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Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

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libelled optician neends carter ruck

Post by pauline on 25.11.11 18:25

Miscee, glad you agree with my post.

Wouldn't it be a laugh if the optician or the man whose full name was read out decided to get a top libel lawyer to restore their good names. While Adam Tudor could not act as he does the Mccanns work (quietly behind the scenes and often without pay as Kate says in the book), I think it is permissable for another partner/senior employee to take on the optician's case providing they had never acted for the McCanns. Somebody who knows more about legal etiquette than I do might clarify this. Carter-Ruck would like this case as I think they would win easily - to be called mentally ill and evil on the BBC and named has to be libellous.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by mrscee on 25.11.11 18:41

Ha ha, yes that would be funny! I would have been absolutely fuming if I were him.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by happychick on 25.11.11 18:55

We've established that this whole case is a scam and the McCanns are being protected so it wouldn't surprise me if the optician and the lady who was promoting Katey's 'truthful' book were members of JATYK

What do you think Xavier?

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Complaint response and a quick "hello".

Post by crewman on 30.11.11 19:47

Hi everyone.

This is my first post so I just wanted to say a very quick hello.

I've been following this case for quite some time now, so why am I making my first post here? Well, I complained to the BBC re: the Jeremy Vine show, hence my comment on this thread.

I got my response today, and I'm not satisfied at all. I made it a point to direct my grievances as being with the standard of presenting in relation to Nina Mishkow's comments - pertaining to the listener in question being mentally ill - having not been by rebuked by Mr Vine on air .

The response I received doesn't address this, and I'm currently considering the issues relating to escalating the complaint.

If anyone wishes, I can post my complaint and response up here if there's any interest or need in me doing so.

Thanks.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by mrscee on 30.11.11 20:13

hello crewman, I would personally be very interested in seeing what reply you received from the Beeb. I also complained along the same lines, and I haven't had any reply as yet. I must say I'm not surprised you haven't been satisfied with your response, and I agree it is a good idea to continue to be a squeaky wheel and escalate it if possible.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by pauline on 30.11.11 20:24

@crewman wrote:Hi everyone.

This is my first post so I just wanted to say a very quick hello.

I've been following this case for quite some time now, so why am I making my first post here? Well, I complained to the BBC re: the Jeremy Vine show, hence my comment on this thread.

I got my response today, and I'm not satisfied at all. I made it a point to direct my grievances as being with the standard of presenting in relation to Nina Mishkow's comments - pertaining to the listener in question being mentally ill - having not been by rebuked by Mr Vine on air .

The response I received doesn't address this, and I'm currently considering the issues relating to escalating the complaint.

If anyone wishes, I can post my complaint and response up here if there's any interest or need in me doing so.

Thanks.

welcome crewman. Would love to read your complaint and response if you would post them.

I heard the broadcast. I should have complained but have become so disillusioned with the media re McCanns I didn't.

It wasn't just the optician - they read out three at least emails including his, dissenting and they were all told to get help with their issues which is libellous in my view. They gave the full name of one of the emailers. Being mentally ill is not a crime but neither is being an alcoholic - there was a case recently in Ireland where a journalist (regarded as a bit eccentric to be polite about it) who thought the mike was off made a comment to the effect that a current govt minister had a drink problem (which many people believed anyway). the radio station apologised immediately. However the Minister sent in the lawyers and got an out of court settlement believed to be about €450,00. Part of the settlement was supposed to go to charity but no charity has yet been named nearly a year later. personally I suspect its gone to the now ex Ministers drinking fund.

What the Jeremy Vine Show said was much worse and went on for 10-15 minutes whereas this Irish example was an off the cuff remark that went out in error and not accepted by the presenter. I understand the station will not use this journalist again.

So Mark the optician and the named emailer should contact their lawyers in my view.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by mrscee on 30.11.11 20:29

I completely agree Pauline. do you know, if was any good at twitter/ facebook all that stuff I would try to do some kind of shout -out for that optician over the 'interweb' and try and get him to come onto this forum! he was called mark something, - wonder if the show is still available to listen to hmmm.....

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by crewman on 01.12.11 0:11

Hi pauline and mrscee,

Yes, I'll post my complaint and the response I received from the Beeb below. Incidentally, the complaint form only allowed me room to air my grievance about the caller named as "Mark", but I would have included other remarks made by Nina Miskow if I could have.

My complaint, along with the one line complaint summary required as per the BBC complaint procedure:

Complaint Summary: Allowing offensive remarks by guest unchallenged.

Full Complaint: The program invited submissions from the public on the topic of the missing girl Madeleine McCann, and both Jeremy Vine and his guest Nina Mishkow would make comments and discuss the submissions chosen by the editorial team.

My complaint relates to some comments made by the guest Nina Mishkow.

One of the first emails to be aired came from an individual who claimed to be an optician (his name on the show was given as "Mark") who, in his comments, cast doubt on the version of events put forward by the family McCann, and suggested that they were guilty of "abandoning" their now missing child.

In response to this person's comment, the guest Nina Mishkow, rather than debating the substantive points of the listener's allegations, instead - and immediately - decided to suggest that the listener was suffering from a mental illness himself and should discuss this with a medical professional/doctor to resolve his own mental health issues that she suggested he was evidently afflicted by.

I found these slanderous comments by Nina Mishkow both highly offensive and disgraceful in themselves, but Jeremy Vine's failure to censure her on the show, and his acquiescence with her sentiment, even more offensive and disgraceful.


The response I received:

Thanks for contacting us regarding Radio 2’s ‘Jeremy Vine’ on 24 November.

I understand you objected to guest Nina Myskow’s comments about a listener’s e-mail regarding the McCann’s appearance at the Leveson Inquiry.

Part of our role as an impartial observer is to report a wide range of views on a particular topic. This item presented the listeners views by reading out his e-mail and then featured guest Nina Myskow’s opinion and objections to his remarks.

The BBC makes no editorial comment or judgement on the views expressed by contributors to our programmes, and our aim is simply to provide enough information for listeners to make up their own minds. Although some people believe that a programme should not allow certain groups or individuals to air their views, we feel that it's better to include many viewpoints wherever possible. This may include hearing opinions which you personally disagree with but which individuals may be fully entitled to hold in the context of legitimate debate. Such an approach is more likely to provide the public with access to differing perspectives and to add context.

Nevertheless, I'd like to assure you that we've registered your comments on our audience log. This is the internal report of audience feedback we compile daily for the programme makers and senior management within the BBC. The audience logs are important documents that can help shape future decisions and they ensure that your points, and all other comments we receive, are made available to BBC staff across the Corporation.

Thanks again for contacting us.

Kind Regards

Stuart Webb

BBC Complaints


As you can see from my "complaint summary" and the last line of the body of the actual complaint, the issue I was objecting to was less Nina Miskow's comments, which the BBC couldn't necessarily prevent, but the lack of rebuke once she'd made them, or even just the lack of an apology later on in the show. As I was aware, don't the BBC hold some liability or culpability for libellous remarks made on their network broadcasts, or don't they have to go to reasonable lengths to rectify any comments that could be potentially in breach of tort or criminal law?

I suppose, unfortunately, that it'd be up to the individuals who contacted the show on the day to push this further. Still, I think it's wrong telling people live on national radio that they are mentally incapable, simply because they hold an opinion contrary to the status quo of the establishment.


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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by jd on 01.12.11 0:24

Thanks Crewman and well done for making the complaint

The BBC reply is very irritating to say the least and a total 'brush under the carpet' one. How can they say they allow the listener to make up their own mind when their presenters are telling people who phone in with an opinion to seek medical help! Its all a cover up and absolute garbage, and they treat people like imbeciles

Infact this kind of reply really makes me feel angry that I won't comment further at this point, but thanks for this

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by listener on 01.12.11 1:08

Salaries and self-preservation

No time in their so busy lives to read, and no will to challenge

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 1:11

B.B.C
British Brainwashing Corporation
Wink

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by listener on 01.12.11 1:32

Yes - but most people I know don't watch the BBC - they seem adicted to SKY channels and RM's crap!

It appears, to me, it is a 'way of life'!

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by crewman on 01.12.11 1:37

@jd wrote:Thanks Crewman and well done for making the complaint

The BBC reply is very irritating to say the least and a total 'brush under the carpet' one. How can they say they allow the listener to make up their own mind when their presenters are telling people who phone in with an opinion to seek medical help! Its all a cover up and absolute garbage, and they treat people like imbeciles

Infact this kind of reply really makes me feel angry that I won't comment further at this point, but thanks for this

Hi jd

Infuriating indeed! The two things in that reply that made me smile were these lines:

.....we feel that it's better to include many viewpoints wherever possible.

and

This may include hearing opinions which you personally disagree with but which individuals may be fully entitled to hold in the context of legitimate debate.

I might have more sympathy for their first point if Nina Miskow wasn't the only guest on the show and if Jeremy Vine showed anything approaching impartiality, and the second comment suggesting that it was me who was stifling "debate" is laughable. If Nina Miskow had addressed "Mark's" comments that would have been fine; but she didn't, she just accused him of being mentally ill and told him to get himself off to a doctor ASAP. Disgraceful, if you ask me.......really, the Beeb's standards are falling.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 1:41

For some time now, I have been aware that this whole case doth remind me of something, and it has just struck me what it is.
I have a tale to tell. Are you sitting comfortably? Yes? Then I shall begin...

CHICKEN LICKEN

AS Chicken-licken was going one day to the wood, whack! an acorn fell from a tree
on to his head.

"Gracious goodness me!" said Chicken-licken, "the sky must have fallen; I must go
and tell the King."

So Chicken-licken turned back, and met Hen-len. "Well, Hen-len, where are you
going ?" said he. "I'm going to the wood," said she.

"Oh, Hen-len, don't go!" said he, "for as I was going the sky fell on to my head, and
I'm going to tell the King."

So Hen-len turned back with Chicken-licken, and met Cock-lock.

"I'm going to the wood," said he.

Then Hen-len said:' "Oh Cock-lock, don't go, for I was going, and I met Chicken-licken, and Chicken-licken had been at the wood, and the sky had fallen on to his head, and we are going to tell the King."

So Cock-lock turned back, and they met Duck-luck. "

Well, Duck-luck, where are you going?"

And Duck-luck said: "I'm going to the wood."

Then Cock-lock said: "Oh! Duck-luck, don't go, for I was going, and I met Hen-len,
and Hen-len met Chicken-licken, and Chicken-licken had been at the wood, and the
sky had fallen on to his head, and we are going to tell the King." So Duck-luck turned
back,and met Drake-lake.

"Well, Drake-lake, where are you going?"
And Drake-lake said: "I'm going to the wood."

Then Duck-luck said: "Oh! Drake-lake, don't go, for I was going, and I met Cock-lock, and Cock-lock met Hen-len, and Hen-len met Chicken-licken, and Chicken-licken
had been at the wood, and the sky had fallen on to his head, and, we are going to tell
the King."

So Drake-lake turned back, and met Goose-loose. "Well, Goose-loose, where are
you going?" And Goose-loose said: "I'm going to the wood."

Then Drake-lake said: "Oh, Goose-loose, don't go, for I was going, and I met Duck-
luck, and Duck-luck met Cock-lock, and Cock-lock met Hen-len, and Hen-len met
Chicken-licken, and Chicken-licken had been at the wood, and the sky had fallen on to
his head, and we are going to tell the King." So Goose-loose turned back, and met
Gander-lander.

"Well, Gander-lander, where are you going ?"

And Gander-lander said: "I'm going to the wood."

Then Goose-loose said: "Oh! Gander-lander, don't go, for I was going, and I met
Drake-lake, and Drake-lake met Duck-luck, and Duck-luck met Cock-lock, and Cock-
lock met Hen-len, and Hen-len met Chicken-licken, and Chicken-licken had been at the
wood, and the sky had fallen on to his head, and we are going to tell the King."

So Gander-lander turned back, and met Turkey-lurkey.

"Well, Turkey-lurkey, where are you going?"
And Turkey-lurkey said: "I'm going to the wood."

Then Gander-dander said: "Oh! Turkey-lurkey, don't go, for I was going, and I met
Goose-loose, and Goose-loose met Drake-lake, and Drake-lake met Duck-luck, and
Duck-luck met Cock-lock, and Cock-lock met Hen-len, and Hen-len met Chicken-licken,
and Chicken-licken had been at the wood, and the sky had fallen on to his head, and
we are going to tell the King."

So Turkey-lurkey turned back, and walked wiith Gander-lander, Goose-loose, Drake-
lake, Duck-luck, Cock-lock, Hen-len, and Chicken-licken. And as they were going along, they met Fox-lox. And Fox-lox said:

"Where are you going ?"

And they said: "Chicken-licken went to the wood, and the sky fell on to his head, and
we are going to tell the King."

And Fox-lox said: "Come along with me, and I will show you the way." But Fox-lox took them into the fox's hole, and he and his young ones soon ate up poor Chicken-licken, Hen-len, Cock-lock, Duck-luck, Drake-lake, Goose-loose,' Ganderdander, and Turkey-lurkey; and they never saw the King to tell him that the sky had fallen.


CAST:

Chicken Licken and friends - the McCann supporters, public
Fox and family - the McCann's and ALL their publica allies and enablers
'The King' - Goncalo Amaral and all us sensible folk.

The tale will keep re-telling, I pray that one day King and Court can convince Chicken Licken and friends NOT TO TRUST THE FOX FAMILY!
To Be Continued..... Wink


 

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"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 2:01

@crewman wrote:
@jd wrote:Thanks Crewman and well done for making the complaint

The BBC reply is very irritating to say the least and a total 'brush under the carpet' one. How can they say they allow the listener to make up their own mind when their presenters are telling people who phone in with an opinion to seek medical help! Its all a cover up and absolute garbage, and they treat people like imbeciles

Infact this kind of reply really makes me feel angry that I won't comment further at this point, but thanks for this

Hi jd

Infuriating indeed! The two things in that reply that made me smile were these lines:

.....we feel that it's better to include many viewpoints wherever possible.

and

This may include hearing opinions which you personally disagree with but which individuals may be fully entitled to hold in the context of legitimate debate.

I might have more sympathy for their first point if Nina Miskow wasn't the only guest on the show and if Jeremy Vine showed anything approaching impartiality, and the second comment suggesting that it was me who was stifling "debate" is laughable. If Nina Miskow had addressed "Mark's" comments that would have been fine; but she didn't, she just accused him of being mentally ill and told him to get himself off to a doctor ASAP. Disgraceful, if you ask me.......really, the Beeb's standards are falling.

Hi, and a belated 'Welcome to the Forum' crewman...
Well done for your complaint - I didn't hear it 'live' but I'm seriously thinking I will also now complain. The response to yours WAS woefully inadequate AND it quite spectacularly missed the point.
YES - it is fine to 'hold different views' in the context of the debate, but how on Earth is slandering and abusing the 'opposition' adding to any debate??? Had Ms Myskow countered with reasons why she believes 'Mark' to be wrong, fair do's. BUT resorting to insult such as 'You are mentally ill and need to work through your issues' seems to be the only way McCann accolytes respond to us. Why? Well, they've got no facts to fall back on and fire at us have they (no, re-read the archiving despatch again, pro's). All they have is insults and bile.
We should expect, and receive, better from the BBC - they charge heavily to try and brainwash us, the licence fee is a joke for this kind of bilge. NOT happy.
Well done once again, crewman Wink

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"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 2:09

Quick memo to Nina M;
The time has come for the Bitch to get back IN her Box, methinks (or crawl back under her stone Wink)

____________________
"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by crewman on 01.12.11 3:10

@rainbow-fairy wrote:YES - it is fine to 'hold different views' in the context of the debate, but how on Earth is slandering and abusing the 'opposition' adding to any debate??? Had Ms Myskow countered with reasons why she believes 'Mark' to be wrong, fair do's. BUT resorting to insult such as 'You are mentally ill and need to work through your issues' seems to be the only way McCann accolytes respond to us.

Hi rainbow-fairy,

This is exactly what went through my mind as I was listening to the show. How can a lie be defended with the "truth", when the truth and the facts supporting it don't for a minute support the position you're trying to propound. Easier just to make ad hominem arguments about people's mental health.....

If my memory serves me right, Nina Myskow responded to the question surrounding the sniffer dogs by trotting out the old "nappies and rotting meat" line. Although many more eminant folks on here and elsewhere have attested to the science behind, and success thereof, of police cadaver dogs, I always wondered why the McCanns would keep nappies and stale meat not just in the boot of their car but also behind their sofa and in their wardrobe?

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 3:40

@crewman wrote:
@rainbow-fairy wrote:YES - it is fine to 'hold different views' in the context of the debate, but how on Earth is slandering and abusing the 'opposition' adding to any debate??? Had Ms Myskow countered with reasons why she believes 'Mark' to be wrong, fair do's. BUT resorting to insult such as 'You are mentally ill and need to work through your issues' seems to be the only way McCann accolytes respond to us.

Hi rainbow-fairy,

This is exactly what went through my mind as I was listening to the show. How can a lie be defended with the "truth", when the truth and the facts supporting it don't for a minute support the position you're trying to propound. Easier just to make ad hominem arguments about people's mental health.....

If my memory serves me right, Nina Myskow responded to the question surrounding the sniffer dogs by trotting out the old "nappies and rotting meat" line. Although many more eminant folks on here and elsewhere have attested to the science behind, and success thereof, of police cadaver dogs, I always wondered why the McCanns would keep nappies and stale meat not just in the boot of their car but also behind their sofa and in their wardrobe?
Exactly, crewman, spot on! Such tired old myths and incomprehensible rubbish still being trotted out by people who should, quite frankly, know better! I don't quite know what it says about Dr's and celebrities, I know some celebs are 'airheads' but they can't be that daft surely (or slovenly). I don't spend very much time on housework, but by 'eck my boys nappies were triple-bagged and binned straightaway! Can you imagine them left in wardrobes, behind sofas, cars - not to mention wrapping them in your checked trousers!?! Imagine the flies and maggots... Do they ever really think before they speak?
Sometimes, honestly, I feel I've slipped into a parallel universe where this case is concerned! Its just so ridiculous - trouble is there are still the gullible lot who just believe what they are spoon-fed by Team McCann. It makes me mourn for the loss of critical thinking - what sheeples the majority are today Sad
Hooray for us who can see through the nonsense! Wink long may it last...

____________________
"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by Gillyspot on 01.12.11 6:55

@rainbow-fairy wrote:Quick memo to Nina M;
The time has come for the Bitch to get back IN her Box, methinks (or crawl back under her stone Wink)

If she complies and does crawl back under her stone can we leave this one unturned big grin

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 7:29

@Gillyspot wrote:
@rainbow-fairy wrote:Quick memo to Nina M;
The time has come for the Bitch to get back IN her Box, methinks (or crawl back under her stone Wink)

If she complies and does crawl back under her stone can we leave this one unturned
Gillyspot, that is a definite YES. Although I can't see her complying with anything! Except, maybe the 'celebs' round robin 'Protect.And.Defend.McCanns.At.All.Costs' Wink
Are there any famous people who don't kiss the McCann Collective's buttocks? I really can't think of any! I know Vernon Coleman has spoken out against them, but then he couldn't be called a 'celeb' - far too controversial and anti-eu etc etc. Although I think if he thought he was being referred to as a celeb he'd be quite offended!
No, I mean your average run-of-the-mill 'zeleb'. Have any spoken of doubt? If not, why not? Its unnatural, every issue raises famous Fors and Againsts but this - just eerie silence...

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"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by mrscee on 01.12.11 8:29

Thanks for sharing your complaint and reply crewman. Your latest comment about resorting to ' ad hominem' is exactly what went through my mind. In fact, I am not exaggerating when I say that a chill went through me when I heard that broadcast because without free speech everything we believe that we have in our society is just a lie. That may sound very melodramatic, but it's how I feel about this issue. I find it very hard to live in a place where seemingly noone actually cares about the truth, only about what is politically or personally expedient at the time. I also have to wonder, what is it which everyone is trying to cover up. Something pretty big I think- bigger than the Mccanns themselves.

With regard to pursuing your complaint further, I agree that it is probably up to those who were slandered on air to do this. I really hope they are doing so. However, I think you could legitimately respond and ask the Beeb representative who replied to you to point out exactly where in this broadcast there was any debate, given the first three definitions of debate below. On the contrary, the entire objective of the piece seemed to be to quosh the opposing view as quickly as possible, without regard for the veracity or otherwise of their arguments. :
Debate
1. A discussion involving opposing points; an argument.
2. Deliberation; consideration: passed the motion with little debate.
3. A formal contest of argumentation in which two opposing teams defend and attack a given proposition.
4. Obsolete Conflict; strife.

In the complaint whicih I wrote( not as measured as yours!) , one of my key points was asking why there had been a deviation from the show format in this case- namely not having another individual who had been brought in to put the opposing view to Nina Myscow. As I am at home with my kids all day, I listen to JV's show almost every day, and I cannot recall another case quite like this when they did not have 2 people giving their views. In addition, I asked why Jeremy had not maintained the impartial position as presenter and moderator of the show, which he usually defends quite vociferously. If and when I get a reply I will let you know.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by pauline on 01.12.11 10:03

Crewman

very interesting that the online form on which you complain is limited in size - I suppose there has to be a limit when setting it up but presumably it could allow much more text (can a techie on this site clarify this please?)

So you could submit more complaints (as many as necessary to make the points you want) emphasising that they are a continuation of your first complaint. or you could submit a written and detailed complaint.

I would love a full transcript of the interview and follow up incoming call from listener if anyone has them. i think the podcase geta taken down after a week?


Another angle you could follow up on is the NUJ. I just went on to the NUJ website and presumably Jeremy Vine is a member, and maybe Nina too. On the website they have a 12 point code of conduct to which members must subscribe. I would consider that Mr Vine is in breach of the following

1.relates to defending freedom of expression and right of public to be informed

2.relates to information being conveyed being accurate and fair

3.Must do your best to correct harmful inaccuracies

4.Must differentiate between fact and opinion.

and maybe

9. the accusation of mental health issues could be relevant here as you must not encorage hatrd/discrimination on the grounds of a no of issues including DISABILITY.

PRESUMABLY DUE TO THE LEVENSON INQUIRY THE NUJ WILL BE PARTICULARLY CONCERNED ABOUT MEMBERS ADHERING TO THEIR CODE OF CONDUCT AT THIS TIME.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by rainbow-fairy on 01.12.11 14:09

@mrscee wrote:Thanks for sharing your complaint and reply crewman. Your latest comment about resorting to ' ad hominem' is exactly what went through my mind. In fact, I am not exaggerating when I say that a chill went through me when I heard that broadcast because without free speech everything we believe that we have in our society is just a lie. That may sound very melodramatic, but it's how I feel about this issue. I find it very hard to live in a place where seemingly noone actually cares about the truth, only about what is politically or personally expedient at the time. I also have to wonder, what is it which everyone is trying to cover up. Something pretty big I think- bigger than the Mccanns themselves.

With regard to pursuing your complaint further, I agree that it is probably up to those who were slandered on air to do this. I really hope they are doing so. However, I think you could legitimately respond and ask the Beeb representative who replied to you to point out exactly where in this broadcast there was any debate, given the first three definitions of debate below. On the contrary, the entire objective of the piece seemed to be to quosh the opposing view as quickly as possible, without regard for the veracity or otherwise of their arguments. :
Debate
1. A discussion involving opposing points; an argument.
2. Deliberation; consideration: passed the motion with little debate.
3. A formal contest of argumentation in which two opposing teams defend and attack a given proposition.
4. Obsolete Conflict; strife.

In the complaint which I wrote( not as measured as yours!) , one of my key points was asking why there had been a deviation from the show format in this case- namely not having another individual who had been brought in to put the opposing view to Nina Myscow. As I am at home with my kids all day, I listen to JV's show almost every day, and I cannot recall another case quite like this when they did not have 2 people giving their views. In addition, I asked why Jeremy had not maintained the impartial position as presenter and moderator of the show, which he usually defends quite vociferously. If and when I get a reply I will let you know.
mrscee, I don't believe you are exaggerating, nor being too melodramatic. It is just one step away from a fascist police state when only the 'official party line' is acceptable to hold as a view. I also understand and share your frustration regarding so many people doing nothing, in truth not caring about anything that isn't X-Factor, Strictly or some vapid z list celeb featured in the red-tops and mags. Its a very true saying that all it takes for evil to flourish is for the good people to do nothing... My dad, for example, like myself has never believed the McCann's, but he tells me to 'let it go, drop it, nothing will ever be done about it now'. Well, he may be right, and on a cynical day I tend to agree. However, I don't think any of us should give up hope that one day this sorry tale will be blown sky-high, and Madeleine gets the justice she so truly deserves. Whether it is because of the media grandstanding, the absence of responsibility or just their faces, I don't know, but no news story has ever got me like this. I couldn't let go if I tried. Goodness, I watch a tv docu on Ben Needham, and who is the VERY FIRST FACE SHOWN? Not Ben - Maddie. Closely followed by the gruesome twosome. I for one found that distasteful and so disrespectful to the Needhams. They pop up everywhere! But no, I'll be with this one til the bitter end, I'm afraid...

____________________
"Ask the dogs, Sandra" - Gerry McCann to Sandra Felgueiras



Truth is artless and innocent - like the eloquence of nature, it is clothed with simplicity and easy persuasion; always open to investigation and analysis, it seeks exposure because it fears not detection.

NORMAN MACDONALD, Maxims and Moral Reflections.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by mrscee on 01.12.11 20:34

Thank you for saying that I am not melodramatic Rainbow Fairy! And I do so hope you are right. We have to have faith that the truth will come out. And I'm with you- I don't think I will ever forget about this case.

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Re: Jeremy Vine Show BBC radio 2 today at 12pm

Post by Gillyspot on 01.12.11 20:38

mrscee I agree as well with you.

I was under the impression that the BBC had to remain impartial yet clearly in this case they have not done this.

I can understand abuse to listeners in the late night show but not at noon.

My mother used to listen to Radio 2 and I am not sure how she would have coped hearing the attitude of Nina Miss Cow!

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Kate McCann "I know that what happened is not due to the fact of us leaving the children asleep. I know it happened under other circumstances"

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