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Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Guest on 18.09.13 15:14

I suppose it could be an odd way of saying that the end of the search (not that it ever started for her personally) would also be the end of all hope that her daughter was alive and well somewhere.

Of course, those of a more sceptical nature might take it to mean that the appeals for money would have to stop.....

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by tigger on 18.09.13 15:21

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:I suppose it could be an odd way of saying that the end of the search (not that it ever started for her personally) would also be the end of all hope that her daughter was alive and well somewhere.

Of course, those of a more sceptical nature might take it to mean that the appeals for money would have to stop.....
Well, we hear a lot about the'search' being stopped because of the 'd' word, but next to nothing about sightings ever exciting them in the least, quite the opposite. It seems they have no hope in any case. Why would that be? They'd have been better advised to at least show some real interest in any sighting at all, but unfortunately they are on record stating the opposite.
Perhaps someone could post 'the smirk' once again?

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by jeanmonroe on 18.09.13 15:36

The biggest 'mystery' about this court case is HOW have any of the credible witnesses for the McCanns managed to KEEP A STRAIGHT FACE!

Don't worry, Ma Healy and Trish will change all that!

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Cristobell on 18.09.13 15:38

Not the smirk, but why is Gerry trying to stop himself giggling as a man asks about the age progression picture?  Fast forward to 20.58, it is just before the end of the news conference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=divprR1XZKM

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by ShuBob on 18.09.13 16:02

@Cristobell wrote:Not the smirk, but why is Gerry trying to stop himself giggling as a man asks about the age progression picture?  Fast forward to 20.58, it is just before the end of the news conference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=divprR1XZKM
His subconscious lets him down every time that man.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by MRNOODLES on 18.09.13 16:38

@Cristobell wrote:Not the smirk, but why is Gerry trying to stop himself giggling as a man asks about the age progression picture?  Fast forward to 20.58, it is just before the end of the news conference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=divprR1XZKM
Just guessing here. But do you reckon they've just held up the infamous 'Asian' looking Maddie?


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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by PeterMac on 18.09.13 16:48

" />

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Cristobell on 18.09.13 16:49

Might have done, the 'asian' Maddie is pretty bizarre.  

Whatever he is laughing at, it was totally inappropriate and there is no sign that anyone else was laughing.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by aiyoyo on 18.09.13 16:55

Maybe the image of a coloured Maddie amuses him since he knows that won't ever happen.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by russiandoll on 18.09.13 17:12

MC – What did the people think of the shelving?
AM says that they respected the AG Report that says that there was no evidence of anything.

MC - But the conclusions of the AG Report are two-fold. It established there was no evidence determining the nature of the crime, whilst indicating that there nothing more that could be done to find Madeleine.
AM concludes saying that the publication of the book raised many comments.


 Therefore it was not GA's book which made the public " give up the search " .

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by plebgate on 18.09.13 17:22

@russiandoll wrote: MC – What did the people think of the shelving?
AM says that they respected the AG Report that says that there was no evidence of anything.

MC - But the conclusions of the AG Report are two-fold. It established there was no evidence determining the nature of the crime, whilst indicating that there nothing more that could be done to find Madeleine.
AM concludes saying that the publication of the book raised many comments.


 Therefore it was not GA's book which made the public " give up the search " .

To quote Aiyoyo in the original post - isn't MC a shining star.

She's done her homework it would seem.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by PeterMac on 18.09.13 17:50

@plebgate wrote:
To quote Aiyoyo in the original post - isn't MC a shining star.
She's done her homework it would seem.    
It may be why she is a judge,

and he is not !

And, lest we forget, these are the best witnesses the McCanns have.  The select few.
Each one carefully chosen from a list, for their ability to give vital first hand evidence on one or more of the details set out in the writ.


They claim £215,000  each for emotional distress
They say they suffer 'permanent anxiety, insomnia, lack of appetite, irritability and an indefinable fear'.
The writ also says Kate McCann is 'steeped in a deep and serious depression'.

" />

" />

God know what she would look like if she were happy ! !

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by jeanmonroe on 18.09.13 17:50

MC – What did the people think of the shelving?
AM says that they respected the AG Report that says that there was no evidence of anything.
______________________________________________

So, they RESPECTED  a report that says their first born daughter Madeleine might of died in Apartment 5A albeit by accident
That they are suspect of being involved somehow
That they and their friends might have concealed a crime.

And they RESPECT that?

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Seek truth on 18.09.13 18:47

@PeterMac wrote:" />
Always a LAUGHING father, NEVER a CRYING father.

Their answers, says all.  Twins becoming teenagers searching etc. loads of money! Loads of happy police investigations, loads of money on this case. I'll spend all my money before they grab it.


They look convinced. But Kate wasn't even sure how she'd given all her photos to make up this NEW MISSING GIRL in the picture, did they forget to tell her?

The search for THIS little girl, not MADELEINE! WTF
Like she wasn't even their daughter.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by PeterMac on 18.09.13 18:52

@jeanmonroe wrote:MC – What did the people think of the shelving?
AM says that they respected the AG Report that says that there was no evidence of anything.
______________________________________________

So, they RESPECTED  a report that says their first born daughter Madeleine might of died in Apartment 5A albeit by accident
That they are suspect of being involved somehow
That they and their friends might have concealed a crime.

And they RESPECT that?
No evidence of anything ?  
Let us re-cap
viii - Despite all of this, it was not possible to obtain any piece of evidence that would allow for a reasonable man, under the light of the criteria of logics, of normality and of the general rules of experience, to formulate any lucid, sensate, serious and honest conclusion about the circumstances under which the child was removed from the apartment (whether dead or alive, whether killed in a neglectful homicide or an intended homicide, whether the victim of a targeted abduction or an opportunistic abduction) nor even to produce a consistent prognosis about her destiny and inclusively - the most dramatic - to establish whether she is still alive or if she is dead, as seems more likely.

8.9. This shows that the parents were not persistently worried about their children [and] that they didn't check on them like they afterwards declared they did, rather neglecting their duty to guard those same children, although not in a temerarious, or gross, manner.

8.15. It seems evident to us and because the files contain enough elements for such, that the crime of exposure or abandonment according to article 138 of the Penal Code can be eliminated from that range: '1 - Whoever places another person's life in danger,  a) By exposing her in a location where she is subject to a situation from which she, on her own, cannot defend herself against; or  b) Abandoning her without defence, whenever the agent had the duty to guard her, to watch over her or to assist her;"

8.16. This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent.  The only reason they were not prosecuted for this

8.12. Finally, the fact that, despite all that confusion and all that noise, the twins continued to sleep, as mentioned by GNR Officer José Maria Baptista Roque, a member of the patrol that was first to arrive at the apartment "the children never woke up, remaining in a ventral decubitus position, not moving during the search and afterwards" [28], remains unexplained.
And they respect that report, because it does not prosecute them.
But, Mr English Solicitor, it makes it plain that the AG did not accept
Abduction
Proper child care arrangements
Lack of Sedation
and lots of other things.
Specifically and in terms, he says it is more likely that Madeleine is DEAD.
What part of that do you not understand, Angus McBride ?

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by aiyoyo on 18.09.13 20:10

That (dead) must be a taboo word, not to be mentioned in front of the Mccanns, or the Mrs' blood will boil!

Might it be that the Mccanns had paid them so handsomely for so little work done, that they believe in not biting the hands that feed them, hence going forth as witness for them thinking its easy peasy anyway. Say their piece, have a good meal put on the travel expense, take a little side tour of Portugal then come home. Nice little short break away.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by sammyc on 18.09.13 20:51

@Cristobell wrote:Not the smirk, but why is Gerry trying to stop himself giggling as a man asks about the age progression picture?  Fast forward to 20.58, it is just before the end of the news conference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=divprR1XZKM
Oh Dear Gerry, Kate, Family and Believers -  What are the Twins going to say and do when they inevitably 'google' their own name.  tick tock

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Guest on 18.09.13 20:57

Not the smirking interview but, thanks to someone on Facebook, I've found the one which has been whooshed from YouTube; the one where they jump up looking as if they've won the lottery when they think they're off camera.
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7380419.stm

I'm hoping that we have a lip-reader to tell us what Kate said at about 2.40.

The contrast between their behaviour then and what it was seconds earlier could hardly be more extreme.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by PeterMac on 18.09.13 21:11

No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:Not the smirking interview but, thanks to someone on Facebook, I've found the one which has been whooshed from YouTube; the one where they jump up looking as if they've won the lottery when they think they're off camera.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7380419.stm
I'm hoping that we have a lip-reader to tell us what Kate said at about 2.40.
The contrast between their behaviour then and what it was seconds earlier could hardly be more extreme.
CAN SOMEONE WHO KNOWS HOW TO DO IT Record this and upload it again onto You Tube.
Or here in a form we can all record and keep and re-play

THIS MUST NEVER BE Whooshed.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by suzyjohnson on 18.09.13 22:22

@PeterMac wrote:
viii - Despite all of this, it was not possible to obtain any piece of evidence that would allow for a reasonable man, under the light of the criteria of logics, of normality and of the general rules of experience, to formulate any lucid, sensate, serious and honest conclusion about the circumstances under which the child was removed from the apartment (whether dead or alive, whether killed in a neglectful homicide or an intended homicide, whether the victim of a targeted abduction or an opportunistic abduction) nor even to produce a consistent prognosis about her destiny and inclusively - the most dramatic - to establish whether she is still alive or if she is dead, as seems more likely.

8.9. This shows that the parents were not persistently worried about their children [and] that they didn't check on them like they afterwards declared they did, rather neglecting their duty to guard those same children, although not in a temerarious, or gross, manner.

8.15. It seems evident to us and because the files contain enough elements for such, that the crime of exposure or abandonment according to article 138 of the Penal Code can be eliminated from that range: '1 - Whoever places another person's life in danger,  a) By exposing her in a location where she is subject to a situation from which she, on her own, cannot defend herself against; or  b) Abandoning her without defence, whenever the agent had the duty to guard her, to watch over her or to assist her;"

8.16. This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent.

8.12. Finally, the fact that, despite all that confusion and all that noise, the twins continued to sleep, as mentioned by GNR Officer José Maria Baptista Roque, a member of the patrol that was first to arrive at the apartment "the children never woke up, remaining in a ventral decubitus position, not moving during the search and afterwards" [28], remains unexplained.
And actually, when you read the above, it shows just how carefully considered the conclusions, and considerate the Portuguese were to the McCanns

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by maebee on 18.09.13 23:14

Ciawoman wrote: wrote:
How can the McCann's state the book hindered the search when the UK tax payers are paying out millions of pounds to still search 6 years later?
Well said Cia. Whether SY are genuine or not in their search for the truth about what happened to Madeleine, they,the top Police Force in UK have (appeared to/been ordered to) spend the last 2 years looking into her disappearance. Therefore GA's book /documentary has no effect whatsoever, even on the top Police Force in the UK. Health Warning about SY's true motive but their involvement for the past 2 years blows the Mcs case againt GA to pieces.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by PeterMac on 19.09.13 8:06

@suzyjohnson wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:
8.15. It seems evident to us and because the files contain enough elements for such, that the crime of exposure or abandonment according to article 138 of the Penal Code can be eliminated from that range: '1 - Whoever places another person's life in danger,  a) By exposing her in a location where she is subject to a situation from which she, on her own, cannot defend herself against; or  b) Abandoning her without defence, whenever the agent had the duty to guard her, to watch over her or to assist her;"

8.16. This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent.

And actually, when you read the above, it shows just how carefully considered the conclusions, and considerate the Portuguese were to the McCanns
It is solely the inclusion of the necessity to prove INTENT in the Portuguese law of exposure or abandonment which stopped them being prosecuted.
All the other elements are present, life in danger - Kate admitted there might have been a fire ! ! - location where she is subject to a situation which she cannot defend herself against - QED- abandoning without defence - everything else is there.

Mere gross, culpable, selfish negligence is clearly not enough in their code, as it would be un the UK.

You can almost sense the quiet resignation and sighing in the AG's wording, that they could not proceed against them.

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Tombraider on 19.09.13 9:20

@PeterMac wrote:
@suzyjohnson wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:
8.15. It seems evident to us and because the files contain enough elements for such, that the crime of exposure or abandonment according to article 138 of the Penal Code can be eliminated from that range: '1 - Whoever places another person's life in danger,  a) By exposing her in a location where she is subject to a situation from which she, on her own, cannot defend herself against; or  b) Abandoning her without defence, whenever the agent had the duty to guard her, to watch over her or to assist her;"

8.16. This legal type of crime is only fulfilled with intent, and this intent has to cover the creation of danger to the victim's life, as well as the absence of a capacity to defend herself, on the victim's behalf. In the case of the files and facing the elements that were collected it is evident that none of the arguidos Gerald or Kate acted with intent.

And actually, when you read the above, it shows just how carefully considered the conclusions, and considerate the Portuguese were to the McCanns
It is solely the inclusion of the necessity to prove INTENT in the Portuguese law of exposure or abandonment which stopped them being prosecuted.
All the other elements are present, life in danger - Kate admitted there might have been a fire ! ! - location where she is subject to a situation which she cannot defend herself against - QED- abandoning without defence - everything else is there.

Mere gross, culpable, selfish negligence is clearly not enough in their code, as it would be un the UK.

You can almost sense the quiet resignation and sighing in the AG's wording, that they could not proceed against them.


The intent of the parent is totally irrelevant. - it does not matter for the child's well being what the intent was. There are parents who have intent to neglect and others who have no premeditated intent. However, the outcome is still failure in their parental duty to protect the child resulting in serious harm.  



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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by Praiaaa on 19.09.13 10:05

@PeterMac wrote:
No Fate Worse Than De'Ath wrote:Not the smirking interview but, thanks to someone on Facebook, I've found the one which has been whooshed from YouTube; the one where they jump up looking as if they've won the lottery when they think they're off camera.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7380419.stm
I'm hoping that we have a lip-reader to tell us what Kate said at about 2.40.
The contrast between their behaviour then and what it was seconds earlier could hardly be more extreme.
CAN SOMEONE WHO KNOWS HOW TO DO IT  Record this and upload it again onto You Tube.
Or here in a form we can all record and keep and re-play

THIS MUST NEVER BE Whooshed.
Wow! Am astonished the BBC let that slip thru ...
Well found!

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Re: Libel Trial - Angus McBride's Testimony

Post by windchime on 19.09.13 10:27

Having watched this over and over again with the sound on and the sound off I am actually coming to the conclusion that the BBC have left it there for a reason.

Watch the video and ask yourself why they show the couple sitting down and confidently attaching microphones and detaching them at the end as if it is part of anyone's daily routine? 

Ask yourself why they make quite a big thing of a close up of the 'hand holding'?  (In fact this is one of those videos where it looks like KM is practically arm wrestling GM - there is obvious pressure in the grip)

Why do the BBC make the statement at the beginning 'the couple almost didn't come for the interview today' and then tell us they are involved in 'a series of interviews this week' - so they almost don't turn up to make a big thing of it but then do and of course they are so busy doing interview after interview!

and why after the oh so acted and difficult statement regarding the service the next day quote 'we may be at the service but depends on how we feel' do they then immediately show the couple as I think NFWTD said 'looking as though they have won the lottery'?!

I have tried to lip read what she says at the end but KM tends to talk through gritted teeth and it makes it very difficult to do so here's hoping a true lip reader can help us out.

2 things that I personally found very odd that were said by GM & KM

GM ' peop.. (massive gulp) everyone wants....... ' why did he stop saying people and change it?  The obvious gulp is a give away that he was about to put his foot in it big time.

KM 'Madeliene needs... wants to be found'  What an odd thing to say, I just cannot fathom it out.

Anyway as Petermac says - this MUST NOT be lost and is a true reflection of how they behave naturally when they are not 'acting'.

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