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The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

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The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 05.10.12 17:26

Reading the points of view on the latest fund started for April on the other thread, and after just watching people in the town with baskets full of pink ribbons with signs saying donations to April's fund I was just wondering why some cases and not others. Was there a fund for missing Claudia Lawrence? Although an adult, she still has a family who is missing a loved one. Also the case of Joana Yeates, again an adult, and missing for days before she was found, sadly dead, again with a family, was there a fund? Those two just spring to my mind.

What sort of problems does it bring if any? My opinion is that is a dangerous template which could encourage unscrupulous evil people/parents to try this. The for points of course are it will help the family. Anyone have any thoughts on this.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by PeterMac on 05.10.12 18:08

Didn't the Matthews clan try to start one ?

What could a "Fund" possibly be for ?
The family are not facing extra costs, there are no travel or accommodation implications, they do not need legal advice, they do not need to hire private detectives, so what is the money actually for ?

They are now talking, as I type, about receiving donations of food and drink for the search and rescue teams, which is great, since most of them operate as Charities. But that is totally different from a "Fund" for the family.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 05.10.12 18:26

This on the BBC website from article............

The town council said it has decided to create April's Fund after receiving calls from across the UK from people eager to donate money for April and her family.

A website will be created later on Friday so that people can donate online, as well as in collection boxes around the town.

Machynlleth mayor Gareth Jones said April's family would decide what the money would be spent on.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-19840165

Perhaps the money will be spent on a memorial garden, assuming we believe what the police are telling us that it is a murder inquiry now, or something like that for little April

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 05.10.12 18:59

I really can't see any pros in setting up a fund in these circumstances and, apart from you-know-who, I can't think of anyone who has.

This link has some relevance - it's about keeping money in an account as a reward for information leading to a missing person being found and the importance of it not being misused.

http://www.ojjdp.gov/pubs/childismissing/ch6.html

Any money being sent unasked by the public should in my view be donated to a respectable charity.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by aquila on 05.10.12 19:04

candyfloss wrote:This on the BBC website from article............

The town council said it has decided to create April's Fund after receiving calls from across the UK from people eager to donate money for April and her family.

A website will be created later on Friday so that people can donate online, as well as in collection boxes around the town.

Machynlleth mayor Gareth Jones said April's family would decide what the money would be spent on.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-19840165

Perhaps the money will be spent on a memorial garden, assuming we believe what the police are telling us that it is a murder inquiry now, or something like that for little April

I seem to recall the same mayor saying yesterday on Sky News something to the tune of 'it will be for the community to decide about what the fund would be spent on' which brings to mind that old saying 'a camel is a horse drawn by a committee' and now it is for April's family. Why? What do April's family need money for? Already there isn't a clear definition of the purpose of a fund.

No-one is going to cut off a utility in a crisis of this magnitude for April's family (and I'm not saying they haven't paid their bills). There will be food in their home and their house will be warm and their immediate needs will be taken care of by the family liaison team who are trained to deal with this, and don't forget the neighbours of a small community who provide practical care too.

I can't see the point of a fund. I CAN see the point of providing funds to voluntary/charitable rescue services which have an ongoing value and commitment.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 05.10.12 19:10

I think of the two policewomen who gave their lives in the protection of others, I think of the soldiers who die every day giving their lives for our country, who these days barely get a mention on the news, just a couple of lines and the family has been informed etc. This case has obviously touched people's hearts, but there are so many deserving cases out there. The problem is people at such a time send in money because it is the only way they think they can help, but it should be carefully managed. But I totally disagree with the line in the BBC article about collection boxes in the town, this makes people feel they have to put something in.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by rainbow-fairy on 05.10.12 22:35

Nope, no Pro's to these 'Funds' for me at all. A very dangerous precedent to set, whether innocent or not.

I do wonder is it a desperate need to feel you are 'doing something'? Obviously I live far, far too far away to participate in searches etc. Is the next thing 'throw money at it - my conscience is clear now as I've done something?
Personally, I cannot see any point or value to a fund in a case like this at all. No amount of money is going to bring a child back safely if they are beyond help already, a child doesn't bring money into a household so the household won't be suffering as a result (emotionally, obviously). IMO, if it were me I would be offended, deeply offended, to think that anyone could possibly believe a few pounds here and there would ease my pain or longing for my missing child. I truly believe people need to THINK about what it can possibly achieve in the short or long term. Sometimes, we have to face the fact we are helpless and their is nothing to be done. The attitude of 'throw some money I've done my bit' may appease consciences but achieves zero.

Can someone please correct me if I am mistaken - I don't recall any 'Funds' set up before MMC - reward money yes - 'Fund' no?

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 05.10.12 22:44

As I mentioned previously I certainly can't think of any other funds in this context. Neither could the writer of the review on the fund - link to that for the benefit of new members.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id405.html

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by aquila on 06.10.12 15:02

@rainbow-fairy wrote:Nope, no Pro's to these 'Funds' for me at all. A very dangerous precedent to set, whether innocent or not.

I do wonder is it a desperate need to feel you are 'doing something'? Obviously I live far, far too far away to participate in searches etc. Is the next thing 'throw money at it - my conscience is clear now as I've done something?
Personally, I cannot see any point or value to a fund in a case like this at all. No amount of money is going to bring a child back safely if they are beyond help already, a child doesn't bring money into a household so the household won't be suffering as a result (emotionally, obviously). IMO, if it were me I would be offended, deeply offended, to think that anyone could possibly believe a few pounds here and there would ease my pain or longing for my missing child. I truly believe people need to THINK about what it can possibly achieve in the short or long term. Sometimes, we have to face the fact we are helpless and their is nothing to be done. The attitude of 'throw some money I've done my bit' may appease consciences but achieves zero.

Can someone please correct me if I am mistaken - I don't recall any 'Funds' set up before MMC - reward money yes - 'Fund' no?

Hi Rainbow-fairy. How right you are.

Unfortunately the great and kind UK public are bombarded with pleas to donate to this and that. There are so many adverts on television to appeal to the consciences of the kind, hammer the guilt factor in a big way (fear and guilt are the ONLY things that sell this product)...3 pounds a month can feed someone, sponsor a child, save a leopard etc. Then there are the people knocking on your door with their direct debit forms, the people in the street doing much the same or rattling tins. This is a form of social conditioning imo. Charities are big business with lots of competition in the marketplace. Charities are on our tv screens everyday. Charities are on our streets everyday. Charities are in our offices everyday (dress down Friday, wear a ribbon for this, that or the other).

Charities choose front people from celebs to sporting heroes of the day who are in the constant face of the media. Charities choose their targets specifically. Charities are no different from any other business. Charities do market research and use expensive consultants to promote themselves. Charities have overheads that are not openly disclosed when they ask for 3 pounds per month. Charities choose to recruit expensive people for their boards of trustees.

I've said the word 'charity' quite a lot because I'm not sure if the big charities actually deliver a miniscule of their intention/purpose. They certainly don't report in detail to my knowledge.

Then there is a 'fund'. It is only since Madeleine went missing that I have understood what a fund is. My opinion is that it is rotten to its core. It is covered by business rules and commercial accounting. It can change its purpose at anytime it wants and provide the minimal reports on its reason for being and yet gun for more donations without a conscience of its own. It can appeal to people who don't have time to read the smallprint and think the money is going directly to the headline on a webpage. Those people are the kind people who are spoon-fed the initial blurb.

I cannot see why April's family need a fund. In the last few days of April's disappearance we have seen local shopkeepers making pink bows. We have seen now that they are being offered on the streets with a basket to collect money. Money for what?

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by ShuBob on 06.10.12 20:27

I can't think of a single pro. I believe the authorities and certain charities provide assistance to the families who find themselves in these sort of situations.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by PeterMac on 06.10.12 20:34

I always worry that if I agree to Sponsor a Polar Bear, if I don't keep up the payments, they will one day deliver it !

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by tigger on 06.10.12 21:38

No Fund for Sarah Payne, was there a Fund for Soham? I don't think so. So when did this Fund thing for lost children start? Would that be about 5 years ago?

Can hardly believe that, not original thinkers, there must have been a precedent. Or someone involved in Soham might have remembered that the public wished to donate money but the parents weren't interested? I'm just guessing here. Is there even one precedent earlier than the McCanns?

In any case, this is following the McCann template fairly well. The ribbons, the town festooned in the stuff (Rothley was) , the Fund, the series of photographs, the main use of the cutest but least useful photograph and even after someone has been charged with murder, the nationwide appeal to find her.
I don't like it.

Kate McCann was asked to speak to Madeleine (in an interview) in case she was watching TV with her abductor(s). She couldn't - she was completely taken aback. It seemed to be pretty well the last thing on her mind and probably wasn't in the script.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by bobbin on 06.10.12 21:51

@PeterMac wrote:I always worry that if I agree to Sponsor a Polar Bear, if I don't keep up the payments, they will one day deliver it !

Don't worry, with all this apparent 'global warming' he won't need to be delivered, he'll just swim round to your house, to collect it himself.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 06.10.12 23:07

Funds are wrong IMO, unless it's to help a family get urgent medical treatment or something, if it's not something that can be provided here and they have to travel abroad. But when it gets involved whilst there is an ongoing investigation by Police - no. Locals can always donate quietly and privately if traumatised families miss work because of the circumstances, but all the trumpeting about it goes in Room 101 along with cellophane wrapped carnations tied to railings IMO. It's part of the grief tourism, tragedy vampires, all the public show of it.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by jd on 06.10.12 23:55

@tigger wrote:No Fund for Sarah Payne, was there a Fund for Soham? I don't think so. So when did this Fund thing for lost children start? Would that be about 5 years ago?

Can hardly believe that, not original thinkers, there must have been a precedent. Or someone involved in Soham might have remembered that the public wished to donate money but the parents weren't interested? I'm just guessing here. Is there even one precedent earlier than the McCanns?

In any case, this is following the McCann template fairly well. The ribbons, the town festooned in the stuff (Rothley was) , the Fund, the series of photographs, the main use of the cutest but least useful photograph and even after someone has been charged with murder, the nationwide appeal to find her.
I don't like it.

Kate McCann was asked to speak to Madeleine (in an interview) in case she was watching TV with her abductor(s). She couldn't - she was completely taken aback. It seemed to be pretty well the last thing on her mind and probably wasn't in the script.
Yes the cutest picture but not one that was representative of what Maddie looked liked at the time of 4 years old for the public to look for. Says all you need to know really

The interview I think you mean the one on channel 5. I always remember this one. Its at the end around 4.41 when they were asked to give a message to Maddie. Their reaction, their words, their looks on their faces does not need any words to describe it


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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by Guest on 07.10.12 0:02

Good grief. I would have been more passionate if it was about my dog.
[No offense to dogs and dog lovers ... ]

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by jd on 07.10.12 0:20

Hold on!!!! Oh what words of encouragement and belief!

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by tigger on 07.10.12 8:03

@jd wrote:Hold on!!!! Oh what words of encouragement and belief!

But they can't even look at the camera when they're doing it.

The question 'did you think you'd .still be.... a year on' wasn't answered correctly. Gerry should have answered that he is on record as saying he had planned a one year anniversary of the disappearance as early as the previous June. Less than two months after she disappeared. Who needs psychics when you have such a natural talent yourself. bad

'..she's being looked after.' says Kate. In that case in a normal family she might be watching tv - all the more reason to look at the camera.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by jd on 07.10.12 9:36

@tigger wrote:
@jd wrote:Hold on!!!! Oh what words of encouragement and belief!

But they can't even look at the camera when they're doing it.

The question 'did you think you'd .still be.... a year on' wasn't answered correctly. Gerry should have answered that he is on record as saying he had planned a one year anniversary of the disappearance as early as the previous June. Less than two months after she disappeared. Who needs psychics when you have such a natural talent yourself. bad

'..she's being looked after.' says Kate. In that case in a normal family she might be watching tv - all the more reason to look at the camera.

They are just making it up as they go along....the look (and smirk) on gerry mccanns face when asked to send a message to Maddie is priceless. Never in my life have I seen a parent half laughing when asked to send a message to their missing child

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Concerns Raised Over “Find Lisa Irwin” Website Fundraising

Post by Guest on 02.11.12 14:27

This from a twitter link,

Concerns Raised Over “Find Lisa Irwin” Website Fundraising


Posted on: 7:00 pm, November 1, 2012, by John Pepitone



KANSAS CITY – It’s been more than a year since Lisa Irwin disappeared from her Northland home. Despite the offer of a $100,000 reward, a separate Lisa Irwin organization is now soliciting donations from the public – and some are questioning why the fundraising is necessary.

The “Find Lisa Irwin” website claims all the donations will be used to raise awareness and to bring Lisa home. But this foundation is not registered with the Missouri Secretary of State. The communications director for that office says because it’s not registered, the state doesn’t know if it’s a legitimate nonprofit organization.

On the official Lisa Irwin website there’s now a donate button where you can make a contribution through Pay Pal to the Lisa Irwin Hope Foundation. The site claims donations also are accepted at any Wells Fargo branch. The solicitation suggests money will be used to print and mail flyers, and produce bracelets, shirts and bumper stickers.

But on Facebook groups dedicated to the Irwin case, many are questioning this fundraising. One woman writes: “Lisa Irwin is a victim, not a brand. Those parents are shameful.”

Cherri West and her family have benefited first-hand from the generosity of others. After her daughter, Pamela Butler, was kidnapped and murdered 13 years ago, Kansas Citians opened up their hearts and wallets, donating more than $100,000 to a fund for West’s family.

“You should know who set it up, and who has control over it,” West said. She’s thankful that donors made the fund into a trust, with volunteers serving as trustees to guide her on how the money should be spent.

“When you have it like that. you just have all kinds of people who come out, need help, want you to help them,” West said. “And if I could, I would. But I didn’t have control of that. it was set up through a trust and a trust said this is how that will work.”

Instead of giving money to others who wanted it, West says she was able to buy a home, furnish it and recevie an allowance every 6 months to buy clothes for her two surviving daughters. When the youngest girl turned 21, the remaining trust funds were split three ways. One daughter used the money to purchase a home, another to buy a car, and west says she used her share to pay bills.

But she shudders to think what would have happened if there were not strict rules governing her fund.

“Just be careful what you’re donating to,” West said. “If it’s not trusted, don’t do it. People can so easily be taken advantage of.”

FOX 4 News talked with the woman who established the account for the Lisa Irwin Hope Foundation. She is Kathleen Costas, a cousin of Lisa’s mother, Deborah Bradley. Costas, who lives in Florida, says the account is a special taxable fund established through Wells Fargo. Costas oversees all spending from the account.

She assured FOX4 News it’s not going to be used for the family’s normal day-to-day living expenses, calling the criticism of the fund: “Total Facebook gossip.”

Costas says it will only be used to pay for bumper stickers, flyers and other materials used in the family’s search for Lisa Irwin

http://fox4kc.com/2012/11/01/concerns-raised-over-find-lisa-irwin-website-fundraising/

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by PeterMac on 02.11.12 15:05

candyfloss wrote:
Cherri West and her family have benefited first-hand from the generosity of others. After her daughter, Pamela Butler, was kidnapped and murdered 13 years ago, Kansas Citians opened up their hearts and wallets, donating more than $100,000 to a fund for West’s family.

“You should know who set it up, and who has control over it,” West said. She’s thankful that donors made the fund into a trust, with volunteers serving as trustees to guide her on how the money should be spent.

Instead of giving money to others who wanted it, West says she was able to buy a home, furnish it and recevie an allowance every 6 months to buy clothes for her two surviving daughters. When the youngest girl turned 21, the remaining trust funds were split three ways. One daughter used the money to purchase a home, another to buy a car, and west says she used her share to pay bills.

But she shudders to think what would have happened if there were not strict rules governing her fund.
“Just be careful what you’re donating to,” West said. “If it’s not trusted, don’t do it. People can so easily be taken advantage of.”

FOX 4 News talked with the woman who established the account for the Lisa Irwin Hope Foundation. She is Kathleen Costas, a cousin of Lisa’s mother, Deborah Bradley. Costas, who lives in Florida, says the account is a special taxable fund established through Wells Fargo. Costas oversees all spending from the account.

She assured FOX4 News it’s not going to be used for the family’s normal day-to-day living expenses, calling the criticism of the fund: “Total Facebook gossip.”
Costas says it will only be used to pay for bumper stickers, flyers and other materials used in the family’s search for Lisa Irwin
Is it me, or is that just gross ?
You lose a daughter and the other daughters are able to buy houses and cars out of public donations.
Why ?
If it had been the breadwinner in the family I could being to understand it, but can anyone explain what is going on here.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by ShuBob on 02.11.12 15:08

It's not just you PM.

No less than two houses and a car were purchased as a result of the fund. Well, it could be that the fund objectives were clearly set out from the off so everyone- including donors- were happy how the money was spent

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by chrissie on 02.11.12 15:19

It's obscene in my opinion. The money should have gone to help other missing children.

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by PeterMac on 02.11.12 16:12

It reminds me of those appeals to send children from the back streets of Wherever, who had terminal illness, to Disneyland.
Entire streets poured funds in, but then the vast extended family joined the jolly, uncles, aunts, nephews, nieces, people who thought they might once have met them.
And it was always Florida. Couldn't be on the one outside Paris.
And some of the children were barely functioning, and certainly couldn't appreciate or enjoy the experience.
Eventually the comedians got hold of it, and it seems to have stopped.

I told my little son we were going to Disneyland and he burst into tears, and said, "Does that mean I've got cancer ?"

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Re: The Pro's and Cons of starting a fund for missing people/children

Post by aiyoyo on 02.11.12 16:20

This is a template started by a couple who needs the fund for lawyers to salvage their reputation, nothing to do with a missing child.

It's is a bad precedent so it is not right for people to copy it blindly without looking at the objective for the Fund. If April Jones parents or the council cannot decide what to do with the fund, what was the valid reason to start it in the first place?

When the findmadeleinefund is exposed for the scam it is, then people will wake up.
That is why it is critical that the Police investigate mccanns pte ltd company.

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