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my verdict and if they came clean

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Cristobell on 02.04.12 13:23

Any mother who truly believed her child was in the hands of paedophiles would be a non functioning basket case, yet we have never seen that real heart churning grief that is tangible in other cases. Their obsession with wrecking other lives, takes this into a league of its own, and we can only hope that the full extent of the crimes that have been committed will eventually be exposed.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by russiandoll on 02.04.12 13:47

Amen to that. I could have felt pity and sympathy for a couple who covered up an accidental death in a panic, only if it were to try to stay with their other children by avoiding prison, not for any other reason such as salvaging careers and /or reputations. Coming to their senses and coming clean very soon afterwards would have kept my sympathy to a certain extent , diminished due to neglecting their child and so contributing to what had happened to her.
It is the continued lies and manipulation and games of smoke and mirrors all these years later that make me feel nothing but contempt for them, to carry on this charade for this long and devalue and abuse their daughter's memory is beyond anything I can try to understand and their hatred for Amaral and those who dare question their version of what happened, the vindictiveness and malice they have shown, is staggering. They are in my eyes truly deranged.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by PeterMac on 02.04.12 14:48

@Cristobell wrote:Any mother who truly believed her child was in the hands of paedophiles would be a non functioning basket case, yet we have never seen that real heart churning grief that is tangible in other cases. Their obsession with wrecking other lives, takes this into a league of its own, and we can only hope that the full extent of the crimes that have been committed will eventually be exposed.
Precisely.
To an extent one could almost begin to understand the failure to search on the first night if they were both 'gibbering wrecks'. Other people have required medical attention at a time like this, But neither has ever put that forward. What we got was "yer 'no, er, we were incredibly busy' or some such tosh. The exact words escape me.
We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days.
What we got was defiance - "find the body ...", long term plans for 100 days, 6 months, anniversaries, Christmas messages, trips round the world, smiles, and an admission that she was sleeping well within 5 days. And of course pleas for money. And more money
And this bizarre insistence that there is no evidence that she has come to harm at the same time as "purporting the theory' that this is indeed her fate.

As somebody has probably already said, once or twice - it makes no sense.


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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by anil39200 on 02.04.12 15:13

Starting from the interview where the mother was asked if they physically searched and responded negatively but stated ' but we be been werking really hard' right up to the recent video by HideHo countering their constant belittling of the PJ investigation and their xenophobic attempts to make themselves the victims of some foreign failure, their lack of 'owning' responsibility for the fate of their daughter, the money aspect and its lack of transparency and the fact that gullible people have bought into the situation makes me believe that these people feel so superior to the rest of us that they van get away with anything. However. Having had some experience studying real religious people I can say that there is some substance to the law of karma, or simply put, what goes around,comes around. I firmly believe that this will apply. Another sayong, pride comes before a fall is also applicable. Ot does not matter how deceitful or arrogant a person is, they always get their just desserts in the end.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by rainbow-fairy on 02.04.12 17:50

@russiandoll wrote: Amen to that. I could have felt pity and sympathy for a couple who covered up an accidental death in a panic, only if it were to try to stay with their other children by avoiding prison, not for any other reason such as salvaging careers and /or reputations. Coming to their senses and coming clean very soon afterwards would have kept my sympathy to a certain extent , diminished due to neglecting their child and so contributing to what had happened to her.
It is the continued lies and manipulation and games of smoke and mirrors all these years later that make me feel nothing but contempt for them, to carry on this charade for this long and devalue and abuse their daughter's memory is beyond anything I can try to understand and their hatred for Amaral and those who dare question their version of what happened, the vindictiveness and malice they have shown, is staggering. They are in my eyes truly deranged.



What upsets me is 'a paedophile took her' followed by 'there is no evidence she has come to serious harm' - err, really???

The absolute disrespect they have shown Madeleine utterly sickens me.

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Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Kololi on 02.04.12 19:37

PeterMac wrote,

"We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days."

We watched the Sport Relief night the other week. Everytime they broke from the entertainment and showed clips of what the money raised would be spent on, at home and abroad, I cried. Properly cried, not just a tear escaping but proper snivelly nose needing a tissue crying. My other half, whilst watching exactly what I was seeing, sat there appearing totally emotionless. I asked after a bit how he could not be moved by such images and was asked in return why I thought he wasn't moved. I am outwardly emotional and cannot help but show when something has touched me and he has an exterior made of stone and can hide his feelings really rather well.

I do not disagree with your comment PeterMac because I would have been that person you describe but having lived with a man for a great number of years who has reacted so differently from me during some very upsetting moments, I do wonder if it is a possibility that the McCanns may be made of the sterner stuff that my husband is able to draw upon when upset hits them.

And I apologise in advance for being pesky but we have seen the tears reaction and that mother ended up in jail.




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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Kololi on 02.04.12 19:44

@russiandoll wrote: a well thought- out post nomendelta. From Kololi's recent response to a post of yours:

"your comment that you would have wished a speedy death for them. I do think that there is probably only a minority that would not wish her to be found as the ideal although people in general may think it unlikely after all this time that she will be. "

Why would anyone, let alone a minority, not wish for a child to be found if she is indeed out there, having been abducted as claimed? I think some people would prefer a speedy end to a life that was being detroyed by abuse than that a child should suffer, that was the meaning of what was said as I understood it and it is with a heavy heart that I must agree.

I respect your comment Russiandoll but do not feel that it would be a sensible thing to further explain mine. I take your point though.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by tiny on 02.04.12 19:50

@Kololi wrote:PeterMac wrote,

"We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days."

We watched the Sport Relief night the other week. Everytime they broke from the entertainment and showed clips of what the money raised would be spent on, at home and abroad, I cried. Properly cried, not just a tear escaping but proper snivelly nose needing a tissue crying. My other half, whilst watching exactly what I was seeing, sat there appearing totally emotionless. I asked after a bit how he could not be moved by such images and was asked in return why I thought he wasn't moved. I am outwardly emotional and cannot help but show when something has touched me and he has an exterior made of stone and can hide his feelings really rather well.

I do not disagree with your comment PeterMac because I would have been that person you describe but having lived with a man for a great number of years who has reacted so differently from me during some very upsetting moments, I do wonder if it is a possibility that the McCanns may be made of the sterner stuff that my husband is able to draw upon when upset hits themAnd I apologise in advance for being pesky but we have seen the tears reaction and that mother ended up in jail.




kololi,

Madeleine was thier 3yr old daughter, not some one they didnt know personally as in your other halfs case,they are a very wierd couple to act the way they have since Madeleine has been gone.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Kololi on 02.04.12 19:57

@tiny wrote:
@Kololi wrote:PeterMac wrote,

"We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days."

We watched the Sport Relief night the other week. Everytime they broke from the entertainment and showed clips of what the money raised would be spent on, at home and abroad, I cried. Properly cried, not just a tear escaping but proper snivelly nose needing a tissue crying. My other half, whilst watching exactly what I was seeing, sat there appearing totally emotionless. I asked after a bit how he could not be moved by such images and was asked in return why I thought he wasn't moved. I am outwardly emotional and cannot help but show when something has touched me and he has an exterior made of stone and can hide his feelings really rather well.

I do not disagree with your comment PeterMac because I would have been that person you describe but having lived with a man for a great number of years who has reacted so differently from me during some very upsetting moments, I do wonder if it is a possibility that the McCanns may be made of the sterner stuff that my husband is able to draw upon when upset hits themAnd I apologise in advance for being pesky but we have seen the tears reaction and that mother ended up in jail.




kololi,

Madeleine was thier 3yr old daughter, not some one they didnt know personally as in your other halfs case,they are a very wierd couple to act the way they have since Madeleine has been gone.

Fair enough, but we have had some other rather upsetting moments during our time that were of a much more personal nature and it provoked the same reaction as watching babies die in Africa because they didn't have a piffling £5 vaccination. And I am not excusing all their behaviour - just trying to keep an open mind that's all.


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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by aiyoyo on 02.04.12 20:20

@PeterMac wrote:Forgiveness is something the McCanns just don't do, despite their alleged faith.
“Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.” Matthew 5:7
“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift.” Matthew 5:23-24
“And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive him, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins.” Mark 11:25
“But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also.” Luke 6:27-29
“Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.” Luke 6:36
“Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.” Luke 6:37
Elsewhere, it is said, "Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?” Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven. Matthew 18:21-22
"And Jesus said, 'Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.'" Luke 23: 34
But then Jesus did not have a legal team trying to make money for him.

HA HA HA big grin thumbsup ......Oh my goodness, PM, you made my day.

Just visualing Jesus with his legal team and someone like Isobel Hudson for paralegal in the team is enough to make me rofl

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by aiyoyo on 02.04.12 20:50

@PeterMac wrote:
@Cristobell wrote:Any mother who truly believed her child was in the hands of paedophiles would be a non functioning basket case, yet we have never seen that real heart churning grief that is tangible in other cases. Their obsession with wrecking other lives, takes this into a league of its own, and we can only hope that the full extent of the crimes that have been committed will eventually be exposed.
Precisely.
To an extent one could almost begin to understand the failure to search on the first night if they were both 'gibbering wrecks'. Other people have required medical attention at a time like this, But neither has ever put that forward. What we got was "yer 'no, er, we were incredibly busy' or some such tosh. The exact words escape me.
We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days.
What we got was defiance - "find the body ...", long term plans for 100 days, 6 months, anniversaries, Christmas messages, trips round the world, smiles, and an admission that she was sleeping well within 5 days. And of course pleas for money. And more money
And this bizarre insistence that there is no evidence that she has come to harm at the same time as "purporting the theory' that this is indeed her fate.

As somebody has probably already said, once or twice - it makes no sense.


I believe Kate said it was too dark! But that did not stop the search party comprising at least half the villagers out there searching on their behalf.

Their insistence there is no evidence she's come to any harm in the belief she was taken by paedophile just dont go together.

It's hard to understand how they can pray for the abductor who had taken their daughter and yet persecute and prosecute those who so much as questioned their version? It just goes to show their priority is all wrong unless it wasn't about priority because there is no priority to be given where the dead is concerned.

I don't understand the catholics confession thing because I can't equate confession of sin as absolution, because I see no absolution for sin even spent one. If confession equate to absolution, how does that apply to murderer?
If a murderer after spending years in prison had paid their debt to society should confess to their sin in Church, does it mean he is automatically guaranteed a place in heaven?

I am really confused about this confession thingie.



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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by aiyoyo on 02.04.12 21:08

@Kololi wrote:
@tiny wrote:
@Kololi wrote:PeterMac wrote,

"We would also have seen both breaking down in tears and unable to continue every time they were interviewed in those early days."

We watched the Sport Relief night the other week. Everytime they broke from the entertainment and showed clips of what the money raised would be spent on, at home and abroad, I cried. Properly cried, not just a tear escaping but proper snivelly nose needing a tissue crying. My other half, whilst watching exactly what I was seeing, sat there appearing totally emotionless. I asked after a bit how he could not be moved by such images and was asked in return why I thought he wasn't moved. I am outwardly emotional and cannot help but show when something has touched me and he has an exterior made of stone and can hide his feelings really rather well.

I do not disagree with your comment PeterMac because I would have been that person you describe but having lived with a man for a great number of years who has reacted so differently from me during some very upsetting moments, I do wonder if it is a possibility that the McCanns may be made of the sterner stuff that my husband is able to draw upon when upset hits themAnd I apologise in advance for being pesky but we have seen the tears reaction and that mother ended up in jail.




kololi,

Madeleine was thier 3yr old daughter, not some one they didnt know personally as in your other halfs case,they are a very wierd couple to act the way they have since Madeleine has been gone.

Fair enough, but we have had some other rather upsetting moments during our time that were of a much more personal nature and it provoked the same reaction as watching babies die in Africa because they didn't have a piffling £5 vaccination. And I am not excusing all their behaviour - just trying to keep an open mind that's all.


But Kololi, we are not only talking about their own flesh and blood who was only 3-year old,
but also not one but both parents having heart of stones and having united behavior.
Have you personally come across a couple where both are equally toughened individuals. They were both able to sleep, jog, and even laugh (Maddie 4th b/day) and function very normally shortly after losing their first born. I have never come across couple united in a devastated situation. They blame each other and eventually they fall out.
But this pair is the exact opposite, not saying they should not be united but it's rare and even a psychologist will tell you that.

We are not talking about people from problem background where real life situation toughened them from young and they are not easily given in to break down or emotions, we are talking a pair of middle class DOCTORS!
This pair collectively never showed emotion - full stop. Do you consider this normal?
They never ever once broke down, not even when they were made suspects.

What got me is their ability to lie, even under oath!

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by PeterMac on 02.04.12 21:53

@aiyoyo wrote:
I believe Kate said it was too dark! But that did not stop the search party comprising at least half the villagers out there searching on their behalf.
I went there. It is not dark. The street lights provide a level of light pollution at which you can only despair. Look at PB's photos.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Gillyspot on 02.04.12 22:15

The lights have been changed but on gerrymccannsblogs there are photos that show the lighting was quite good - particularly if someone is walking past you within feet as JT was supposedly passing by GM & JW

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Kololi on 02.04.12 22:19

Aiyoyo

For a person who wears their heart on their sleeve, no, I would not expect the rather focussed display that we saw. For somebody who is a lot more private with their emotions I wouldn't be surprised.

I can only "judge" by my own life experiences and of course as Tiny rightly pointed out, maybe my own personal experience has not come close to that of losing a child, in which case who am I to judge? Who are any of us to judge until we have walked a mile or two in the shoes of a mum who may have had her child stolen from her? For all we know if put in the same position we may feel the need to dance naked through the streets in order to cope or we may need to be sedated because of the shock - whatever our coping mechanisms I am guessing that there will always be somebody who doesn't think them right or appropriate.

I did initially think woah how cold and do still, to a degree, wonder about their demeanor but after watching Shannon Matthews' mum weep and wail for the cameras and then seeing how that panned out, I felt it a little ungracious of me to expect somebody to behave in the way that I probably would under the same circumstances.

I have mentioned Shannon Matthews and her mum's amazing public display of grief and tears a few times and nobody responds. Now I am used to being ignored for not agreeing with all that a few more formidable posters think lol so I boil it down to that. Seeing how though, you have responded to my comments would you, if you don't mind please enlighten me how tears and upset necessarily prove a person loving and caring of their child and above all, innocent of any wrong doing in their child's disappearance. The comparators would obviously be Kate McCann and Shannon Matthews' mum.

Aiyoyo there is no hard and fast rule on how to behave given certain circumstances for this or for that. The day we all act exactly like each other will be a sad day indeed.



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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Gillyspot on 02.04.12 22:33

@Kololi wrote:Aiyoyo

For a person who wears their heart on their sleeve, no, I would not expect the rather focussed display that we saw. For somebody who is a lot more private with their emotions I wouldn't be surprised.

I can only "judge" by my own life experiences and of course as Tiny rightly pointed out, maybe my own personal experience has not come close to that of losing a child, in which case who am I to judge? Who are any of us to judge until we have walked a mile or two in the shoes of a mum who may have had her child stolen from her? For all we know if put in the same position we may feel the need to dance naked through the streets in order to cope or we may need to be sedated because of the shock - whatever our coping mechanisms I am guessing that there will always be somebody who doesn't think them right or appropriate.

I did initially think woah how cold and do still, to a degree, wonder about their demeanor but after watching Shannon Matthews' mum weep and wail for the cameras and then seeing how that panned out, I felt it a little ungracious of me to expect somebody to behave in the way that I probably would under the same circumstances.

I have mentioned Shannon Matthews and her mum's amazing public display of grief and tears a few times and nobody responds. Now I am used to being ignored for not agreeing with all that a few more formidable posters think lol so I boil it down to that. Seeing how though, you have responded to my comments would you, if you don't mind please enlighten me how tears and upset necessarily prove a person loving and caring of their child and above all, innocent of any wrong doing in their child's disappearance. The comparators would obviously be Kate McCann and Shannon Matthews' mum.

Aiyoyo there is no hard and fast rule on how to behave given certain circumstances for this or for that. The day we all act exactly like each other will be a sad day indeed.



What caring & loving parent would be able to smile & laugh & tour the world (leaving remaining kids behind where firstborn was "abducted") after stating that their first child, Madeleine, Aged 3 had been abducted by paedophiles?

I don't know anyone who could be so cool. IMO it isn't Gerry McCann that I have a problem with (in the early days - men can be stronger in public) but Kate who looked like a guilty child who had been caught out stealing sweets.

As regards Karen Matthews - I never believed her either & it had nothing to do with class & education. Just so you know.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Kololi on 02.04.12 22:47

@Gillyspot wrote:
@Kololi wrote:Aiyoyo

For a person who wears their heart on their sleeve, no, I would not expect the rather focussed display that we saw. For somebody who is a lot more private with their emotions I wouldn't be surprised.

I can only "judge" by my own life experiences and of course as Tiny rightly pointed out, maybe my own personal experience has not come close to that of losing a child, in which case who am I to judge? Who are any of us to judge until we have walked a mile or two in the shoes of a mum who may have had her child stolen from her? For all we know if put in the same position we may feel the need to dance naked through the streets in order to cope or we may need to be sedated because of the shock - whatever our coping mechanisms I am guessing that there will always be somebody who doesn't think them right or appropriate.

I did initially think woah how cold and do still, to a degree, wonder about their demeanor but after watching Shannon Matthews' mum weep and wail for the cameras and then seeing how that panned out, I felt it a little ungracious of me to expect somebody to behave in the way that I probably would under the same circumstances.

I have mentioned Shannon Matthews and her mum's amazing public display of grief and tears a few times and nobody responds. Now I am used to being ignored for not agreeing with all that a few more formidable posters think lol so I boil it down to that. Seeing how though, you have responded to my comments would you, if you don't mind please enlighten me how tears and upset necessarily prove a person loving and caring of their child and above all, innocent of any wrong doing in their child's disappearance. The comparators would obviously be Kate McCann and Shannon Matthews' mum.

Aiyoyo there is no hard and fast rule on how to behave given certain circumstances for this or for that. The day we all act exactly like each other will be a sad day indeed.



What caring & loving parent would be able to smile & laugh & tour the world (leaving remaining kids behind where firstborn was "abducted") after stating that their first child, Madeleine, Aged 3 had been abducted by paedophiles?

I don't know anyone who could be so cool. IMO it isn't Gerry McCann that I have a problem with (in the early days - men can be stronger in public) but Kate who looked like a guilty child who had been caught out stealing sweets.

As regards Karen Matthews - I never believed her either & it had nothing to do with class & education. Just so you know.


I don't understand the taking flight to other places either Gillyspot. I suppose they did what they felt necessary but I agree it seemed odd as I am not sure what exactly it was that they achieved but that may be me just being a bit dim.

It would not have entered my head tbh - you being unsure of Shannon Matthews mum based simply on class and education. I actually did believe her because she behaved the way that I thought I would and that's the shocking thing. She was fibbing so badly that it became an eat humble pie moment for me.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Ribisl on 02.04.12 23:10

If the Mccanns are recovering Catholicis, I suppose I am a happily unredeemed one having tutored in the faith in my youth and discovered quickly how far removed the established church was from the very essence of the teachings they claim to follow, much like the al-Qaeda fundamentalists are to the teachings of Islam.

If it turns out that the Mccanns are indeed responsible for whatever happened to Madeleine, I could not easily forgive and forget their subsequent behaviour even if they were to come clean now and confess. Admitting guilt alone is not enough imv and I do not believe these people are capable of truly repenting. All their pretence of religiouness and the church’s accommodation of them (at least at the beginning) makes me feel quite ill in the stomach. They have had plenty of time to confess in public, yet they would only do so if things finally turn against them and are cornered by irrefutable evidence of some criminal offence.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Spaniel on 03.04.12 3:58

Kololi wrote;

I have mentioned Shannon Matthews and her mum's amazing public display of grief and tears a few times and nobody responds. Now I am used to being ignored for not agreeing with all that a few more formidable posters think lol so I boil it down to that. Seeing how though, you have responded to my comments would you, if you don't mind please enlighten me how tears and upset necessarily prove a person loving and caring of their child and above all, innocent of any wrong doing in their child's disappearance. The comparators would obviously be Kate McCann and Shannon Matthews' mum.


Karen Matthews was shedding false tears for the cameras. It was the fact that her two mates witnessed her laughing as soon as the cameras were turned off, that alerted their suspicions. They later forced her to confess.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Gillyspot on 03.04.12 6:26

@Spaniel wrote:Kololi wrote;

I have mentioned Shannon Matthews and her mum's amazing public display of grief and tears a few times and nobody responds. Now I am used to being ignored for not agreeing with all that a few more formidable posters think lol so I boil it down to that. Seeing how though, you have responded to my comments would you, if you don't mind please enlighten me how tears and upset necessarily prove a person loving and caring of their child and above all, innocent of any wrong doing in their child's disappearance. The comparators would obviously be Kate McCann and Shannon Matthews' mum.


Karen Matthews was shedding false tears for the cameras. It was the fact that her two mates witnessed her laughing as soon as the cameras were turned off, that alerted their suspicions. They later forced her to confess.

Well said Spaniel. IMO Karen Matthews was shedding crocodile tears. I can't say what alerted me to question her motive but as I said before it "had nothing to do with class & education." Just a hunch I suppose & generally I am correct when I have them.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by aiyoyo on 03.04.12 7:08

kololi,

You are right. Its not about tears and upset. What is the point of crocodile tears? as Shannon Matthew has proven.

Its about their whole mannerism,(something surreal about their mannerism)their attitude, body language, and most of all their speeches.

Did OJ Simpson cry?
Did Dr Murray Conrad appear upset?
What about Amanda Knox - I know that is a controversial one?
What about Lisa Irwin's mum? Did she cry? That's another dodgy one.

Here a link to why do killers speak out?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15l9HQgAk4M

These are all people who made appeals on TV and later charged. All of them appeared superficial whether they had tears or not.

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by tigger on 03.04.12 7:40

@Ribisl wrote:If the Mccanns are recovering Catholicis, I suppose I am a happily unredeemed one having tutored in the faith in my youth and discovered quickly how far removed the established church was from the very essence of the teachings they claim to follow, much like the al-Qaeda fundamentalists are to the teachings of Islam.

If it turns out that the Mccanns are indeed responsible for whatever happened to Madeleine, I could not easily forgive and forget their subsequent behaviour even if they were to come clean now and confess. Admitting guilt alone is not enough imv and I do not believe these people are capable of truly repenting. All their pretence of religiouness and the church’s accommodation of them (at least at the beginning) makes me feel quite ill in the stomach. They have had plenty of time to confess in public, yet they would only do so if things finally turn against them and are cornered by irrefutable evidence of some criminal offence.

To me it looks as if they're almost peeved at having to explain to us lowly sheeples once again.
Well, we know they didn't neglect their children in that way, so I can understand a certain lack of logic. But it's the 'not their fault' attitude which gets me down. As if it's the children's fault that the parents can't even have some 'me-time' without having to check on their offspring all the time.

They have soothed their consciences and those of their family and friends who are in the know by using religion. But psychopaths and narcissists are well above religion, it is there to be used as and when required.

The bolded bit above is brilliant, Ribisl! You might want to read 'Small Gods' by Terry Pratchett. It describes this concept brilliantly and a friend of mine who was a vicar told me it was the best book on religion he'd ever read.

As far as the topic here goes - they can never come clean and they don't ever want to either, I'm sure. I'm pretty sure that whatever can be found will never be enough to put them in prison, but closing down the Fund would be a strong possibility. Some adverse publicity may indicate they aren't the naive babes in the wood they made out to be.
It would help if the prime source of the idiotic government protection was revealed and the extend to which they had preferential treatment.

They won't ever come clean. The concept isn't one they understand.



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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by Ribisl on 03.04.12 8:58

Thanks tigger. Will see if Amazon have got a Kindle version. A timely read for the Easter weekend!
Have you read "God is not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything" by Christopher Hichens?

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by aiyoyo on 03.04.12 10:45

@Ribisl wrote:Thanks tigger. Will see if Amazon have got a Kindle version. A timely read for the Easter weekend!
Have you read "God is not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything" by Christopher Hichens?

Gosh, don't start.
My OH is a scientist who believes God is Men created, not the other way round. He will have field days over the subject of religions.
As for me I believe there is repercussion and consequence for one's action be it this life or another one.

Has anyone read Bertrand Russell "Why I am not a Christian?"

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Re: my verdict and if they came clean

Post by tigger on 03.04.12 12:23

@aiyoyo wrote:
@Ribisl wrote:Thanks tigger. Will see if Amazon have got a Kindle version. A timely read for the Easter weekend!
Have you read "God is not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything" by Christopher Hichens?

Gosh, don't start.
My OH is a scientist who believes God is Men created, not the other way round. He will have field days over the subject of religions.
As for me I believe there is repercussion and consequence for one's action be it this life or another one.

Has anyone read Bertrand Russell "Why I am not a Christian?"

Ah! Aiyoyo, 'Small Gods' is about men creating Gods. Very interesting, plus a good dose of Greek philosophy. You'll love it!

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