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Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by plebgate on 08.10.13 22:02

@russiandoll wrote:But all 3 had fallen asleep or so we are told when they left 5a.

 I am more interested to see the excessively tired child left alone with her 2 year old siblings while Daddy was out and Mummy took a shower.

 I wonder what they will be filmed doing?

 colouring quietly?

 sticker book game?

 fighting over toys/books?

 fighting over cuddlecat?

 running around?

 climbing on furniture?

 how long on average is a quick shower, and why not wait until Daddy was back, if it could be done so quickly, once children asleep?

 They had a full hour from when kids asleep didn't they?
 Given that the reason crèche was out was that the children needed to be asleep before it opened?

 It is going to be interesting viewing.

..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

An excessively tired child, prone to nose bleeds.   As a non medical person I would not have left my child alone had I witnessed excessive tiredness and knowing that she was prone to nose bleeds. 

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Woofer on 08.10.13 22:21

Logged on late today and just seen Peter Mac`s letter - yes, absolutely brilliant.  And yes it should be sent before the programme IMO so they can`t say they were not aware of these facts.

In fact, it should be posted far and wide and to every journalist on the planet, so none of them can say they weren`t told.

The BBC have an arrogant reputation and think they can get away with anything so I think they will do what they want with Crimewatch.  They broadcast the Jimmy Savile Xmas Commemoration when they knew the type of man he was ...... and, boy, did that backfire on them big time.  Perhaps the same will happen with the McCanns.

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by russiandoll on 08.10.13 22:22

I take your point, plebgate. I misunderstood your post.

 It is unbelievable that these people are doctors.

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contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
unrealistic.
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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by aiyoyo on 09.10.13 7:04

@PeterMac wrote:And let us never forget that Kate not only arrived at the Tapas bar AFTER her run and found the entire family -INCLUDING MADELEINE -  at High Tea  (from the book - so it must be true)
and
At Exactly the same time
Signed Madeleine out of the creche.


How are the BBC going to reconstruct that ?
i cant wait to see whether BBC include the happy family at the Tapas Bar sans their usual Hol. friends; and how that is going to reconcile with witnesses statement?

Also, how are BBC going to reconstruct Kate in her bathrobe answering the door to DP, while her 3 children inside were within the vision of DP that he saw those 3 angelic looking children dressed in white ready for bed.

I really would like to see the reconstruct of the last photo at the pool as well.
And, the route they take the children to the Creche back & forth, route G&K take to the Tennis Court and all the events they did on the 3rd running up to the alert.

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 09.10.13 7:28

I wonder if they have a few "extras" of swarthy Roma extraction strategically loitering about ready to whisk Madeleine off to a hellish lair upon a lawless hill? Just to make it authentic of course. 

Or will they reconstruct an elderly Mrs Fenn phoning a friend in concern for a child wailing for something approaching two hours, with not a check in sight?

Oh, dear, how ARE they going to pull off a reconstruction in any factual way?

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by worriedmum on 09.10.13 8:22

If the reconstruction is based on facts as presented in statements and police photographs,we are in for an amazing evening's viewing. 

It will be very interesting to see the Ritual of the Shared Toothbrush.  The beige trousers on the bed.  Kate going for a shower while three tiny children amuse themselves, then later going for a bath. David Payne talking to Kate for a few seconds which is also many minutes,standing outside the patio doors but maybe inside the patio doors. Madeleine lying inside the covers and on top of them at the same time. And of course the windows that are open/shut, shutters that are smashed/intact, Jane Tanner and egg/swarthy/bundleman and the Smith family and button- trouser man. Doors that are 'open much wider ' but which still don't reveal an open window to an adult checking children in the room.  I will be interested to see at what point the abductor decides to open the bedroom window and curtains as a 'red herring' . Also how the patio curtains are closed and opened as people leave and enter the apartment. And how the curtains whooshed when the police photographs show them tucked behind the bed.  Plus I am hoping that in the interests of accuracy, there will be some-one measuring the gap available for concealment behind the bedroom door, measuring the gap in the open window,and pointing out any missing high shelves.

It's going to be very interesting...

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by sweetex on 09.10.13 8:27

I am not in the UK Sad Do you guys think there will be ANY possible way for us who are not in the UK to view this?

If someone can perhaps give me the exact channel, I can maybe somehow stream it?

Thanks

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Nereid on 09.10.13 10:11

Excellent letter PeterMac. Chapeau! And a clever move to post it online. They can't say they didn't see it! They will probably disregard it, but then the complaints will flood in hopefully.
 
This from their own website:
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/editorialguidelines/page/guidance-crime-full#crime-reconstructions
 
"Crime Reconstructions
 
When reconstructing crime for factual programmes we should take care only to reconstruct what we actually know, and avoid speculation or unfounded significant detail.
We do not normally reconstruct detail, including dialogue, which we do not have reason to believe occurred, unless there is a clear and specific editorial reason for doing so. We should not use an actor's portrayal of a character to create dramatic details or an overall tone for which we there is no verifiable evidence.
In addition, we should think carefully about the appropriate use of camera angles - particularly point-of-view shots. Although it will sometimes be necessary to show a scene from a victim's viewpoint, we should take care to avoid frightening audiences by using shots that make them feel they are the victim. The camera will usually appear as an observer of events rather than as a participant.
We do not normally use close-ups of weapons or shots of blood simply for dramatic impact and the inflicting of wounds is only reconstructed where editorially justified.
Post-production techniques, such as slow motion, may sometimes have an editorial purpose - but they are not normally used simply for dramatic effect. And we do not normally use incidental music or irrelevant sound effects.
We should take care in reconstructions to avoid revealing detail that could be used to make a criminal activity more effective."
 
 
They cannot possibly do the reconstruction based on what they actually know, because they don't know a thing if they are basing it on the conflicting statements. It will be pure speculation!
 
How are they going to do (or have done) the reconstruction? Draw lots as to which version of events to pick? It reminds me of one of those games where you can select different options along the way. Each time the outcome of the game is totally different based on what option you chose. 

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by flaxyard on 09.10.13 10:23

@sweetex wrote:I am not in the UK :(Do you guys think there will be ANY possible way for us who are not in the UK to view this?

If someone can perhaps give me the exact channel, I can maybe somehow stream it?

Thanks
sweetex, It may be a live stream but probably delayed by a couple of hours but will definately be on www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer Just navigate to the correct channel BBC1 and watch at your leisure.

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by justjoined on 09.10.13 10:56

@flaxyard wrote:
@sweetex wrote:I am not in the UK :(Do you guys think there will be ANY possible way for us who are not in the UK to view this?

If someone can perhaps give me the exact channel, I can maybe somehow stream it?

Thanks
sweetex, It may be a live stream but probably delayed by a couple of hours but will definately be on www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer Just navigate to the correct channel BBC1 and watch at your leisure.
You will not be able to watch either BBC or IPlayer from outside the UK (well strictly speaking you could but would have to download a VPN to make your computer think it was in the UK)) but you can watch live UK channels 1-5 free of charge on www.filmon.com (Hope this post is OK- I don't do it very often).

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by sweetex on 09.10.13 14:54

@justjoined wrote:
@flaxyard wrote:
@sweetex wrote:I am not in the UK :(Do you guys think there will be ANY possible way for us who are not in the UK to view this?

If someone can perhaps give me the exact channel, I can maybe somehow stream it?

Thanks
sweetex, It may be a live stream but probably delayed by a couple of hours but will definately be on www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer Just navigate to the correct channel BBC1 and watch at your leisure.
You will not be able to watch either BBC or IPlayer from outside the UK (well strictly speaking you could but would have to download a VPN to make your computer think it was in the UK)) but you can watch live UK channels 1-5 free of charge on www.filmon.com (Hope this post is OK- I don't do it very often).
Thank you flaxyard and justjoined!! Will have a look and see. Definitely don't want to miss the "recon" we been waiting for for 6 years lol

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Cherry on 09.10.13 17:10

Fantastic letter Peter, well done, will certainly give them something to think about! clapping

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Guest on 10.10.13 10:47

@ justjoined
Thanks very much for the link. It works for me here in France and I can for the first time watch BBC live!
roses 

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Creche records and Wine Drinking

Post by Pyewacket on 10.10.13 11:35

Hi All,

Am quite new on here and have been reading through various bits and pieces in all the archived material. Firstly; Hats off to you all you've certainly been busy beavering away in the cause of seeking justice for Madeleine. Respect !! thumbsup 

Secondly; these creche records. Many on here have suspicions that they are not all that that seem, and that some entries could be well be suspect. One thing that springs to mind, and I've not seen it mentioned anywhere yet, is just where were the record sheets kept ? The Carer girls were only minimally trained and would have their hands full looking after the kids, and perhaps didn't leave them to personally supervise each and every signing in and out, this seems to correlate with the fact, as shown on the sheets that some kids were signed in but on occasion weren't signed out. If the sheets were say in a ring binder or folder in the entrance hall or lobby, or away from where the kids activities were actually taking place, it could be that someone could make an entry completely undetected. Also if someone turned up at creche whom was recognised as being a "regular" it would not really draw any attention, as the girls would be too busy anyway looking after the kids. It would also make sense to have the sheets out of reach of the kids, I'm sure you what they're like !!

Thirdly; I read somewhere that the Tapas staff stated that they served twelve bottles of wine to the T9's table on the night of third (Hope I'm right on this) Well IMO, if correct that's going it a bit, in an hour and a half ! That's quite a bit of lubricant even between nine of them. The words: Dutch and Courage spring to mind. Should look good on Crimewatch though

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Guest on 10.10.13 11:48

@Pyewacket wrote:Hi All,

Am quite new on here and have been reading through various bits and pieces in all the archived material. Firstly; Hats off to you all you've certainly been busy beavering away in the cause of seeking justice for Madeleine. Respect !! thumbsup 

Secondly; these creche records. Many on here have suspicions that they are not all that that seem, and that some entries could be well be suspect. One thing that springs to mind, and I've not seen it mentioned anywhere yet, is just where were the record sheets kept ? The Carer girls were only minimally trained and would have their hands full looking after the kids, and perhaps didn't leave them to personally supervise each and every signing in and out, this seems to correlate with the fact, as shown on the sheets that some kids were signed in but on occasion weren't signed out. If the sheets were say in a ring binder or folder in the entrance hall or lobby, or away from where the kids activities were actually taking place, it could be that someone could make an entry completely undetected. Also if someone turned up at creche whom was recognised as being a "regular" it would not really draw any attention, as the girls would be too busy anyway looking after the kids. It would also make sense to have the sheets out of reach of the kids, I'm sure you what they're like !!

Thirdly; I read somewhere that the Tapas staff stated that they served twelve bottles of wine to the T9's table on the night of third (Hope I'm right on this) Well IMO, if correct that's going it a bit, in an hour and a half ! That's quite a bit of lubricant even between nine of them. The words: Dutch and Courage spring to mind. Should look good on Crimewatch though
Plus the bottle the McCs have declared downing in the one hour when 'relaxing' between the DP visit (plus shower) and departure for the Tapas (after bath)

Lively bunch they must have been. 

Dutch? Nah, they don't bath that often: shark

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Pyewacket on 10.10.13 12:00

Sorry Portia, not sure you get my meaning. Dutch Courage refers to bravado through drink. This is from Wiki:

Dutch courage or liquid courage, (properly potvaliancy[1]), refers to courage gained from intoxication from alcohol. Originally the phrase 'Dutch courage' referred to the courage that results from indulgence in Dutch gin (jenever), but 'Dutch courage' can also refer to the gin itself.

IMO they might have needed it !!

Kind regards

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Guest on 10.10.13 12:15

@Pyewacket wrote:Sorry Portia, not sure you get my meaning. Dutch Courage refers to bravado through drink. This is from Wiki:

Dutch courage or liquid courage, (properly potvaliancy[1]), refers to courage gained from intoxication from alcohol. Originally the phrase 'Dutch courage' referred to the courage that results from indulgence in Dutch gin (jenever), but 'Dutch courage' can also refer to the gin itself.

IMO they might have needed it !!

Kind regards
Never heard of it. Sorry

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by Guest on 10.10.13 15:29

There are many more [negative] English expressions on "Dutch, like "going Dutch" or a "Dutch treat", "Double Dutch" 'Dutch Oncle", "being in Dutch", "Dutch Auction". They may originate from the British-Dutch battles in the 17th century, resulting in some of the worst defeats of the British and leaving no love lost between them ...

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Re: Open letter re: Proposed Crimewatch programme 14 October 2013 - Madeleine McCann.

Post by jeanmonroe on 10.10.13 15:42

Châtelaine wrote:There are many more  [negative] English expressions on "Dutch, like "going Dutch" or a "Dutch treat", "Double Dutch" 'Dutch Oncle", "being in Dutch", "Dutch Auction". They may originate from the British-Dutch battles in the 17th century, resulting in some of the worst defeats of the British and leaving no love lost between them ...
But we luvs 'em now!

Especially Rotterdamers!

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