The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Hi,

A very warm welcome to The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™ forum.

Please log in, or register to view all the forums, then settle in and start chatting with us!

Enjoy your day,

Jill Havern
Forum owner

Blacksmith

Page 5 of 10 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by aquila on 25.06.13 11:27

@Kepharel wrote:Is that a debate about Blacksmith himself, his latest blog, the content of any particular posting within his blog archive, his general opinions on the whole case, his views on the media or any other peripheral topic he has put forward a view on.  A debate perhaps on the views of this forum regarding the value of Blacksmith's contribution towards our understanding of the case?  maybe you would like to pick one among these or offer a topic of your own.  I'm sure it would be great fun.  I am not a confrontational person but your comment on my post appears a little defensive.  Be specific about your challenge and I am sure I can, within a reasonable amount of time to allow consideration and reflection, to come up with something :)

My comment is neither confrontational nor defensive. If you have the time to consider and reflect I would value your opinion on all of the interesting issues you have raised above. You never know it might be fun as you say.

aquila

Posts : 7953
Reputation : 1174
Join date : 2011-09-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Kepharel on 25.06.13 11:59

'On all of the above’ sounds like a labour of Hercules to me.  You suggested that nowhere on these forums have I made any contribution to debate within any particular topic.  That’s because I am a reader rather than a contributor, as are many of your membership.  It doesn’t mean, though, that I have no views, just rather I have little time to express myself. OK I may appear to be online most of the day, but it is not through idleness, rather my duties as a full time carer to my wife.
 
That I appear to be online does not mean I am physically at my computer.  Having offered me a challenge perhaps you might like to focus on any particular aspect of this case and I will do my best to play devil’s advocate on that subject in debate.  I am quite happy to play the part and put my views up for dissection from anyone in the forum; even lost causes such as timelines J J.  That I lose emphatically will have no personal effect on me, because in all probability, maybe even certainty, I won’t believe a word of my own argument myself J
 

I respect all views in this forum, that’s why I continue to monitor it…it has been both educational and entertaining at the same time

Kepharel

Posts : 130
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by aquila on 25.06.13 12:19

No-one needs to play devil's advocate on this forum. It's full of honest opinion - in fact it's brimming with it. I can't find anything remotely decent or fun about anyone who writes or comments on the disappearance of Madeleine McCann in an 'entertaining' or 'provocative' manner to 'inspire' debate such as Blacksmith does.

I'll take it that the Herculian list you wrote is what most of us have been discussing about Blacksmith.

aquila

Posts : 7953
Reputation : 1174
Join date : 2011-09-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Kepharel on 25.06.13 12:45

Every day this forum spends time debunking any views opposing the ethos within which the forum operates, and does so in the name of honest opinion, 99% of which I agree with.  In that sense this Forum's opposition to other points of view may be regarded as a devil’s advocation (not sure if there is such a word, but you get my meaning).  All I suggest to you is that it may promote debate and understanding of the case if it were brought ‘in house’ so to speak.  Remember, you put up the challenge to me.
 
That such a debate should be about Blacksmith, rather than the facts of the case would be a lost opportunity to the Forum to justify exactly what their opinion is on any particular matter, and why it is the correct one.  There must be 1001 things to debate, anyone one of which is more relevant than Blacksmith, and I am willing to put the Forum opinion to the test by putting up an alternative point of view for discussion.  In doing so I will forgo my own opinion on the validity of my own argument.
 

I would like to make clear that the cut and thrust of debate should not be read in the context of the tragic circumstances of the subject matter, and that the word ‘fun’ in this context has a very narrow meaning which specifically excludes that subject matter.  So there you have it, pick a topic or let’s just let this exchange die a natural.

Kepharel

Posts : 130
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by PeterMac on 25.06.13 12:47

The one "Devil's Advocate" debate which is urgently needed, is a full description of how any abduction might have been completed within the time allowed.
This is the one thing that has been missing right from the start, or more accurately from the next morning when it was shown that the shutters / windows / curtains / doors stories were just that.
No one, pro-TM, or pro-justice for MBM has managed to come up with a convincing scenario.  (Or for that matter any scenario !)
TM themselves painted themselves into a corner when they admitted in the blog that the shutter / windows etc was a "red herring", and CM said that they were convinced no one came in that way.
This is the problem that haunts everyone.  Grange included, I would bet.
Where is the point of entry ?
Where is the point of exit ?
Where is the time needed to sedate three children in silence and in the dark ?
Where is the time needed to pick up a sedated child, turn it round, and exit ?
Where is the forensic evidence of any intruder, anywhere, ever ?

I would love to debate with a Devil's Advocate who can draw up something credible.
And, yes, this is a genuine invitation.

____________________


PeterMac
Researcher

Posts : 10170
Reputation : 143
Join date : 2010-12-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by aquila on 25.06.13 12:58

@Kepharel wrote:Every day this forum spends time debunking any views opposing the ethos within which the forum operates, and does so in the name of honest opinion, 99% of which I agree with.  In that sense this Forum's opposition to other points of view may be regarded as a devil’s advocation (not sure if there is such a word, but you get my meaning).  All I suggest to you is that it may promote debate and understanding of the case if it were brought ‘in house’ so to speak.  Remember, you put up the challenge to me.
 
That such a debate should be about Blacksmith, rather than the facts of the case would be a lost opportunity to the Forum to justify exactly what their opinion is on any particular matter, and why it is the correct one.  There must be 1001 things to debate, anyone one of which is more relevant than Blacksmith, and I am willing to put the Forum opinion to the test by putting up an alternative point of view for discussion.  In doing so I will forgo my own opinion on the validity of my own argument.
 

I would like to make clear that the cut and thrust of debate should not be read in the context of the tragic circumstances of the subject matter, and that the word ‘fun’ in this context has a very narrow meaning which specifically excludes that subject matter.  So there you have it, pick a topic or let’s just let this exchange die a natural.

I see we've moved swiftly on from Blacksmith now.

ETA. Who challenged you?

aquila

Posts : 7953
Reputation : 1174
Join date : 2011-09-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Kepharel on 25.06.13 13:02

Thank you PeterMac.  Give me a week for research and I'll do my best :))..... Post on here this time next week, and I'll even put my case first and throw it into the Forum for savaging :)  As you say it is mission impossible but I'll try to come up with something.  In the meantime let this all now rest.

Kepharel

Posts : 130
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by bobbin on 25.06.13 13:21

@Kepharel wrote:Thank you PeterMac.  Give me a week for research and I'll do my best :))..... Post on here this time next week, and I'll even put my case first and throw it into the Forum for savaging :)  As you say it is mission impossible but I'll try to come up with something.  In the meantime let this all now rest.
Hello Kepharel, I am not clear on what you are saying here.
Are you meaning 'let "you" rest until this time next week when we may anticipate your studied reply' ? or are you suggesting we drop the discussion of the pros and cons of Blacksmith and any / or not/ contribution he might make to the aim of this forum, namely, to bring justice to Maddy, who at the age of 3 went on holiday with her parents and did not return ?
Perhaps it would be more profitable to find some new angle, or a piece of the jigsaw not yet discovered, that would help that aim rather than taking on the 'herculean' task that you set yourself.
For my part, I have no thirst for spending my time 'savaging' any one's opinions. I am here, like the majority who are serious, to analyse the information to hand and to ensure Maddy achieves the justice she deserves.

bobbin

Posts : 2030
Reputation : 119
Join date : 2011-12-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by happychick on 25.06.13 13:28

@PeterMac wrote:The one "Devil's Advocate" debate which is urgently needed, is a full description of how any abduction might have been completed within the time allowed.
This is the one thing that has been missing right from the start, or more accurately from the next morning when it was shown that the shutters / windows / curtains / doors stories were just that.
No one, pro-TM, or pro-justice for MBM has managed to come up with a convincing scenario.  (Or for that matter any scenario !)
TM themselves painted themselves into a corner when they admitted in the blog that the shutter / windows etc was a "red herring", and CM said that they were convinced no one came in that way.
This is the problem that haunts everyone.  Grange included, I would bet.
Where is the point of entry ?
Where is the point of exit ?
Where is the time needed to sedate three children in silence and in the dark ?
Where is the time needed to pick up a sedated child, turn it round, and exit ?
Where is the forensic evidence of any intruder, anywhere, ever ?

I would love to debate with a Devil's Advocate who can draw up something credible.
And, yes, this is a genuine invitation.

PeterMac, may I ask that you start a new thread with this invitation because some people may not see it in this Blacksmith thread.

____________________


happychick

Posts : 394
Reputation : 34
Join date : 2011-06-14

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Kepharel on 25.06.13 14:00

I was just suggesting that this thread has now run its natural course and I have been left with the following challenge from PeterMac.
 
‘Provide a convincing scenario that supports a theory that it was not impossible for an abduction to have taken place’

In doing so I will putting forward a point of view that is the antithesis of what I really believe. We all know what happened really, but the week will allow me to put forward some explanation that supports this hypothesis. It won't be my prerogative to convince you that what I say is true, merely that it is possible that the overwhelming evidence against can be reconciled to more than one scenario.  So in that respect your understanding of the case will not be advanced in any way...sorry :/.... Wish me luck, I’ll need all of it J J
 
 

Hope this helps.

Kepharel

Posts : 130
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-01-29

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by aquila on 25.06.13 14:04

This thread hasn't run its 'natural course' imo and is open to continue the topic of Blacksmith.

aquila

Posts : 7953
Reputation : 1174
Join date : 2011-09-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Juulcy on 25.06.13 15:29

I have a neighbour who sometimes greets me, sometimes not, depending on her mood. I get the same hot/cold feeling with Blacksmith bureau. Either it is more than one person, or it is one person with moodswings. I made up my own mind a while ago about Blacksmith's opinions. The latest Blacksmith posts are better, but like my neighbour, they might just change their tune again.

Juulcy

Posts : 151
Reputation : 17
Join date : 2011-07-04
Location : Netherlands

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Guest on 25.06.13 16:27

Blacksmith wrote:And the parents? In the hypothetical event that they are found to have been involved in some way then celebration would be the very last thing on my mind. How could one celebrate such a thing?

No-one. Absolutely nobody, whatever happens, has any reason to celebrate anything to do with this case. Someone has a very twisted view of the world if they think there is any cause for celebration in any of this.

Just to clarify - Blacksmith's quote reads to me that someone somewhere has suggested that we would celebrate the McCann's downfall.


Blacksmith wrote:I rather dread the way the mob, led without shame by our charming media, will turn on them once it's safe to do so.

The very same mob who handed over their pensions and spent their holidays looking for an angelic blonde haired toddler? The same mob who wept for an innocent child they thought had been abducted? If the McCanns had gone straight to the police and told the truth, there would be no mob. The mob was created by the McCanns and when the mob learns the truth, it will have every right to be angry.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by DIBarlow on 25.06.13 17:33


DIBarlow

Posts : 95
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-10-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by PeterMac on 25.06.13 19:22

That is good.
Here it is.
When is a justice system corrupt and untruthful?
When it makes  the McCanns arguidos

When is a justice system honest and brave?
When it makes Amaral an arguido

What do you say when you read Kate's book?
So true

What do you say when you read the Lisbon judgement?
All rubbish

How do you react when the PJ say "we never do deals"?
With disgust at their lies

What do you feel when Kate says  "they offered a deal"?
Righteous outrage

What do you say when Amaral admits mistakes in Panorama?
Yah boo

What do you say when Kate admits lying in Madeleine?
Absolutely nothing

What's the translation of an arguido?
If his name's Amaral, "a filthy criminal" 

And if it's Gerry McCann?
A person of interest, my lord

Who is Cipriano?
A martyr falsely imprisoned

And Amaral?
A martinet who should be in prison

Hewitt?
Obviously a child killer

How do you know?
Just look at him

What's a Portuguese neglect law?
Common sense

And a Portuguese secrecy law?
Optional

Did prosecutor Menezes describe Kate McCann as innocent in a legal document?
Absolutely

Did he describe the Tapas 9 as "lying" when he was in the witness box?
We don't remember

How many paragraphs in an archiving summary?
Lots and lots

How many do you ever quote?
Just one.

____________________


PeterMac
Researcher

Posts : 10170
Reputation : 143
Join date : 2010-12-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Brilliant,hilarious piece from Blacksmith today!

Post by scrants on 26.06.13 12:43

http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/a-guest-writes.html?m=1We've cracked the case that the Bingo-hunters in the Mediterranean left unsolved for six years. Our police and our Crown Prosecution Service  are about to grab the paedos in their speedos!

scrants

Posts : 84
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2011-08-21
Location : London

View user profile

Back to top Go down

scotland yard takes

Post by marconi on 26.06.13 14:57

when finally will Theresa May give her statement?  It is taking longer than the USA preparations for the first Golf war.
 That was very much irritating but Madeleine's case is worse.
I hope Theresa will go further than to tell that the Meting is doing an investigation.
Maybe she is waiting for the school holidays, in order to protect the twins, that they would not be confronted with comments. And probably to protect little children of the Tapas' for the same reason.wowthinking
When do the school holidays start in Rothley, does any of you know i?

marconi

Posts : 1082
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2013-05-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by DIBarlow on 26.06.13 15:18

@scrants wrote:http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/a-guest-writes.html?m=1We've cracked the case that the Bingo-hunters in the Mediterranean left unsolved for six years. Our police and our Crown Prosecution Service  are about to grab the paedos in their speedos!
http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/cps-suspect-identified.html

Blacksmith at it again.

Also he(they?) picks up on the spelling of Hewitt?

Clues or hogwash?

And who's the hunchback?

DIBarlow

Posts : 95
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-10-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Newintown on 26.06.13 15:21

@marconi wrote:when finally will Theresa May give her statement?  It is taking longer than the USA preparations for the first Golf war.
 That was very much irritating but Madeleine's case is worse.
I hope Theresa will go further than to tell that the Meting is doing an investigation.
[b]Maybe she is waiting for the school holidays, in order to protect the twins, that they would not be confronted with comments. And probably to protect little children of the Tapas' for the same reason.:[/b]wow:thinking
When do the school holidays start in Rothley, does any of you know i?

That's a very good point you've made there, not one I would have ever of thought of.

I did a search and Rothley primary school summer holidays start 13th July and end on 28th August.  I don't know if that is the right school, although all schools in one area seem to keep to the same holiday dates.

But of course what we're thinking is going on with CPS and SY may not be happening at all, so what we're actually speculating on could all be a waste of time, we will just have to wait and see.

ETA: My English teacher at school always drummed into us not to use the word "but", "and" and many other words to start a sentence but as she's probably long gone and won't know, I'm being naughty.  smilie

____________________
Laurie Levenson, Quoted in the Guardian ........

"Never trust an eyewitness whose memory gets better over time"


Newintown

Posts : 1597
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2011-07-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Cristobell on 26.06.13 15:25

@scrants wrote:http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/a-guest-writes.html?m=1We've cracked the case that the Bingo-hunters in the Mediterranean left unsolved for six years. Our police and our Crown Prosecution Service  are about to grab the paedos in their speedos!
Brilliant!  And true, the trolls have nothing, so they are upping the personal abuse on twitter.  The hate sites have slowed right down, although I did read a bizarre rebuttal to a previous blog by Blacksmith, apparently there was no danger to Madeleine in Scotland Yard's recent news, because she is living safely within a nice family environment, ergo no risk.  

I have also read a few references to bungling Portuguese being exposed and Goncalo Amaral being arrested. There is a psychopath on twitter who believes Goncalo was the abductor!  Have to agree with Blacksmith, the silence is deafening.

Cristobell

Posts : 2436
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2011-10-12

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by marconi on 26.06.13 16:01

@Newintown wrote:
@marconi wrote:when finally will Theresa May give her statement?  It is taking longer than the USA preparations for the first Golf war.
 That was very much irritating but Madeleine's case is worse.
I hope Theresa will go further than to tell that the Meting is doing an investigation.
[b]Maybe she is waiting for the school holidays, in order to protect the twins, that they would not be confronted with comments. And probably to protect little children of the Tapas' for the same reason.:[/b]wow:thinking
When do the school holidays start in Rothley, does any of you know i?

That's a very good point you've made there, not one I would have ever of thought of.

I did a search and Rothley primary school summer holidays start 13th July and end on 28th August.  I don't know if that is the right school though, although all schools in one area seem to keep to the same holiday dates.

thank you!  July the 13th? in that case Mrs. May is waiting for Mrs. Fenn's resurection.

marconi

Posts : 1082
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2013-05-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Newintown on 26.06.13 16:15

@marconi wrote:
@Newintown wrote:
@marconi wrote:when finally will Theresa May give her statement?  It is taking longer than the USA preparations for the first Golf war.
 That was very much irritating but Madeleine's case is worse.
I hope Theresa will go further than to tell that the Meting is doing an investigation.
[b]Maybe she is waiting for the school holidays, in order to protect the twins, that they would not be confronted with comments. And probably to protect little children of the Tapas' for the same reason.:[/b]wow:thinking
When do the school holidays start in Rothley, does any of you know i?

That's a very good point you've made there, not one I would have ever of thought of.

I did a search and Rothley primary school summer holidays start 13th July and end on 28th August.  I don't know if that is the right school though, although all schools in one area seem to keep to the same holiday dates.

thank you!  July the 13th? in that case Mrs. May is waiting for Mrs. Fenn's resurection.

All I can say is that if the McCanns are found responsible for the disappearance of Madeleine they have opened a can of worms that affects everyone around them. In trying to protect their own backsides they've ruined and touched the lives of many, many people. Not just family, but friends, neighbours, work colleagues, the staff at the school Madeleine was supposed to start at, the Mark Warner staff, the residents of PDL, the list is endless.

____________________
Laurie Levenson, Quoted in the Guardian ........

"Never trust an eyewitness whose memory gets better over time"


Newintown

Posts : 1597
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2011-07-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by marconi on 26.06.13 16:54

A lawyer explained me today that if every police wait for children's holidays, suspects can be only arrested a couple of times per year.
Arresting suspects has nothing to do with their eventual children. A crime is a crime and the perpetrators have to be caught.
"There must be another reason why Mrs. May still didn't made her statement yet"  he said.

marconi

Posts : 1082
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2013-05-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by aquila on 26.06.13 16:58

@marconi and Newintown

What have your posts got to do with this topic? This topic is entitled Blacksmith.

aquila

Posts : 7953
Reputation : 1174
Join date : 2011-09-03

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Blacksmith

Post by Newintown on 26.06.13 17:01

@aquila wrote:@marconi and Newintown

What have your posts got to do with this topic? This topic is entitled Blacksmith.

Are you part of admin? They haven't complained so far.

We were just carrying on from discussions posted. Sorry to have upset you, what's it's got to do with you anyway if you're not admin?

____________________
Laurie Levenson, Quoted in the Guardian ........

"Never trust an eyewitness whose memory gets better over time"


Newintown

Posts : 1597
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2011-07-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 5 of 10 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum