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is robert murat involved

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by ROCKY on 01.12.09 9:30

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1569143/Madeleine-McCann-Possible-translation-errors.html

It seems that even The Telegraph tried to put the boot in...These errors could have been put to right by the reconstruction. Paulo Rebelo was now in charge and yet the tapas still refused to return to Portugal.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 01.12.09 14:45

@exempt wrote:
trunky wrote:It's one of the more baffling things to me in this entire case and the comment that surrounds it that supposedly intelligent people can actually read 'I am not not going to comment on that' as an admission that he was some kind of buddy.

I never would have credited that it were possible if I hadn't seen it repeated ad bleedin nauseam for two years and more.
Rolling Eyes

It's possible that Gerry vaguely knew Murat or one of the Tapas 7 knew him and so he would then have to answer "Yes" to that question. That would really have set the conspiracy theorists into action.

We know that Mr Murat helped the police in the early days and so there is every chance that he may have been in the same room/area/geographical location as Mr McCann at some point in those early days but then so were hundreds of other people that probably were introduced to the Mccanns to a lesser or greater extent, Murat might know as he was presumeably of sound mind at the time, the McCanns however are unlikely to remember so that alone would be sound reason to say no comment, even if judicial secrecy had not been in place, which of course it was, but the theorists need there to be some sort of hinting going on to make their stories fit, best to leave them to it, there is little chance of reasoning with them.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Jamie on 01.12.09 15:59

Fond of answering no comment are the Mc's.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 02.12.09 15:27

@Tony Bennett wrote:
murat_fan wrote:Mr Bennett, are you going to publish a leaflet giving reasons why murat is guilty? Or is that just for the McCanns
Expect an article on our new website www.madeleinefoundation.org.uk within the next few weeks along the lines of: "Questions about Robert Murat's involvement in the case of missing Madeleine McCann".

Maybe you can help us with our research?

You really are a piece of work, Mr. Bennett.

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Why did Robert Murat make SIXTEEN changes to his story about what he'd been doing on 1, 2, 3 and 4 May?

Post by Tony Bennett on 10.12.09 23:58

BACK ON TOPIC

Murat was interviewed by police in May when he became an arguido.

He made various statements about what he did on May 1, 2, 3 and 4.

He was interviewed again by police on 10 and 11 July.

When he was interviewed again, he asked if he could change his previous statements about what he had been doing on May 1, 2, 3 and 4.

Can anyone suggest a good reason why he made as many as sixteen changes to his story, as follows:

A summary of Murat’s changes of story about 1, 2, 3 and 4 May

1. Remembers that on 2 May he didn’t leave home at 10.30 but instead had a meeting with Sergei Malinka at the Batista Supermarket
2. He had in fact taken Michaela and Malinka back to his mother’s house in Praai da Luz for a further discussion, something he’d omitted to tell the police in the first interview
3. He now remembered visiting his bank and paying in 287.51 euros
4. He now remembered he’d called at the home of Francisco Pagarete, his lawyer, that morning
5. He now remembers that he had met Francisco Pagarete that afternoon
6. He now remembers that another of Jorge’s sons was present at their meeting in the café in the afternoon
7. The meeting in the café went on much longer than he had said previously
8. He thinks that Michaela Walczuk’s husband Luis Antonio may not have been present at Michaela’s house that evening, contrary to what he had previously said
9. On 3 May, he had not woken at 9.00am as previously stated, but at 8.00am
10. He had not driven to Michaela’s house after 10.00am as previously stated; instead he had left home at 8.45am for a 9.30am meeting with the owner of the business tourist complex called ‘Gold Bunker’ in the Espiche district and her father-in-law
11. He now remembered that he had visited two apartments for about 30 minutes, probably on the afternoon of 3 May
12. He and Michaela had lunch with them, a fact he had not disclosed to police before
13. Michaela’s daughter Christine was not with them that day contrary to his previous story
14. They went to the Palmares Golf Club in the afternoon, another fact Murat had failed to disclose
15. He now admitted to making two telephone calls, to Sergei Malinka and Michaela, at 11.39pm and 11.40pm that night
16. He previously said he had woken at 9.00am on Friday 4 May. He now admitted he had telephoned Michaela at 8.27am and must have got up earlier.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 11.12.09 2:28

Dear God. Someone is going to have to do something about you, Mr. Bennett. You have absolutely no respect for The Law, and no respect for what it stands for.

Having failed miserably to implicate The McCanns, you are now trying to implicate another person who was also found to be without fault. Albeit in some way associated with The McCanns, simply by virtue of being in the same place, and at the same time.

I feel so dreadfully sorry for you. And please do believe that I do. To live your life must be unadulterate hell.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Tony Bennett on 11.12.09 8:24

Sabot wrote:Dear God. Someone is going to have to do something about you, Mr. Bennett. You have absolutely no respect for The Law, and no respect for what it stands for.

Having failed miserably to implicate The McCanns, you are now trying to implicate another person who was also found to be without fault. Albeit in some way associated with The McCanns, simply by virtue of being in the same place, and at the same time.

I feel so dreadfully sorry for you. And please do believe that I do. To live your life must be unadulterate hell.
A post which combines failure to answer the question with personal abuse. So unusual for you, Sabot.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by preciousramotswe on 14.12.09 19:28

There isn't any personal abuse there, just factual assessment.

A lot of us are perplexed as to why you are now turning your attentions to Robert Murat.
Particularly as some of us spent an age on 3As trying to point out to you that if you wanted inconsistencies and changes in witness statements, then he's your boy.

The difference is that we (well I in an any case) wasn't trying to implicate him in Madeleine's abduction, just to point out that different standards were being applied to one lot of statements (the McCanns and their friends) compared to another lot of statements (the Murats and their friends).

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by LG78 on 21.08.11 7:54

The fact that Murat translated a lot of the witness statement of the nannies in the Ocean Club surprised me. Never noticed that before.
He translated the nannie Mccanns witness statement for example

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAULINE-MCCANN.htm

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Get'emGonçalo on 28.08.11 11:55

What if cadaver odour was found in Robert Murat's car boot, car keys, apartment, clothing, some toy in his house.

What if, of the twenty DNA markers to accept it as total evidence, there were fifteen markers, that would be admitted as evidence in other cases.

What if he refused to answer 48 questions or refused to co-operate with a reconstruction?

Where do you think Robert Murat would be by now?

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I'm not saying Gerry McCann is obsessed with what comes out in the media but Kim Jong-un thinks he needs to lighten up a bit.


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Great!

Post by tigger on 28.08.11 13:27

Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:What if cadaver odour was found in Robert Murat's car boot, car keys, apartment, clothing, some toy in his house.

What if, of the twenty DNA markers to accept it as total evidence, there were fifteen markers, that would be admitted as evidence in other cases.

What if he refused to answer 48 questions or refused to co-operate with a reconstruction?

Where do you think Robert Murat would be by now?

What a wonderful insight! If this was published in the newspapers, would a large number of hypnotised rabbits wake up?

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Evidence of possible guilt

Post by Marian on 28.08.11 13:38

I rather think that it would be the same answer if those questions were asked of any ordinary member of the public. That description of course excludes anyone with the same influential friends that the McCanns have.

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Nothing derogatory

Post by tigger on 28.08.11 13:47

@Marian wrote:I rather think that it would be the same answer if those questions were asked of any ordinary member of the public. That description of course excludes anyone with the same influential friends that the McCanns have.

I meant that having been served the same bedtime story time after time by the media, it would be like the snap of the fingers of the hypnotist and millions of people would wake up. But in fact, most of them don't know the name Murat anymore because it's never mentioned. Excepting paedophiles, alternatives are never mentioned.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by puzzled on 28.08.11 13:57

Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:What if cadaver odour was found in Robert Murat's car boot, car keys, apartment, clothing, some toy in his house.

What if, of the twenty DNA markers to accept it as total evidence, there were fifteen markers, that would be admitted as evidence in other cases.

What if he refused to answer 48 questions or refused to co-operate with a reconstruction?

Where do you think Robert Murat would be by now?

And of course if all this had been the case, I wonder how quick the McCann's supporters would be to claim that the dogs were unreliable, and put their findings down to chance.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Smokeandmirrors on 28.08.11 14:16

@puzzled wrote:
Get 'em Gonçalo wrote:What if cadaver odour was found in Robert Murat's car boot, car keys, apartment, clothing, some toy in his house.

What if, of the twenty DNA markers to accept it as total evidence, there were fifteen markers, that would be admitted as evidence in other cases.

What if he refused to answer 48 questions or refused to co-operate with a reconstruction?

Where do you think Robert Murat would be by now?

And of course if all this had been the case, I wonder how quick the McCann's supporters would be to claim that the dogs were unreliable, and put their findings down to chance.



Absolutely ditto that!!

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 9:29

Manuel informs us that the day after Madeleine's disappearance at about 4 or 5 pm when he was travelling on the ICI road at kilometre 718, he saw two stationary cars, an Audi A3 driven by a man and a green car (very special green colour) driven by a blonde woman. Subsequently we showed him a series of photographs that were in our possession amongst which the one with the closes resemblance was that of a woman who turns out to be Murat's girlfriend, Michaela Walczuch.

The cars were stationary; the green one was inside a farm where two elderly men live and separated by a metal fence and on the pavement of the road was the Audi. When Manuel drove past in his lorry he saw how the woman passed a bundle wrapped in a blanket over the fence, being convinced that this was a child. (Because of the way she was holding it and because it was wrapped in the blanket).

It should be noted that Manuel's manifestations seem reliable to us, in part because of the fear that he showed before and during our meeting as well as due to the successive contacts that we have had with him and the interest that he has always shown.


Manuel preferred to remain anonymous given that he was very frightened and did not want to give us his surnames. He drives a grey Renault Laguna, number plate 53 92 RF. In order for us to contact him he provided the email address of a relative:http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MICHAELA_WALCZUCH.htm

And this is after Metod 3 has had a external diligence carried out:

n point form:
- The PJ traced the driver, Manuel A P Gautier, and spoke to him.
- He acknowledged speaking to M3 on 3 November.
- He and PJ met by agreement at a given location on IC1.
- The driver related his story of having seen a grey Audi and a green car (possibly Opel Astra) on 4 May between 15h00 and 17h00 in the IC1 freeway
- He saw a woman (standing next to the Audi) pass something wrapped in cloth to a man (next to the green car) over the metal fence.
- From what he could make out it was not very heavy and there was nothing to suggest it might have been a child.
- They went to the location where photos were taken.
- The resident of a nearby house was questioned by the PJ. He neither saw nor heard vehicles in his 'driveway' on 4 May, and noticed nothing untoward with the closed gate across its entrance.
- The driver stated that from pictures in the printed media he recognised some resemblance between MW and the woman he saw on 4 May, mainly some facial features, her build and hair colour, but he could not positively assert that it was her.
- The driver could not recall the man.
- The PJ checked the phone antenna records for 4 May and found phone calls to and from MW, RM, SM and LA during that day, and during the time of the alleged observation, all calls showing they were all some 65 km away from the location of the alleged sighting.


Hmmm...
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/METODO_3.htm

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Gillyspot on 20.09.11 10:50

I have posted this on the DNA section also but.



In PJ files it says:

"2nd- With respect to autosomic STRs the genetic profiles of the following analysed samples matched with the reference sample indicated:

- hair root CEnv 7-51 recovered in the apartment (entrance hall-Env.7) matched with Gerald McCann, father of the victim.

- hair root PVT07 recovered in the vehicle (floor in front of rear seat Env.4) match with Robert James Queriol Eveleigh Murat. "

When did Murat travel in the McCanns car?

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 11:20

@Gillyspot wrote:I have posted this on the DNA section also but.



In PJ files it says:

"2nd- With respect to autosomic STRs the genetic profiles of the following analysed samples matched with the reference sample indicated:

- hair root CEnv 7-51 recovered in the apartment (entrance hall-Env.7) matched with Gerald McCann, father of the victim.

- hair root PVT07 recovered in the vehicle (floor in front of rear seat Env.4) match with Robert James Queriol Eveleigh Murat. "

When did Murat travel in the McCanns car?

Interesting defently...I think, mark THINK, I read somewhere he rentet the same car?

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Gillyspot on 20.09.11 11:30

I haven't read that anywhere but will have a look. Remember though the hair was in the back of the car not near the drivers seat.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 11:40

@Gillyspot wrote:I haven't read that anywhere but will have a look. Remember though the hair was in the back of the car not near the drivers seat.

I'll let you know if I find it again ! Im sure I read it somewhere...

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Gillyspot on 20.09.11 12:01

Just had another look at the PJ files. Robert Didn't hire the car himself as his name isn't on the sheet.



Copy attached



http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P11/rentedcars.jpg

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 12:05

@Gillyspot wrote:I have posted this on the DNA section also but.



In PJ files it says:

"2nd- With respect to autosomic STRs the genetic profiles of the following analysed samples matched with the reference sample indicated:

- hair root CEnv 7-51 recovered in the apartment (entrance hall-Env.7) matched with Gerald McCann, father of the victim.

- hair root PVT07 recovered in the vehicle (floor in front of rear seat Env.4) match with Robert James Queriol Eveleigh Murat. "

When did Murat travel in the McCanns car?
Gillyspot, what is the name of the document this is in please?

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 12:15

I found it. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PORTUGUESE-FORENSIC.htm

It also says;

Third: The study of autosomic STRs from the sample received in the 2 phases revealed:

There were matches between the reference sample genetic profiles and the following analysed samples:

- hair root (CEnv 7-51) collected in apartament Ocean Club (entrance hall env.7) and Gerald Mccann, father of the victim.

- hair root (PVT07) collected in the Volkswagen 44-77-KD (floor in front of rear seats env.4) and Robert James Queriol Eveleight Murat.

- hair root (C742-05) collected in Volkswagen 44-77-KD (floor in front of front seats - env.3) and Michaela Walczuch.


The McCann's had a Renault Scenic, not a Volkswagen, it is a genuine mistake as that report can be very confusing.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Gillyspot on 20.09.11 12:25

Hi Stella



Sorry. You are right I should have read further up about the actual sample number.

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Re: is robert murat involved

Post by Guest on 20.09.11 12:33

@Gillyspot wrote:Hi Stella

Sorry. You are right I should have read further up about the actual sample number.
That's OK Gillyspot, empathy it took me long enough to go through that document when it first came out. I actually used the search and find tool, to check out each reference number, searching the whole document, to make sure everything had been covered and explained properly. It was a long job, which is how I remembered how to search for things.

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