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'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by tigger on 28.12.12 17:26

Châtelaine wrote:Exactly. It may help forcing new legislation, but don't try and tell me that a massive "hoax" was invented to push this through.

I don't believe that either, but the aftermath can be used by the powers that be and I certainly feel the above clip is highly suspect. Did they chose him because he looked the part? I.e. not wildly overweight or red-necked as it were?
He was reading from a crib sheet and told us absolutely nothing about his daughter. Where was his wife? He looks more like an FBI underling doing a job to me.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 28.12.12 18:19

Châtelaine wrote:Parapono, do I understand correctly that you'd want those horrible police pictures of slaughtered children published to proof that it DID happen ... ?

'those horrible police pictures of slaughtered children'

What horrible police pictures, did you see them?
Were there any...

Any proof to prove this really happened would be appreciated,
that's all.

Same goes for the McCann story.
My opinion.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 28.12.12 21:33

Of course, there are police pictures for the police files.
I see no reason whatsoever to publish those.
In fact they're hardly ever published, no matter which case involved.

And may I say that I completely agree to your occasional log-line: "what you sow, you'll harvest" ...
It's a classic.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 28.12.12 22:52

I cannot think of any criminal case where the photos of victims have been made generally available and rightly so.

I love a good conspiracy theory but, to suggest that the school massacre did not happen because nobody has seen proof of it, is in my view giving conspiracy theorists a worse name than they already have!

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 28.12.12 22:57

Jean wrote:I cannot think of any criminal case where the photos of victims have been made generally available and rightly so.

I love a good conspiracy theory but, to suggest that the school massacre did not happen because nobody has seen proof of it, is in my view giving conspiracy theorists a worse name than they already have!
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my log line

Post by Guest on 29.12.12 8:07

Right. That's the second time now, you commenting on my log line.
Get off my back and off my log line 'Chatters'.

You had me banned from the MCF forum already, thus robbing all good members of all my lovely pics.

I am asking the mods here to watch over me.

Have lovely weekend all!

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 29.12.12 8:44

For the record: I didn't get you banned; you got yourself banned, by publicly threatening me.
Your "log-line" is only used in reply to one of my posts.

Now, shall we take this dispute off-line? You can PM me if you still have an axe to grind.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.12.12 9:12

Jean wrote:I love a good conspiracy theory but, to suggest that the school massacre did not happen because nobody has seen proof of it, is in my view giving conspiracy theorists a worse name than they already have!
Just for the record, of course 27 people died as stated. What I have done, in a modest way, is to query the official version that this event was accomplished by one lone deranged man acting alone. Just for starters, there are reports of two other men being apprehended. There are other significant inconsistenecies, e.g. about the weapons used by the man/men. There are now many websites and blogs fully accepting that 27 people were killed, but asking penetrating questions about how this was accomplished

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by tigger on 29.12.12 12:30

I'm confused huh

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 29.12.12 12:31

What about, Tigger?

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by tigger on 29.12.12 13:01

Jean wrote:What about, Tigger?

Chatter - log - log-lines?

As far as the school massacre goes, don't think it's a conspiracy. But things like this are waiting to happen and when they do, I'm sure certain bodies make maximum use of it. Which is why I find this man in the video suspect. I'm not looking for tears, but the whole thing was fake, except the smiles imo.

There are simple ways in which such events can be taken over to be used for other agendas.
E.g. as about 54 parents in total, not to mention aunts and uncles and siblings are involved, I'm sure you could insert a suitable 'spokesman' who isn't in fact related but can be said to be the divorced father of one of the children. That would explain to the other parents why they don't know him etc.
Not that this is the truth, but just an illustration to show how easily these things can be worked.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by HiDeHo on 29.12.12 17:57

@tigger wrote:
Jean wrote:Here's a longer version of the interview with the same man.



It's certainly odd behaviour but I don't know how I would react in a situation like that. Alarm bells go off though at the mention at the end of money being raised for his daughter......

I think that some of the initial reports of more than one gunman are understandable in view of the absolute panic and chaos there must have been. I believe that one or two men were found in the neighbouring woods but they could have been there quite by chance - we possibly don't need to know what they were doing!

Rainbow-Fairy: I added the "not always of course" about the reason for home schooling specifically for you!

It's still weird at the full length. For a start, the poor little girl is immediately raised to sainthood status. It's all about the little girl, nothing about the parents how they feel, how her siblings are coping. Another abstract little angel, she was a little girl, we still know little about her apart from the sainthood.
In short: we have another little girl who was 'special' lighting up the world around her.
We hear nothing about her siblings.
We hear a touching tale of her learning Portuguese. (seems early and no mention why).
The smiling face at the start doesn't seem to me to be an automatic or nervous reaction, it goes on too long for that and the preparation back to sadness takes a tad too long.
Yes, the money at the end, what the hell is that for? To pay the taxes?
Combined donations for all the victims makes more sense. Never, mind dig deep, middle America!



I spent two full days (Sat/Sun) compiling the video I did for the shooting.

I had a few questions myself as I was doing it, but I prefer not to look at conspiracy right now, based on what is NOT available.

That doesn't mean I don't think it was possible, only that for my personal opinion I need to have some 'proof' to the contrary rather than speculate on what appears to 'fit.

Regarding the 'fund' for Emilie, the facebook account was set up by friends and the fund appears to have been implemented by them to help pay for the transportation of her body back to Utah.

I am, however, troubled by the father needing to compose himself after a very obvious laugh.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Ribisl on 29.12.12 18:23

I haven't seen any evidence convincing enough to suggest conspiracy either. As for Robbie Parker's off-camera behaviour I would like to think it was due to shock/nervousness. But could that also explain Gerry's laughing and joking on the terrace? I don't think so somehow.

Although I imagine the underlying motive is sound in most cases, this recent trend in setting up funds so quickly after the event to collect donations for the family of victims still leaves me somewhat puzzled.

Alan Prothero and I have set up an account at America First Credit Union to help Robbie Parker and his family with their immediate needs due to their loss of their beautiful girl in the shooting this morning in Conn. You can put funds in the account or give them directly to me or Alan. Please contribute what you can and spread the word: Emilie Parker Memorial Account at America First Credit Union. Account #9056862.
https://www.facebook.com/EmilieParkerFund/timeline?filter=1


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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by kinell on 29.12.12 18:33

@Ribisl wrote:I haven't seen any evidence convincing enough to suggest conspiracy either. As for Robbie Parker's off-camera behaviour I would like to think it was due to shock/nervousness. But could that also explain Gerry's laughing and joking on the terrace? I don't think so somehow.

For me, it's not the laughing and joking. It's the nose scratching, ear pulling that tells me he's lying.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.12.12 18:35

@Ribisl wrote:I haven't seen any evidence convincing enough to suggest conspiracy either. As for Robbie Parker's off-camera behaviour I would like to think it was due to shock/nervousness. But could that also explain Gerry's laughing and joking on the terrace? I don't think so somehow.

Although I imagine the underlying motive is sound in most cases, this recent trend in setting up funds so quickly after the event to collect donations for the family of victims still leaves me somewhat puzzled.

Alan Prothero and I have set up an account at America First Credit Union to help Robbie Parker and his family with their immediate needs due to their loss of their beautiful girl in the shooting this morning in Conn. You can put funds in the account or give them directly to me or Alan. Please contribute what you can and spread the word: Emilie Parker Memorial Account at America First Credit Union. Account #9056862.
https://www.facebook.com/EmilieParkerFund/timeline?filter=1

Are there funds for the families of any other victims?

Or only for the bereaved parents of Emilie Parker?

By the way, I assume that both of Emilie Parker's parents wholeheartedly approve of this fund being set up for their benefit, and have either consented in writing, or given strong and unequivocal verbal assent.

Usually, where an account is set up for a specific purpose such as this, the bank will require sight of either a trust deed (as per the Find Madeleine Fund) or a constitution (as per The Madeleine Foundation), or similar document. I wonder for what specific purposes the fund will be used?

Here, by the way, each parent would receive the sum of £5,500 from the Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority (i.e. from the government) as their child has died from a crime of violence.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Ribisl on 29.12.12 18:55

@Tony
This fund is specifically to help Emilie Parker's family who are taking time off work to grieve. They have even set up a PayPal account to make it easier for overseas supporters to donate!

Donation Options For the Emilie Parker Memorial:

America First Credit Union: Emilie Parker Memorial Account #5001359. For AFCU members transfer into Share Savings. For Non-AFCU members the routing number is 324377516

PAYPAL: Use the email - emilieparkermemorial@gmail.com

For US Post-Mail use:
Emilie Parker Memorial
PO Box 12751
Ogden, UT 84412-2751

To Donate to all the Sandy Hook Families Use the website:
https://newtown.uwwesternct.org/

Thank you for your outpouring of love and support. This international concern is simply amazing. Thank you.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by cath2756 on 29.12.12 22:28

This so reminds me of the McCann case. It isn't just Robbie Parker who acts weird. 3 families have been interviewed so far and here is the second family http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhWGPXEuf7k&feature=youtu.be Also just go to YouTube and search for Medical Examiner, Sandy Hook. The guy, Wayne Carver, is supposedly a 'top' medical examiner. Loads and loads of other things don't add up - as PeterMac said their were other shooters. 3rd family were interviewed in school grounds just after the massacre while police were planning on going into the school - Why were they interviewed there? Surely police would have cleared the area in case there was a second (or third) shooter and in case they had booby trapped the surrounding area.

It is very difficult to think bad thoughts when we are told children are involved but at the end of the day this forum came into being because a young child went missing and there were inconsistancies in the parents interviews etc

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 29.12.12 23:02

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShgdN8arHCc

I don't think there's anything I can say other than after watching interviews with the medical examiner.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.12.12 23:36

Jean wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShgdN8arHCc

I don't think there's anything I can say other than after watching interviews with the medical examiner.
Yes, Jean, thank you very much for posting, I had not seen this before but even my sceptical frame of mind was unprepared for the shock of seeing this man give this extraordinary interview.

I think the UK term for 'medical examiner' would probably be 'pathologist'.

One discredited UK pathologist has been very much on my mind over the past 6 years: Home Office pathologist Michael John Heath.

Heath was the pathologist called in by Essex Police in the Stuart Lubbock murder case. He said Stuart Lubbock drowned. Three other pathologists were called in. They said that Lubbock died from a combination of a serious sexual assault, asphyxiation NOT drowning, and a heart attack.

In the Lee Balkwell case which I've spent 6 years investigating, Heath was again called in by Essex Police. He said that Lee died in the machinery of a cement mixer. But more and more evidence suggests he was murdered that night and his body placed in the mixer to make it look like an accident.

In the Alec Barrack case which I also investigated, Heath was again called in, this time by the Met. He said Alec, aged 28, died from an asthma attack. But later evidence showed that Robert Thompson Simpson, a lawyer at Crown Prosecution Service HQ and still working there, had placed a balloon-head device over his head and suffocated Alec in a bizarre and dangerous S & M ritual. No-one was prosecuted over Alec's death. His mother, Doris Barrack, wrote a book about the case.

In 2006, the discredited Dr Heath was finally disciplined for professional misconduct and he resigned as a Home Office pathologist.

In the YouTube clip of the Connecticut medical examiner, I noted more than a hint of flippancy. This was something I also observed of Dr Heath when he gave evidence at Lee Balkwell's inquest in 2008.

Not making any allegations, but there have certainly been corrupt pathologists in many parts of the world, and no doubt will be in the future.

I would recommend anyone visiting this thread to view the 4-min video of the medical examiner, which by the way has been slightly edited

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Woofer on 30.12.12 0:24

I realise a lot of Americans over-dramatise the corny hearts, flowers, angels stuff, but not all. I could perhaps believe that this fellow was smiling to the technicians before his speech and then had to compose himself to do the heavy bit.

But its seeing all the other interviews with the families seeming so fake that makes this all so creepy - anyone would think they were robots or had been hypnotised - and not one person ever sheds a tear. Its all so corny and overly sentimental, almost joyous. What made me suspicious was seeing Obama doing his fake speech and pretending to cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QVKu4_JxcE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_b9hh2lp3I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KDZQ10c8O4

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Tony Bennett on 30.12.12 0:44

@Woofer wrote:I realise a lot of Americans over-dramatise the corny hearts, flowers, angels stuff, but not all. I could perhaps believe that this fellow was smiling to the technicians before his speech and then had to compose himself to do the heavy bit.

But its seeing all the other interviews with the families seeming so fake that makes this all so creepy - anyone would think they were robots or had been hypnotised - and not one person ever sheds a tear. Its all so corny and overly sentimental, almost joyous. What made me suspicious was seeing Obama doing his fake speech and pretending to cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QVKu4_JxcE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_b9hh2lp3I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KDZQ10c8O4
Yes, Woofer, I too have seen these strange interviews. One mother is actually smiling almost throughout. I could not understand it. If I'd been similarly bereaved, the last thing I'd agree to is a TV interview.

I didn't post these myself as I'm aware that there are 27 or so grieiving families out there, but, as you say, nothing seems quite right about Sandy Hook.

Obama's fakery was obvious, the flick of his finger to first his left eye, and then his right eye, to wipe away a tear that wasn't there.

It was all about photo-opportunities

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 30.12.12 9:52

On second thoughts I'm not sure if the clip I posted last night can be taken as reliable. It has I think been tampered with to give a worse impression than necessary.

Here is a longer version - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxVQCJymXdw - where the ME's behaviour is a lot less strange and, even with his years of experience, could be put down to shock.

I'm still having a problem though with the various parents laughing and joking as if what has happened is the highlight of their lives.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by aquila on 30.12.12 10:51

There are quite a few videos on YouTube casting doubt on this terrible tragedy but it is for everyone to make up their own minds. I think I've watched most of them. I thought the behaviour of the parents who were interviewed strange to say the least.

There are parents, families and friends who are grieving for their loved ones. There are also parents with surviving children who are in grief. I remember the Aberfan disaster (my Dad's school) where the parents of the survivors felt guilt as did some of the survivors.

The Sandy Hook community must be in total shock. The calibre of the media interviews is very poor but to be expected in a media world where the story is the most important thing and to hell with human dignity. I see no reason why any of the families needed to be paraded. The questions levelled at them were just sickening. I see no reason why the ME had to give information to the media other than to say the autopsies were in progress and full findings would be published in due course.

There is the usual appeal for funds for the families and independently for one child so far. I don't know why funds are needed but this seems to be the norm nowadays and perhaps funds will be necessary for psychological healthcare in the future - I don't know how America works in terms of healthcare.

I just cannot imagine the agony so many people are in. To get through each day must be a major battle. I wish the media would back off and give some dignity to the deceased and some space to those who grieve. There are facts that can be published without the need for staged interviews with families. As for the anti-gun angle well that was bound to be jumped on as an opportunity. As I am not American and don't live there I have no opinion on whether it would be a good or bad thing to remove arms. It's for the American population to decide their rights.

Just my opinion.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Woofer on 30.12.12 11:20

Thanks for the Medical Examiner link Jean. Someone has obviously tampered with the other one. He still seems quite casual but that could be put down to his job and the fact he`s American - can`t quite believe he has seen thousands of shot people during his career but that`s just over dramatising. That interview is more plausible than the grieving parent interviews - some of those are coming across as if it`s almost a great honour for their little angels to be sacrificed and they`ll all be together now holding hands in heaven - weird, but maybe I`m being too judgmental and its how ultra religious people react - dunno.

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Re: 'Many die' in Connecticut primary school shooting

Post by Guest on 30.12.12 11:26

@aquila wrote:There are quite a few videos on YouTube casting doubt on this terrible tragedy but it is for everyone to make up their own minds. I think I've watched most of them. I thought the behaviour of the parents who were interviewed strange to say the least.

There are parents, families and friends who are grieving for their loved ones. There are also parents with surviving children who are in grief. I remember the Aberfan disaster (my Dad's school) where the parents of the survivors felt guilt as did some of the survivors.

The Sandy Hook community must be in total shock. The calibre of the media interviews is very poor but to be expected in a media world where the story is the most important thing and to hell with human dignity. I see no reason why any of the families needed to be paraded. The questions levelled at them were just sickening. I see no reason why the ME had to give information to the media other than to say the autopsies were in progress and full findings would be published in due course.

There is the usual appeal for funds for the families and independently for one child so far. I don't know why funds are needed but this seems to be the norm nowadays and perhaps funds will be necessary for psychological healthcare in the future - I don't know how America works in terms of healthcare.

I just cannot imagine the agony so many people are in. To get through each day must be a major battle. I wish the media would back off and give some dignity to the deceased and some space to those who grieve. There are facts that can be published without the need for staged interviews with families. As for the anti-gun angle well that was bound to be jumped on as an opportunity. As I am not American and don't live there I have no opinion on whether it would be a good or bad thing to remove arms. It's for the American population to decide their rights.

Just my opinion.

Aquila,
thanks for your quite 'balanced' opinion,
I share most of it


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