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Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

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Is Operation Grange a no-holds-barred search for the truth re Madeleine?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Hummingbird on 30.05.12 11:29

@nomendelta wrote:Those hopeful of SY establishing the truth and thinking Redwood was playing the game forget one pertinent fact.

The McCanns WANTED the review. Through seemingly nefarious means they got the review as part of their deal with NI for serialising the bewk. Hardly a card they would play if they thought they'd come off worst.

Yeah see now that's what I can never put my finger on, why if you are guilty would you ask for a review unless you already knew what the outcome would be?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by nomendelta on 30.05.12 11:58

@Hummingbird wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:Those hopeful of SY establishing the truth and thinking Redwood was playing the game forget one pertinent fact.

The McCanns WANTED the review. Through seemingly nefarious means they got the review as part of their deal with NI for serialising the bewk. Hardly a card they would play if they thought they'd come off worst.

Yeah see now that's what I can never put my finger on, why if you are guilty would you ask for a review unless you already knew what the outcome would be?

Exactly!

Most of us had assumed the McCanns were publicly being seen to be happy about the review when in fact they were bricking it behind the scenes. This was when we thought that they hadn't expected a review to happen and had been taken by surprise. It seems very much to be exactly the opposite.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Guest on 30.05.12 12:08

@nomendelta wrote:
@Hummingbird wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:Those hopeful of SY establishing the truth and thinking Redwood was playing the game forget one pertinent fact.

The McCanns WANTED the review. Through seemingly nefarious means they got the review as part of their deal with NI for serialising the bewk. Hardly a card they would play if they thought they'd come off worst.

Yeah see now that's what I can never put my finger on, why if you are guilty would you ask for a review unless you already knew what the outcome would be?

Exactly!

Most of us had assumed the McCanns were publicly being seen to be happy about the review when in fact they were bricking it behind the scenes. This was when we thought that they hadn't expected a review to happen and had been taken by surprise. It seems very much to be exactly the opposite.



If the review was already happening as stated by Theresa May, and Alan Johnson had begun it the year before that, and the McCanns weren't allowed to see the report which was deemed "sensitive" then perhaps this was maybe just put out there as spin to make it look like they had pressed for it?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Hummingbird on 30.05.12 12:21

candyfloss wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:
@Hummingbird wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:Those hopeful of SY establishing the truth and thinking Redwood was playing the game forget one pertinent fact.

The McCanns WANTED the review. Through seemingly nefarious means they got the review as part of their deal with NI for serialising the bewk. Hardly a card they would play if they thought they'd come off worst.

Yeah see now that's what I can never put my finger on, why if you are guilty would you ask for a review unless you already knew what the outcome would be?

Exactly!

Most of us had assumed the McCanns were publicly being seen to be happy about the review when in fact they were bricking it behind the scenes. This was when we thought that they hadn't expected a review to happen and had been taken by surprise. It seems very much to be exactly the opposite.



If the review was already happening as stated by Theresa May, and Alan Johnson had begun it the year before that, and the McCanns weren't allowed to see the report which was deemed "sensitive" then perhaps this was maybe just put out there as spin to make it look like they had pressed for it?

Well that would be the same as most of the games TM play now wouldn't it, make the 'public' feel sorry for them and think they are doing everything in their power to find their daughter, when in fact the truth is, as nomendelta put it, they are bricking themselves!!!!!
Let's hope and pray you are right and that SY are doing a worthy job and waiting (as I always hoped) for the right time to pounce - 'with the sensitive info'!

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by T4two on 30.05.12 12:27

candyfloss wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:
@Hummingbird wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:Those hopeful of SY establishing the truth and thinking Redwood was playing the game forget one pertinent fact.

The McCanns WANTED the review. Through seemingly nefarious means they got the review as part of their deal with NI for serialising the bewk. Hardly a card they would play if they thought they'd come off worst.

Yeah see now that's what I can never put my finger on, why if you are guilty would you ask for a review unless you already knew what the outcome would be?

Exactly!

Most of us had assumed the McCanns were publicly being seen to be happy about the review when in fact they were bricking it behind the scenes. This was when we thought that they hadn't expected a review to happen and had been taken by surprise. It seems very much to be exactly the opposite.



If the review was already happening as stated by Theresa May, and Alan Johnson had begun it the year before that, and the McCanns weren't allowed to see the report which was deemed "sensitive" then perhaps this was maybe just put out there as spin to make it look like they had pressed for it?

Bernard Hogan-Howe is the present head of Scotland Yard and he is the man who as Chief Constable of Liverpool led the release of balloons on behalf of the McCanns as recently as 2011. I just cannot see this man ordering a no holds barred investigation which by definition would have to include the exclusion of the parents as a very first step.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by nomendelta on 30.05.12 12:57

candyfloss wrote:



If the review was already happening as stated by Theresa May, and Alan Johnson had begun it the year before that, and the McCanns weren't allowed to see the report which was deemed "sensitive" then perhaps this was maybe just put out there as spin to make it look like they had pressed for it?

Or is it more likely Theresa May is spinning it? After all she was the one threatened by NI. Front page promised every day.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by monkey mind on 30.05.12 13:05

@nomendelta wrote:T4two in answer to that last paragraph...

How does that tally with Redwood's statement that a "forensic review of the timeline" that allows for an abduction to take place? Something which we on this forum largely think is impossible based on OUR various reviews of the timeline(s).

How does it tally with Redwood stating unequivocably that he believe Maddie to be alive?

Further, how does it tally with Redwood stating that he wants to "bring closure for the family". Not "find the truth" or get "justice for Maddie".

I think after a year to be no further forward, to not be wanting to plug the gaping holes in the various statements by the T9 and to be encouraging yet more false sightings with a bland "everygirl" photo...it's obvious the direction this review is taking.

Exactly!


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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by T4two on 30.05.12 13:11

@nomendelta wrote:
candyfloss wrote:



If the review was already happening as stated by Theresa May, and Alan Johnson had begun it the year before that, and the McCanns weren't allowed to see the report which was deemed "sensitive" then perhaps this was maybe just put out there as spin to make it look like they had pressed for it?

Or is it more likely Theresa May is spinning it? After all she was the one threatened by NI. Front page promised every day.


A politician and particularly a member of the government could never admit to even being influenced by the media let alone pressured or blackmailed. If people at Murdoch's News International or a woman accused of perverting the course of justice intimated otherwise I'd react in exactly the same way as Theresa May and gently point out that decisions they claim to have influenced were already taken via normal decision-making processes without outside interference by the media. I'll never forget the line which was spun after Blair's first election victory, "It was the Sun wot won it". Making a big thing of your own importance no doubt helps to sell newspapers.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by ShuBob on 30.05.12 13:12

@T4two wrote:
Bernard Hogan-Howe is the present head of Scotland Yard and he is the man who as Chief Constable of Liverpool led the release of balloons on behalf of the McCanns as recently as 2011. I just cannot see this man ordering a no holds barred investigation which by definition would have to include the exclusion of the parents as a very first step.

Where is the evidence for this? As far as I know, NONE exists but I'll be happy to be put right.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by monkey mind on 30.05.12 13:15

@PeterMac wrote:The picture of the police officer in Bali standing behind the woman with all that cocaine tells its own story.
She is white and western and therefore invincible.
He is dark and eastern and eats sardines and bean sprouts, and is therefore by definition useless.
Tell that to the firing squad, madam ! They probably can't shoot straight anyway.

big grin lol! big grin

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Guest on 30.05.12 13:16

@ShuBob wrote:
@T4two wrote:
Bernard Hogan-Howe is the present head of Scotland Yard and he is the man who as Chief Constable of Liverpool led the release of balloons on behalf of the McCanns as recently as 2011. I just cannot see this man ordering a no holds barred investigation which by definition would have to include the exclusion of the parents as a very first step.

Where is the evidence for this? As far as I know, NONE exists but I'll be happy to be put right.



Perfectly true..........

The balloons will cost a pound to sponsor and all money will go to the Madeleine appeal fund.

The Chief Constable of Merseyside Police - Bernard Hogan Howe will lead the release of balloons on the highest point of Liverpool inner city on Mossley Hill Field at 1400 BST.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6761027.stm

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by ShuBob on 30.05.12 13:18

candyfloss wrote:
@ShuBob wrote:
@T4two wrote:
Bernard Hogan-Howe is the present head of Scotland Yard and he is the man who as Chief Constable of Liverpool led the release of balloons on behalf of the McCanns as recently as 2011. I just cannot see this man ordering a no holds barred investigation which by definition would have to include the exclusion of the parents as a very first step.

Where is the evidence for this? As far as I know, NONE exists but I'll be happy to be put right.



Perfectly true..........

The balloons will cost a pound to sponsor and all money will go to the Madeleine appeal fund.

The Chief Constable of Merseyside Police - Bernard Hogan Howe will lead the release of balloons on the highest point of Liverpool inner city on Mossley Hill Field at 1400 BST.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6761027.stm

What part of that REPORT is "perfectly true"? Did he lead the balloons release? If so, where is the evidence that he did so?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by T4two on 30.05.12 13:27

@monkey mind wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:T4two in answer to that last paragraph...

How does that tally with Redwood's statement that a "forensic review of the timeline" that allows for an abduction to take place? Something which we on this forum largely think is impossible based on OUR various reviews of the timeline(s).

How does it tally with Redwood stating unequivocably that he believe Maddie to be alive?

Further, how does it tally with Redwood stating that he wants to "bring closure for the family". Not "find the truth" or get "justice for Maddie".

I think after a year to be no further forward, to not be wanting to plug the gaping holes in the various statements by the T9 and to be encouraging yet more false sightings with a bland "everygirl" photo...it's obvious the direction this review is taking.

Exactly!


Exactly! exactly! The answer to all questions is that it does not tally and this is a very strong reason to suspect that the whole review is a sham. In the case of a missing infant, the first thing that any investigation must ascertain without the shadow of a doubt is that the parents are not involved. If this is not being done then the question why is it not being done is a perfectly legitimate question. Why are the McCanns off limits? Why is the detective leading this 'review' appearing on TV programmes talking as though he were the successor to Dave Edgar? Why call it a review - why isn't it a criminal investigation?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by bobbin on 30.05.12 14:51

Shuhbob said

"What part of that REPORT is "perfectly true"? Did he lead the balloons release? If so, where is the evidence that he did so?"

I have looked and all reports refer back to the BBC one, even the
Joanna Morais member posting reference back to the one BBC report,
namely that Hogan-Howe 'WILL' release the balloons. So far I have not
been able to find any report that he actually did.

I found one entry for Bernard Hogan-Howe linked with the Red Balloon, learning centres for bullied children

Could this reference to B.H-H be more McCann/N.I./BBC spin to make it sound more important
and that the police force thinks that the McCs are kosher.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Guest on 30.05.12 14:55

@bobbin wrote:Shuhbob said

"What part of that REPORT is "perfectly true"? Did he lead the balloons release? If so, where is the evidence that he did so?"

I have looked and all reports refer back to the BBC one, even the
Joanna Morais member posting reference back to the one BBC report,
namely that Hogan-Howe 'WILL' release the balloons. So far I have not
been able to find any report that he actually did.

I found one entry for Bernard Hogan-Howe linked with the Red Balloon, learning centres for bullied children

Could this reference to B.H-H be more McCann/N.I./BBC spin to make it sound more important
and that the police force thinks that the McCs are kosher.

Yes, you are right, I have googled and nothing comes up but that BBC report I posted earlier, and other articles and blogs that link to it. I even looked at GM's blogs, where it mentions the balloon launch etc, being held in various locations, asking for people to upload their photos, but no mention of that one or Bernard Hogan-Howe.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by ShuBob on 30.05.12 15:07

Thanks Bobbin.

You confirm the point I was making that no evidence in the public domain exists that links BH-H to the actual balloon release. There are already many evidenced dodgy characters and dodgy dealings associated with this case and I don't think it helps to make such accusations as has been repeatedly made against BH-H without any basis in fact.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by bobbin on 30.05.12 15:10

@ShuBob wrote:Thanks Bobbin.

You confirm the point I was making that no evidence in the public domain exists that links BH-H to the actual balloon release. There are already many evidenced dodgy characters and dodgy dealings associated with this case and I don't think it helps to make such accusations as has been repeatedly made against BH-H without any basis in fact.

It would be good now, if he is kosher, and if he will oversee a police force that can actually carry out an honest investigation....can only hope.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Guest on 30.05.12 15:18

@ShuBob wrote:Thanks Bobbin.

You confirm the point I was making that no evidence in the public domain exists that links BH-H to the actual balloon release. There are already many evidenced dodgy characters and dodgy dealings associated with this case and I don't think it helps to make such accusations as has been repeatedly made against BH-H without any basis in fact.

ShuBob, no-one was making accusations as far as I could tell, it was mentioned he led the balloon launch, which actually is mentioned and still there on the BBC website. Perhaps someone should email the BBC and ask if this happened, or where the info came from?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by ShuBob on 30.05.12 15:55

The actual report claimed he "will lead" and not that he "led" which are two different things.

I will not labour the point any further.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by jd on 30.05.12 17:59

If his name is in line to release the balloons & in the press about it, then this is enough information to know the SY review is a whitewash. Unless he became ill on the day or something then by saying he will lead means he has agreed to do it. I guess SY won't be getting Maddie her justice

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Snifferdog on 01.06.12 11:32

Things are falling apart for some, and things previously hidden are coming out into the light to be examined and acted upon. I wonder how far up the sack will unravell, exposing the Worm within. I hope there are still some honest and upstanding people who are able to pull the string further and expose the whole rotten system in all its shame. An uncorrupted brave informed individual who is ambitious (in a healthy way), may stand to gain a lot in the eyes of the public...Here's hoping that such a person exists within the present system.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by aquila on 01.06.12 12:33

@Snifferdog wrote:Things are falling apart for some, and things previously hidden are coming out into the light to be examined and acted upon. I wonder how far up the sack will unravell, exposing the Worm within. I hope there are still some honest and upstanding people who are able to pull the string further and expose the whole rotten system in all its shame. An uncorrupted brave informed individual who is ambitious (in a healthy way), may stand to gain a lot in the eyes of the public...Here's hoping that such a person exists within the present system.

I hope they exist in every country Snifferdog. How is South Africa doing for these types of folk?

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by Snifferdog on 01.06.12 13:00

Do you mean corruption gvt wise Aquila? The same usual stuff, though the press does expose it here though sure what we get to hear is only the tip of the iceberg. Some new interesting corruption expose re. the new Gauteng Toll Road...

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by aquila on 01.06.12 13:08

@Snifferdog wrote:Do you mean corruption gvt wise Aquila? The same usual stuff, though the press does expose it here though sure what we get to hear is only the tip of the iceberg. Some new interesting corruption expose re. the new Gauteng Toll Road...

Perhaps we could have this conversation in the Members Lounge and not railroad this topic.

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Re: Is Operation Grange, the 37-strong Scotland Yard Review Team reviewing the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, a wholehearted, no-holds-barred search for the truth?

Post by friedtomatoes on 01.06.12 14:08

@Snifferdog wrote:Things are falling apart for some, and things previously hidden are coming out into the light to be examined and acted upon. I wonder how far up the sack will unravell, exposing the Worm within. I hope there are still some honest and upstanding people who are able to pull the string further and expose the whole rotten system in all its shame. An uncorrupted brave informed individual who is ambitious (in a healthy way), may stand to gain a lot in the eyes of the public...Here's hoping that such a person exists within the present system.

You never know. Police have been arresting people left right and centre around this phone hacking enquiry, the whole Leveson inquiry, then the Mets review. Maybe one of them will set something off. Who knows, perhaps soca will get involved if the fund is shown to have holes in it. Halligen is in custody, surely the Met at some stage will question him too. What happened to the satellite images the yanks have apparently handed over to the British police recently, the ones they refused to give to the PJ when asked? And not forgetting C Mitchell who has not been invited to speak at Levesons inquiry.....yet. That would be interesting. And lastly, I dont believe for a nanosecond they will ignore the dog findings.

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