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Red carnations for Gerry McCann

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by Cristobell on 09.05.14 11:45

Interesting read Tigger thank you. Going to check out Gerry's blogs and KH1, or should that be 'GM1' - well done to Pamalam for saving them!

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by Guest on 09.05.14 11:56

@tigger.

Hi tigger, very interesting recap on the moves the McCans made while in Praia. One question, why do you think contamination took place around June 10, while they were still at the OC?

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by tigger on 09.05.14 15:53


Dee Coy wrote:@tigger.

Hi tigger, very interesting recap on the moves the McCans made while in Praia. One question, why do you think contamination took place around June 10, while they were still at the OC?

It's been discussed before. The call which Gerry lied about was inthe morning of the 10th. In the afternoon they left for Morocco.
So the coast was clear as all journos were with them in Morocco.
Both were dressed in black, on their return Gerry gave a strange speech, stating that they needed to grieve.
In other topics - long ago I proposed that M probably died on the 30th April.
All the obligations to thedead were observed: church on the 3rd day, mass on the 12th day, family and friends memorial on the 40th day.
If you check Gerry's blog there was a meeting of the family in Sagres on the ninth. Gerry fudges the dates, Kate doesn't but neither mention the family gathering forwhich a number of people flew in.
Three months after the date of death one is meant to say goodbye at the graveside.
As it happens, that fits the trip to Huelva.

Sorry, I wish I was more diligent in keeping track of my posts. It was also discussed on thefraudulentfund website.

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by lj on 09.05.14 19:50

@tigger wrote:From page one here because I must say TM have downplayed the move from one villa to the next. 

I did know that they said the villa was lent to them free of charge but also knew they'd paid rent. If they had the first villa free and the second was paid for (I remember quite a hefty number for the rent) two villas would explain that problem.  So it must have been as from the first days of July that they had a neighbour who noticed the airing of the Espace?  If - the contamination in the boot of the car happened around June the 10th, the car must have been parked at OC and whether serious airing took place there or not, it would stand out in the car park to leave the back open.

Marvellous, so they had their meals, their friends and their accommodation free at OC. Contamination happened because of the dirty pyjamas and sandals Maddie had worn were thrown in the boot during the move to the villa. Villa nr. 1 .  
Which does place their timeline for the disposal of the body before the date they moved from OC. Hmm,  hadn't thought of that before.

From the first post:
Paul Luckman the editor of Portugal News detailed in a phoned in report to RTE, an Irish news station, that the McCanns first villa was being paid for by the Portuguese goverment and put at the McCanns disposal through the auspices of The Algarve Tourist Authority.

The English sniffer dogs were active in the region under the guidance of Mark Harrison and his team in mid-July. It was whilst these dogs were active in the area the McCanns were forced to move from their first rent free villa to their next villa, one in which they were required to pay rent from their own pocket.

Before the end of July Mr. Antonio Pina insisted to the McCanns they move out of their villa by the end of the month. In the press nothing of this exchange was reported. All that was apparent was the fact that the McCanns were suddenly on the move again and this second move was unexpected and unwelcome to the McCanns. It was known in the press that this move was the cause of real inconvenience to the McCanns and their party. The McCanns had not expected to be moved out and it was on this chaotic move that Clarence Mitchell later said, "seats were ripped out of the back of the McCanns rental car'. This drastic action on the part of the McCanns and their friends implies that real panic had set in. Such was their anxiety to move. The enforced move plainly came as a shock to the McCanns as they were given little or no notice to find alternative accommodation.

Gerry McCann complained on his bloggs that despite being given little notice to quit their rent free villa he considered himself as fortunate to have secured the lease on their next villa quickly. By August Gerry McCann remarked it had become almost too late in the season to be making rental arrangements in a small town such as Luz which contained a limited supply of suitable family accommodation.

It now appears that there was a reason for the McCanns hurried eviction from Antonio Pinas grace and favour villa. The cloth with the cadaver scent could only have been located in the second apartment when the English cadaver dogs arrived in late July. By the end of July the evidence had been uncovered and was plainly known to the PJ and the McCanns, and it seems this piece of forensic intelligence was also made known to Antonio Pina. Pina all but evicted the McCanns from the tourist board villa as the Portuguese goverment appears to have refused, in the light of the uncovered evidence, to continue to subsidise the McCanns past the end of the month. From the 1st of August the McCanns were to be on their own.

unquote

Great piece of research again, Tigger, Thanks.

Being made an arguido did not really come unexpected did it? Apart from what have played in their guilty conscience, the writing was on the wall.

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by Mirage on 09.05.14 20:31

With acknowledgements to the wonderful Pamalam, the following:

From Gerry's Blog:

The last section of Day 52' entry -  24/06/2007

If Madeleine is not found in the next couple of weks we need to move out of the appartment we have been staying in as the family is coming out for a holiday. I have to say the owners have been extremely understanding, as they came to Praia da Luz for a holiday and relocated to another apartment to save us moving again.

This degree of flexibility does not exist in the resort in high season. We have managed to look at a few properties to rent in the last couple of days and I think we have found somewhere suitable to live until we return back to the UK with Madeleine.


------------------------------------------
If they were virtually evicted you can see how GM spins his way out of every bad situation from this little vignette alone. Notice the coming out for a holiday. Most people's relatives would be organising a rota of meals on wheels and rest care. What a shower.

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by Gillyspot on 09.05.14 20:34

@tigger wrote:
Three months after the date of death one is meant to say goodbye at the graveside.
As it happens, that fits the trip to Huelva.

Sorry, I wish I was more diligent in keeping track of my posts. It was also discussed on thefraudulentfund website.
Probably a wrong thought but how about they made a detour on their Huelva journey via Monte Vascão (as mentioned on the McGuinness map). This journey takes 3 hours 7 minutes & would explain their LONG journey time.

Just a thought of course.

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by ultimaThule on 10.05.14 4:43

@tigger wrote:From page one here because I must say TM have downplayed the move from one villa to the next.

I did know that they said the villa was lent to them free of charge but also knew they'd paid rent. If they had the first villa free and the second was paid for (I remember quite a hefty number for the rent) two villas would explain that problem.  So it must have been as from the first days of July that they had a neighbour who noticed the airing of the Espace?  If - the contamination in the boot of the car happened around June the 10th, the car must have been parked at OC and whether serious airing took place there or not, it would stand out in the car park to leave the back open.

Marvellous, so they had their meals, their friends and their accommodation free at OC. Contamination happened because of the dirty pyjamas and sandals Maddie had worn were thrown in the boot during the move to the villa. Villa nr. 1 .  
Which does place their timeline for the disposal of the body before the date they moved from OC. Hmm,  hadn't thought of that before.

From the first post:
Paul Luckman the editor of Portugal News detailed in a phoned in report to RTE, an Irish news station, that the McCanns first villa was being paid for by the Portuguese goverment and put at the McCanns disposal through the auspices of The Algarve Tourist Authority.

The English sniffer dogs were active in the region under the guidance of Mark Harrison and his team in mid-July. It was whilst these dogs were active in the area the McCanns were forced to move from their first rent free villa to their next villa, one in which they were required to pay rent from their own pocket.

Before the end of July Mr. Antonio Pina insisted to the McCanns they move out of their villa by the end of the month. In the press nothing of this exchange was reported. All that was apparent was the fact that the McCanns were suddenly on the move again and this second move was unexpected and unwelcome to the McCanns. It was known in the press that this move was the cause of real inconvenience to the McCanns and their party. The McCanns had not expected to be moved out and it was on this chaotic move that Clarence Mitchell later said, "seats were ripped out of the back of the McCanns rental car'. This drastic action on the part of the McCanns and their friends implies that real panic had set in. Such was their anxiety to move. The enforced move plainly came as a shock to the McCanns as they were given little or no notice to find alternative accommodation.

Gerry McCann complained on his bloggs that despite being given little notice to quit their rent free villa he considered himself as fortunate to have secured the lease on their next villa quickly. By August Gerry McCann remarked it had become almost too late in the season to be making rental arrangements in a small town such as Luz which contained a limited supply of suitable family accommodation.

It now appears that there was a reason for the McCanns hurried eviction from Antonio Pinas grace and favour villa. The cloth with the cadaver scent could only have been located in the second apartment when the English cadaver dogs arrived in late July. By the end of July the evidence had been uncovered and was plainly known to the PJ and the McCanns, and it seems this piece of forensic intelligence was also made known to Antonio Pina. Pina all but evicted the McCanns from the tourist board villa as the Portuguese goverment appears to have refused, in the light of the uncovered evidence, to continue to subsidise the McCanns past the end of the month. From the 1st of August the McCanns were to be on their own.

unquote

P.195 of the bewk has it that "on 2 July, we had moved out of the Ocean Club and into a rented villa, the cheapest we could find that suited our requirements (Gerry was now on unpaid leave), in Parque Luz".  These 'requirements' appear to have extended to at least 3 bedrooms, one of which served the dual purpose of an office and sleeping quarters for Trish and Sandy who had moved with them.

Further, "We also rented a small flat at the Ocean Club for Justine" and it appears the dogbodies T&S were required to ship out of the villa and doss down in the flat "when other people came to stay"  

After the above, the next reference to accomodation is on p.215 when, on 2 August, "we learned that we would need to vacate our villa by 11 September".  

It seems to me that, for all the author of Exhbit KH1 prided herself on p266 that she would 'put Sherlock Holmes out of a job', it's unlikely that Mr Holmes would regard solving 'The RIddle of the Portuguese Villa' as being elementary, my dear tigger  smilie

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by tigger on 10.05.14 6:42

Thanks for looking that up!  Doesn't Ms H skate over various things, such as the psychic vision on 8/5 but if she's also forgotten and entire villa it's more serious.
The plot thickens. I'm only trying to get it straight  because for reasons best known to TM, they don't tell us about an event which would elevate their martyr status. (We had to move several times, kind people offered us a villa but only for one month, then we had to move again - etc).

It would certainly resolve the free villa and the rented villa problem.

These moves also link to the hire car.

2/7/07 could have been a Saturday. change over day for OC.
They must have had adequate warning for the villa to be ready for them. This is the Da Pino villa.
But I remember a discussion on a villa  complete with photographs  from a brochure in connection with a fridge, as the brochure iirc stated that  there was a brand new one.

Now it seems things started to unravel earlier than I thought. i'll have to check the exact dates the dogs arrived.

Re the hire car: only occurred to me now that - as they moved on 2/7 and their excuse for the DNA in the car was initially Maddie's dirty sandals and pyjamas when they moved. - might give us a date to work from.

Up to 2/7 the car was parked at the OC.  When did the contamination take place?  
Michael Wright :  when was he in OC,  he was the named driver on several occasions.
So in effect we could look for a window of opportunity which contains the absence of the McCanns, MW present and a date before 2/7.  His statement on the smell in the car  focussed on transport of goods to and from the villa. But that was in the rogs, almost a year later.

Of course a later date is possible but for the moment I'm just going by the first excuse that came into their heads.

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by Woofer on 10.05.14 8:41

@Gillyspot wrote:
@tigger wrote:
Three months after the date of death one is meant to say goodbye at the graveside.
As it happens, that fits the trip to Huelva.

Sorry, I wish I was more diligent in keeping track of my posts. It was also discussed on thefraudulentfund website.
Probably a wrong thought but how about they made a detour on their Huelva journey via Monte Vascão (as mentioned on the McGuinness map). This journey takes 3 hours 7 minutes & would explain their LONG journey time.

Just a thought of course.

OR ........ a saying goodbye at the graveside in the Roman Catholic Cemetary (belonging to the British Government) in Huelva (from the Trip to Huelva thread) :-

"Raising this topic again to add details of the Roman Catholic Cemetary at Huelva which is owned by the British Government.  Its just north east of Huelva on the H-1417.

I doubt there would be many people around in this cemetary if there was a Fiesta happening on 3 August.

Michael Glyndwr is buried there - the dead body in Operation Mincemeat.

The British Cemetery, called "Nuestra Señora de la Soledad", belongs to the British Government.  OK if one has contacts in the British Government.

[url=http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva Roman Catholic Cemetery][url=http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva Roman Catholic Cemetery[/url]]http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva%20Roman%20Catholic%20Cemetery[/url][/url]

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Re: Red carnations for Gerry McCann

Post by tigger on 10.05.14 11:20

@Woofer wrote:
@Gillyspot wrote:
@tigger wrote:
Three months after the date of death one is meant to say goodbye at the graveside.
As it happens, that fits the trip to Huelva.

Sorry, I wish I was more diligent in keeping track of my posts. It was also discussed on thefraudulentfund website.
Probably a wrong thought but how about they made a detour on their Huelva journey via Monte Vascão (as mentioned on the McGuinness map). This journey takes 3 hours 7 minutes & would explain their LONG journey time.

Just a thought of course.

OR ........ a saying goodbye at the graveside in the Roman Catholic Cemetary (belonging to the British Government) in Huelva (from the Trip to Huelva thread) :-

"Raising this topic again to add details of the Roman Catholic Cemetary at Huelva which is owned by the British Government.  Its just north east of Huelva on the H-1417.

I doubt there would be many people around in this cemetary if there was a Fiesta happening on 3 August.

Michael Glyndwr is buried there - the dead body in Operation Mincemeat.

The British Cemetery, called "Nuestra Señora de la Soledad", belongs to the British Government.  OK if one has contacts in the British Government.

[url=http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva Roman Catholic Cemetery][url=http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva Roman Catholic Cemetery[/url]]http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/2086519/Huelva%20Roman%20Catholic%20Cemetery[/url][/url]

Good find! The PJ know that the return journey from Huelva didn't follow a logical route....

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