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Madeleine's health records

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Guest on Sat May 17, 2014 7:37 pm

@canada12 wrote:
@kimHager wrote:Cherry Blossom i just saw that pic from the link for the first time and i was also like omg where did that come from and it looks like a real pic not one photoshopped like the one to the right with the short brown hair...

Agreed - and what's with the three vertical lines over her left eyebrow that look like scars?

The face that was used for this short blonde hair photo is the same as the face in the red velvet dress pic where she is very young. But the skew of the face has been angled differently and the body is facing in an entirely different direction.

Which makes me wonder now if the red velvet dress photo has been manipulated! And the short blonde hair photo is actually real.

Looking at the red velvet dress picture on the front of the bewk, then MBM has long hair and fringe and those vertical lines are remnants of her fringe left after the rest photoshopped out  - matches up exactly with the fringe on the bewk.  Just another badly done photoshop.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by j.rob on Sun May 18, 2014 12:59 pm

@kimHager wrote:I think no records were given because KM probably being a gp was maddys doctor....or perhaps with out medical files if calls were ever on file from..say...social workers ....they would alert the pj to possible abuse or neglect already observed..just an opinion


As far as I am aware, doctors are not supposed to have their own children as patients - officially at any rate. Not sure what the exact rules are on this, on even whether there are any. Perhaps more of a 'best practice' type of thing, or something.

It can only be suspicious that Madeleine's heath records (and dental records too?) have been a subject of such intense secrecy. 

I personally think that it is possible there is a still a question over whether Gerry and or Kate are the biological parents. Certainly there was an article in the Portuguese press that stated that Gerry was not the biological father. They seemed clear on their sources, even challenging the McCanns and Mitchell to sue them.

The other possible reasons for keeping the health records secret would be evidence of neglect and/or abuse. There may have been social services concerns or concerns from playgroup/creche/health visitor, for instance.

Even if it waa *just* a case of Kate and Gerry finding it difficult to cope with 20 month year old Madeleine and then twin babies (which would be understandable as everyone I know who has had twins has found it pretty challenging, especially if you have other young children) then there would be notes in there relating to that. 

If Kate had had problems coping with bringing up Madeleine and the twins and maybe associated physical/psychological/mental health issues surrounding this, than that would  have been flagged up in the children's health files. Has to be, in the GP practice is doing its job properly. Otherwise, if a parent either intentionally or unintentionally (ie: in a fit of rage which is then deeply regretted) does something to any of the children, the police investigation would look towards the professionals who had failed to act upon concerns.

It is also instructive that, from the very outset, a social worker - Yvonne Martin - had concerns about the McCanns version of events and also recognized David Payne from her professional capacity. And wrote to police expressing her concerns, as far as I am aware, and urging them to check whether David Payne (and presumably the McCanns too given that she felt they might know more than they were letting on about Madeleine's appearance.)

And two other doctors gave statements to police about inappropriate gestures and actions displayed by David Payne to Gerry McCann which appeared to be in relation to Madeleine. And Mrs Gasper did not fudge the conclusion she came to either - DELETED

I mean, the red flags have been billowing in wind from day one. But were ignored and/or hidden.

If, for instance, the McCanns were in the habit of sedating their children, it may be that this had been noticed. Or had lead to adverse reactions which could not be adequately explained. Perhaps Madeleine or the twins had been given other drugs or even treatments by the McCanns. It is possible And it could have raised eye-brows (at the least) or lead to adverse consequences - physical/mental consequences.

I have wondered about the colic thing. Again, this may not be the gospel truth. A very unhappy, crying baby might be doing so for other reasons.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Guest on Thu May 22, 2014 11:47 am

My thoughts on the possibliity of Madeleine suffering from leukimia.

Although I haven’t read it anywhere, maybe KM had  been  prescribed infertility drugs before going down the IVF route, if so this could account for the possibility of MM having leukimia

According to a study conducted at the Centre for Research in Epidemiology and Population Health in France, children born to mothers who use fertility drugs to induce ovulation are more than twice has likely to develop leukemia during their childhoods than other children.

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2012/04/24/fertility-drugs-more-than-double-childhood-cancer-risk-scientists-say/

Moving on to IVF, one unsuccessful attempt before MM was conceived.

Egg donation is the process by which a woman provides one or several (usually 10-15) eggs (ova, oocytes) for purposes of assisted reproduction or biomedical research. For assisted reproduction purposes, egg donation typically involves the process of in vitro fertilization as the eggs are fertilized in the laboratory; more rarely, unfertilized eggs are frozen and stored for later use by the intended parents

The McCanns underwent IVF treatment near their Leicestershire home before Madeleine was conceived. They had further IVF treatment to conceive their twins while they were living in Amsterdam

The twins, I haven’t seen any information to say that the twins were conceived from the same batch of eggs used when MM was conceived if they weren’t and KM donated more, that is a hell of a lot of eggs. Did they give to friends, or were they part of a Donor Clinic a sort of IVF Club for medical research?

Something that has always been at the back of my mind is if MM had luekimia then maybe the chemotherapy wasn’t working and she needed a bone marrow transplant is this why the twins were  conceived?

A saviour sibling (or saviour sibling) is a child who is born to provide an organ or cell transplant to a sibling that is affected with a fatal disease, such as cancer or Fanconi anemia,  that can best be treated by hematopoietic stem cell transplantation.
The saviour sibling is conceived through in vitro fertilization. Fertilized zygotes are tested for genetic compatibility (human leucocyte antigen (HLA) typing), using preimplantation genetic diagnosis (PGD), and only zygotes that are compatible with the existing child are implanted. Zygotes are also tested to make sure they are free of the original genetic disease. The procedure is controversial.[1][2][3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savior_sibling

Now If, If GM was not MM’s biological father then maybe neither of the twins were compatible donors, if they were, then it's possible MM suffered complications.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bone_marrow_transplantation

Chimera (genetics)

I know this has been discussed before on the forum but what caught my eye in this article was:

Another way that chimerism can occur is by organ transplantation, giving one individual tissues that developed from two different genomes. For example, a bone marrow transplant can change someone's blood type.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimera_(genetics)

Of course this is just a theory. Will we ever know if MM was seriously ill and on medication that went terribly wrong, or part of something else. There is one witness who is silent and will remain that way because imo certain people have made sure there will be no physical remains of MBM ever found.

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Embryos

Post by missbeetle on Thu May 22, 2014 12:26 pm

I've had a bit of a read up in the bewk, and there were 13 embryos created in the UK.

First two implanted failed.

Second two didn't survive defrosting.

Third two were implanted, resulting in the birth of Madeleine.

So seven left over.


Surely they can't have had them shipped over to Amsterdam?

I would think they would have to start over afresh.

Kate intimates that the first treatment cycle was a success. Twins.

So, yes - quite a few embryos floating about, possibly in two countries.

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Leukaemia

Post by missbeetle on Thu May 22, 2014 1:02 pm

In my early teens I wanted to become a haematologist and find a cure for leukaemia (God knows where that came from, or how I even had a clue what a haematologist was).
McCann, Kate (2011-05-12). Madeleine: Our daughter's disappearance and the continuing search for her (Kindle Locations 175-176). Transworld. Kindle Edition.

Bone marrow transplant... This can be tried in the treatment of Gaucher's Disease. The Mayo Clinic patient info explains the basics of this illness. A few things jumped out at me.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by tigger on Thu May 22, 2014 1:08 pm

Some more links:   http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t2986-ivf-procedure-may-increase-risk-of-down-s-syndrome?highlight=Munchhausen+syndrome

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t5043-munchausens-syndrome-by-proxy?highlight=Munchhausen+syndrome


In this last one we came to the conclusion that the condition doesn't apply here, however there are a number of useful links and observations in this topic.

Here is the curious statement of their GP with comment from Russiandoll, copied from the second link.

3—Witness statement of Ian Richard Schofield (Dr. at Alpine Practice) 2008.05.14
Testimony of: Ian Richard SCHOFIELD
Age is less than 18 years:
Occupation: Physician (General Practice)
This deposition (comprising 1 page and signed by me) is true and according to my understanding. I am aware that, if proven to the contrary, I will be subject to prosecution if I have voluntarily testified to something with
knowledge of it being false or not corresponding to the truth.
Date: May 14, 2008
Signature ______________________________________

I am a GP and senior partner in Alpine Practice in Rothley Road, Mountsorrel and in summary my qualifications are respectively at MBChB, DRCOG, MRCGP.
I am currently, and have been for 14 months, the GP of the McCann family. Before Madeleine's disappearance, I had only consulted Kate McCann once and never had assisted Gerry, nor ever had reason to deal with the twins Sean and Amelie and only saw them once after the disappearance of Madeleine.
As Kate and Gerry are general practitioners I never had any doubt about their capacity or mental abilities as individuals or as parents to their three children.
I never prescribed Kate or Gerry any medication that could alter their behaviour or demeanour.
I never had any doubt about the psychological welfare of the children.
The only thing I can affirm is that Kate and Gerry are a very genuine couple, affectionate and careful [caring] parents. They always kept me, social services and other authorities informed on the progress of the investigation that followed the disappearance of Madeleine.
After the disappearance of Madeleine, I met Kate and Gerry at their home and never had any cause for concern about the twins.
This testimony was prepared from a series of questions raised by DC Ferguson and DC Holliday of the Leicestershire police, following the request by the Portuguese PJ.
This testimony was made by me and it is true according to my understanding.

so only the family GP since Maddie vanished.
Had not to date seen the twins.
Maddie therefore appears never to have been seen by any doctor apart from a duty doctor for a post-birth check.

So the question remains, who was responsible for Madeleine's health ? If she had any prescriptions, they do not appear to have been written up by her GP. Her medical records are imo of major importance. And is there any explanation for why the family GP changed in March 2007?
Unquote

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Downs is out...

Post by missbeetle on Thu May 22, 2014 1:22 pm

@tigger wrote:Some more links:   http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t2986-ivf-procedure-may-increase-risk-of-down-s-syndrome?highlight=Munchhausen+syndrome

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t5043-munchausens-syndrome-by-proxy?highlight=Munchhausen+syndrome


In this last one we came to the conclusion that the condition doesn't apply here, however there are a number of useful links and observations in this topic.

I can't see Kate and Gerry NOT having amniocentesis to check for Downs.

However, an attack of the Munchies is certainly something I have thought about. Quite a bit.

It might account for the CATS file, and steady stream of minders.

...but no, it doesn't quite fit.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Nina on Thu May 22, 2014 3:02 pm

Where did Madeleine have all her vaccinations and her age progress tests then, or have I missed them?

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by tigger on Thu May 22, 2014 8:47 pm

Copied from Recap on tennis photo.

russiandoll wrote:
have never read the words FEAR OF PAIN but have read fear and pain
Dantezebu write:
Kates Diary:
FRIDAY, JUNE 1: Quite fed up...I can't stop thinking about Madeleine, about her fear of pain. How can I go on knowing that her life could have ended like this?

This week I have been quite overtaken by black thoughts. Please, God, bring her back.
Unquote

Iirc it.s mentioned twice in the diary and changed in the book to fear and pain.it being too late to change the already published diary.

In itself very revealing imo. I'm copying this post to the health topic.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by j.rob on Thu May 22, 2014 11:56 pm

"As Kate and Gerry are general practitioners I never had any doubt about their capacity or mental abilities as individuals or as parents to their three children."

 big grin  big grin  


Harold Shipman was a general practitioner, so I hardly think that the mere fact of Kate and Gerry being general practitioners is any kind of indication as to their mental abilities, or, indeed their capacity to be kind, responsible and caring parents.


Okay - let's put it another way. Suppose they had not been general practitioners, would he then have had cause for doubt?


Also - Gerry wasn't a general practitioner (GP) to my knowledge.


"The only thing I can affirm is that Kate and Gerry are a very genuine couple, affectionate and careful [caring] parents. They always kept me, social services and other authorities informed on the progress of the investigation that followed the disappearance of Madeleine."




Since when is it normal for the parents of a child who has disappeared in suspicious circumstances to 'keep social services and other authorities informed on the progress of the investigation'.

Oh, okay, I get it! Only when the parents are doctors!

HA. What nonsense.

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Not from Dr Schofield...

Post by missbeetle on Fri May 23, 2014 1:21 am

@Nina wrote:Where did Madeleine have all her vaccinations and her age progress tests then, or have I missed them?
A couple of thoughts here :

A private GP?

An institution involved in confidential medical research?

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by tigger on Fri May 23, 2014 6:16 am

This is the statement of  Dr. Hussey:

Witness Statement of Philip Hussey (McCann family doctor) 2008.05.15

I am the abovementioned person living at the address previously supplied to police.
I am a GP at the Center for Health at Syston and my qualifications are as follows: MB, CHB, MRCGP.
I have practised my profession at this location for 22 years.
I was visited by police officers from Leicestershire who are conducting an investigation by order of the Portuguese authorities regarding the disappearance of Madeleine McCann in May 2007.

When the McCann family lived in Queniborough, Leicestershire they were included in my consultancy; Kate, Gerry, Madeleine, Sean and Amelie were all my clients.

Kate's first consultation was on 20 October 2000, and Gerry on 19 December 2000, Madeleine was included since birth.

There was a period in which the family did not use our services, which coincided with the change of residence to the Netherlands where he spent a season, but upon their return resumed their affiliation with us.


When the twins Sean and Amelie were born, both were registered in my clinic.
It could be said that I know Kate well, the couple faced some problems of conception and I recall that Kate was particularly desperate for a family. After treatment for infertility and when pregnant with Madeleine she could not be more happy because she wanted that child so much.

I met Kate and Gerry once at a social event at the home of Professor Gershlick who is a colleague of Gerry.

I remember sitting close to Kate during the dinner. We spoke about the difficulties of medicine in general and of the problems within the National Health Service. I got on well with both of them.
I never had any doubts about the state of mental health of Kate and Gerry and I never prescribed them sedatives or any medication that could alter the psychological state of Kate or Gerry.

Also, I never had doubts regarding the physical or psychological well-being of the children. Madeleine was seen by the duty doctor when born and by our nurses during the routine vaccinations. If there had been cause for concern in any of the children, it would have been brought to my attention, and this did not happen.

The last time I saw Kate as a patient was on March 10, 2006
.

Knowing how much the couple wanted a family, I do not believe that they would have had any kind of involvement in the disappearance of Madeleine.

This testimony was made by me and it is true according to my understanding.

Unquote

Imo a friend and a brother to GM.

They moved to Rothley and the new GP in January 2006.
He says nothing about having seen Maddie - ever. Not even for colic, which should have merited an examination imo esp. As according to Kate they weren't sure what it was. So a baby who cried non stop for six months, which made the parents so desperate they sat in the kitchen and cried themselves (all in KH1) was never examined by their GP?
He makes an unnecessary declaration on how much they wanted a child etc. but absolutely nothing in the way of ''Madeleine was a healthy and active child'.
Says GM was away for a season when it was a year.

Every bit of 'back-up' only serves to demolish the official story.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by tigger on Fri May 23, 2014 6:34 am

This is an interesting topic to read again. The retraction of the eye defect was in May 2011, so is still seen as part of a possible condition in some of the conditions.

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t3188p40-kate-obsessed-with-beautiful-children?highlight=obsessed+with+beautiful+children

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Vague, vaguer, vaguest...

Post by missbeetle on Fri May 23, 2014 7:04 am

A season. In the Netherlands. He spent a season in the Netherlands...

No dates provided.

Almost makes Gerry sound like a footballer.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by kimHager on Fri May 23, 2014 7:23 am

Hmmm I imagine as in the USA in the UK they may have immunization clinics like the local health Dept.,or something like that to go have immunizations and regular check ups. I dunno that's just my opinion.
If Maddy had been saw by this GP Dr. Schofield once, obviously they changed doctors for a reason... Yet another mccanns mystery we always end with a question and never an answer but if the doctor didn't see the twins or Gerry sounds like Kate must have went (with Maddy? )at least once in the two months before the disappearance... Surely that doesn't build a relationship where the doctor would come to your house and not seeing the others can say that they were careful parents etc....How on earth would he know that from one or two visits? Sounds like he got he got that observation somewhere else.... Just an opinion

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by kimHager on Fri May 23, 2014 7:40 am

Thanks tigger i just read your post on the doctor Hussey.... Clients.. They were not patients rather they were clients... Wierd wording and the bit on Kate Desperately wanting children almost .sounds to me like a stranger thing to say. Another thing to catch my attention was that he never prescribed any sedatives or any medication that could alter the psychological state of Kate or Gerry.However he never says he didn't prescribe any medication for the children. I think his wording is very strange indeed

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Conception of saviour sibling/s

Post by missbeetle on Fri May 23, 2014 8:34 am

Possibly...?


Would not the 'real' biological father/parents be required to provide the closest match to the potential recipient? I don't know.


Why would a medical family not reveal a diagnosis of childhood leukaemia to family, friends and colleagues? I don't know.


I really don't know...

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Guest on Fri May 23, 2014 11:14 am

@missbeetle wrote:A season. In the Netherlands. He spent a season in the Netherlands...

No dates provided.

Almost makes Gerry sound like a footballer.

Exactly what I thought! I expected it to be followed up with something like "....where he made twenty five appearances for ADO Den Haag, but was not offered a new contract".

I don't know if this is one of those double translation things, but season in Portuguese is temporada, lit. a period of time.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Guest on Fri May 23, 2014 11:17 am

@missbeetle wrote:Possibly...?


Would not the 'real' biological father/parents be required to provide the closest match to the potential recipient? I don't know.


Why would a medical family not reveal a diagnosis of childhood leukaemia to family, friends and colleagues? I don't know.


I really don't know...

There's also the thorny question of blood transfusions and why a Jehovah's witness would be so keen to get involved.

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Blood brothers...?

Post by missbeetle on Fri May 23, 2014 12:01 pm

Let's try that again...

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Apropos nothing in particular.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by Guest on Fri May 23, 2014 12:17 pm


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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by tigger on Fri May 23, 2014 3:41 pm

@kimHager wrote:Thanks tigger i just read your post on the doctor Hussey.... Clients.. They were not patients rather they were clients... Wierd wording and the bit on Kate Desperately wanting children almost .sounds to me like a stranger thing to say. Another thing to catch my attention was that he never prescribed any sedatives or any medication that could alter the psychological state of Kate or Gerry.However he never says he didn't prescribe any medication for the children. I think his wording is very strange indeed

Keep in mind these - to my mind - incomplete statements were made in confidence. Dr. Hussey, nor any of the other knew these files would be released to the public.

So I infer from that situation that those asked to supply a statement or agreed to be interviewed in general did the absolute minimum they could get away with. Leaving room to expand on the little information they gave in court if necessary.

Which leads us to the question of how willing they were to get involved in the first place.

Next question: why did John McCann say in the early days that people owed them favours and so they called them in.....

One wonders if there were a few favours left to call in?

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by kimHager on Fri May 23, 2014 6:43 pm

Yes who owed what and why? Ivee noticed most meetings and conversations took place with kate... Which isnt too strange as alot of times mom is the one in charge of appointments and so on. However nothing in the Mccanns case seems normal so if and i stress IF premeditation was involved it appears as if kate was behind it all, or either Gerry was smart and kept his hands clean.

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by lj on Fri May 23, 2014 8:55 pm

2 Major mistakes are made by these 2 doctors (as by many of the pros):

1 that because they are doctor they are suitable parents. Apart from dr Shipman: doctors have a higher depression rate, higher addiction rate and a higher suicide rate than the normal population, all of which hardly makes them suitable parents
1 because Kate wanted a child so desperately she must be a good parent. It might very well have been that in her despair Kate idolized being a parent. Then when the colicky baby came along it was not at all what she had imagined.

Whatever the reason, these 2 very bland statements cannot make up for not having the medical files. I wonder has SY them now?

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Re: Madeleine's health records

Post by lj on Fri May 23, 2014 8:58 pm

Clay Regazzoni wrote:
@missbeetle wrote:Let's try that again...


I found a better link.

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/main-topics/local-stories/blood-devices-donated-to-nhs-1-2480431

August 2005.

These machines are nothing new and have been in use in many hospitals for at least 25 years. I cannot see why that has anything to do with Madeleine's disappearance.

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