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Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

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Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Ribisl on 03.02.13 0:24

FROM the Houses of Parliament to the High Court. Lord McAlpine, the Tory grandee, has accused Sally Bercow, the wife of the Commons Speaker, of adopting a “cavalier” attitude after writing an allegedly libellous tweet linking him to false claims of child sex abuse.

The peer believes Bercow, whom he is suing for damages of up to £50,000, sought to “trivialise” the affair and “added insult to injury” in a series of subsequent Twitter postings.

In legal papers obtained by The Sunday Times, McAlpine goes as far as suggesting that the behaviour of Bercow, a Labour supporter, may have been politically motivated.

Last November she wrote on Twitter “Why is Lord McAlpine trending? *innocent face*” after BBC2’s Newsnight programme accused an unnamed leading Conservative politician of sexually abusing boys at a Welsh care home during the time of Margaret Thatcher’s leadership.

The BBC had to make a grovelling apology and paid McAlpine £185,000 in damages after admitting it had made a mistake.

Papers lodged at the High Court reveal that Bercow, 43, did not even watch Newsnight before posting her comments online and had failed to remove the offending tweet more than a month later.

McAlpine’s lawyers have been seeking redress from Twitter users who identified the former Tory party treasurer in relation to the false child sex abuse claims.

In most cases, including that of Alan Davies, the actor and comedian, the 70-year-old peer has accepted an apology. He had hoped to reach an out-of-court settlement with Bercow, but last December he served her with a claim form, saying her tweet had gone “viral”.

Bercow says she has repeatedly apologised but denies her posting was defamatory. She has hired lawyers at Carter-Ruck on a no-win, no-fee basis and is believed to have taken out insurance to cover costs of up to £100,000 should she lose.

The libel battle is expected to go to trial at the High Court in the next few months.

McAlpine’s lawyers refer to Bercow’s “high public and media profile” in the claim form, noting her appearance in 2011 as a contestant on Celebrity Big Brother.

They continue: “The defendant is also politically well connected. She has been a prominent campaigner for the Labour party and is the wife of the Speaker.”

In her defence, Bercow’s team questions “the relevance to this action of her political connections or her campaigning for the Labour party”.

McAlpine is seeking aggravated damages. The writ states: “After the BBC had retracted its allegations and apologised unreservedly, the defendant added insult to injury by her public comments about the tweet. She adopted a cavalier attitude to the damage and distress which she had caused to the claimant and sought to trivialise the allegations she had spread.”

Bercow’s original remark about McAlpine was posted on Twitter on November 4, when she had about 56,000 followers. On November 9, after the peer issued a statement saying he had been defamed, she wrote: “Am TOTAL, irresponsible eejit for mentioning fact that he was trending on my timeline. So sorry.”

On November 15, after McAlpine threatened to sue Twitter users who had named him, Bercow wrote: “*Gulps*.” She added: “I guess I’d better get some legal advice then. Still maintain was not a libellous tweet — just foolish.”

Bercow deactivated her Twitter account on November 19 but then reactivated it nine days later.

However, she did not delete the allegedly libellous tweet until December 13 — almost a week after McAlpine launched his lawsuit. Bercow’s defence states: “It is denied that [the tweet’s] availability until then was capable of causing or aggravating any damage.”

The document adds: “The defendant does not deny that the claimant was distressed or embarrassed by the words complained of; she denies that they were defamatory of him and hence such distress as he suffered is not compensatable at law.”

http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/uk_news/People/article1206921.ece

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Olive_Boyle on 03.02.13 10:57

Right and all. You can't go round accusing people of that without fact. I think anyone with common sense will realise it was a case of mistaken identity now. I think a few people on this site would do well to be careful what they say.

I put accusing someone of being a paedophile when they are not on the same level as actually being one. Sick! And best left to the David Icke forum.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by jd on 03.02.13 11:07

This comment has been attributed to a certain individual ""Spread false accusation & then arrange for it to be exposed as such - so the accuser will forever be treated with suspicion" ........

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by tigger on 03.02.13 11:52

The quote above is from 'The new Machiavelli' I believe. Here is the list of publications/books by Lord McAlpine from Wikipedia:
(I presume posting this will not distress the author since it promotes his work?)

Writing (from Wikipedia:)

Lord McAlpine has written and co-written a number of books. He has also written for periodicals.[3][26] A partial bibliography follows.
The Servant. London: Faber & Faber, 1992. ISBN 9780571173402.[3][27] This work discusses his relationship with Thatcher.[3][6] He later re-released it as part of a compilation called The Ruthless Leader, which also included The Art of War by Sun Tzu and The Prince by Niccolò Machiavelli, along with an introduction.[28]
Letters to a Young Politician - From his uncle. London: Faber & Faber, 1995. ISBN 9780571170579.[29]
Once a Jolly Bagman: Memoirs. London: Weidenfeld & Nicolson, 1997. ISBN 9780297817376.[27][30] Contains numerous critical comments about former associates such as John Major, Edward Heath, and Michael Heseltine.[13]
The New Machiavelli: The art of politics in business. New York; Chichester: John Wiley, 1998. ISBN 9780471350958.[27][31]
Collecting and Display, with Cathy Giangrande. London: Conran Octopus, 1998. ISBN 9781850299561.[27]
The Collector's Companion: A source book of public collections in Europe and the USA, with Cathy Giangrande. London: Everyman, 2001. ISBN 9781841590806.[27]
Bagman to Swagman. London: Allen & Unwin, 1999. ISBN 9781865083896.[26][27]
Adventures of a Collector. London: Allen & Unwin, 2002. ISBN 9781865087863.[26][27]
Triumph from Failure: Lessons from Life for Business Success, with Kate Dixey. New York: Texere, 2003. ISBN 9781587991813.[27]
unquote

The Art of War by Sun Tzu is imo a very important book, what is more relevant is that Sun Tzu is said to have retired as he was disgusted by the immoral use his Emperor made of Sun Tzu's insights.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Mirage on 03.02.13 11:58

@jd wrote:This comment has been attributed to a certain individual ""Spread false accusation & then arrange for it to be exposed as such - so the accuser will forever be treated with suspicion" ........

JD - I think I read that in a bewk somewhere!


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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Woofer on 03.02.13 12:41

This case is so ridiculous. All she said is "why is LA trending?" It is a question asking why he is trending ........ yeah ......... so!

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by aiyoyo on 03.02.13 15:14

Wonder which side is going to hire a few big guns to represent them?

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by ShuBob on 03.02.13 15:21

@aiyoyo wrote:Wonder which side is going to hire a few big guns to represent them?

Well, Bercow has apparently hired Carter Ruck.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 03.02.13 15:36

@Woofer wrote:This case is so ridiculous. All she said is "why is LA trending?" It is a question asking why he is trending ........ yeah ......... so!

Exactly what I thought. He's bought all this negative attention on himself. She never accused him of anything, so it cannot be defamatory.

If on the other hand, he had ignored it, it would not have become a hot topic !! What a fool.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Inspectorfrost on 03.02.13 16:07




I dont think she libelled him, she never made any claims, she asked a question about why he was trending on her timeline. At best its mischievous gossip IF she KNEW why he was trending. Whether she should have or not if she did is not really imo in the realms of libel.

She did apologise and said she was an irresponsible eejit but that wasnt enough for some reason.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Nina on 03.02.13 16:26

@Inspectorfrost wrote:


I dont think she libelled him, she never made any claims, she asked a question about why he was trending on her timeline. At best its mischievous gossip IF she KNEW why he was trending. Whether she should have or not if she did is not really imo in the realms of libel.

She did apologise and said she was an irresponsible eejit but that wasnt enough for some reason.

What does 'trending on her timeline' mean please? flag roses

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Inspectorfrost on 03.02.13 16:33

HI Nina, I don't use or understand twitter, so am in the dark as much as you
big grin

i do know though that twiiter advertise trends, which are the most talked about topics at any one time, I guess SB saw them when logged into her page? Some twitted owl will explain.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Olive_Boyle on 03.02.13 16:37

She actually said

"Why is Lord McAlpine trending? *innocent face*"


We all know what she meant. And it wasn't just an innocent question.

She is followed by a lot of people so has a lot of influence. Serves her right.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Nina on 03.02.13 16:38

@Inspectorfrost wrote:HI Nina, I don't use or understand twitter, so am in the dark as much as you
big grin

i do know though that twiiter advertise trends, which are the most talked about topics at any one time, I guess SB saw them when logged into her page? Some twitted owl will explain.

laughat Ah I get the trend bit then. So he was twittering with her was he?

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Inspectorfrost on 03.02.13 17:07

@Nina wrote:
@Inspectorfrost wrote:HI Nina, I don't use or understand twitter, so am in the dark as much as you
big grin

i do know though that twiiter advertise trends, which are the most talked about topics at any one time, I guess SB saw them when logged into her page? Some twitted owl will explain.

laughat Ah I get the trend bit then. So he was twittering with her was he?

LOL, No he wasn't

@Olive, well that's for the court to decide and even if they think she knew it still doesnt make it libel, we will have to wait and see. At this rate before we know it, raising an eyebrow will be considered libellous.

ETA
I do agree with you that being named wrongfully in this awful way is really bad. But she was not responsible for that.
And just because someone is followed by a lot of people doesnt mean to say every follower believes or follows everything that is tweeted.



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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Nina on 03.02.13 17:18

@Inspectorfrost wrote:
@Nina wrote:
@Inspectorfrost wrote:HI Nina, I don't use or understand twitter, so am in the dark as much as you
big grin

i do know though that twiiter advertise trends, which are the most talked about topics at any one time, I guess SB saw them when logged into her page? Some twitted owl will explain.

laughat Ah I get the trend bit then. So he was twittering with her was he?

LOL, No he wasn't

@Olive, well that's for the court to decide and even if they think she knew it still doesnt make it libel, we will have to wait and see. At this rate before we know it, raising an eyebrow will be considered libellous.

ETA
I do agree with you that being named wrongfully in this awful way is really bad. But she was not responsible for that.




Mmmm, I haven't got it then duh Never mind Inspectorfrost, I'll leave it to those who can understand it. However I do understand that it is an excellent way of getting information to the masses in super quick time so hope that it will be used on the 5th and 6th to get news to us on the forum awaiting news from the court during recess.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by bobbin on 03.02.13 18:23

@Olive_Boyle wrote:She actually said

"Why is Lord McAlpine trending? *innocent face*"


We all know what she meant. And it wasn't just an innocent question.

She is followed by a lot of people so has a lot of influence. Serves her right.

Sorry Olive_Boyle but I do not feel that I can agree that it 'serves her right' and in terms of Lord McAlpine I do not approve of bullying and threatening behaviour.

I am very concerned about people being used as sacrificial cows and am truly discomforted at reading a quote (which I take
at present as being correct, but have not been able to corroborate, since I do not have his book to hand) from a book which Lord McAlpine apparently wrote at the end of the last century.

If anyone can indicate that the quote below is incorrect I will gladly accept correction.


…........Quote taken from “The New Machiavelli: The Art of Politics in Business” 1999 by Lord McAlpine.
Lord McAlpine’s views on dealing with the media:

“Another option is for the businessperson to learn the art of dealing with the media, using all the tricks that go with that trade – such as the false defeat: when a person seems to lose, in order to gain public sympathy, or the false triumph: where a person seems to win in order to appear strong – thus giving credibility to any number of dubious propositions that person may wish to make in the future.

Neither of these ploys are examples of the use of true facts, rather of false facts given to the media to chew on, much as a dog chews on a bone.


Another useful ploy is the false accusation.
First, create a situation where you are wrongly accused.
Then, at a convenient moment, arrange for the false accusation to be shown to be false beyond all doubt.


Those who have made accusations against both the company and its management become discredited.

Further accusations will then be treated with great suspicion.

Always remember that people’s memories are very frail, remembering only both the high spots and the lows of a person’s career, and then seldom remembering accurately.

People believe in the facts that it suits them to believe.” p176…....end quote......

I have absolutely no respect for anyone who can recommend such duplicity, and in my view, and in this case in particular I
believe that duplicity can spectacularly backfire.

McAlpine lays the foundations for ‘further accusations’ to be treated with great suspicion. This ploy could be interpreted
as rendering some form of immunity against further allegations of a similar nature.
This would then protect any perpetrator from accusation, and inhibit any true accuser from being able to make accusation.

It seems to me that Lord McAlpine's advice is at risk of being very bad advice.

It would seem that he has taken Mrs. Bercow's message to be a false accusation.
He has taken her ‘non-stated’ remarks and inferred that they were accusing him of being involved in paedophilic acts.


I await the 'Convenient moment’ when he can arrange for the false accusation to be shown to be FALSE BEYOND ALL DOUBT'.

Now that might take some achieving since the onus will be on him to convince the public and myself, that the accusation which initially he inferred and subsequently implied, was indeed false, more particularly, ‘false beyond all doubt’.

If he believes his final sentence to be correct, ‘people (will continue to) believe in the facts that it suits them to believe’ and this may not necessarily suit him.

If he fails to show allegations ‘false beyond all doubt’, will he accept such allegations as being people’s retained belief.

Furthermore, how can he think he can force anyone to make a contribution to a charity or indeed be taken to court so that he can defend his reputation when he is the author who accedes to the right of people to have their own thoughts.

The onus it would seem falls on him.

I see this either as an unfortunate home-goal, or a deliberate attempt to practise his own teachings for purposes that only he knows best.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Ribisl on 03.02.13 19:23

@Nina
In the twitter world one uses a hashtag (#) to indicate what the relevant subject of you are tweeting about. Trending now indicates it's being talked about a lot. A popular topic.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Nina on 03.02.13 19:43

Thank you for the explanations. I think that I will not sign up though,I tried it once and made a real mess of it so will leave it to the experts.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by sonic72 on 03.02.13 20:01

This is ridiculous! Even if she knew about it, she still did nothing wrong, she can say what she wants as long as she does not libel him, and she didn't libel him!

His name has been thrown about for a long time now, just like Jimmy Saville's name was thrown about for a long time.. That's all I'm saying!

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Olive_Boyle on 03.02.13 20:07

Ribs I didn't realise that quote was taken from him in that context.

I thought he was saying that after being accused himself.

If that is the case then it has come back to bite him right on his arse. And my sympathy drops quite considerably.

I still believe that an accusation of paedophilia has got to be the grossest thing one can do to a person who is innocent.

The one and only person who accused him (or put his name out there) made a public apology and said that it was a case of mistaken identity (quite understandable how this happened) and no-one else had come forward to accuse him, is enough for me to say he wasn't involved in paedeophilia.

It is still being discussed on this forum as though he may have been involved which is too much for me.

I'm going to avoid this thread now and not even go near the other similar one.

Thanks for englightening me.

p.s I still think Sally Bercow is repulsive, she reminds me of Cherie Blair. Trying to make a name for herself off the back of her husband with "clever" and "controversial" comments. Who can take her seriously when she appears on Big Brother and dresses up in a sheet to have her photo taken for a trashy magazine.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by tigger on 03.02.13 20:19

@bobbin wrote:
@Olive_Boyle wrote:She actually said

"Why is Lord McAlpine trending? *innocent face*"


We all know what she meant. And it wasn't just an innocent question.

She is followed by a lot of people so has a lot of influence. Serves her right.

Sorry Olive_Boyle but I do not feel that I can agree that it 'serves her right' and in terms of Lord McAlpine I do not approve of bullying and threatening behaviour.

I am very concerned about people being used as sacrificial cows and am truly discomforted at reading a quote (which I take
at present as being correct, but have not been able to corroborate, since I do not have his book to hand) from a book which Lord McAlpine apparently wrote at the end of the last century.

If anyone can indicate that the quote below is incorrect I will gladly accept correction.


…........Quote taken from “The New Machiavelli: The Art of Politics in Business” 1999 by Lord McAlpine.
Lord McAlpine’s views on dealing with the media:

“Another option is for the businessperson to learn the art of dealing with the media, using all the tricks that go with that trade – such as the false defeat: when a person seems to lose, in order to gain public sympathy, or the false triumph: where a person seems to win in order to appear strong – thus giving credibility to any number of dubious propositions that person may wish to make in the future.

Neither of these ploys are examples of the use of true facts, rather of false facts given to the media to chew on, much as a dog chews on a bone.


Another useful ploy is the false accusation.
First, create a situation where you are wrongly accused.
Then, at a convenient moment, arrange for the false accusation to be shown to be false beyond all doubt.


Those who have made accusations against both the company and its management become discredited.

Further accusations will then be treated with great suspicion.

Always remember that people’s memories are very frail, remembering only both the high spots and the lows of a person’s career, and then seldom remembering accurately.

People believe in the facts that it suits them to believe.” p176…....end quote......

I have absolutely no respect for anyone who can recommend such duplicity, and in my view, and in this case in particular I
believe that duplicity can spectacularly backfire.

McAlpine lays the foundations for ‘further accusations’ to be treated with great suspicion. This ploy could be interpreted
as rendering some form of immunity against further allegations of a similar nature.
This would then protect any perpetrator from accusation, and inhibit any true accuser from being able to make accusation.

It seems to me that Lord McAlpine's advice is at risk of being very bad advice.

It would seem that he has taken Mrs. Bercow's message to be a false accusation.
He has taken her ‘non-stated’ remarks and inferred that they were accusing him of being involved in paedophilic acts.


I await the 'Convenient moment’ when he can arrange for the false accusation to be shown to be FALSE BEYOND ALL DOUBT'.

Now that might take some achieving since the onus will be on him to convince the public and myself, that the accusation which initially he inferred and subsequently implied, was indeed false, more particularly, ‘false beyond all doubt’.

If he believes his final sentence to be correct, ‘people (will continue to) believe in the facts that it suits them to believe’ and this may not necessarily suit him.

If he fails to show allegations ‘false beyond all doubt’, will he accept such allegations as being people’s retained belief.

Furthermore, how can he think he can force anyone to make a contribution to a charity or indeed be taken to court so that he can defend his reputation when he is the author who accedes to the right of people to have their own thoughts.

The onus it would seem falls on him.

I see this either as an unfortunate home-goal, or a deliberate attempt to practise his own teachings for purposes that only he knows best.

I agree, might it not be the case that Lord McAlpine's own advice, as given in the above book, is even now being tested?
How would we know?
The New Machiavelli could be a bestseller if such were to be the case.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by russiandoll on 21.02.13 11:51

BREAKING.............Lord McAlpine has dropped his defamation claims against twitter users.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by Guest on 21.02.13 11:53

@russiandoll wrote:BREAKING.............Lord McAlpine has dropped his defamation claims against twitter users.

Very wise.

Who kows what rot could have come out of a libel trial.

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Re: Lord McAlpine to sue Sally Bercow over the ‘damage and distress’

Post by tigger on 21.02.13 13:30

@Portia wrote:
@russiandoll wrote:BREAKING.............Lord McAlpine has dropped his defamation claims against twitter users.

Very wise.

Who kows what rot could have come out of a libel trial.

That means that all costs so far incurred will fall on LA? certainly he will have to pay his useless lawyer for advising him and I've never seen such a blatant effort to obtain personal information as the form drawn up by said lawyer. Only thing he missed out was shoe size.

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