.co.uk/2013/10/pressures-on-court.html?m=1

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