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Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Newintown on 02.05.14 16:15

@tiny wrote:I was hoping he would get more than 8 years,he will spend his time writing a book about his time inside, of that I have know doubt.

Unfortunately it won't be 8 years only 4 most likely which is derisory, people have got more than that for robbing a bank.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Newintown on 02.05.14 16:18

@ultimaThule wrote:
@Hobs wrote:Wooohoo i was jumping up and down and cheering, that is way better than the 2 everyone was bandying around. i sincerely hope he serves the full 8 and that any further victims will come forward.

I wonder now if he will air his clients dirty laundry, his career is over, he is unemployable  as a PR, he is a registered sex offender, he has nothing to lose.

The 'eight years' is composed of 8 sentences of between 6 and 24 months to be served consecutively and the judge has directed that Clifford serves 'at least' half of his total sentence in jail, Hobs.

I was hoping for a minimum total of 10 years but, in imposing a figure which is only half of the maximum sentence he could have handed down, it seems the judge has ensured that any appeal against the length of the sentence will be unsuccessful although, of course, Clifford may lodge an appeal on other grounds.  

With reference to your post a couple of days ago, I came across this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27157132 which, while I have no doubt Louise has a strong bond with her father, would indicate he's not above using his daughter to promote his interests.  

It's also something of a masterclass in how to spin effectively by keeping up physical appearances at all times and continuing to act in an insouciant manner even as the axe is about to fall, which is not unlike the behaviour of a certain couple whose name currently escapes me  smilie

Unfortunately some people help with the masterclass and spin, the initials LK come to mind for some reason.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by rainbow-fairy on 02.05.14 16:39

@aquila wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@Newintown wrote:


The people who accuse offenders have to think of the long-term consequences, being pushed into the public eye, having to appear in court and relive what they went through, having to face their husband/partner/family if they hadn't mentioned it previously.

Maybe so, but in this case, were not the women in question wannabe models and actresses, as opposed to potential nuns.
Diatribe, I think you might be taking the p*ss here.
Dinnerlady, secretary, model, actress, nun, barmaid, prostitute. What have all these women got in common? A right to live their lives without being assaulted or raped!
It doesn't matter what they do and really, are 'wannabe actresses and models' somehow lesser and not deserving of the same justice as a nun?
I'd have expected a comment like that in the days of Bernard Manning tbh.

That attitude is yet another reason why many victims are afraid to come forward. Maybe one was wearing a short skirt and stillies too? nah

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by diatribe on 02.05.14 16:49

@aquila wrote:
Diatribe, are you suggesting that Max Clifford's crimes, guilty verdict and subsequent sentencing (the sentencing in particular) are some sort of political witch hunt?

Undoubtably Max Clifford's behaviour towards these women at the time constituted a crime, Aquila and one cannot appeal on the basis of a juries verdict, no matter how perverse that verdict may be, however one cannot escape the fact that these current prosecutions are directly related to the sexual abuse allegations made against James Savile since his demise. Had it not been for the aforementioned, none of these cases would have been pursued, so in this respect there is a political witch hunt in progress.

Are you suggesting the judge got it wrong?

I'm sure the judge's sentence was within the guidelines of the time, but he would also have had one eye on the meeja reaction. Can you imagine how the tabloids would have castigated him had he not imposed a draconian sentence above the realms of normality. I'm certain the meeja have been sharpening their knives for yrs. in anticiptation of adorning Max Clifford with a columbian necklace.

Are you suggesting the judge gave a sentence that was in anyway influenced by the need for the judiciary to curry favour with the general public?

I'm not sure about currying favour with the general public, certainly Max Clifford would have been the most vulnerable of the targets in the sense that he would have been the least popular, thus most likely to be convicted. He may well transpire to be the only CPS success and someone has pick up the tab for all the efforts and financial expenditure. He may also be their only opportunity to gain their pound of flesh. If one compares his sentence with that of George O'Dowd, perhaps more affectionately known as Boy George, it is disproportionate, particularly in the vein that the offences relating to kidnapping that he was convicted of were far higher up the scale of seriousness than indecent assault.  Not to mention the fact that he had previous convictions and the offences at the time were current, as opposed to the prehistoric variety.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by rainbow-fairy on 02.05.14 16:57

@PeterMac wrote:Perhaps Clifford should have hired McMitchell to act for him.

(And the McCanns should have used Cipriano Babysitting Services)
laughat

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aiyoyo on 02.05.14 17:05

@Newintown wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:
 but let us not kid ourselves that it is unlikely he's carried out (and possibly helped enable others to) far more over the years.

I appreciate what you are stating, Nomendelta, but a judge is only supposed to sentence a person on the crimes he has been convicted of, not those he may or may not have committed.

I'd be interested to determine what the previous longest sentence for indecent assault in the UK is, I wouldn't be surprised if it was in the months, as opposed to years.

Didn't MC say in an interview that he'd attended many sex parties years ago (in the 60s/70s or had organised them) but never took part (well that's according to him).  I think that statement says a lot about his character.

It may not have swayed the judge in the sentencing but does show his mindset all those years ago.

Perhaps his profession and his autobiography "Read All About It" went against him.
I've never read his book but from comments about the book that I read it seems his book is about his skills  at manipulating the media and how he forged his career covering up dirty secrets for the rich infamous and notorious.

He's perceived/seen as a white collar crook if you like, coupled that with his arrogant behavior in Court thinking he's untouchable, that all worked against him.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by diatribe on 02.05.14 17:11

@Newintown wrote:

Unfortunately it won't be 8 years only 4 most likely which is derisory, people have got more than that for robbing a bank.

---and less for taking other's lives, where juries have opted for manslaughter in murder trials.

I'm afraid sentencing in the UK has become subject to inflation, whereas in the 1960's one was considered to be a 'villian' if sentenced to 3 yrs. imp. and 4 yrs. was classified as long term, now the aforementioned are viewed as shit, shave an' haircut sentences.

Still, I suppose our Max will soon adapt to taking a doctorate in day time TV.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aiyoyo on 02.05.14 17:17

@PeterMac wrote:Perhaps Clifford should have hired McMitchell to act for him.

(And the McCanns should have used Cipriano Babysitting Services)

What irony isn't it?  A PR spinmaster without a PR to represent him?

CM is not up to par with Clifford, he's a good for one-master-type of guy and his loyalty to his master and mistress has remained steadfast thus far.   Clifford needs a clone if he wants to stand a chance of effective representation and CM is not up to the role.

Just notice CM and MC shares same initials in the reverse.

M.Clifford's bewk is full of incriminating materials, and we know of one other infamous doctor whose bewk is of exactly the same category ie tailored fairy tale full of incriminating evidence and lies.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Newintown on 02.05.14 17:18

@aiyoyo wrote:
@Newintown wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:
 but let us not kid ourselves that it is unlikely he's carried out (and possibly helped enable others to) far more over the years.

I appreciate what you are stating, Nomendelta, but a judge is only supposed to sentence a person on the crimes he has been convicted of, not those he may or may not have committed.

I'd be interested to determine what the previous longest sentence for indecent assault in the UK is, I wouldn't be surprised if it was in the months, as opposed to years.

Didn't MC say in an interview that he'd attended many sex parties years ago (in the 60s/70s or had organised them) but never took part (well that's according to him).  I think that statement says a lot about his character.

It may not have swayed the judge in the sentencing but does show his mindset all those years ago.

Perhaps his profession and his autobiography "Read All About It" went against him.
I've never read his book but from comments about the book that I read it seems his book is about his skills  at manipulating the media and how he forged his career covering up dirty secrets for the rich infamous and notorious.

He's perceived/seen as a white collar crook if you like, coupled that with his arrogant behavior in Court thinking he's untouchable, that all worked against him.

Nor have I read his book and wouldn't want to but it seems strange that you can invert his initials - MC to CM - and you wouldn't know the difference between the jobs they have/had been paid to do.

In fact when I was posting my posts about MC earlier it took all of my will not to post CM instead of MC, which I did on the beginning of this sentence and changed it just before posting.   Two peas in a pod come to mind.  big grin

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aiyoyo on 02.05.14 17:20

@ultimaThule wrote:[
With reference to your post a couple of days ago, I came across this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27157132 which, while I have no doubt Louise has a strong bond with her father, would indicate he's not above using his daughter to promote his interests.  

His office is staff by half-a-dozen jolly females and his daughter works for him too. She's probably his deputy.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Newintown on 02.05.14 17:21

@aiyoyo wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:Perhaps Clifford should have hired McMitchell to act for him.

(And the McCanns should have used Cipriano Babysitting Services)

What irony isn't it?  A PR spinmaster without a PR to represent him?

CM is not up to par with Clifford, he's a good for one-master-type of guy and his loyalty to his master and mistress has remain steadfast thus far.   Clifford needs a clone if he wants to stand a chance of effective representation and CM is up not to the role.

Just notice CM and MC shares same initials in the reverse.

M.Clifford's bewk is full of incriminating materials, and we know of one other infamous doctor whose bewk is of exactly the same category ie tailored fairy tale full of incriminating evidence and lies.


I've just posted the same thoughts, it's hard to tell the difference between CM and MC.   smilie high5

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Gillyspot on 02.05.14 17:45

@aiyoyo wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:[
With reference to your post a couple of days ago, I came across this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27157132 which, while I have no doubt Louise has a strong bond with her father, would indicate he's not above using his daughter to promote his interests.  

His office is staff by half-a-dozen jolly females and his daughter works for him too.  She's probably his deputy.
Will his daughter (Louise) be hauled up for perjury? 

One of Clifford's victims from a holiday in Spain where MC was "alleged - now found guilty of) to have put a 12-year-old girl’s hand on his penis when she was with him and his daughter in a jacuzzi was referred (under oath) by Louise as a "very disturbed, malicious person". 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595440/The-rantings-mad-woman-Max-Cliffords-daughter-comes-fathers-defence-describes-one-accusers-disturbed-malicious.html

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by russiandoll on 02.05.14 17:46

@diatribe wrote:
@Newintown wrote:


The people who accuse offenders have to think of the long-term consequences, being pushed into the public eye, having to appear in court and relive what they went through, having to face their husband/partner/family if they hadn't mentioned it previously.

Maybe so, but in this case, were not the women in question wannabe models and actresses, as opposed to potential nuns.

  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by ultimaThule on 02.05.14 17:51

While it may have something to do with the similarity of their hair and ability to tell outrageous untruths while keeping a straight face, I've long thought that CM is the natural successor to MC and now the master's spinning days have been curtailed it may be that the heir apparent will step into his shoes, so to speak.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by diatribe on 02.05.14 17:52

@Gillyspot wrote:
Will his daughter (Louise) be hauled up for perjury? 

One of Clifford's victims from a holiday in Spain where MC was "alleged - now found guilty of) to have put a 12-year-old girl’s hand on his penis when she was with him and his daughter in a jacuzzi was referred (under oath) by Louise as a "very disturbed, malicious person". 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595440/The-rantings-mad-woman-Max-Cliffords-daughter-comes-fathers-defence-describes-one-accusers-disturbed-malicious.html

But wouldn't that have merely been her opinion, if every witnessed who expressed an unfavourable opinion of another  whilst under oath were to be subjected to charges of perjury, the courts would have to open all hours.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Gillyspot on 02.05.14 17:56

From the article "Ms Clifford denied the girl told her about the alleged incident after they had been in the jacuzzi together.

'It’s completely untrue. Utterly, utterly a lie,' she said.  "



See what I mean? (sorry about type size-can admin sort it out?)

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by diatribe on 02.05.14 18:04

@russiandoll wrote:




  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

But is it irrelevant, Russian, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong, but weren't all of the offences that Clifford was convicted of against the same two women and further, were they not offences committed on separate occasions, hence the separate indictments.

My friend does a bit of glamour modelling and she has categorically informed me that if on a shoot, a photographer in any way acted inappropriately towards her, she sure as hell wouldn't go back for seconds.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by ultimaThule on 02.05.14 18:15

@Gillyspot wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:[
With reference to your post a couple of days ago, I came across this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27157132 which, while I have no doubt Louise has a strong bond with her father, would indicate he's not above using his daughter to promote his interests.  

His office is staff by half-a-dozen jolly females and his daughter works for him too.  She's probably his deputy.
Will his daughter (Louise) be hauled up for perjury? 

One of Clifford's victims from a holiday in Spain where MC was "alleged - now found guilty of) to have put a 12-year-old girl’s hand on his penis when she was with him and his daughter in a jacuzzi was referred (under oath) by Louise as a "very disturbed, malicious person". 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595440/The-rantings-mad-woman-Max-Cliffords-daughter-comes-fathers-defence-describes-one-accusers-disturbed-malicious.html

As Max Clifford was not charged with, or convicted of, any offence against a 12 year old girl in Spain or elsewhere, it seems that Louise Clifford was giving her opinion of an anonymous letter sent to her father when she answered a question from the prosecution by saying she thought 'it reads like a very disturbed, malicious person'

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aquila on 02.05.14 18:18

@diatribe wrote:
@russiandoll wrote:




  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

But is it irrelevant, Russian, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong, but weren't all of the offences that Clifford was convicted of against the same two women and further, were they not offences committed on separate occasions, hence the separate indictments.

My friend does a bit of glamour modelling and she has categorically informed me that if on a shoot, a photographer in any way acted inappropriately towards her, she sure as hell wouldn't go back for seconds.
This case was brought to a court diatribe, there was defence (no doubt very expensive, top lawyers) there was a prosecutor and a jury. The jury found Clifford guilty.

Are you insinuating in some way that a jury is incapable of coming to a decision?

Perhaps you think a jury lacks intellectual capacity?

Perhaps you think a jury ought to have an intelligence test?

Perhaps the defence counsel would agree with you.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by Newintown on 02.05.14 18:25

@ultimaThule wrote:
@Gillyspot wrote:
@aiyoyo wrote:
@ultimaThule wrote:[
With reference to your post a couple of days ago, I came across this article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27157132 which, while I have no doubt Louise has a strong bond with her father, would indicate he's not above using his daughter to promote his interests.  

His office is staff by half-a-dozen jolly females and his daughter works for him too.  She's probably his deputy.
Will his daughter (Louise) be hauled up for perjury? 

One of Clifford's victims from a holiday in Spain where MC was "alleged - now found guilty of) to have put a 12-year-old girl’s hand on his penis when she was with him and his daughter in a jacuzzi was referred (under oath) by Louise as a "very disturbed, malicious person". 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2595440/The-rantings-mad-woman-Max-Cliffords-daughter-comes-fathers-defence-describes-one-accusers-disturbed-malicious.html

As Max Clifford was not charged with, or convicted of, any offence against a 12 year old girl in Spain or elsewhere, it seems that Louise Clifford was giving her opinion of an anonymous letter sent to her father when she answered a question from the prosecution by saying she thought 'it reads like a very disturbed, malicious person'

How would his young daughter be able to react to an allegation like that out of the blue.  If she loved her Dad and he'd been good to her in all of her 12 years was she going to admit to his wrong doing and lose her father and all that he meant, her upbringing, schooling, nice house, nice food, nice clothes, fabulous holidays every year, his fame and fortune  - how would a 12 year old respond at that time.   Would she say, yes, he's a cunning b*st*rd and I hate his guts or say "he's my lovely Dad and he wouldn't hurt a fly".

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by diatribe on 02.05.14 18:34

@aquila wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@russiandoll wrote:




  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

But is it irrelevant, Russian, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong, but weren't all of the offences that Clifford was convicted of against the same two women and further, were they not offences committed on separate occasions, hence the separate indictments.

My friend does a bit of glamour modelling and she has categorically informed me that if on a shoot, a photographer in any way acted inappropriately towards her, she sure as hell wouldn't go back for seconds.
This case was brought to a court diatribe, there was defence (no doubt very expensive, top lawyers) there was a prosecutor and a jury. The jury found Clifford guilty.

Are you insinuating in some way that a jury is incapable of coming to a decision?

Perhaps you think a jury lacks intellectual capacity?

Perhaps you think a jury ought to have an intelligence test?

Perhaps the defence counsel would agree with you.

Calm down, Aquila, no need for heart attack time, I was not inferring that the jury had arrived at the wrong decision, nor that they were intellectually challenged. I was merely replying to Russian's assertion that just because a female is a wannabe actress/model doesn't necessarily mean that they are fair game for every pervert on the planet to exploit.

I agree that is not the case, I was merely stating that in this instance, as was the case with William Roache, the women can't have objected too strongly to unwarranted attention, otherwise they wouldn't have returned to suffer further indignities, nor would they have waited nearly 30 yrs. to make a complaint.

As for defence counsels requiring juries to undergo intelligence testing prior to casting judgement on their clients, I'd have thought that in most cases, that would be the last thing they'd want.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by ultimaThule on 02.05.14 18:36

@rainbow-fairy wrote:
@aquila wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@Newintown wrote:


The people who accuse offenders have to think of the long-term consequences, being pushed into the public eye, having to appear in court and relive what they went through, having to face their husband/partner/family if they hadn't mentioned it previously.

Maybe so, but in this case, were not the women in question wannabe models and actresses, as opposed to potential nuns.
Diatribe, I think you might be taking the p*ss here.
Dinnerlady, secretary, model, actress, nun, barmaid, prostitute. What have all these women got in common? A right to live their lives without being assaulted or raped!
It doesn't matter what they do and really, are 'wannabe actresses and models' somehow lesser and not deserving of the same justice as a nun?
I'd have expected a comment like that in the days of Bernard Manning tbh.

That attitude is yet another reason why many victims are afraid to come forward. Maybe one was wearing a short skirt and stillies too? nah

Well said, r-f.  

Clifford's victims in this case were:
a 15-year-old girl assaulted four times in 1977 or 78
a 19-year-old woman assaulted in 1981 or 82
a 17-year-old assaulted twice between 1982 and 84
a 18-year-old woman assaulted in 1983 or 84

Clifford "groomed and degraded" young women and girls who were less than half his age at the time he perpetrated serious sexual offences against them and, regardless of their aspirations, they were victimised by a predatory serial sex offender.    

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27259318

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aquila on 02.05.14 18:41

@diatribe wrote:
@aquila wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@russiandoll wrote:




  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

But is it irrelevant, Russian, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong, but weren't all of the offences that Clifford was convicted of against the same two women and further, were they not offences committed on separate occasions, hence the separate indictments.

My friend does a bit of glamour modelling and she has categorically informed me that if on a shoot, a photographer in any way acted inappropriately towards her, she sure as hell wouldn't go back for seconds.
This case was brought to a court diatribe, there was defence (no doubt very expensive, top lawyers) there was a prosecutor and a jury. The jury found Clifford guilty.

Are you insinuating in some way that a jury is incapable of coming to a decision?

Perhaps you think a jury lacks intellectual capacity?

Perhaps you think a jury ought to have an intelligence test?

Perhaps the defence counsel would agree with you.

Calm down, Aquila, no need for heart attack time, I was not inferring that the jury had arrived at the wrong decision, nor that they were intellectually challenged. I was merely replying to Russian's assertion that just because a female is a wannabe actress/model doesn't necessarily mean that they are fair game for every pervert on the planet to exploit.

I agree that is not the case, I was merely stating that in this instance, as was the case with William Roache, the women can't have objected too strongly to unwarranted attention, otherwise they wouldn't have returned to suffer further indignites, nor would they have waited nearly 30 yrs. to make a complaint.

As for defence counsels requiring juries to undergo intelligence testing prior to casting judgement on their clients, I'd have thought that in most cases, that would be the last thing they'd want.
I'm perfectly calm thank you although I find the comment quite weird as I find the other part of your post I've underlined weird.

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by aquila on 02.05.14 18:45

@ultimaThule wrote:
@rainbow-fairy wrote:
@aquila wrote:
@diatribe wrote:
@Newintown wrote:


The people who accuse offenders have to think of the long-term consequences, being pushed into the public eye, having to appear in court and relive what they went through, having to face their husband/partner/family if they hadn't mentioned it previously.

Maybe so, but in this case, were not the women in question wannabe models and actresses, as opposed to potential nuns.
Diatribe, I think you might be taking the p*ss here.
Dinnerlady, secretary, model, actress, nun, barmaid, prostitute. What have all these women got in common? A right to live their lives without being assaulted or raped!
It doesn't matter what they do and really, are 'wannabe actresses and models' somehow lesser and not deserving of the same justice as a nun?
I'd have expected a comment like that in the days of Bernard Manning tbh.

That attitude is yet another reason why many victims are afraid to come forward. Maybe one was wearing a short skirt and stillies too? nah

Well said, r-f.  

Clifford's victims in this case were:
a 15-year-old girl assaulted four times in 1977 or 78
a 19-year-old woman assaulted in 1981 or 82
a 17-year-old assaulted twice between 1982 and 84
a 18-year-old woman assaulted in 1983 or 84

Clifford "groomed and degraded" young women and girls who were less than half his age at the time he perpetrated serious sexual offences against them and, regardless of their aspirations, they were victimised by a predatory serial sex offender.    

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27259318
 thumbsup

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Re: Update: Max Clifford convicted and sentenced to 8 years: 2nd May 2014

Post by sallypelt on 02.05.14 18:48

@diatribe wrote:
@russiandoll wrote:




  that is irrelevant...the girls allowing themselves to be coerced due to their ambitions was not a criminal act. Your remark here reminds me of the old attitude shown by the media when innocent women [ as opposed to experienced women or prostitutes ] were sexually assaulted or raped.

But is it irrelevant, Russian, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong, but weren't all of the offences that Clifford was convicted of against the same two women and further, were they not offences committed on separate occasions, hence the separate indictments.

My friend does a bit of glamour modelling and she has categorically informed me that if on a shoot, a photographer in any way acted inappropriately towards her, she sure as hell wouldn't go back for seconds.
Diatribe, what a hypocrite. When I said that my daughter is a law student to make a point, you slated me, now you are doing exactly the same thing to make YOUR point, by stating "My friend does a bit of glamour modelling....".

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