The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Hi!

A very warm welcome to The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™ forum.

Please log in, or register to view all the forums, then settle in and help us get to the truth about what really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann.


Jill Havern
Forum owner

Not a f...... penny form me

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Guest on 21.02.13 22:11

Dear hearts,

You all know how I feel for you.

These past few hours, after the highly commendable and completely just decision of Judge T, some of you have started a fund to help TB pay the McCs costs.

Stop this nonsense!!!

I, a little pipsqueek from the Continent have this to say:

IF you raise a fund,
and if I were CR,

would I not consider the fund you raised a deciding factor in my negotiations with TB, upping my ante, and causing me to demand much MORE of him, in the full knowledge that you, his stout supporters, will contribute as the McCs supporters are undoubtedly contributing to them?

That, my dears, is what I (CR) would convey to the deciding Judge.

Consider that.

Also: please refrain from any ill considered acts of mercy with legal consequences, before taking legal advice.

This case is not about charity or emotions; it is about some peoples very existence.

Have you not grabbed that yet?

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by bobbin on 21.02.13 22:17

@Portia wrote:Dear hearts,

You all know how I feel for you.

These past few hours, after the highly commendable and completely just decision of Judge T, some of you have started a fund to help TB pay the McCs costs.

Stop this nonsense!!!

I, a little pipsqueek from the Continent have this to say:

IF you raise a fund,
and if I were CR,

would I not consider the fund you raised a deciding factor in my negotiations with TB, upping my ante, and causing me to demand much MORE of him, in the full knowledge that you, his stout supporters, will contribute as the McCs supporters are undoubtedly contributing to them?

That, my dears, is what I (CR) would convey to the deciding Judge.

Consider that.

Also: please refrain from any ill considered acts of mercy with legal consequences, before taking legal advice.

This case is not about charity or emotions; it is about some peoples very existence.

Have you not grabbed that yet?
Portia, I do agree with you, that was my first thought.
If the judge is setting the costs, will he be persuaded to vary those according to pressure from CR.
Equally, if Tony finds them unable to be agreed, will he then feel obliged to continue with his lifting of the stay and it follow on to a libel case.

bobbin

Posts : 2030
Reputation : 125
Join date : 2011-12-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by puzzled on 21.02.13 22:20

I don't know that much about the law, but I suspect this is sound advice. Let's wait until we find out what costs Tony is facing, before we chip in.

____________________
...how did you feel the last time you squashed a bug? -psychopathic criminal, quoted in Robert Hare, Without Conscience

puzzled

Posts : 177
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2011-06-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Inspectorfrost on 21.02.13 22:22

fair comment

Inspectorfrost

Posts : 841
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2012-12-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Ribisl on 21.02.13 22:25

Totally agree with you, Portia. Couldn't have expressed it better. tongue

____________________
There is a taint of death, a flavour of mortality in lies... Heart of Darkness by Joseph Conrad

Ribisl

Posts : 807
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-02-04

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Guest on 21.02.13 23:10

Yes, I agree; it's a very well-meaning gesture (a lot more than you can say about anything that Team McCann has ever done) but I feel that we need to wait and see what develops.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by russiandoll on 21.02.13 23:44

you need to remove this fund appeal from the front page of the site imo, good intentions might be making TB's situation even more difficult financially.....please reconsider and wait to see what the costs are before suggesting donations.

____________________



             The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie — deliberate,
contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
unrealistic.
~John F. Kennedy


russiandoll

Posts : 3942
Reputation : 7
Join date : 2011-09-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by wilbeth on 21.02.13 23:53

you need to remove this fund appeal from the front page of the site imo, good intentions might be making TB's situation even more difficult financially.....please reconsider and wait to see what the costs are before suggesting donations.

I totally agree, better to be safe than sorry. Thank you Portia for bringing it to our attention - it's so easy to get carried away without thinking.

wilbeth

Posts : 21
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-02-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by saltnpepper on 22.02.13 0:25

I thought a judge decides costs?either way sound advice untill we know what's what

saltnpepper

Posts : 154
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2012-04-30
Location : wales

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Nina on 22.02.13 6:31

The fund has been going for some time, it is not a sudden knee jerk reaction to the Judge's decision. But I agree with Portia, we mustn't do anything to endanger Tony's or GA's well being.

____________________
Not one more cent from me.

Nina

Posts : 2657
Reputation : 223
Join date : 2011-06-16

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by tigger on 22.02.13 6:37

Jean wrote:Yes, I agree; it's a very well-meaning gesture (a lot more than you can say about anything that Team McCann has ever done) but I feel that we need to wait and see what develops.

agreed roses
No doubt the cost judge has done this sort of thing before. We're in unknown territory.

____________________
Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate.

tigger

Posts : 8112
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Truthmustout on 22.02.13 8:09

I trust the owner of this site and the ppl that have been working closely with TB over this years that they know what they are doing and that they would not do it if it could harm them in any way.
It's not cr that decide the cost , it's the judge.

Beside CR or the judge can't take the organization the money are donated to into consideration when setting the cost. As they belong to the organization and not TB directly.

Without the help he defently will suffer a lot more financially damage than without it.
Is not like CR would ask for small penny's anyway if a fund did not exist.

IMHO I think those who want to help should do so without being scared away by the thoughts of harming them even more by helping.

I guess it comes down to who you trust, a poster on this forum or the ppl actually standing behind and beside TB and madeleine all this years.....

____________________
The tide is turning - justice is coming ! Freedom of speech for all !

Truthmustout

Posts : 128
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-02-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by russiandoll on 22.02.13 9:18

Moa -vanilla : while I was rather puzzled at the title of this thread, I have to disagree with you about this. As far as I can judge it, there may be harm done from jumpng in feet- first with donations, whereas waiting will not be harmful to TB. There will be a deadline for payment of costs, time for donations to be made I would think.

____________________



             The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie — deliberate,
contrived and dishonest — but the myth — persistent, persuasive and
unrealistic.
~John F. Kennedy


russiandoll

Posts : 3942
Reputation : 7
Join date : 2011-09-11

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Truthmustout on 22.02.13 9:41

Maybe maybe not , to me it becomes a trust issue as I don't have the law expertise . And I think that if what said here is true, I don't think the forum owner or the person that know and has worked with TB all this year would put the link up. I'm sure they know what they are doing. And I'm sure they would not do anything to put either in any harm of more trouble. I'm sure they have thought this threw in every way possible and that they have the knowledge that I don't have.

We have to agree to disagree ...

____________________
The tide is turning - justice is coming ! Freedom of speech for all !

Truthmustout

Posts : 128
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-02-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Woofer on 22.02.13 9:50

Moa-Vanilla wrote:Maybe maybe not , to me it becomes a trust issue as I don't have the law expertise . And I think that if what said here is true, I don't think the forum owner or the person that know and has worked with TB all this year would put the link up. I'm sure they know what they are doing. And I'm sure they would not do anything to put either in any harm of more trouble. I'm sure they have thought this threw in every way possible and that they have the knowledge that I don't have.

We have to agree to disagree ...

I`m in sync with Moa here. Trust the forum owner. COLD was set up ages ago and isn`t a knee-jerk reaction. The money does not belong to Tony.

Woofer

Posts : 3390
Reputation : 12
Join date : 2012-02-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by bobbin on 22.02.13 10:12

The question of putting funds in is a bit complex.
If the judge is working independently of CR and McCs, then the price will be set according to court rules.
If CR and McCs have an influence on the level of charges set, then if they believe there is a fund, they may be tempted to force the costs up.
There is a risk here though.
Tony has been lucky to avoid prison and having his house seized. He has a VERY small sum of money which should be there for his retirement.
Now if I understand the position the judge has left an open possibility for Tony to request to lift the stay, and this could open then the course for a full libel court case.
Equally, Carter Ruck and the McCs have been lucky and because Tony is tired, are in a position at the moment to come to an agreement with Tony, to not lift the stay and go on to a full libel case.
If it were me, and if I were faced with a bill that was in my mind too swingeing, and if I could not in principle agree to being robbed blind, then I would say, right, no agreement, we'll have to continue with the lifting of the stay which opens the prospects of a full libel case ensuing.
Tony has been lucky, but CR and McCs are also possibly going to be lucky if they can avoid what they don't want which is a full libel and questionning trial.
A compromise means appeasing both sides sufficiently or there could be the risk of entrenched positions being taken. JIMO

bobbin

Posts : 2030
Reputation : 125
Join date : 2011-12-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Woofer on 22.02.13 10:23

Bobbin - I don`t think CR could force the charges up as they have already been stated - it would look a bit dodgy on their part in they started hoiking them up after the event.

Anyway, I`m sure I read in one of Tony`s posts that he may negotiate dropping the application to lift the stay in return for a reduction of costs, one reason I think is that he is totally exhausted.

Woofer

Posts : 3390
Reputation : 12
Join date : 2012-02-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by AskTheDogsSandra on 22.02.13 10:31

@bobbin wrote:Now if I understand the position the judge has left an open possibility for Tony to request to lift the stay, and this could open then the course for a full libel court case.
Equally, Carter Ruck and the McCs have been lucky and because Tony is tired, are in a position at the moment to come to an agreement with Tony, to not lift the stay and go on to a full libel case.
If it were me, and if I were faced with a bill that was in my mind too swingeing, and if I could not in principle agree to being robbed blind, then I would say, right, no agreement, we'll have to continue with the lifting of the stay which opens the prospects of a full libel case ensuing.
Tony has been lucky, but CR and McCs are also possibly going to be lucky if they can avoid what they don't want which is a full libel and questionning trial.
A compromise means appeasing both sides sufficiently or there could be the risk of entrenched positions being taken. JIMO

This is how I see it at the moment, Bobbin. Tony must have done an enormous amount of work on this case and must already be sufficiently prepared for a full libel trial. I can't see how Tony can lose anything more by going to a full libel trial. The McCann's don't want that, of course. I appreciate Tony must be exhausted now but I really think he should go the whole way and get it to a full libel trial. It's the only way, imo, to show the McCann's up for what they really are and for Tony to repair his reputation in the media. It's not like the libel trial would be coming up soon, so maybe it will give Tony time to recover and to regain his strength.

AskTheDogsSandra

Posts : 132
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2011-05-22

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by bobbin on 22.02.13 10:41

@AskTheDogsSandra wrote:
@bobbin wrote:Now if I understand the position the judge has left an open possibility for Tony to request to lift the stay, and this could open then the course for a full libel court case.
Equally, Carter Ruck and the McCs have been lucky and because Tony is tired, are in a position at the moment to come to an agreement with Tony, to not lift the stay and go on to a full libel case.
If it were me, and if I were faced with a bill that was in my mind too swingeing, and if I could not in principle agree to being robbed blind, then I would say, right, no agreement, we'll have to continue with the lifting of the stay which opens the prospects of a full libel case ensuing.
Tony has been lucky, but CR and McCs are also possibly going to be lucky if they can avoid what they don't want which is a full libel and questionning trial.
A compromise means appeasing both sides sufficiently or there could be the risk of entrenched positions being taken. JIMO

This is how I see it at the moment, Bobbin. Tony must have done an enormous amount of work on this case and must already be sufficiently prepared for a full libel trial. I can't see how Tony can lose anything more by going to a full libel trial. The McCann's don't want that, of course. I appreciate Tony must be exhausted now but I really think he should go the whole way and get it to a full libel trial. It's the only way, imo, to show the McCann's up for what they really are and for Tony to repair his reputation in the media. It's not like the libel trial would be coming up soon, so maybe it will give Tony time to recover and to regain his strength.

That is a very astute observation 'AskTheDogsSandra'. yes, given what you have said, the choice of a swingeing financial punishment or appearance in court for a full libel trial, having recovered strength and with the need to repair his own reputation (after all this was the main tenet of the McCs claim, to repair their reputation) it wouldn't really be much of a contest would it.

bobbin

Posts : 2030
Reputation : 125
Join date : 2011-12-05

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Guest on 22.02.13 11:01

Without wanting to push Tony into ANY
direction: he has been sentenced for breaching his undertakings, NOT because
what he’s been theorising is not true or libellous ... A request for changing
or lifting the undertakings is IMO something the judge is willing to consider.
Subsequently the way to a lift of the stay on the libel trial is open. And that’s
a way the claimants don’t want to go. Also, in such scenario, the libel trial
would be AFTER McCann v Amaral in Lisbon. I have very good hopes, that Amaral
will win and would therefore be an excellent witness in Tony’s case in the U.K.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Cheshire Cat on 22.02.13 12:07

What does the title of this thread mean by "Not a F...... Penny form me"?

Cheshire Cat
Madeleine Foundation

Posts : 660
Reputation : 21
Join date : 2010-08-16

View user profile

Back to top Go down

English like wot it is writ

Post by Guest on 22.02.13 12:52

It should of course be "from me" and not "form me".

Portia is saying in her own inimitable way that she will not contribute to a fund to help Tony because of the dangers of any money raised being taken into account by Team McCann when assessing the level of costs.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by Casey5 on 22.02.13 19:18

If Tony Bennett agrees to stop the lifting of the stay in return for a lowering of costs, what then happens to the costs incurred by Carter Ruck on behalf of the McCanns?
I have read that the McCanns will have taken out an insurance - linked with the "no win-no fee" rules but what happens in these circumstances, the McCanns have won so the insurance would not pay out surely - who would bear the costs?
If it's Carter Ruck, how can they exist as a business?
Or have I got it all wrong?

Casey5

Posts : 323
Reputation : 19
Join date : 2013-02-01

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by tigger on 22.02.13 19:25

@Casey5 wrote:If Tony Bennett agrees to stop the lifting of the stay in return for a lowering of costs, what then happens to the costs incurred by Carter Ruck on behalf of the McCanns?
I have read that the McCanns will have taken out an insurance - linked with the "no win-no fee" rules but what happens in these circumstances, the McCanns have won so the insurance would not pay out surely - who would bear the costs?
If it's Carter Ruck, how can they exist as a business?
Or have I got it all wrong?

My theory is that CR mainly employs free work-experience teenagers in this case. A win-win situation. Kevin's learned a lot I think, should pass his A levels with flying colours. winkwink

____________________
Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate.

tigger

Posts : 8112
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2011-07-20

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Not a f...... penny form me

Post by happychick on 22.02.13 19:31

@Casey5 wrote:If Tony Bennett agrees to stop the lifting of the stay in return for a lowering of costs, what then happens to the costs incurred by Carter Ruck on behalf of the McCanns?
I have read that the McCanns will have taken out an insurance - linked with the "no win-no fee" rules but what happens in these circumstances, the McCanns have won so the insurance would not pay out surely - who would bear the costs?
If it's Carter Ruck, how can they exist as a business?
Or have I got it all wrong?

The McCanns have only won this round, surely? There is still some distance to go before they can say they've won the whole thing. There is the varying of the undertakings and the libel trial to go yet before they can say they've won. The McC's won't want the libel trial so I guess they'll bail out before then. Maybe TB will win after all?

____________________


happychick

Posts : 400
Reputation : 36
Join date : 2011-06-14

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum