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Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Guest on 15.03.13 12:42

Did this cleaning company employ a Victoria Beckham lookalike or a gang of Romanian gypsies? Did they perhaps employ Gerry's long-lost twin, with matching beige buttoned trousers, like the man the Smiths saw? Did they have a dead body that they would drag round the apartments they stole children from, as a kind of "red herring" for sniffer dogs? Sorry, I find it difficult to put all these convincing 'leads' together to form one coherent narrative.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by HiDeHo on 15.03.13 12:52

Could it have anything to do with this apartment building referred to in an interview with Goncalo Amaral?

GA: The corpse couldn’t have remained there all the time. It’s impossible.

JP: So where was it taken next?

GA: If we take into account that, if we consider the traces that were found in the car boot…

JP: … which are in fact…

GA: … which are in fact from the little girl. In order to justify that bodily fluid as the lab says, it could only have been preserved and conserved in the cold because otherwise it would have been…

JP: That means that…

GA: … in an advanced state of decomposition, at least it’s a hypothesis. Therefore it’s a question of a deep freezer, or something similar, and there we had to search for it and that was what we were doing. This means, the contacts that they had, where they went, where they were seen… There are people who say that they were seen entering an apartment block near the cemetery in Praia da Luz. At that point in time we weren’t able to detect which apartment they entered, who lived there, because it’s also a bit complicated because you have to understand it’s a tourist area and often it’s not known who the apartment belongs to.


http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Goncalo-Amaral/Interview-Comments-1-801692.html

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Cheshire Cat on 15.03.13 13:15

@HiDeHo wrote:Could it have anything to do with this apartment building referred to in an interview with Goncalo Amaral?

GA: The corpse couldn’t have remained there all the time. It’s impossible.

JP: So where was it taken next?

GA: If we take into account that, if we consider the traces that were found in the car boot…

JP: … which are in fact…

GA: … which are in fact from the little girl. In order to justify that bodily fluid as the lab says, it could only have been preserved and conserved in the cold because otherwise it would have been…

JP: That means that…

GA: … in an advanced state of decomposition, at least it’s a hypothesis. Therefore it’s a question of a deep freezer, or something similar, and there we had to search for it and that was what we were doing. This means, the contacts that they had, where they went, where they were seen… There are people who say that they were seen entering an apartment block near the cemetery in Praia da Luz. At that point in time we weren’t able to detect which apartment they entered, who lived there, because it’s also a bit complicated because you have to understand it’s a tourist area and often it’s not known who the apartment belongs to.


[url=http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Goncalo-Amaral/Interview-Comments-1-801692.html
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Goncalo-Amaral/Interview-Comments-1-801692.html[/quote[/url]]

Something to bear in mind, perhaps, is that Gerry McCann and Rupert Murdoch are now positioned as polar opposites within the context of the Levenson proposals. This 'cleaner' story was first put out by the Sun (as far as I can see).

There is a vote on Monday in the Commons. Murdoch does not want to be shackled by regulation backed by statute which is what McCann is actively pushing for.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by worriedmum on 15.03.13 13:32

WHY are they looking for these cleaners, though? Is it because they cleaned somewhere of interest to the police?

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by bobbin on 15.03.13 13:47

@Cheshire Cat wrote:
@HiDeHo wrote:Could it have anything to do with this apartment building referred to in an interview with Goncalo Amaral?

GA: The corpse couldn’t have remained there all the time. It’s impossible.

JP: So where was it taken next?

GA: If we take into account that, if we consider the traces that were found in the car boot…

JP: … which are in fact…

GA: … which are in fact from the little girl. In order to justify that bodily fluid as the lab says, it could only have been preserved and conserved in the cold because otherwise it would have been…

JP: That means that…

GA: … in an advanced state of decomposition, at least it’s a hypothesis. Therefore it’s a question of a deep freezer, or something similar, and there we had to search for it and that was what we were doing. This means, the contacts that they had, where they went, where they were seen… There are people who say that they were seen entering an apartment block near the cemetery in Praia da Luz. At that point in time we weren’t able to detect which apartment they entered, who lived there, because it’s also a bit complicated because you have to understand it’s a tourist area and often it’s not known who the apartment belongs to.


[url=http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Goncalo-Amaral/Interview-Comments-1-801692.html
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Goncalo-Amaral/Interview-Comments-1-801692.html[/quote[/url]]

Something to bear in mind, perhaps, is that Gerry McCann and Rupert Murdoch are now positioned as polar opposites within the context of the Levenson proposals. This 'cleaner' story was first put out by the Sun (as far as I can see).

There is a vote on Monday in the Commons. Murdoch does not want to be shackled by regulation backed by statute which is what McCann is actively pushing for.

A DEEP CLEANING BRITISH TEAM ?, now that's a thought. We knew some deep cleaning had to have been done, since no sign of Maddie's DNA was found (except for the blood which had been bleached) and, with Katie being so inept in everything else, like the way she didn't look after her children, getting 6 dead bodies on her trousers, (by the way 'thanks Aunty Phil...we luv u 2') washing curtains, Maddie's Tea stain, pink puss, BUT somehow not her own slacks, it would be a surprise if she could run a truly professional clean up.
And has anyone noticed how 'legislation to gag all but the McCanns' is now the McCanns (alone the flag carriers in a supposed crusade for the other hand-full of whingeing z list celebs) versus the Prime Minister of the UK for statutory control of the press.
Newspapers are putting McCanns in the pictures, quoting their requirements, stating their aims, why the whingeing self-pitying victims (no they caused this all to rain down on themselves) are demanding that the laws of the land be changed for All, to suit their needs, namely to keep the lid on some pot which is so about to explode.
Ooooh, Gerry, I do hope Cameron keeps his metal and takes notice of who you really are.
He might just be pushed enough now to go back to Operation Grange and say, No, scrap the original 'whitewash deal', now I want the full truth out there, let this couple understand what freedom of speech really means.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Trainer on 15.03.13 13:59

The mirror are taking comments but wooshed mine for mentioning the uk police dogs

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by sallypelt on 15.03.13 14:03

[quote="bobbin"][quote="Cheshire Cat"][quote="HiDeHo"]Could it have anything to do with this apartment building referred to in an interview with Goncalo Amaral?


A DEEP CLEANING BRITISH TEAM ?, now that's a thought. We knew some deep cleaning had to have been done, since no sign of Maddie's DNA was found (except for the blood which had been bleached) and, with Katie being so inept in everything else, like the way she didn't look after her children, getting 6 dead bodies on her trousers, (by the way 'thanks Aunty Phil...we luv u 2') washing curtains, Maddie's Tea stain, pink puss, BUT somehow not her own slacks, it would be a surprise if she could run a truly professional clean up.
OMG, I am crying at "pink puss"

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by jeanmonroe on 15.03.13 14:09

Jean wrote:That's the way I read it too.

I've never heard of these two "journalists" before.

http://journalisted.com/dan-sales?allarticles=yes

http://journalisted.com/jack-royston?allarticles=yes

This seems to be their first venture into the McCann fairy tale and what a wonderful effort it is!


BBC ‘used licence cash to gag Jimmy Savile victim'

By JACK (SNIFFER) ROYSTON
Published: 04th March 2013

Pity he didn't have the balls to write:

MCSCAMS ' USED PUBLICLY DONATED MADELEINE FUND CASH TO GAG TONY BENNETT '

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Nina on 15.03.13 14:40

Robert Murat may know who this cleaning team are, as he was in the property buying and letting business at that time.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by aiyoyo on 15.03.13 14:48

Questions:

If OP Grange is investigating this "new" line of enquiry, who leaks it to the Press?

Cleaners do not come to clean in the night. Also usually one cleaner turns up for the job, not six collectively to do one small apt.

One would have thought the MET would have the basic common sense to ask the owner, Ruth Mccann, whether she hires "Brits" cleaners, and was cleaning done during the mccanns' occupation of the apt. It would be much quicker and more discreet.

If cleaners other than those hired by Resort had cleaned Mccanns' Apt, especially if they were Brits surely mccanns couldn't have failed to notice that, so surely one would have thought they would mention that to the Police, for obvious reason cleaners usually hold key to the apt, hence access to the apt. Then there is no need for their open-sesame-door tale.

If (big IF) Op Grange is behind this enquiry it could mean they are onto something.
IMO it will not be about whether those Brits cleaned 5A, rather the Police would be interested in the list of apts covered by the Brit cleaners, and of particular interest would be anything unusual as in unusual stench or whatever noticed by the cleaners.

The blue bag in a fridge theory has yet to be solved so they may be trying to establish which apt Mccanns went into with a blue bag for a fridge.

All just my opinion of course.









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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Cristobell on 15.03.13 15:48

I am actually wondering if this story is true? Can't quite pin down if this is current news or not though. If it is current, that is, SY are in PDL making enquiries, it is of course within the realms of possibility that it is a factual media story. If locals were being question, the news would spread. If SY are questioning locals, it is unlikely they would sticking to one line of enquiry alone, Ie. white van, 6 British cleaners, it could just be the 'line of enquiry' picked up by the media, for whatever reason. The newsdesks will be looking for 'a line' to take, a slant, as it were. They may even be working with the police, in order to avoid tipping off those involved in other lines of enquiry. I think the reporting of this news item on ITV, then withdrawn on ITV+1 'due to legal reasons' is significant, and I haven't seen it broadcast on any other channels. Oooer.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by plebgate on 15.03.13 16:45

as someone else posted earlier - the cops sent a letter to residents. this man then rang them and the cops asked him 4 times about the cleaners.

Doesn't sound as if the cops are urgently following this lead if they first wrote letters asking apartment owners to contact them about the possibility of 6 british cleaners in a white van. I agree with the other poster if it was that urgent they would have officers doing door to door enquiries.

These stories are getting very dreary aren't they. Who said about distraction tactics in an earlier post? I think they could be right.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Pershing36 on 15.03.13 16:49

@Trainer wrote:The mirror are taking comments but wooshed mine for mentioning the uk police dogs

Correction, The Mirror are taking pro-McCann comments. thumbsup

Anyway, so are they telling us there are 6 British people cleaning with access to peoples homes etc, but nobody knew who they were?

What is it with this resort and the places around it that they have to bring in people from another country to work? Yet when push comes to shove nobody seems to know anything about their backgrounds etc.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by mydadsanastronaut on 15.03.13 17:13

[quote="Pershing36"]
@Trainer wrote:The mirror are taking comments but wooshed mine for mentioning the uk police dogs

Correction, The Mirror are taking pro-McCann comments. thumbsup

Anyway, so are they telling us there are 6 British people cleaning with access to peoples homes etc, but nobody knew who they were?

What is it with this resort and the places around it that they have to bring in people from another country to work? Yet when push comes to shove nobody seems to know anything about their backgrounds etc.

IMO it is precisely the fact that such people have unknown backgrounds is what allows such speculative, vague stories to be placed in the media. It backfired in New Zealand because the people concerned were quickly traced and publically eliminated from the enquiry. Therefore, once again, the stories concern people who it will be almost impossible to track down, as I don't think they really want these people to be traced.

These marvels of spin serve as the curtains of distraction whilst the scenery is changed on stage and we move inevitably on to the next stage in the work of dramatic fiction.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Mrs Beeton on 15.03.13 17:30

@aiyoyo wrote:Questions:

If OP Grange is investigating this "new" line of enquiry, who leaks it to the Press?

Cleaners do not come to clean in the night. Also usually one cleaner turns up for the job, not six collectively to do one small apt.

One would have thought the MET would have the basic common sense to ask the owner, Ruth Mccann, whether she hires "Brits" cleaners, and was cleaning done during the mccanns' occupation of the apt. It would be much quicker and more discreet.

If cleaners other than those hired by Resort had cleaned Mccanns' Apt, especially if they were Brits surely mccanns couldn't have failed to notice that, so surely one would have thought they would mention that to the Police, for obvious reason cleaners usually hold key to the apt, hence access to the apt. Then there is no need for their open-sesame-door tale.

If (big IF) Op Grange is behind this enquiry it could mean they are onto something.
IMO it will not be about whether those Brits cleaned 5A, rather the Police would be interested in the list of apts covered by the Brit cleaners, and of particular interest would be anything unusual as in unusual stench or whatever noticed by the cleaners.

The blue bag in a fridge theory has yet to be solved so they may be trying to establish which apt Mccanns went into with a blue bag for a fridge.

All just my opinion of course.



Could this be that something to do with that famous , oft-quoted 'key piece of information' that GM was so keen on getting hold of?

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by sharonl on 15.03.13 18:00

I take it that this is a different white van?

http://goncaloamaraltruthofthelie.blogspot.co.uk/2009/06/chapter-5.html

Tuesday March 8th, 5pm, Vila da LuzThe white van seen near the Ocean Club, driven by an individual who looked like a tramp, ends up being identified. It belongs to a British music teacher, aged 56, who is spending his holiday playing the guitar and collecting money on the beach or in the streets of Vila da Luz. It's certainly him that Gerald McCann passed on the promenade on the day he bought an ice cream for Madeleine. It's also he who was seen near apartment 5A in the vehicle that serves him as living space. The follow-up investigation totally rules him out.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by rainbow-fairy on 15.03.13 18:21

Well first I knew about this, having not been able to get online, was peering at the newspapers in Tesco (jd, stop your sniggering! laughat)

Between this, and Mr Stinky Trousers, I did have a little giggle through sheer frustration BUT no more.
It WOULD be hilarious if innocent children weren't dead Sad

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Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Lance De Boils on 15.03.13 18:26

"They were very interested in who’d have access to those apartments."
I read that to mean, "they were very interested in who had keys to 5A."

So they must have come to the conclusion that nobody forcibly broke in, through "jemmied shutters," or otherwise. big grin

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by rainbow-fairy on 15.03.13 19:16

@Lance De Boils wrote:"They were very interested in who’d have access to those apartments."
I read that to mean, "they were very interested in who had keys to 5A."

So they must have come to the conclusion that nobody forcibly broke in, through "jemmied shutters," or otherwise. big grin

Well, to be fair, the 'jemmied shutters' has already been retracted by Pinky (feel free to 'clarrify' if that is wrong), forensics found no sign of forcible entry. Why would there need to be, seeing as Katey reminds us 'they' were watching the apt so would KNOW they left the apt unlocked (ah-hem).

We already know 2 people at least who had keys to 5A...

Even an amoeba could work out there was no forced entry.

Since 2007 our intelligence has been insulted over and over and I for one am sick and tired of this same old s**t (you can tell by the language)
Only consolation is that more and more people are waking up to the nonsense.

The ultimate insult though is to a not-yet-four-year-old girl who at the very least was lost through her parents sheer negligence if not worse. SHE is the victim, NOT them.

I totally agree with PeterMac on page 1 -
Don't look over here, look over there.....

What is going on? I'm split between the libel trial, and the upcoming judgement in the Leonor Cipriano trial conclusion soon imminent...

One more thing - the 'gypsy' nonsense is getting really tiresome now. What does a 'gypsy' look like exactly??? Not the way the papers would have you believe that is for sure.

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Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Beanie on 15.03.13 19:24

I for one moment do not believe Met Police released this information regarding the cleaners and the white van.

Thinking outside the box.

We know, according to the pj files, Ocean Club cleaners were employed to clean 5a.

What if the McCanns and their friends used outside cleaners to completely clean the apartment and destroy the evidence. Perhaps it is the McCanns putting this information into msm because they know the police are looking into these English cleaners with a white van and want to know just what their cleaning duties were!

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by tigger on 15.03.13 19:28

@Beanie wrote:I for one moment do not believe Met Police released this information regarding the cleaners and the white van.

Thinking outside the box.

We know, according to the pj files, Ocean Club cleaners were employed to clean 5a.

What if the McCanns and their friends used outside cleaners to completely clean the apartment and destroy the evidence. Perhaps it is the McCanns putting this information into msm because they know the police are looking into these English cleaners with a white van and want to know just what their cleaning duties were!

I have a theory that these cleaners were the T7/9 themselves, hard-up doctors who could only have a holiday if they worked for it. winkwink
(I've just PM'd you)

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by Beanie on 15.03.13 19:47

@tigger wrote:
@Beanie wrote:I for one moment do not believe Met Police released this information regarding the cleaners and the white van.

Thinking outside the box.

We know, according to the pj files, Ocean Club cleaners were employed to clean 5a.

What if the McCanns and their friends used outside cleaners to completely clean the apartment and destroy the evidence. Perhaps it is the McCanns putting this information into msm because they know the police are looking into these English cleaners with a white van and want to know just what their cleaning duties were!


I have a theory that these cleaners were the T7/9 themselves, hard-up doctors who could only have a holiday if they worked for it. winkwink
(I've just PM'd you)

You are very probably right tigger, thanks for the pm roses

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by PeterMac on 15.03.13 22:16


This was an important moment in her life and it would be expected, even for the numerous times she has been asked the same questions, that she had kept it in her memory" argued the Public Ministry prosecutor, concluding that Leonor "insists on lying" and that she should be condemned to a jail sentence [for those lies].

The defence attorney alleged that Leonor Cipriano "has difficulties in explaining herself", which, allied to a situation "in which the discernment wasn't the best", explains the contradictions.

The sentence was scheduled for the 14th of March


Oh ! And there's a stupid story in the Sun. What a coincidence.

Incidentally, the defence attorney's remarks about LC being really thick, and really stupid and unable to formulate her ideas, and that THEREFORE her contradictions must be understood and ignored, - - -
- has just mucked up any possible defence anyone else in any other case involving any persons close to the instant one - might have had.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by bobbin on 15.03.13 22:26

Just musing, as you do. If the 'cleaning' article wasn't leaked by the Met, and if the McCs didn't put it out there, was it the Sun that put this article out for its own reasons.
Murdoch is about to have his freedoms terminated by Gerry McCann.
Now in the past, the Stun and Gerry have been close mates, playing a pretend game of 'I'll give you a story (but pretend it didn't come from me, pink-rinse and the missus)' and you can print it and make 'loads a money' selling our whingeing faces.
Now how much does the Stun/Murdoch know about the real facts of the case. Even if he hasn't actually been confided in, Murdoch is enough of a con-artist 'man on the street' to be able to guess that Gerry is not telling the whole truth about his innocent fairy tale abduction.
Since Gerry is putting Murdoch's empire at risk, could this article stem from the Stun as a little 'cannon on the broad-side' reminder that more can be let out than Gerry might like, so 'button it' 'back off with the pushing for legislation'. a white van with British cleaners, deep cleaning was done at some time, that is for certain....one muses.

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Re: Maddie: Hunt for 6 Brit Cleaners - The Sun 15/03/13

Post by PeterMac on 15.03.13 22:31

One of my Sun posts has been allowed. The second one, about the dogs findings, has been "whooshed'. They clearly do not like this evidence introduced.

So the question is, "Is there a super-injuction about the dogs' findings" ?
I think we need to test it, with carefully worded posts on the comments pages of any paper which bothers or dares to report, and see what happens.

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